Why are American women so frumpy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let's take an example.

Size 2-6. Running around town in athleisure. Hair in a top knot.

Frumpy?

Depends on the height. Short and size 6? Certainly not great looking. Quite tall and size 6? Probably not frumpy. Depends on athletic clothes. Also, athleisure is just that athletic wear, what a stupid term. Why is an older woman wearing tights and yoga pants to run around town? So, basically, yes, she is frumpy. What jeans and a t shirt are hard to put on?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re feminists who value comfort over the male gaze.

Women don't dress for men, women dress for other women, even the indignant frumpy ones. The indignant frumpy ones think they are "choosing not to care" when they are often hanging around with other women who "choose not to care" so basically they are sheeple just swinging in the other direction.

I personally make an effort most days because I like makeup, dresses, heels and all of that, but yeah, there are times I DGAF and wear soft clothes with elastic waistbands.

Women you view as frumpy are simply enlightened. Women who continue to fuss unnecessarily about these arbitrary and in some cases harmful “standards “ for womens’ appearance need to wake up. If you continue to waste time and energy on these things, that’s bad enough, but telling other women what they “need” to do is way out of line. You contribute to the objectification and oppression of women when you perpetuate these “standards “.

Focus on your health, physical and mental. The rest is nonsense cooked up to sell you products you do not need. Don’t be such a sucker.

Are women with messy and ugly homes enlightened?

Are women with dirty cars enlightened?

Are women with babies with spitup and slovenly clothes enlightened?

Are families with messy yards full of weeds enlightened?

I think being dressed in a neat and tidy way is one thing, and manis/pedis, hair curling, makeup, heels, and push up bras is another. These are only requirements for women, thus they are sexist.

None of those are requirements for women in our society. I know plenty of women who don't use/wear these things, or do so only to the extent to which suits them personally.

The title of this thread is "why are American women so frumpy"? To many people, it is indeed a requirement to do these things in order not to be considered frumpy. A woman in flats with limp hair and no makeup will certainly be indicted as a frump by many.

Hair curling? LOL! Do you live in a retirement community?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's take an example.

Size 2-6. Running around town in athleisure. Hair in a top knot.

Frumpy?

Depends on the height. Short and size 6? Certainly not great looking. Quite tall and size 6? Probably not frumpy. Depends on athletic clothes. Also, athleisure is just that athletic wear, what a stupid term. Why is an older woman wearing tights and yoga pants to run around town? So, basically, yes, she is frumpy. What jeans and a t shirt are hard to put on?

+ 1

She can wear a chic t shirt, jeans and ballet flats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's take an example.

Size 2-6. Running around town in athleisure. Hair in a top knot.

Frumpy?

Depends on the height. Short and size 6? Certainly not great looking. Quite tall and size 6? Probably not frumpy. Depends on athletic clothes. Also, athleisure is just that athletic wear, what a stupid term. Why is an older woman wearing tights and yoga pants to run around town? So, basically, yes, she is frumpy. What jeans and a t shirt are hard to put on?

+ 1

She can wear a chic t shirt, jeans and ballet flats.

To go to Target or the grocery store? No. To a restaurant? Yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re feminists who value comfort over the male gaze.

Women don't dress for men, women dress for other women, even the indignant frumpy ones. The indignant frumpy ones think they are "choosing not to care" when they are often hanging around with other women who "choose not to care" so basically they are sheeple just swinging in the other direction.

I personally make an effort most days because I like makeup, dresses, heels and all of that, but yeah, there are times I DGAF and wear soft clothes with elastic waistbands.

Women you view as frumpy are simply enlightened. Women who continue to fuss unnecessarily about these arbitrary and in some cases harmful “standards “ for womens’ appearance need to wake up. If you continue to waste time and energy on these things, that’s bad enough, but telling other women what they “need” to do is way out of line. You contribute to the objectification and oppression of women when you perpetuate these “standards “.

Focus on your health, physical and mental. The rest is nonsense cooked up to sell you products you do not need. Don’t be such a sucker.

No, I am not objectifying women but it's funny to me that, like I said earlier the INDIGNANT frumpy women who are "choosing" not to care what they look like think they are making a choice to not be eye candy or whatever when you are just the other side of the same coin you are angry about. You dress frumpy for other WOMEN because it signals some kind of virtue and smugness about how you don't care what you look like because YOU ARE NOT EYE CANDY! YOU ARE BUCKING THE PATRIARCHY!!!!!!!!

I generally take pride in my appearance and if when I am better groomed and not in my soft clothes I am eye candy for other women or men well, OK. ::shrug:: I don't care if you don't care what you look like, I just care that I care what I look like.

No. You really don't get it. I have no "frumpy standard" to which I aspire. I'm interested in being happy and comfortable. I don't make clothing choices in the morning or at a store based on trying to stick it to the Man or stick it to women who waste their time on this stuff or to appeal to other frumpy women, etc. etc. etc. I pick clothes that are comfortable and functional for ME, based on my life and my profession or what I'm doing with the kids that day. I give no thought to people like you. I give no thought to women who may be like-minded in their fashion choices. I'm not interested in being smug at anyone else's expense. For all your "shrugs" I suspect you care more than you will admit.

But when I see threads like this, they make me sad. Not for myself, but for people like you. And for girls coming up in the world, whose mothers will pass on all this unnecessary baggage.
I've just gotten under your skin, because you understand, somewhere down in there, that what I'm saying is true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's take an example.

Size 2-6. Running around town in athleisure. Hair in a top knot.

Frumpy?

Depends on the height. Short and size 6? Certainly not great looking. Quite tall and size 6? Probably not frumpy. Depends on athletic clothes. Also, athleisure is just that athletic wear, what a stupid term. Why is an older woman wearing tights and yoga pants to run around town? So, basically, yes, she is frumpy. What jeans and a t shirt are hard to put on?

+ 1

She can wear a chic t shirt, jeans and ballet flats.

Then, that becomes the new outfit for people to complain about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's take an example.

Size 2-6. Running around town in athleisure. Hair in a top knot.

Frumpy?

Depends on the height. Short and size 6? Certainly not great looking. Quite tall and size 6? Probably not frumpy. Depends on athletic clothes. Also, athleisure is just that athletic wear, what a stupid term. Why is an older woman wearing tights and yoga pants to run around town? So, basically, yes, she is frumpy. What jeans and a t shirt are hard to put on?

+ 1

She can wear a chic t shirt, jeans and ballet flats.

Then, that becomes the new outfit for people to complain about.

This. Woman will find ways to tear each other down.

If everyone wore T-shirt, jeans and ballet flats (yuck) they would say how hard is it to pull on a simple dress and kitten heels or how hard is it to throw on trousers and a blouse with loafers? Etc.

It’s not about difficulty people. It’s what they WANT to wear and they are getting dressed all the while not worrying about what bitchy women think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I found that the women in Europe do dress more feminine (dresses, skirts), but American women are more fit and athletic.

Europe is not a monolith. You have obviously never been to Germany or Poland or Iceland or a dozen other countries that are not Spain, France and Italy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re feminists who value comfort over the male gaze.

Women don't dress for men, women dress for other women, even the indignant frumpy ones. The indignant frumpy ones think they are "choosing not to care" when they are often hanging around with other women who "choose not to care" so basically they are sheeple just swinging in the other direction.

I personally make an effort most days because I like makeup, dresses, heels and all of that, but yeah, there are times I DGAF and wear soft clothes with elastic waistbands.

Women you view as frumpy are simply enlightened. Women who continue to fuss unnecessarily about these arbitrary and in some cases harmful “standards “ for womens’ appearance need to wake up. If you continue to waste time and energy on these things, that’s bad enough, but telling other women what they “need” to do is way out of line. You contribute to the objectification and oppression of women when you perpetuate these “standards “.

Focus on your health, physical and mental. The rest is nonsense cooked up to sell you products you do not need. Don’t be such a sucker.

No, I am not objectifying women but it's funny to me that, like I said earlier the INDIGNANT frumpy women who are "choosing" not to care what they look like think they are making a choice to not be eye candy or whatever when you are just the other side of the same coin you are angry about. You dress frumpy for other WOMEN because it signals some kind of virtue and smugness about how you don't care what you look like because YOU ARE NOT EYE CANDY! YOU ARE BUCKING THE PATRIARCHY!!!!!!!!

I generally take pride in my appearance and if when I am better groomed and not in my soft clothes I am eye candy for other women or men well, OK. ::shrug:: I don't care if you don't care what you look like, I just care that I care what I look like.

No. You really don't get it. I have no "frumpy standard" to which I aspire. I'm interested in being happy and comfortable. I don't make clothing choices in the morning or at a store based on trying to stick it to the Man or stick it to women who waste their time on this stuff or to appeal to other frumpy women, etc. etc. etc. I pick clothes that are comfortable and functional for ME, based on my life and my profession or what I'm doing with the kids that day. I give no thought to people like you. I give no thought to women who may be like-minded in their fashion choices. I'm not interested in being smug at anyone else's expense. For all your "shrugs" I suspect you care more than you will admit.

But when I see threads like this, they make me sad. Not for myself, but for people like you. And for girls coming up in the world, whose mothers will pass on all this unnecessary baggage.
I've just gotten under your skin, because you understand, somewhere down in there, that what I'm saying is true.

I feel sad for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Personally I think women are idiots. They spend so much time on inconsequential things while men run society. They can continue running on the hamster wheel. Let them distract themselves with waxing, coloring hair an injecting themselves with Botox. Those of us who are liberated will continue to be free.

I am free, though our current president seems to working up to putting my people back in chains and sending us into the cotton fields again. I personally think it is white women privilege to look awful and tell other women who are judged by their appearance up to and including our hair, in ways that have negative effects on our lives because of racism, that they are wrong for caring and that their goal of bucking the patriarchy in this way should be my goal, too. Intersectional feminism is a thing.

Np. You are inserting a racial component into the discussion, as valid as your point is.

Actually, I think she has a point. The messy bun is a perfect example of white hair privilege. AA women can’t even wear their own natural texture without having their professionalism questioned. AA women have to dress better to get ahead in corporate America, but they run the risk of being sexualized if they dress too well.

Social class also matters. When I worked with poor women of all races in the rural Deep South, PA, and WV, dress and careful grooming was a huge signifier of power or aspiration to power. I purposely dressed down in Kmart casual clothing initially, hoping to not seem pretentious and build rapport. A coworker advised me that clients would not see me as an authority in my field if I was not very well-dressed. And she was right. A well-fitted suit meant I was an outsider, but an outsider had the keys to the kingdom.

Yep. If UMC white woman wanna look jacked up, for the most part all they will suffer from is other women judging them and possibly not being attractive to men. Big whoop.

[Anonymous]

All I am thinking about us my own comfort, the occasion, and how much time I have when I get ready. I am not thinking about other women or smashing the patriarchy or whatever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's take an example.

Size 2-6. Running around town in athleisure. Hair in a top knot.

Frumpy?

Depends on the height. Short and size 6? Certainly not great looking. Quite tall and size 6? Probably not frumpy. Depends on athletic clothes. Also, athleisure is just that athletic wear, what a stupid term. Why is an older woman wearing tights and yoga pants to run around town? So, basically, yes, she is frumpy. What jeans and a t shirt are hard to put on?

+ 1

She can wear a chic t shirt, jeans and ballet flats.

It's not that jeans and a t-shirt are hard to put on. Many of us hit the gym/yoga/etc before or after running errands. The issue is that I'm not going to bring an extra outfit to change into.