Thoughts on supsending preschool students

[Anonymous]

Simple question: what kind of a kid throws chairs? What kind of a kid spits on people? ONCE AGAIN! Doesn't matter what color - pink, blue, purple or green . . . something is going on at home that needs to be addressed. It's that simple. Three paragraph responses are not needed. It really is THAT SIMPLE.

[Anonymous]

This was my son in preschool. He didn't act like that at home. He had a lot of sensory problems that manifested in very defensive behavior (biting, hitting, pinching, pushing, etc). Any loud noises, people touching him unexpectedly, overwhelming stimuli and he would react badly. He was asked to leave one preschool and was on his way to being asked to leave another one. Thankfully, I didn't need preschool for daycare. I don't know what I would've done had I needed group daycare b/c I couldn't afford a nanny/babysitter. Years later, he was diagnosed with ADHD and still overreacts to certain stimuli when he isn't on medication. Some kids just cannot stand being around groups of kids all day everyday. It is too much. Don't always blame the parents for the way a child acts. My son's preschool director (at the last preschool) was a friend of mine. She saw firsthand how he acted at home and I was thankful that she recommended he be tested by an OT. I didn't have the money for him to go to OT more than a few sessions but the evaluator was very clear in her findings. The louder and more chaotic the environment, the more my son would "act out." I saw it myself at places that were loud and crowded (Chuck E. Cheese was the worst!).

[Anonymous]

In the cases we've seen of boys acting out like this (two kids at two difference schools), they had some sort of sensory issues which put a lot of pressure on them.

Luckily the teachers were great and once they realized there was a pattern they helped them with quiet areas or gave them a break from other students when they started to get upset. There were still occasional incidents and I know they talked to the parents about them but everyone was trying to help. No one thought they were "bad" and no one (at least as far as I know) was talking suspension or expulsion.

Clearly these kids aren't trying to hurt anyone because even if they are throwing chairs they could have easily thrown one at a person but in the story it sounds like he was just having a tantrum and had no intention of hurting anyone.

I'm kind of horrified at the parents on this thread saying that kind of child should be kicked out and they don't want their child in a classroom with that kind of kid.
Both these boys were actually very sweet kids and I am happy my DD was in the same classroom with them. She would occasionally mention that so and so had a tantrum and that everyone tried to help make him feel better.

I feel lucky that at those schools the parents were all very understanding and not as mean-spirited as many on this thread seem to be.

[Anonymous]

I think its fine to suspend or kick kids out of preschool.

Preschool isn't necessary and for some kids at age 3 and 4, a group environment is just too overwhelming. There is nothing wrong with the school or center letting a parent know that the group setting isn't working.

I was a preschool teacher. Throwing a chair - If I read that literally that he picked up a preschool chair and threw it in the air - that's fairly unusual. Kicking chairs, pushing chairs, pushing other kids out of chairs, throwing blocks or other small toys, - that I saw fairly regularly. Would I kick a kid out for it? Maybe. If I thought the parents needed a wake up call and that their child likely needed an evaluation and they were reluctant.

As far as black boys being more violent - at the elementary level - I saw that yes, there were some who tended to be more much more loud and agressive then other boys - black, hispanic, white. The more agressive kids often had aggressive mothers - loud, younger and immature and rude women - so I tended to think those boys were really learned behaviors as opposed to being inherently violent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So the elephant in the living room: what causes black kids to be born with these behaviors and to maintain them so that they end up disproportionately represented in prisons?

And before you bash me: my white preschooler was suspended more times than I could count for behavior problems and tantrums. I learned later that they were holding him down and he would hit them. They didn't call it a suspension because that would have skewed their school safety profile. Just a call home, "Can you come pick up your son?" It got so bad that he would walk up to the teacher, hit her and calmly ask, "Can I go home now?" Four year olds know how the system works.

Re: that elephant in the room: black children experience physical punishment by their parents at a higher rate. It stands to reason this would cause more physical acting out.

http://www.child-psych.org/2012/05/race-and-spanking-in-the-us-a-spank-is-a-spank-is-a-spank.html

[Anonymous]

I didn't read previous comments but my child was in a preschool class with a biter and kicker. He did not bite my child but targeted a few others. Teachers worked with him, kids were moved, child was monitored, but ultimately he was too violent for the classroom and was gone before the end of the year.

[Anonymous]

I see a lot of posts calling children "violent." What's a violent preschooler? Where do you draw the line?

Normal from what I've observed in our own preschool and a kid I would be perfectly comfortable with as a classmate for my DD:
If a child bites occasionally, kicks a little, pushes a little, pinches a little because he/she is upset or wants a toy, etc. Pushes around some chairs or knocks over books or toys.

Violent and a kid I would feel uncomfortable having around my DD:
Pushes or hits, etc. children, throws things for no apparent reason or does it with the purpose of hurting someone. Hits a kid on the head or with a hard toy and especially on the head with a hard toy. Throws hard toys or chairs or other objects AT OTHER KIDS (as opposed to at a wall or away from other kids-obviously this isn't great either as the toy could hit someone by accident). Pushes kids while they are on the playground equipment or on a bike or otherwise creates a dangerous situation.

Remember that kids this age are still learning how to act appropriately!

There was nothing in the Washington Post article that makes me believe that the three-year-old is violent and I think it's unfair to call him that. He's certainly very physical but I think that it's very very rare for a kid that age to actually be violent.

[Anonymous]

3 and 4 years old is still *very* young. I mentioned in a previous post that my son had all kinds of issues in preschool. No "chair throwing" but some aggression toward other children, some disruptive behavior, and refusing to follow directions.

I tried everything- listened to the teachers, tried to work with my son, and even took him to see a therapist-- the only success was changing the school (voluntarily) and giving him a chance to mature. While we going through it, I felt helpless and judged as a "bad" parent because my son wouldn't behave at school.

We discovered when my DS was older that he suffers from moderate anxiety- and apparently, anxiety can cause all kinds of behavior. It wasn't our environment or our parenting, it's an issue that runs on my side of the family. DS didn't have the vocabulary back then to explain his feelings and tended to act them out.

I just can't stand the judgement "what kind of child" and leaping to conclusions about an inferior home life.

[Anonymous]

With a mom that is placing the blame on race discrimination, it is really difficult to know what the true story is here. Had she been called prior to this event. I suspect the child was a problem all the time and this was the icing on the cake. Throwing a chair is not normal.

[Anonymous]

I taught a girl in first grade (FWIW she was white), who acted out violently. She had been abused in many terrible ways. It did not change the fact that she was a danger to the other kids. I couldn't let her out of my sight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a early childhood teacher, this is my impression of the article:

I, too, would be embarrassed, as pp said. I'm sure the suspensions were not the school's first consequence. The child's actions were completely unacceptable for any child of any race. "Fatherlessness"?? Please. Get your shit together, and stop making excuses for your future juvenile delinquents.

I really, really hope you're not anyone's teacher.

Oh, but I guarantee you she is. I knew teachers like her. Dreadful.

[Anonymous]

Oh, but I guarantee you she is. I knew teachers like her. Dreadful.

But, the mom IS making excuses.

[Anonymous]

I think that it you didn't have free preschool the ones looking for educational enrichment would be in attendance. Maybe they need free daycare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son was nearly expelled from preschool and we're white. I can't argue with discrimination- I think peole who have never experienced discrimination don't see it when it's right in front of them.

I know from my son's preschool experience that he quickly got a reputation- after a few incidents, we got notes home, conferences, e-mails, son in the principal's etc. at least twice a week. I volunteered occasionally in the class and saw other boys engaging in the same behaviors. I think once the "rep" starts, a kid will get I trouble more frequently, even if other kids do the same thing,

We moved my son to a new preschool for a fresh start. I got a few notes over the span of a year and the teacher said that DS was a sweet kid, slightly immature, and behaviorally in the middle of the pack. No problems in K or 1st.

None of this excuses hitting a teacher or throwing a chair, and I'm not trying to say it's no big deal. I do wonder however, if after one or two incidents, the teacher may have been on guard and ready to punish more bad behavior.

So much depends on the teacher and the environment. We had a similar experience to yours. Moved our kid to a new school and POOF! - no problem. The teacher at the first school was convinced our kid was bad/troubled/special needs (he's been evaluated and is none of the above), and so she read into every little thing he did. And he wasn't the only one. There were a handful of kids she just decided she didn't like and her attitude toward them was palpable. She was a big part of the problem and IMO had np business teaching preschoolers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:3 and 4 years old is still *very* young. I mentioned in a previous post that my son had all kinds of issues in preschool. No "chair throwing" but some aggression toward other children, some disruptive behavior, and refusing to follow directions.

I tried everything- listened to the teachers, tried to work with my son, and even took him to see a therapist-- the only success was changing the school (voluntarily) and giving him a chance to mature. While we going through it, I felt helpless and judged as a "bad" parent because my son wouldn't behave at school.

We discovered when my DS was older that he suffers from moderate anxiety- and apparently, anxiety can cause all kinds of behavior. It wasn't our environment or our parenting, it's an issue that runs on my side of the family. DS didn't have the vocabulary back then to explain his feelings and tended to act them out.

I just can't stand the judgement "what kind of child" and leaping to conclusions about an inferior home life.

The superiority of many commenters here is just begging for some karmic justice. They'll get their comeuppance sooner or later. No one escapes parenting unscathed.