Disciplinary action or not? Any Tips?

[Anonymous]

My DD was asked to withdraw from school for lying. She was at a school sponsored social event when she should have been studying and told the same lie about her whereabouts to multiple adults in her private high school. We thought it was harsh punishment for a 1st offence but bc she lied, put herself in the situation and certainly learnt her lesson!

How do we present this to colleges so they can still give her a fair chance especially since she has grown and learnt from her mistake. The school "gave us the option" to withdraw for breaking a school code in leiu of dismissal but I suspect colleges understand that not all withdrawals are voluntary especially happening middle of 11th grade. Her transcript reads "withdrawn" as we left mid semester. She finished out the year with excellent grades at another school and is doing well there.

We were going to narrate the circumstances, show complete remorse and take full responsibility including how she has grown since the incident. Do we report this as a disciplinary action or do we just explain the incident in the additional details section of the application? I dont want to make a bad situation worse than it needs to be but want to be truthful and report it however we need to. Id appreciate the guidance if anyone knows. How do colleges react to these types of incidents and what are the important points to consider.

[Anonymous]

Honestly, it feels a lot lot like you are lying about what happened, or at the very least lying by omission. I’m not buying that a junior in good standing at a private school was told to withdraw or be expelled because she went to a homecoming game or spirit day event when she was supposed to be studying and lied to some teachers. I’m assuming that she skipped or advisory this was a boarding school or …. Even so, that doesn’t get you expelled. It feels like she was on her third strike, or attending homecoming and having sex or doing coke under the bleachers or the “school event” was senior skip day and she got a DUI with other kids in the car, or….

Maybe she was a 4.0 angel who made one misjudgment. And the punishment is way out of proportion. But it feels like you are leaving things out. And if it feels that way to me (who tends to err on the side of suspending the troublemakers so everyone else can learn and am frequently shocked at what doesn’t get serious discipline in DC area public and private schools), it will feel that way to AOs. They is a key detail missing, and whatever you aren’t saying it doesn’t make your kid look good.

A one day suspension gets explained with “I screwed up, skipped advisory to go to the school carnival and led to my advisory teacher. I worked hard to earn back my teachers trust and I learned my lesson.” A withdrawal to avoid suspension just doesn’t.

So, start by telling us the whole story. The way the principal would see it, not her mother’s best spin. Then let people respond.

I suspect that in the end, it’s better to just let the withdrawn stand unexplained and hope her new school gives her a glowing rec. and she has a teacher at her old school who will give at least a neutral rec. then, apply to large schools that deal in numbers and not holistic admissions.

Also realize— they will get transcripts from the old school and ask if there was discipline. So is withdrawal discipline? Don’t ask us. You need to ask the school if they will report it as such. The last thing your kid needs is to say no discipline when her old school says their was.

[Anonymous]

I would be vague since withdrawing midterm could also mean she was being bullied and wanted to start at a new school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would be vague since withdrawing midterm could also mean she was being bullied and wanted to start at a new school.

Or had a health issue or family emergency. The general rule is don’t make AOs guess. But when their worst choice guess is the right one? I’d let them guess.

Also, there is something fishy about this whole story.

[Anonymous]

You need to ask the old school what they will say if the college calls and asks if there were disciplinary actions taken.

FWIW, in my experience, the school will not volunteer information that does not appear on the transcript. But you should ask the school.

Also, many schools have limited their questions about disciplinary matters because it was seen as racially discriminatory because minority kids may be unfairly disciplined at higher rates. Some only ask about criminal activity and some don’t ask at all.

Withdrawal mid year is not that necessarily that suspicious. Kids move all the time for all kinds of reasons.

[Anonymous]

Might it look like she simply changed schools? Does it need to be explained why? Perhaps not?

[Anonymous]

I don’t have any advice but two college apps my kid filled out specifically asked about disciplinary actiiion.

I agree with the PP, that seems like an incredibly severe punishment for a lie.

[Anonymous]

Are disciplinary maters only reported for high school offenses? My child had an offense in 8th grade for which he served detention- does this have to be reported? Not applying to colleges just yet so I’m trying to figure this out. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

My question is what counts as a disciplinary action. This seems like a very defined term (defined by the old school). Her school records are legally your right to see. I would ask them to provide you with any records they have regarding disciplinary actions taken against her while she was there. This will enable you to see whether asking her to withdraw is considered (in their definition) as a disciplinary action. (They can't define it as such to a university and not define it the same way to you.)

You could also ask them to provide you with any records they would provide in the university application process-- this is probably simply a transcript but framing it that way would help you see the full picture.

[Anonymous]

This seems weird. I don’t think you are telling us the whole story.
Which is fine I guess but it is hard to give you a good answer.
If you are trying to whitewash why she was asked to leave, then don’t bring it up at all.
The admissions people will see through your bs.
Was she caught cheating on something big and asked to leave?

[Anonymous]

Well, I don't believe your story, but putting that aside:

1. Will she have to obtain a transcript from School #1, or will School #2 include her grades from School #1? If the latter, I wouldn't think too hard about School #1 any more.

2. Run all this by a lawyer. If you live around DC, you must have a lawyer friend who can parse what is meant by "disciplinary action", both by the colleges to which she is applying and by School #1.

3. Speak to a private college counselor (i.e., one NOT affiliated with your high school) regarding the wisdom of addressing this in the "additional information" section. Personally I think that addressing it draws attention to it and away from the more important parts of her application.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are disciplinary maters only reported for high school offenses? My child had an offense in 8th grade for which he served detention- does this have to be reported? Not applying to colleges just yet so I’m trying to figure this out. Thanks!

No, not for 8th grade and even in high school they're not asking about detention. The question is different for each school, but generally asks if you were suspended or expelled. My DD was suspended in 9th grade and was honest about it on her applications. It did not keep her out of her ED school (top 50). The suspension was not included in her school records (FCPS), but she did not want to start off her college career by lying on the application!

OP your situation is challenging. Because she was allowed to withdraw, she wasn't technically expelled and therefore would not have to disclose. I would get some more informed advice on this though.

[Anonymous]

It sounds like there is more to this story than you are saying or know. If she voluntary withdrew, I'd just say she was homesick or boarding school wasn't a good fit. If she was kicked out, you tell the truth.

[Anonymous]

Sorry if I misled you by the nature of my original post but that was not intended. The omission was not a lie. She really was supposed to be at study hall detention (for being tardy) when she decided instead to go to the school dance and lied about it. Thats all that happened. No cheating, No stealing, No sex or anything else at a dance or any of the other suggestions that have been posted. She messed up by lying because she wanted to be at the dance with her friends and she lied about it. When confronted, she pannicked and lied again but when confronted with the evidence she told the truth and apologized and then it went downhill. It WAS a 1st offense like I said previously and the school confirmed that much. They also confirmed that this was the singular reason for this action and was "advised to withdraw". Although she was wrong we thought it was a little heavy handed but she broke their school rules and "some adults in the community lost faith in her". She is living with the consequences. She is no angel but honestly those are the facts.

The school will not have anything about this in her records and a teacher from the school is writing a letter of recommendation for college on her behalf. They said they "allowed" her to withdraw so we can control the narrative and told us that if asked they will say the family withdrew and any questions should be directed to us. I do not want to lie and know the importance of having her take responsibility for her actions but I also want to know how best to position this to give her a chance. She is very remorseful and working hard to move beyond this.

I appreciate all your comments and thank you for you insights. I welcome any additional input.

[Anonymous]

I say not to disclose. This is exactly what the school was doing. They were helping you by making it a non-disclosable event (kid of like when people settle something with an NDA). Take it and move on.