Option H is permanent and the old Wootton HS campus will be closed for good?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

The only reason I live in moco not Fairfax is because of the commute to work is a nightmare from VA to MD. But at some point I’ll move there if more work at home flexibility can be secured or when I retire.

You're probably one of the few that I know of that works in Montgomery County.

The few that I know tend to be federal workers or contractors, who are getting decimated by the current administration. And/or researchers or statisticians, where if they don't work for the fed, they work for one of the Biotech firms in the area.

Some of them are from out of the area and country and when asking them why they chose the specific school area they did, they said it was because of the school ratings. Well MCPS seems intent on eliminating one of it's top ranked schools. Where even though it might be an entire move now, there are still possibilities for changes and modifications. If not now, then later down the road if school capacity requires it.

Practically everyone else I know does the hour or so commute into DC or Virginia. Some of the people that commuted to Virginia came back close to midnight when there was that thundersnow several years back.

I sure hope Montgomery County and MCPS makes Montgomery County a worthwhile place to move to and also to deal with those types of commutes.

Well if you work in DC or Virginia, it makes no sense to live in MoCo. Just move since you have the choice

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

Many move to VA or Howard because of the jobs, especially tech jobs. The commutes are very hard otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

They aren’t bringing the county and MCPS down. They were not happy and moved. Nothing wrong with that. The commute to VA is easily 60-120 minutes plus lots of tolls each way.

I'm not saying the people that moved are the people that brought down the county.

I'm saying it's these people who keep shouting and controlling the politics and narrative. They don't make it a very friendly or positive place for people to succeed or even worthwhile to invest in.

It's okay though. They can keep getting their revenue by keeping on building new homes and raising taxes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

They aren’t bringing the county and MCPS down. They were not happy and moved. Nothing wrong with that. The commute to VA is easily 60-120 minutes plus lots of tolls each way.

I'm not saying the people that moved are the people that brought down the county.

I'm saying it's these people who keep shouting and controlling the politics and narrative. They don't make it a very friendly or positive place for people to succeed or even worthwhile to invest in.

It's okay though. They can keep getting their revenue by keeping on building new homes and raising taxes.

Maryland needs to step in and break up MCPS and or Montgomery County. MCPS is one of the largest districts in the country it is too big for its size and is unable to provide a consistent educational experience across the schools it's charged with. EG Why is it such a big deal to move/relocate schools? Well because just a neighborhood over, the schools are not very good. This is not what you see in other counties in Maryland or school districts in other states.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wootton is the affordable W school

Which is why it's the easier target and the one always beat up on.

As previous poster mentioned, once can choose to settle for a little bit less for the money in choosing Wootton vs some other areas.

And the same can be said for choosing Wootton over some of the other richer areas.

But this whole process shows what areas are more protected and in hindsight it is apparent, where some of the schools there don't have to deal with some of the nonsense that some of the Wootton cluster schools did. Those Wayside parents sure didn't want to get zoned to Wootton.

So it may very well be worth it to move to an even older/smaller home in these richer areas but also have more protection against these kinds of things.

No one is targeting or beating up on Wootton. Wootton is just being unrealistic about the boundary situation and crying about it.

First it was unfair that Dufief has to leave the cluster
Second was it is unfair that the school is falling apart
Third is that it is unfair that Wootton needs to move to a new building
Fourth is that it is unfair that Gaithersburg students will be at the new building with Wootton.

Wootton boundaries are right along where the area with Crown. There will be changes to Wootton. You all need to be realistic about the situation.

Changes like:
being moved to a new building miles from the original
a new name
new student cohort
new teachers
new admin
new programs
leveling the old Wootton

Apart from those things it'll be EXACTLY THE SAME.

The bolded has no basis in fact.
If Wootton were moved to a holding school for a year while the current building was leveled and a new building in its place, would you have an issue? No. So that is not a thing.
There may be an additional student cohort, not splitting up the current one.

So yes, there will be changes- many students very much inconvenienced by traveling to a new location. That is real. Yes, there will be a new name, but I can't see the meaningful argument for why that matters much. And...tell me why additional students is a bad thing?

Of course there will be teacher and admin turnover. That's what happens when a school closes and another opens. As for students, they're proposing to add a couple extra ES and they'll probably remove an ES or two which changes the cohort. Change is bad when things are working well and Wooton is one of the state's best high schools. Just admit that you hate the W schools and want to see them eliminated.

That's not why there would be turnover. There is turnover yearly at every school. Usually, teachers want closer to home, better admin, teaching their actual classes they were train for, etc.

Your kids will be ok if they add another ES. Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income and not just rich pretending they are low income.

I'm glad we agree that when a school closes and a new one opens there are reasons new teachers might to want to teach there or existing teachers might find it too far and this will cause more turnover than usual. And you outed yourself as an anti-W school, pro-busser with "Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income."

Yeah I'm not a fan of them and is a reason why we purposely avoided some of the richer areas... Yes we're one of the ones that could've afforded to live somewhere more expensive but didn't want our kids in that environment.

But some people honestly can live in a segregated world and that's their world. And it's fine. It's just different worlds and classes.

But some of these "anti-W school" people think that their point of view or world is the right way and how everyone should do and see things.

It goes back to the debate about county wide magnet programs. Some of these students are coming out and benefiting society and leading change. Whereas a lot of posters on here are saying that enrichment isn't needed for these types of students and the focus should be for the greater population who are struggling.

It's the same point of view when it comes to wanting to tear down W schools or forcing mixed demographics or integration. If they do that, can they guarantee the same level of academic rigor and standards that some of these families were looking for in choosing an area to live in and send their kids to?

The W schools have advanced classes for these students. Its the kids in the other schools that are lacking in course offerings that need the magnets to achieve to the same level.

This is kind of the mentality out there, where people want things for free.

Maybe five or ten years ago on this forum people would post, "It's all one school district. It's all the same curriculum" And that was a very naive way of thinking. And people that knew, knew which schools to look for and why some areas were more desirable and expensive than others. In the Wootton school district there are rentals available, both homes and townhomes. And they have the apartments over by the Traville Shopping Center. And there were some homes with multiple families living there. The specific cases I'm thinking of are African immigrants. So yeah believe it or not there are URM minorities in the Wootton school district.

So people were willing to sacrifice to give their kids a chance for a better education.

Fast forward to now, people are realizing there really is an inequality between schools. Such as in the different levels of rigor in the same class in different schools, leading to limited advanced offerings at some schools because supposedly there weren't enough students interested and qualified for it.

And instead of looking at the root of the problem and trying to improve it to make more students qualified for the classes, they're saying it's not fair so we should make it equal for everyone. So those people who decided to take the "grasshopper" route by buying a really nice house on a nice plot of land say that no one should take the really advanced classes or be in the advanced programs because not everyone qualifies for it. Or trying to mix the W students in with some other populations so there would be enough students for the advanced classes. But some of these students come from different elementary schools with the same different levels of preparation. So what happens if some of them can't perform or keep up with the material? Well MCPS doesn't fail anyone, so they'll slow down the curriculum for everyone in the class and school.

If people say they purposely avoid Wootton because they didn't want their kids in a pressure cooker environment, well don't complain that Wootton and other W schools have more advanced classes than other schools. Because that pressure cooker environment is what pushed kids to be able to take those courses and eligible for the countywide programs.

No one is asking for anything for free. We all all paying taxes to support the schools and all our kids should get equal opportunities. There are enough kids to take the advanced classes but there ae also more average kids than advanced and the prinicipals choose to use their allocations on the average kids vs. doing a mix good for all.

If you look at this document, the max MPDU rental rate for a one bedroom in high rise with someone with a max annual salary of $80500 is $1680/month:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DHCA/Resources/Files/housing/affordable/publications/mpdu/calculate_rental_rates.pdf

This rental in Rio island assigned to Wootton is $1628/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/eaves-Washingtonian-Center/apartment/22011115

This townhome is for sale for $675000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/554-Monet-Dr-20850/home/10518574

This recently listed home now under contract listed for $785000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/2892-Balmoral-Dr-20850/home/10510799

And these apartments not in Rio island are about $2500/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/Avalon-at-Traville/apartment/22011398

The homes in Wootton aren't necessarily inaccessible. But a lot of the pricing is because you're paying for the schools.

For example instead of paying $785000 for a 1830 square foot 60 year old single family home listed above, you chose to buy this new build home for $800k recently under contract:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Montgomery-Village/9759-Stewartown-Rd-20886/unit-P45/home/196137281

You're paying more in property taxes. But you also chose to go for the newer and bigger home and most likely didn't take schools as much into account.

Or if you want something closer, this home in the Lakelands:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/528-Market-Mews-E-20878/home/11183064

Not much bigger. But newer and gets the amenities of being in a preplanned development if you like that kind of thing.

Living in the Wootton school district isn't out of reach. But you can definitely get more for the money if you live elsewhere. But people choose to pay the money to live in the Wootton school district because of the reputation of its schools. So they may settle for the smaller or older home. And even if you're paying the same amount in property taxes, you probably have a lot more house for the money or some features that you really like that would've cost a lot more if it was in an area zoned for a W school.

Wootton is a school, MCPS is the school district. Wootton has had some serious issues in the past five years. I wouldn't pay that much to send my child there, especially after the rape.

And this is the type of poster that doesn't contribute.

You know school system employee staff refer to school zones as districts right? In multiple school systems in the area?

It's posters like the above that demand things to be called a certain way instead of focusing on the actual matters.

They're probably the ones that used to spout the "It's all one district and one curriculum belief'

It's okay they'll just go on and pick up whatever new popular words or trends are later.

Actually those things do matter especially when it was preventable. What do you have to offer? We’ve asked many times for suggestions and you have not suggested anything. There is no money in the budget and you refuse crown. You’d rather tantrum and bully vs offer real solutions or wait your turn.

The “wait your turn” poster is still here?

Your question has been answered countless times in this thread, but you don’t like the answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

They aren’t bringing the county and MCPS down. They were not happy and moved. Nothing wrong with that. The commute to VA is easily 60-120 minutes plus lots of tolls each way.

I'm not saying the people that moved are the people that brought down the county.

I'm saying it's these people who keep shouting and controlling the politics and narrative. They don't make it a very friendly or positive place for people to succeed or even worthwhile to invest in.

It's okay though. They can keep getting their revenue by keeping on building new homes and raising taxes.

Maryland needs to step in and break up MCPS and or Montgomery County. MCPS is one of the largest districts in the country it is too big for its size and is unable to provide a consistent educational experience across the schools it's charged with. EG Why is it such a big deal to move/relocate schools? Well because just a neighborhood over, the schools are not very good. This is not what you see in other counties in Maryland or school districts in other states.

You have not been in other school districts.

Not saying MCPS doesn't have issues, but other districts also have similar issues.

This is purely about income disparity, which is an issue everywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wootton is the affordable W school

Which is why it's the easier target and the one always beat up on.

As previous poster mentioned, once can choose to settle for a little bit less for the money in choosing Wootton vs some other areas.

And the same can be said for choosing Wootton over some of the other richer areas.

But this whole process shows what areas are more protected and in hindsight it is apparent, where some of the schools there don't have to deal with some of the nonsense that some of the Wootton cluster schools did. Those Wayside parents sure didn't want to get zoned to Wootton.

So it may very well be worth it to move to an even older/smaller home in these richer areas but also have more protection against these kinds of things.

No one is targeting or beating up on Wootton. Wootton is just being unrealistic about the boundary situation and crying about it.

First it was unfair that Dufief has to leave the cluster
Second was it is unfair that the school is falling apart
Third is that it is unfair that Wootton needs to move to a new building
Fourth is that it is unfair that Gaithersburg students will be at the new building with Wootton.

Wootton boundaries are right along where the area with Crown. There will be changes to Wootton. You all need to be realistic about the situation.

Changes like:
being moved to a new building miles from the original
a new name
new student cohort
new teachers
new admin
new programs
leveling the old Wootton

Apart from those things it'll be EXACTLY THE SAME.

The bolded has no basis in fact.
If Wootton were moved to a holding school for a year while the current building was leveled and a new building in its place, would you have an issue? No. So that is not a thing.
There may be an additional student cohort, not splitting up the current one.

So yes, there will be changes- many students very much inconvenienced by traveling to a new location. That is real. Yes, there will be a new name, but I can't see the meaningful argument for why that matters much. And...tell me why additional students is a bad thing?

Of course there will be teacher and admin turnover. That's what happens when a school closes and another opens. As for students, they're proposing to add a couple extra ES and they'll probably remove an ES or two which changes the cohort. Change is bad when things are working well and Wooton is one of the state's best high schools. Just admit that you hate the W schools and want to see them eliminated.

That's not why there would be turnover. There is turnover yearly at every school. Usually, teachers want closer to home, better admin, teaching their actual classes they were train for, etc.

Your kids will be ok if they add another ES. Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income and not just rich pretending they are low income.

I'm glad we agree that when a school closes and a new one opens there are reasons new teachers might to want to teach there or existing teachers might find it too far and this will cause more turnover than usual. And you outed yourself as an anti-W school, pro-busser with "Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income."

Yeah I'm not a fan of them and is a reason why we purposely avoided some of the richer areas... Yes we're one of the ones that could've afforded to live somewhere more expensive but didn't want our kids in that environment.

But some people honestly can live in a segregated world and that's their world. And it's fine. It's just different worlds and classes.

But some of these "anti-W school" people think that their point of view or world is the right way and how everyone should do and see things.

It goes back to the debate about county wide magnet programs. Some of these students are coming out and benefiting society and leading change. Whereas a lot of posters on here are saying that enrichment isn't needed for these types of students and the focus should be for the greater population who are struggling.

It's the same point of view when it comes to wanting to tear down W schools or forcing mixed demographics or integration. If they do that, can they guarantee the same level of academic rigor and standards that some of these families were looking for in choosing an area to live in and send their kids to?

The W schools have advanced classes for these students. Its the kids in the other schools that are lacking in course offerings that need the magnets to achieve to the same level.

This is kind of the mentality out there, where people want things for free.

Maybe five or ten years ago on this forum people would post, "It's all one school district. It's all the same curriculum" And that was a very naive way of thinking. And people that knew, knew which schools to look for and why some areas were more desirable and expensive than others. In the Wootton school district there are rentals available, both homes and townhomes. And they have the apartments over by the Traville Shopping Center. And there were some homes with multiple families living there. The specific cases I'm thinking of are African immigrants. So yeah believe it or not there are URM minorities in the Wootton school district.

So people were willing to sacrifice to give their kids a chance for a better education.

Fast forward to now, people are realizing there really is an inequality between schools. Such as in the different levels of rigor in the same class in different schools, leading to limited advanced offerings at some schools because supposedly there weren't enough students interested and qualified for it.

And instead of looking at the root of the problem and trying to improve it to make more students qualified for the classes, they're saying it's not fair so we should make it equal for everyone. So those people who decided to take the "grasshopper" route by buying a really nice house on a nice plot of land say that no one should take the really advanced classes or be in the advanced programs because not everyone qualifies for it. Or trying to mix the W students in with some other populations so there would be enough students for the advanced classes. But some of these students come from different elementary schools with the same different levels of preparation. So what happens if some of them can't perform or keep up with the material? Well MCPS doesn't fail anyone, so they'll slow down the curriculum for everyone in the class and school.

If people say they purposely avoid Wootton because they didn't want their kids in a pressure cooker environment, well don't complain that Wootton and other W schools have more advanced classes than other schools. Because that pressure cooker environment is what pushed kids to be able to take those courses and eligible for the countywide programs.

No one is asking for anything for free. We all all paying taxes to support the schools and all our kids should get equal opportunities. There are enough kids to take the advanced classes but there ae also more average kids than advanced and the prinicipals choose to use their allocations on the average kids vs. doing a mix good for all.

If you look at this document, the max MPDU rental rate for a one bedroom in high rise with someone with a max annual salary of $80500 is $1680/month:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DHCA/Resources/Files/housing/affordable/publications/mpdu/calculate_rental_rates.pdf

This rental in Rio island assigned to Wootton is $1628/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/eaves-Washingtonian-Center/apartment/22011115

This townhome is for sale for $675000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/554-Monet-Dr-20850/home/10518574

This recently listed home now under contract listed for $785000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/2892-Balmoral-Dr-20850/home/10510799

And these apartments not in Rio island are about $2500/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/Avalon-at-Traville/apartment/22011398

The homes in Wootton aren't necessarily inaccessible. But a lot of the pricing is because you're paying for the schools.

For example instead of paying $785000 for a 1830 square foot 60 year old single family home listed above, you chose to buy this new build home for $800k recently under contract:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Montgomery-Village/9759-Stewartown-Rd-20886/unit-P45/home/196137281

You're paying more in property taxes. But you also chose to go for the newer and bigger home and most likely didn't take schools as much into account.

Or if you want something closer, this home in the Lakelands:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/528-Market-Mews-E-20878/home/11183064

Not much bigger. But newer and gets the amenities of being in a preplanned development if you like that kind of thing.

Living in the Wootton school district isn't out of reach. But you can definitely get more for the money if you live elsewhere. But people choose to pay the money to live in the Wootton school district because of the reputation of its schools. So they may settle for the smaller or older home. And even if you're paying the same amount in property taxes, you probably have a lot more house for the money or some features that you really like that would've cost a lot more if it was in an area zoned for a W school.

Wootton is a school, MCPS is the school district. Wootton has had some serious issues in the past five years. I wouldn't pay that much to send my child there, especially after the rape.

And this is the type of poster that doesn't contribute.

You know school system employee staff refer to school zones as districts right? In multiple school systems in the area?

It's posters like the above that demand things to be called a certain way instead of focusing on the actual matters.

They're probably the ones that used to spout the "It's all one district and one curriculum belief'

It's okay they'll just go on and pick up whatever new popular words or trends are later.

Actually those things do matter especially when it was preventable. What do you have to offer? We’ve asked many times for suggestions and you have not suggested anything. There is no money in the budget and you refuse crown. You’d rather tantrum and bully vs offer real solutions or wait your turn.

The “wait your turn” poster is still here?

Your question has been answered countless times in this thread, but you don’t like the answer.

No, you don’t want to wait your turn and that’s the issue. You are so entitled that you think you should get priority over other schools with more serious issues.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

They aren’t bringing the county and MCPS down. They were not happy and moved. Nothing wrong with that. The commute to VA is easily 60-120 minutes plus lots of tolls each way.

I'm not saying the people that moved are the people that brought down the county.

I'm saying it's these people who keep shouting and controlling the politics and narrative. They don't make it a very friendly or positive place for people to succeed or even worthwhile to invest in.

It's okay though. They can keep getting their revenue by keeping on building new homes and raising taxes.

Maryland needs to step in and break up MCPS and or Montgomery County. MCPS is one of the largest districts in the country it is too big for its size and is unable to provide a consistent educational experience across the schools it's charged with. EG Why is it such a big deal to move/relocate schools? Well because just a neighborhood over, the schools are not very good. This is not what you see in other counties in Maryland or school districts in other states.

This makes no sense. Our school systems in Md go by county. They could do it, they choose not to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not people commenting on here who will close a "W" school. It will be elected officials. And people who want to keep Wootton and the other "W" schools open probably voted for these officials. These same officials wanted to change the name of the school a couple years back. This might also be a factor. Closing the school certainly eliminates the name. Bussing was also proposed at one point. Think before you vote for these officials

There are no elected officials on the school board or county council who ever expressed wanting to change the name of Wootton. Stop making things up.

There are only two elected officials who were even in office at the time when they approved initiating a review TO SEE IF THERE WAS COMMUNITY INTEREST in changing the name of any school. There was none, so nothing happened. No elected official advocated in support of changing the name of Wootton.

Additionally, no elected official (other than one Gaithersburg city councilmember) has advocated in support of Option H. Stop making things up.

Laura Stewart has been pushing for bussing for years. She hates the W schools and would to see one of them closed because they are an affront to equity.

I'm kind of picking on her because people are saying that she's anti W schools. But I'm trying to figure out what Laura Stewart did to lead her into her current role:

https://laurastewart.org/about-laura

I know she has greatly advocated and worked for what she believes is the betterment of Montgomery County and provides time and effort in a role that many are not willing to do.

But careerwise it says she earned a degree as a paralegal from a community college, vague reference to ten years in telecommunications, then taught music for a bit until COVID 19 when she transitioned to a fulltime volunteer.

So essentially she's a bored housewife. A lot of us know these types where they put a lot of their time, effort and energy into the PTA and are appreciated.

But I think these types of people kind of have an idealistic view of things and don't really understand the reality of things or how some things work.

For example, let's say she does hate W schools, why does she hate people wanting to live in the W school areas and have their kids strive to go to the colleges that students from those areas normally go to? The parents likely has been there and done that and knows what it takes. Then when their kids succeed they actually help and benefit society. They're not just making a living and possibly using resources without really adding to it.

It's like how it's really easy for kids to spend their parent's money. Once it's their own money, they kind of know and appreciate the value of it and are not so quick to waste it. Or how a lot of us, or we knew people, who were strong activists in our younger days but then once we grew up we had to kind of learn to work in the real world and try to benefit it in other ways. If she's not sheltered, she doesn't really know much about the world that some other people live in.

I'm not necessarily looking down on her. But I'm just curious on her background to see why she would have such an anti W school stance if she does. (someone correct me if she doesn't)

And I'm a big fan of Grace Rivera-Oven, and am happy she's the president of the board, and Brenda Wolff because they both seem to be active members of the community that they advocate for. Natalie Zimmerman is a teacher and can give firsthand experience of what's it like in the classroom and school. So am not trying to beat up the members of the BOE.

But it's that type of idealism but not grounded in reality that is leading to the decline in MCPS and Montgomery County.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

They aren’t bringing the county and MCPS down. They were not happy and moved. Nothing wrong with that. The commute to VA is easily 60-120 minutes plus lots of tolls each way.

I'm not saying the people that moved are the people that brought down the county.

I'm saying it's these people who keep shouting and controlling the politics and narrative. They don't make it a very friendly or positive place for people to succeed or even worthwhile to invest in.

It's okay though. They can keep getting their revenue by keeping on building new homes and raising taxes.

Maryland needs to step in and break up MCPS and or Montgomery County. MCPS is one of the largest districts in the country it is too big for its size and is unable to provide a consistent educational experience across the schools it's charged with. EG Why is it such a big deal to move/relocate schools? Well because just a neighborhood over, the schools are not very good. This is not what you see in other counties in Maryland or school districts in other states.

You have not been in other school districts.

Not saying MCPS doesn't have issues, but other districts also have similar issues.

This is purely about income disparity, which is an issue everywhere.

Bottom line is MCPS isn't going to do anything about it and is way out of its league in terms of organization and tools it has to bring to bear. For example, the BOE is run by part time politicians.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Wootton is the affordable W school

Which is why it's the easier target and the one always beat up on.

As previous poster mentioned, once can choose to settle for a little bit less for the money in choosing Wootton vs some other areas.

And the same can be said for choosing Wootton over some of the other richer areas.

But this whole process shows what areas are more protected and in hindsight it is apparent, where some of the schools there don't have to deal with some of the nonsense that some of the Wootton cluster schools did. Those Wayside parents sure didn't want to get zoned to Wootton.

So it may very well be worth it to move to an even older/smaller home in these richer areas but also have more protection against these kinds of things.

No one is targeting or beating up on Wootton. Wootton is just being unrealistic about the boundary situation and crying about it.

First it was unfair that Dufief has to leave the cluster
Second was it is unfair that the school is falling apart
Third is that it is unfair that Wootton needs to move to a new building
Fourth is that it is unfair that Gaithersburg students will be at the new building with Wootton.

Wootton boundaries are right along where the area with Crown. There will be changes to Wootton. You all need to be realistic about the situation.

Changes like:
being moved to a new building miles from the original
a new name
new student cohort
new teachers
new admin
new programs
leveling the old Wootton

Apart from those things it'll be EXACTLY THE SAME.

The bolded has no basis in fact.
If Wootton were moved to a holding school for a year while the current building was leveled and a new building in its place, would you have an issue? No. So that is not a thing.
There may be an additional student cohort, not splitting up the current one.

So yes, there will be changes- many students very much inconvenienced by traveling to a new location. That is real. Yes, there will be a new name, but I can't see the meaningful argument for why that matters much. And...tell me why additional students is a bad thing?

Of course there will be teacher and admin turnover. That's what happens when a school closes and another opens. As for students, they're proposing to add a couple extra ES and they'll probably remove an ES or two which changes the cohort. Change is bad when things are working well and Wooton is one of the state's best high schools. Just admit that you hate the W schools and want to see them eliminated.

That's not why there would be turnover. There is turnover yearly at every school. Usually, teachers want closer to home, better admin, teaching their actual classes they were train for, etc.

Your kids will be ok if they add another ES. Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income and not just rich pretending they are low income.

I'm glad we agree that when a school closes and a new one opens there are reasons new teachers might to want to teach there or existing teachers might find it too far and this will cause more turnover than usual. And you outed yourself as an anti-W school, pro-busser with "Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income."

Yeah I'm not a fan of them and is a reason why we purposely avoided some of the richer areas... Yes we're one of the ones that could've afforded to live somewhere more expensive but didn't want our kids in that environment.

But some people honestly can live in a segregated world and that's their world. And it's fine. It's just different worlds and classes.

But some of these "anti-W school" people think that their point of view or world is the right way and how everyone should do and see things.

It goes back to the debate about county wide magnet programs. Some of these students are coming out and benefiting society and leading change. Whereas a lot of posters on here are saying that enrichment isn't needed for these types of students and the focus should be for the greater population who are struggling.

It's the same point of view when it comes to wanting to tear down W schools or forcing mixed demographics or integration. If they do that, can they guarantee the same level of academic rigor and standards that some of these families were looking for in choosing an area to live in and send their kids to?

The W schools have advanced classes for these students. Its the kids in the other schools that are lacking in course offerings that need the magnets to achieve to the same level.

This is kind of the mentality out there, where people want things for free.

Maybe five or ten years ago on this forum people would post, "It's all one school district. It's all the same curriculum" And that was a very naive way of thinking. And people that knew, knew which schools to look for and why some areas were more desirable and expensive than others. In the Wootton school district there are rentals available, both homes and townhomes. And they have the apartments over by the Traville Shopping Center. And there were some homes with multiple families living there. The specific cases I'm thinking of are African immigrants. So yeah believe it or not there are URM minorities in the Wootton school district.

So people were willing to sacrifice to give their kids a chance for a better education.

Fast forward to now, people are realizing there really is an inequality between schools. Such as in the different levels of rigor in the same class in different schools, leading to limited advanced offerings at some schools because supposedly there weren't enough students interested and qualified for it.

And instead of looking at the root of the problem and trying to improve it to make more students qualified for the classes, they're saying it's not fair so we should make it equal for everyone. So those people who decided to take the "grasshopper" route by buying a really nice house on a nice plot of land say that no one should take the really advanced classes or be in the advanced programs because not everyone qualifies for it. Or trying to mix the W students in with some other populations so there would be enough students for the advanced classes. But some of these students come from different elementary schools with the same different levels of preparation. So what happens if some of them can't perform or keep up with the material? Well MCPS doesn't fail anyone, so they'll slow down the curriculum for everyone in the class and school.

If people say they purposely avoid Wootton because they didn't want their kids in a pressure cooker environment, well don't complain that Wootton and other W schools have more advanced classes than other schools. Because that pressure cooker environment is what pushed kids to be able to take those courses and eligible for the countywide programs.

No one is asking for anything for free. We all all paying taxes to support the schools and all our kids should get equal opportunities. There are enough kids to take the advanced classes but there ae also more average kids than advanced and the prinicipals choose to use their allocations on the average kids vs. doing a mix good for all.

If you look at this document, the max MPDU rental rate for a one bedroom in high rise with someone with a max annual salary of $80500 is $1680/month:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DHCA/Resources/Files/housing/affordable/publications/mpdu/calculate_rental_rates.pdf

This rental in Rio island assigned to Wootton is $1628/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/eaves-Washingtonian-Center/apartment/22011115

This townhome is for sale for $675000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/554-Monet-Dr-20850/home/10518574

This recently listed home now under contract listed for $785000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/2892-Balmoral-Dr-20850/home/10510799

And these apartments not in Rio island are about $2500/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/Avalon-at-Traville/apartment/22011398

The homes in Wootton aren't necessarily inaccessible. But a lot of the pricing is because you're paying for the schools.

For example instead of paying $785000 for a 1830 square foot 60 year old single family home listed above, you chose to buy this new build home for $800k recently under contract:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Montgomery-Village/9759-Stewartown-Rd-20886/unit-P45/home/196137281

You're paying more in property taxes. But you also chose to go for the newer and bigger home and most likely didn't take schools as much into account.

Or if you want something closer, this home in the Lakelands:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/528-Market-Mews-E-20878/home/11183064

Not much bigger. But newer and gets the amenities of being in a preplanned development if you like that kind of thing.

Living in the Wootton school district isn't out of reach. But you can definitely get more for the money if you live elsewhere. But people choose to pay the money to live in the Wootton school district because of the reputation of its schools. So they may settle for the smaller or older home. And even if you're paying the same amount in property taxes, you probably have a lot more house for the money or some features that you really like that would've cost a lot more if it was in an area zoned for a W school.

Wootton is a school, MCPS is the school district. Wootton has had some serious issues in the past five years. I wouldn't pay that much to send my child there, especially after the rape.

And this is the type of poster that doesn't contribute.

You know school system employee staff refer to school zones as districts right? In multiple school systems in the area?

It's posters like the above that demand things to be called a certain way instead of focusing on the actual matters.

They're probably the ones that used to spout the "It's all one district and one curriculum belief'

It's okay they'll just go on and pick up whatever new popular words or trends are later.

Actually those things do matter especially when it was preventable. What do you have to offer? We’ve asked many times for suggestions and you have not suggested anything. There is no money in the budget and you refuse crown. You’d rather tantrum and bully vs offer real solutions or wait your turn.

The “wait your turn” poster is still here?

Your question has been answered countless times in this thread, but you don’t like the answer.

No, you don’t want to wait your turn and that’s the issue. You are so entitled that you think you should get priority over other schools with more serious issues.

Fine, we will wait our turn. Leave us alone.

What else ya got?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not people commenting on here who will close a "W" school. It will be elected officials. And people who want to keep Wootton and the other "W" schools open probably voted for these officials. These same officials wanted to change the name of the school a couple years back. This might also be a factor. Closing the school certainly eliminates the name. Bussing was also proposed at one point. Think before you vote for these officials

There are no elected officials on the school board or county council who ever expressed wanting to change the name of Wootton. Stop making things up.

There are only two elected officials who were even in office at the time when they approved initiating a review TO SEE IF THERE WAS COMMUNITY INTEREST in changing the name of any school. There was none, so nothing happened. No elected official advocated in support of changing the name of Wootton.

Additionally, no elected official (other than one Gaithersburg city councilmember) has advocated in support of Option H. Stop making things up.

Laura Stewart has been pushing for bussing for years. She hates the W schools and would to see one of them closed because they are an affront to equity.

I'm kind of picking on her because people are saying that she's anti W schools. But I'm trying to figure out what Laura Stewart did to lead her into her current role:

https://laurastewart.org/about-laura

I know she has greatly advocated and worked for what she believes is the betterment of Montgomery County and provides time and effort in a role that many are not willing to do.

But careerwise it says she earned a degree as a paralegal from a community college, vague reference to ten years in telecommunications, then taught music for a bit until COVID 19 when she transitioned to a fulltime volunteer.

So essentially she's a bored housewife. A lot of us know these types where they put a lot of their time, effort and energy into the PTA and are appreciated.

But I think these types of people kind of have an idealistic view of things and don't really understand the reality of things or how some things work.

For example, let's say she does hate W schools, why does she hate people wanting to live in the W school areas and have their kids strive to go to the colleges that students from those areas normally go to? The parents likely has been there and done that and knows what it takes. Then when their kids succeed they actually help and benefit society. They're not just making a living and possibly using resources without really adding to it.

It's like how it's really easy for kids to spend their parent's money. Once it's their own money, they kind of know and appreciate the value of it and are not so quick to waste it. Or how a lot of us, or we knew people, who were strong activists in our younger days but then once we grew up we had to kind of learn to work in the real world and try to benefit it in other ways. If she's not sheltered, she doesn't really know much about the world that some other people live in.

I'm not necessarily looking down on her. But I'm just curious on her background to see why she would have such an anti W school stance if she does. (someone correct me if she doesn't)

And I'm a big fan of Grace Rivera-Oven, and am happy she's the president of the board, and Brenda Wolff because they both seem to be active members of the community that they advocate for. Natalie Zimmerman is a teacher and can give firsthand experience of what's it like in the classroom and school. So am not trying to beat up the members of the BOE.

But it's that type of idealism but not grounded in reality that is leading to the decline in MCPS and Montgomery County.

Except Grace, the president of the BOE came to the town hall meeting a few weeks ago without even knowing what option H was.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not people commenting on here who will close a "W" school. It will be elected officials. And people who want to keep Wootton and the other "W" schools open probably voted for these officials. These same officials wanted to change the name of the school a couple years back. This might also be a factor. Closing the school certainly eliminates the name. Bussing was also proposed at one point. Think before you vote for these officials

There are no elected officials on the school board or county council who ever expressed wanting to change the name of Wootton. Stop making things up.

There are only two elected officials who were even in office at the time when they approved initiating a review TO SEE IF THERE WAS COMMUNITY INTEREST in changing the name of any school. There was none, so nothing happened. No elected official advocated in support of changing the name of Wootton.

Additionally, no elected official (other than one Gaithersburg city councilmember) has advocated in support of Option H. Stop making things up.

Laura Stewart has been pushing for bussing for years. She hates the W schools and would to see one of them closed because they are an affront to equity.

I'm kind of picking on her because people are saying that she's anti W schools. But I'm trying to figure out what Laura Stewart did to lead her into her current role:

https://laurastewart.org/about-laura

I know she has greatly advocated and worked for what she believes is the betterment of Montgomery County and provides time and effort in a role that many are not willing to do.

But careerwise it says she earned a degree as a paralegal from a community college, vague reference to ten years in telecommunications, then taught music for a bit until COVID 19 when she transitioned to a fulltime volunteer.

So essentially she's a bored housewife. A lot of us know these types where they put a lot of their time, effort and energy into the PTA and are appreciated.

But I think these types of people kind of have an idealistic view of things and don't really understand the reality of things or how some things work.

For example, let's say she does hate W schools, why does she hate people wanting to live in the W school areas and have their kids strive to go to the colleges that students from those areas normally go to? The parents likely has been there and done that and knows what it takes. Then when their kids succeed they actually help and benefit society. They're not just making a living and possibly using resources without really adding to it.

It's like how it's really easy for kids to spend their parent's money. Once it's their own money, they kind of know and appreciate the value of it and are not so quick to waste it. Or how a lot of us, or we knew people, who were strong activists in our younger days but then once we grew up we had to kind of learn to work in the real world and try to benefit it in other ways. If she's not sheltered, she doesn't really know much about the world that some other people live in.

I'm not necessarily looking down on her. But I'm just curious on her background to see why she would have such an anti W school stance if she does. (someone correct me if she doesn't)

And I'm a big fan of Grace Rivera-Oven, and am happy she's the president of the board, and Brenda Wolff because they both seem to be active members of the community that they advocate for. Natalie Zimmerman is a teacher and can give firsthand experience of what's it like in the classroom and school. So am not trying to beat up the members of the BOE.

But it's that type of idealism but not grounded in reality that is leading to the decline in MCPS and Montgomery County.

Except Grace, the president of the BOE came to the town hall meeting a few weeks ago without even knowing what option H was.

lol, like I said she advocates and cares about her community and they did seemingly spring Option H suddenly out of nowhere. Just giving her excuses because like I said, she's one of the ones I like.

Rita Montoya kind of has a neat background too. I originally was questioning why she always seems be attending meetings online but looking at her profile, she was a public defender for a while going through community college beforehand:

https://bethesdamagazine.com/voters-guide/board-of-education/rita-montoya/

Karla Silvestre, people on DCUM always says she has ulterior purposes due to her position at MC.

Julie Yang came from schools as well. I think some people on DCUM pick on her, claiming that they can't understand what she says. I have no issues understanding her, although her deliveries sometimes might be kind of rough. She seems okay though. Although some people in the Wootton community aren't happy with her for not advocating for them and only watching out for Churchill instead.

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Anonymous wrote:No they don't listen and won't listen in the future. Look at the regional program roll-out. How many threads and posts you've seen here expressing concerns or oppositions? Even if only 50% of them actually wrote emails or filled the survey (i.e., the tiny little orange button saying "having a question?"), they should have received thousands of negative feedbacks. Look at the MCCPTA and MCEA opposition on this. Look at the study team's shout on the opinion article....

Now look at their proposed operating budget and the fact that Mr. O's "promotion" to join the CO? They have decided long time ago and don't every care a penny what you think.

That's fine if they decide to do that.

But they also risk making a less desirable place to live.

That's why maybe just fifteen or twenty years ago, MCPS was head to head with Fairfax County. Fairfax is now at number five in the list of wealthiest counties in the US and Montgomery County is down at twenty now:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-income_counties_in_the_United_States

Same county size, used to be similar populations. But one is able to maintain and improve, while the other declines.

It's been stated before, the middle class of all races are determining there's more for the money and better quality in surrounding areas outside of Montgomery County. Wilde Lake Middle School in Howard County serves it's Black population better than Ridgeview, which have similar size and population, in Montgomery:
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/50/1305522.page

Urbana is serving all of it's student groups better than Montgomery County does.

So no, the flight is not just one or two specific families someone might know. It's a lot and we've been seeing it over the last ten years.

Montgomery County still has some pockets that do well. But now they're talking about eliminating those too.

Let's see how that works with attracting and retaining residents in the next ten or fifteen years.

I live in Churchill, and I plan to move to NoVA after my elder one done with MCPS. I've seen enough and disappointed enough. Several of my elder DCs' friends went to NoVA in the past few years and they seemed happy.

I don't think I really participated in the Fairfax vs Montgomery County debates in the past. But people used to post how people who grew up in Montgomery County usually don't go over to Virginia. But in fact we know whole a whole group of friends who graduated from Churchill and moved together into the same neighborhood in Fairfax. Some of these members were investors who seeked to revitalize the Wheaton area, to model the revitalization of Arlington and Alexandria went through several years prior, but met too much opposition from the residents there. So decided that Virginia/Fairfax was the better area. In hindsight, maybe they weren't wrong.

And it's exactly those types of residents who insist on bringing down Montgomery County and MCPS.

They aren’t bringing the county and MCPS down. They were not happy and moved. Nothing wrong with that. The commute to VA is easily 60-120 minutes plus lots of tolls each way.

I'm not saying the people that moved are the people that brought down the county.

I'm saying it's these people who keep shouting and controlling the politics and narrative. They don't make it a very friendly or positive place for people to succeed or even worthwhile to invest in.

It's okay though. They can keep getting their revenue by keeping on building new homes and raising taxes.

Maryland needs to step in and break up MCPS and or Montgomery County. MCPS is one of the largest districts in the country it is too big for its size and is unable to provide a consistent educational experience across the schools it's charged with. EG Why is it such a big deal to move/relocate schools? Well because just a neighborhood over, the schools are not very good. This is not what you see in other counties in Maryland or school districts in other states.

You have not been in other school districts.

Not saying MCPS doesn't have issues, but other districts also have similar issues.

This is purely about income disparity, which is an issue everywhere.

Bottom line is MCPS isn't going to do anything about it and is way out of its league in terms of organization and tools it has to bring to bear. For example, the BOE is run by part time politicians.

again, you have not been part of any other school district.

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Anonymous wrote:Wootton is the affordable W school

Which is why it's the easier target and the one always beat up on.

As previous poster mentioned, once can choose to settle for a little bit less for the money in choosing Wootton vs some other areas.

And the same can be said for choosing Wootton over some of the other richer areas.

But this whole process shows what areas are more protected and in hindsight it is apparent, where some of the schools there don't have to deal with some of the nonsense that some of the Wootton cluster schools did. Those Wayside parents sure didn't want to get zoned to Wootton.

So it may very well be worth it to move to an even older/smaller home in these richer areas but also have more protection against these kinds of things.

No one is targeting or beating up on Wootton. Wootton is just being unrealistic about the boundary situation and crying about it.

First it was unfair that Dufief has to leave the cluster
Second was it is unfair that the school is falling apart
Third is that it is unfair that Wootton needs to move to a new building
Fourth is that it is unfair that Gaithersburg students will be at the new building with Wootton.

Wootton boundaries are right along where the area with Crown. There will be changes to Wootton. You all need to be realistic about the situation.

Changes like:
being moved to a new building miles from the original
a new name
new student cohort
new teachers
new admin
new programs
leveling the old Wootton

Apart from those things it'll be EXACTLY THE SAME.

The bolded has no basis in fact.
If Wootton were moved to a holding school for a year while the current building was leveled and a new building in its place, would you have an issue? No. So that is not a thing.
There may be an additional student cohort, not splitting up the current one.

So yes, there will be changes- many students very much inconvenienced by traveling to a new location. That is real. Yes, there will be a new name, but I can't see the meaningful argument for why that matters much. And...tell me why additional students is a bad thing?

Of course there will be teacher and admin turnover. That's what happens when a school closes and another opens. As for students, they're proposing to add a couple extra ES and they'll probably remove an ES or two which changes the cohort. Change is bad when things are working well and Wooton is one of the state's best high schools. Just admit that you hate the W schools and want to see them eliminated.

That's not why there would be turnover. There is turnover yearly at every school. Usually, teachers want closer to home, better admin, teaching their actual classes they were train for, etc.

Your kids will be ok if they add another ES. Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income and not just rich pretending they are low income.

I'm glad we agree that when a school closes and a new one opens there are reasons new teachers might to want to teach there or existing teachers might find it too far and this will cause more turnover than usual. And you outed yourself as an anti-W school, pro-busser with "Its a good learning lesson for them to be in the real world with actual low income."

Yeah I'm not a fan of them and is a reason why we purposely avoided some of the richer areas... Yes we're one of the ones that could've afforded to live somewhere more expensive but didn't want our kids in that environment.

But some people honestly can live in a segregated world and that's their world. And it's fine. It's just different worlds and classes.

But some of these "anti-W school" people think that their point of view or world is the right way and how everyone should do and see things.

It goes back to the debate about county wide magnet programs. Some of these students are coming out and benefiting society and leading change. Whereas a lot of posters on here are saying that enrichment isn't needed for these types of students and the focus should be for the greater population who are struggling.

It's the same point of view when it comes to wanting to tear down W schools or forcing mixed demographics or integration. If they do that, can they guarantee the same level of academic rigor and standards that some of these families were looking for in choosing an area to live in and send their kids to?

The W schools have advanced classes for these students. Its the kids in the other schools that are lacking in course offerings that need the magnets to achieve to the same level.

This is kind of the mentality out there, where people want things for free.

Maybe five or ten years ago on this forum people would post, "It's all one school district. It's all the same curriculum" And that was a very naive way of thinking. And people that knew, knew which schools to look for and why some areas were more desirable and expensive than others. In the Wootton school district there are rentals available, both homes and townhomes. And they have the apartments over by the Traville Shopping Center. And there were some homes with multiple families living there. The specific cases I'm thinking of are African immigrants. So yeah believe it or not there are URM minorities in the Wootton school district.

So people were willing to sacrifice to give their kids a chance for a better education.

Fast forward to now, people are realizing there really is an inequality between schools. Such as in the different levels of rigor in the same class in different schools, leading to limited advanced offerings at some schools because supposedly there weren't enough students interested and qualified for it.

And instead of looking at the root of the problem and trying to improve it to make more students qualified for the classes, they're saying it's not fair so we should make it equal for everyone. So those people who decided to take the "grasshopper" route by buying a really nice house on a nice plot of land say that no one should take the really advanced classes or be in the advanced programs because not everyone qualifies for it. Or trying to mix the W students in with some other populations so there would be enough students for the advanced classes. But some of these students come from different elementary schools with the same different levels of preparation. So what happens if some of them can't perform or keep up with the material? Well MCPS doesn't fail anyone, so they'll slow down the curriculum for everyone in the class and school.

If people say they purposely avoid Wootton because they didn't want their kids in a pressure cooker environment, well don't complain that Wootton and other W schools have more advanced classes than other schools. Because that pressure cooker environment is what pushed kids to be able to take those courses and eligible for the countywide programs.

No one is asking for anything for free. We all all paying taxes to support the schools and all our kids should get equal opportunities. There are enough kids to take the advanced classes but there ae also more average kids than advanced and the prinicipals choose to use their allocations on the average kids vs. doing a mix good for all.

If you look at this document, the max MPDU rental rate for a one bedroom in high rise with someone with a max annual salary of $80500 is $1680/month:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DHCA/Resources/Files/housing/affordable/publications/mpdu/calculate_rental_rates.pdf

This rental in Rio island assigned to Wootton is $1628/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/eaves-Washingtonian-Center/apartment/22011115

This townhome is for sale for $675000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/554-Monet-Dr-20850/home/10518574

This recently listed home now under contract listed for $785000:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/2892-Balmoral-Dr-20850/home/10510799

And these apartments not in Rio island are about $2500/month:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Rockville/Avalon-at-Traville/apartment/22011398

The homes in Wootton aren't necessarily inaccessible. But a lot of the pricing is because you're paying for the schools.

For example instead of paying $785000 for a 1830 square foot 60 year old single family home listed above, you chose to buy this new build home for $800k recently under contract:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Montgomery-Village/9759-Stewartown-Rd-20886/unit-P45/home/196137281

You're paying more in property taxes. But you also chose to go for the newer and bigger home and most likely didn't take schools as much into account.

Or if you want something closer, this home in the Lakelands:
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Gaithersburg/528-Market-Mews-E-20878/home/11183064

Not much bigger. But newer and gets the amenities of being in a preplanned development if you like that kind of thing.

Living in the Wootton school district isn't out of reach. But you can definitely get more for the money if you live elsewhere. But people choose to pay the money to live in the Wootton school district because of the reputation of its schools. So they may settle for the smaller or older home. And even if you're paying the same amount in property taxes, you probably have a lot more house for the money or some features that you really like that would've cost a lot more if it was in an area zoned for a W school.

Wootton is a school, MCPS is the school district. Wootton has had some serious issues in the past five years. I wouldn't pay that much to send my child there, especially after the rape.

And this is the type of poster that doesn't contribute.

You know school system employee staff refer to school zones as districts right? In multiple school systems in the area?

It's posters like the above that demand things to be called a certain way instead of focusing on the actual matters.

They're probably the ones that used to spout the "It's all one district and one curriculum belief'

It's okay they'll just go on and pick up whatever new popular words or trends are later.

Actually those things do matter especially when it was preventable. What do you have to offer? We’ve asked many times for suggestions and you have not suggested anything. There is no money in the budget and you refuse crown. You’d rather tantrum and bully vs offer real solutions or wait your turn.

The “wait your turn” poster is still here?

Your question has been answered countless times in this thread, but you don’t like the answer.

No, you don’t want to wait your turn and that’s the issue. You are so entitled that you think you should get priority over other schools with more serious issues.

Fine, we will wait our turn. Leave us alone.

What else ya got?

dp.. ok, then don't complain about having to send your kids to a dilapidated school.