What happened to this California family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I understand why it's being proposed but the heat stroke theory doesn't ring true to me. All dropped dead within feet of each other? If one was in distress, wouldn't everyone stop and rest? Wouldn't the dog have run on? Just doesn't make sense.

I think I read the dog was on a leash and clipped to the dad.

There was another hike mentioned on her IG, pre baby, that the husband and wife did in the blazing sun and they had to take multiple breaks she mentions. Of course on that hike, there appear to be trees they could rest under unlike their last deadly hike.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They may not have realized how close they were to hearstroke/death while they were trying to save the dog as well. Maybe if they did they would have acted differently but maybe not. Dogs have become like humans to many of us.

+1

I would never leave my dog behind to die alone.

Darwinism for dog owners.

I’d rather die with my dog than live with sh1theads like you.

You'd risk your baby's life to save a dog?

Google the Hites Cove Trail and the Lundy Sauvage Trail. Some are speculating that they meant to take the easier Hites Cove Trail although there was some evidence the husband had hiked that trail before. The Lundy Sauvage Trail is much more strenuous with no shade, lots of uphills over rocks. If you google you can see what switchbacks are. That trail isn't just a downhill hike with an uphill return. The switchbacks themselves can be up and down. Their decision to hike this trail under these conditions at this time of day with a baby and a dog make no sense.



I wouldn’t leave the dog out tied up alone. Parents could split up.

Seems like they did. It didn’t work.

I don't think they did. According to reports, they have only mentioned the water on the husband. If they split up, she needed the water to finish the last 1.5 miles. Leaving him the water would be suicide.

Well, judging by the results….

It is really puzzling. According to the reports, the pack held about 3L of water. That's not even a gallon. For an 8 mile hike in heat, that seems awfully low. According to experts, your body can absorb about 1L/hour of water.

We will likely never know, but I gather they took the wrong path and went down the switchback. They got to the bottom, realized their mistake, but it was too late at that point. The 1.5 mile hike back up in +100F weather, would be very difficult.

Which way would they have been meaning to go instead? I’m not familiar with trails and I don’t understand what people mean by the loop… if they hiked all the way down the easy path and turned around right before the switchbacks, wouldn’t they still have had 4 miles in the heat back the way they came?

[Anonymous]

Hopefully there is now greater awareness of how heat stroke can act quickly and kill you. I had no idea before this and I've been hiking for years. I always figured just take enough water, stay hydrated and you're good.
What happened to this family hit home with me because I encountered a situation this summer. My younger son loves hiking our neighborhood trail and really wanted to go out. It was in the 90s but I figured we'd just bring plenty of water. The trail runs alongside a creek and completely shaded by the canopy of trees. We've hiked this trail for many years, and round trip to the house and back is only a couple miles. It usually takes us a couple hours, he likes to explore various areas of the creek.

On this particular day my son had a hard time. We were really sweating from the heat. Even under the shade of the trees. We got maybe half a mile from home and he couldn't go on. He just sat on the ground. I let him rest about 10 minutes and tried to hydrate him. Then I was able to get him walking again. As we got closer to home and he started throwing up. Thankfully we made it back and he was able to cool off and rest.

Now that I understand more about heat exhaustion, I can see how his body was under distress. And this was just a 2 mile hike with no steep incline. It can happen to anyone and it happened quickly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After reading through all the information, it doesn't sound like they intended to do a day long hike. And if the dog didn't have protection for it's feet, Jonathan probably found himself trying to carry the dog AND the baby. With the scorching temperatures, he reached a point where he simply couldn't go any further. He was probably also developing heat stroke. And that's why he was found in the sitting position with the dog and baby next to him.
Then his wife was also succumbing to heat stroke. I gather they were trying to stick together as a group, but when Jonathan couldn't go any further she ventured ahead to seek help. Maybe due to her health issues she couldn't take the baby with her. By then it was too late. Soon after she also collapsed.
Very heartbreaking and tragic.

I think this is right, and I’ve been posting on this thread since the 3rd page.

At the end, sticking together is what killed them. At a certain point, you need to ditch the “fur baby” if you’re struggling to physically save yourself or a child. I know it’s terrible, but the best course of action was to leave the dog behind tied up in a shady location. That older dog with the heavy fur likely began having trouble first, either thru burned paws or heat exhaustion. I’m willing to bet money on it. They then killed themselves struggling to help the dog.

Had they managed to get back to safety and cell phone reception, they could’ve called the park service and gotten the fire gate unlocked. The rancher could then drive the fire road to rescue the dog.

I think the big story here is that people need to be a lot more careful when taking their pets on outdoor adventures. If something bad happens, you need to face the fact that you may be put in a situation where you will need to sacrifice your animal. This recently happened to a friend of mine who was involved in a sinking sailboat incident off the coast of California - his dog was left on the boat and lost at sea.

I'm sorry to hear that about your friend and glad to hear that he was safe. Why couldn't they take the dog with them to shore, if you don't mind me asking? Asking as I like to take my dog with me on trips.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They may not have realized how close they were to hearstroke/death while they were trying to save the dog as well. Maybe if they did they would have acted differently but maybe not. Dogs have become like humans to many of us.

This is so sad and really hits home for me. I can frankly see myself doing this for my dog. And it’s going to result in me being a lot more careful and intentional in high temperatures

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Could be a boulder

There would have been blunt force trauma that would have shown up on an autopsy.

Lol. For the second time: “Tell me you haven’t read the thread without telling me you haven’t read the thread.”

It’s 71 pages - if I hadn’t seen the original boulder idiocy I would have said the same.

I refuse to believe their are two Boulder boosters

NP
What’s this about boulders? I don’t get it.

DP. Somebody earlier in the thread earnestly put forth outlandish theories involving this family being hit by a Boulder or tree branch or being run over by a motorbike and it has become something of a running joke throughout this thread.

That would be me. I didn't mean they were run over (there would be obvious signs of that). I meant there could have been a scenario in which they were injured or exhausted by dealing with a biker, tree branch, boulder, or mountain lion (and I threw in an alien for fun). I'm okay with the "Could be a boulder" teasing, but I can do without mean spirited trolls calling me an idiot. I'm not even the one that came up with the permafrost idea, but who cares if people suggest wild things. You guys are beating a dead horse still after 70+ pages. If you think my ideas are outlandish, feel free to enlighten yourselves about the dangers of hiking.

Woman killed by branch
https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2021/06/19/upper-saint-clair-boyce-mayview-park-morton-ravine-trail-woman-killed/
Man crushed by boulder
https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebrity/man-survives-after-being-crushed-by-8000-lb-boulder-on-charity-hike-with-his-daughter/ar-BB1aXBKB
Women killed by rockslide
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tatum-morrel-body-found-missing-hiker-beartooth-mountains-montana/
Woman killed by cougar
https://abcnews.go.com/US/hiker-found-dead-mount-hood-killed-cougar-officials/story?id=57764083
Man chased by mountain lion
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p25MgRZ9rJc
Woman and dog run over by mountain biker (scroll down to second story)
https://bikinginla.com/2021/03/23/da-calls-for-review-police-shootings-la-hiker-run-over-by-e-mtn-biker-and-nba-star-was-sideswiped-by-passing-driver/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Could be a boulder

There would have been blunt force trauma that would have shown up on an autopsy.

Lol. For the second time: “Tell me you haven’t read the thread without telling me you haven’t read the thread.”

It’s 71 pages - if I hadn’t seen the original boulder idiocy I would have said the same.

I refuse to believe their are two Boulder boosters

NP
What’s this about boulders? I don’t get it.

DP. Somebody earlier in the thread earnestly put forth outlandish theories involving this family being hit by a Boulder or tree branch or being run over by a motorbike and it has become something of a running joke throughout this thread.

That would be me. I didn't mean they were run over (there would be obvious signs of that). I meant there could have been a scenario in which they were injured or exhausted by dealing with a biker, tree branch, boulder, or mountain lion (and I threw in an alien for fun). I'm okay with the "Could be a boulder" teasing, but I can do without mean spirited trolls calling me an idiot. I'm not even the one that came up with the permafrost idea, but who cares if people suggest wild things. You guys are beating a dead horse still after 70+ pages. If you think my ideas are outlandish, feel free to enlighten yourselves about the dangers of hiking.

Woman killed by branch
https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2021/06/19/upper-saint-clair-boyce-mayview-park-morton-ravine-trail-woman-killed/
Man crushed by boulder
https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebrity/man-survives-after-being-crushed-by-8000-lb-boulder-on-charity-hike-with-his-daughter/ar-BB1aXBKB
Women killed by rockslide
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tatum-morrel-body-found-missing-hiker-beartooth-mountains-montana/
Woman killed by cougar
https://abcnews.go.com/US/hiker-found-dead-mount-hood-killed-cougar-officials/story?id=57764083
Man chased by mountain lion
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p25MgRZ9rJc
Woman and dog run over by mountain biker (scroll down to second story)
https://bikinginla.com/2021/03/23/da-calls-for-review-police-shootings-la-hiker-run-over-by-e-mtn-biker-and-nba-star-was-sideswiped-by-passing-driver/

The problem with these theories is that there weren't any boulders, branches, rock slides, or bike tracks in the area. A bobcat might be possible, but they pretty much hide during the day.

[Anonymous]

How do you know? Have you been on that hike? Did you watch the video of the mountain lion in daytime? Are you saying that hike had no rocks and no trees? Hikes like that are dusty or gravelly. There may not be bike tracks.

[Anonymous]

Just to clarify, I do think heat stroke is a good possibility but who knows what other accidents could have happened along the way that weakened them.

[Anonymous]

To the branches, biker, rock slides, cougar poster. Get with the program. No visible signs of trauma.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just to clarify, I do think heat stroke is a good possibility but who knows what other accidents could have happened along the way that weakened them.

Well at least we’ve moved past evil spirits (dEViL’s GuLcH) and sneaky chloroform killers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After reading through all the information, it doesn't sound like they intended to do a day long hike. And if the dog didn't have protection for it's feet, Jonathan probably found himself trying to carry the dog AND the baby. With the scorching temperatures, he reached a point where he simply couldn't go any further. He was probably also developing heat stroke. And that's why he was found in the sitting position with the dog and baby next to him.
Then his wife was also succumbing to heat stroke. I gather they were trying to stick together as a group, but when Jonathan couldn't go any further she ventured ahead to seek help. Maybe due to her health issues she couldn't take the baby with her. By then it was too late. Soon after she also collapsed.
Very heartbreaking and tragic.

I think this is right, and I’ve been posting on this thread since the 3rd page.

At the end, sticking together is what killed them. At a certain point, you need to ditch the “fur baby” if you’re struggling to physically save yourself or a child. I know it’s terrible, but the best course of action was to leave the dog behind tied up in a shady location. That older dog with the heavy fur likely began having trouble first, either thru burned paws or heat exhaustion. I’m willing to bet money on it. They then killed themselves struggling to help the dog.

Had they managed to get back to safety and cell phone reception, they could’ve called the park service and gotten the fire gate unlocked. The rancher could then drive the fire road to rescue the dog.

I think the big story here is that people need to be a lot more careful when taking their pets on outdoor adventures. If something bad happens, you need to face the fact that you may be put in a situation where you will need to sacrifice your animal. This recently happened to a friend of mine who was involved in a sinking sailboat incident off the coast of California - his dog was left on the boat and lost at sea.

Or maybe the dad carrying 25 pounds - the 9-month-old and the baby hiking backpack - should have left both at home and the parents should have considered hiking either in less strenuous conditions or without the added weight.

If they waited til Monday when the nanny was there they could have hiked alone and likely been much more cognizant of both their limitations and rising heat complications.

You have no idea it was the dog. I personally think it was the dad who pushed through and didn't realize until too late that he wasn't feeling well. Wife left the dog with him for protection but she didn't make it very far either.

[Anonymous]

It also makes sense to me that they wouldn't been adjusted to the additional weight of the baby who was growing every day.

Born in January, they would have waited until at least June/July to have her out in a solo carrying backpack just so she'd have the neck control of a six-month-old.

Considering that, the arid desert conditions, the temperatures soaring to 100F, I think they took on too much, too soon with the added weight, hydration needs, and the heat intensifying factors of the baby carrier.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After reading through all the information, it doesn't sound like they intended to do a day long hike. And if the dog didn't have protection for it's feet, Jonathan probably found himself trying to carry the dog AND the baby. With the scorching temperatures, he reached a point where he simply couldn't go any further. He was probably also developing heat stroke. And that's why he was found in the sitting position with the dog and baby next to him.
Then his wife was also succumbing to heat stroke. I gather they were trying to stick together as a group, but when Jonathan couldn't go any further she ventured ahead to seek help. Maybe due to her health issues she couldn't take the baby with her. By then it was too late. Soon after she also collapsed.
Very heartbreaking and tragic.

I think this is right, and I’ve been posting on this thread since the 3rd page.

At the end, sticking together is what killed them. At a certain point, you need to ditch the “fur baby” if you’re struggling to physically save yourself or a child. I know it’s terrible, but the best course of action was to leave the dog behind tied up in a shady location. That older dog with the heavy fur likely began having trouble first, either thru burned paws or heat exhaustion. I’m willing to bet money on it. They then killed themselves struggling to help the dog.

Had they managed to get back to safety and cell phone reception, they could’ve called the park service and gotten the fire gate unlocked. The rancher could then drive the fire road to rescue the dog.

I think the big story here is that people need to be a lot more careful when taking their pets on outdoor adventures. If something bad happens, you need to face the fact that you may be put in a situation where you will need to sacrifice your animal. This recently happened to a friend of mine who was involved in a sinking sailboat incident off the coast of California - his dog was left on the boat and lost at sea.

Or maybe the dad carrying 25 pounds - the 9-month-old and the baby hiking backpack - should have left both at home and the parents should have considered hiking either in less strenuous conditions or without the added weight.

If they waited til Monday when the nanny was there they could have hiked alone and likely been much more cognizant of both their limitations and rising heat complications.

You have no idea it was the dog. I personally think it was the dad who pushed through and didn't realize until too late that he wasn't feeling well. Wife left the dog with him for protection but she didn't make it very far either.

I wonder if the autopsy would show injury on the dog's feet? Then it's plausible that Jonathan tried to carry it along the trail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After reading through all the information, it doesn't sound like they intended to do a day long hike. And if the dog didn't have protection for it's feet, Jonathan probably found himself trying to carry the dog AND the baby. With the scorching temperatures, he reached a point where he simply couldn't go any further. He was probably also developing heat stroke. And that's why he was found in the sitting position with the dog and baby next to him.
Then his wife was also succumbing to heat stroke. I gather they were trying to stick together as a group, but when Jonathan couldn't go any further she ventured ahead to seek help. Maybe due to her health issues she couldn't take the baby with her. By then it was too late. Soon after she also collapsed.
Very heartbreaking and tragic.

I think this is right, and I’ve been posting on this thread since the 3rd page.

At the end, sticking together is what killed them. At a certain point, you need to ditch the “fur baby” if you’re struggling to physically save yourself or a child. I know it’s terrible, but the best course of action was to leave the dog behind tied up in a shady location. That older dog with the heavy fur likely began having trouble first, either thru burned paws or heat exhaustion. I’m willing to bet money on it. They then killed themselves struggling to help the dog.

Had they managed to get back to safety and cell phone reception, they could’ve called the park service and gotten the fire gate unlocked. The rancher could then drive the fire road to rescue the dog.

I think the big story here is that people need to be a lot more careful when taking their pets on outdoor adventures. If something bad happens, you need to face the fact that you may be put in a situation where you will need to sacrifice your animal. This recently happened to a friend of mine who was involved in a sinking sailboat incident off the coast of California - his dog was left on the boat and lost at sea.

Or maybe the dad carrying 25 pounds - the 9-month-old and the baby hiking backpack - should have left both at home and the parents should have considered hiking either in less strenuous conditions or without the added weight.

If they waited til Monday when the nanny was there they could have hiked alone and likely been much more cognizant of both their limitations and rising heat complications.

You have no idea it was the dog. I personally think it was the dad who pushed through and didn't realize until too late that he wasn't feeling well. Wife left the dog with him for protection but she didn't make it very far either.

I wonder if the autopsy would show injury on the dog's feet? Then it's plausible that Jonathan tried to carry it along the trail.

I have no doubt it'll be pointed out in the police report when they release it if that's the case. They will examine all of them and it would be easy to see if the dog had torn, bloody or burned paw pads.