DC area law schools

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:FWIW, The current USNWR rankings are
Georgetown 14 (tied with others)
GW and Mason tied at 31 (with several others, including W&M)
Catholic 71 (tied)
American 104

I went to AU law when it was ranked in the top 50 and liked it, have had good jobs since graduation. But it was outrageously expensive then and seems to be so now. I can’t fathom what it has done to fall so far in the rankings.

If I had it to do all over again and wanted to be in this area, I would live in VA and go to Mason law school. Well ranked and a lot less expensive.

Yeah, what's going on at AU Law?

Likely nothing is "going on at AU Law," the rankings have never meant much beyond top 15 or so and they have shifted like crazy for many, many schools in recent history, and usually for no obvious reason. I attended Tulane when it was just inside the first tier at 40 and now it's 78. Nothing "going on" (although there were some issues when Katrina hit, that was over 20 years ago).

LOL. The "first tier" stops way short of no. 40.

Not when I went to law school it didn't. It referred to the top 50, not the top 14 like now.

When did you go to law school? Fifty years ago?

No, not 50 years ago.

When did you go to law school? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Never. You’re one of the mommies, right? Obsessing over things like this because you want your kid to go to law school? Yep. That’s what I thought.

I am a law school graduate.

Sure, Jan.

Why on earth is that so hard to believe? This board—like this town—is full of lawyers.

If you disagree with what I’m saying, fine, prove me wrong. Simply writing me off as a non-lawyer when it isn’t true is hardly a lawyerly approach to an argument.

“law school grad” = didn’t pass the bar, right? That’s you.

You said I didn't go to law school. That's the question I answered. Now you're saying I didn't pass the bar, so I'll answer that one too. Yes, I passed the bar. The DC bar to be exact.

Weirdo.

Most big law lawyers took NY bar. Nobody really takes DC bar. You just waive into it later.

Bullshit. More than 2200 sat for the most recent DC bar exam. Of the 51 state bars and DC, only 5 (NY, CA, IL, FL and TX) had more people sit for their exams. All five are much larger jurisdictions.

Maybe life has changed in the quarter century since I took the bar but zero of the first year class in the DC office of the firm that I joined out of law school took the DC bar. We were pretty evenly split between NY, MD, VA and home state other than NY/MD/VA. Then we waived into DC.

How big was the first year class in your DC office? Was it big law? And how do you know the number is zero? Were you stalking your colleagues?

I joined a DC-based Biglaw firm before you. I took the the DC bar. So did many of my fellow first years. Yes, many others elected to waive in. But I couldn't give you an exact breakdown because I didn't stalk my colleagues.

18 in the DC office. AM Law took 50 firm. Not stalking. We actually spoke to one another - including "hey, I'm heading back to State X this week to be sworn in".

Pretty extraordinary for you to remember what all 18 first years in your law firm did over a quarter century ago to become bar members.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, The current USNWR rankings are
Georgetown 14 (tied with others)
GW and Mason tied at 31 (with several others, including W&M)
Catholic 71 (tied)
American 104

I went to AU law when it was ranked in the top 50 and liked it, have had good jobs since graduation. But it was outrageously expensive then and seems to be so now. I can’t fathom what it has done to fall so far in the rankings.

If I had it to do all over again and wanted to be in this area, I would live in VA and go to Mason law school. Well ranked and a lot less expensive.

Yeah, what's going on at AU Law?

Likely nothing is "going on at AU Law," the rankings have never meant much beyond top 15 or so and they have shifted like crazy for many, many schools in recent history, and usually for no obvious reason. I attended Tulane when it was just inside the first tier at 40 and now it's 78. Nothing "going on" (although there were some issues when Katrina hit, that was over 20 years ago).

LOL. The "first tier" stops way short of no. 40.

Not when I went to law school it didn't. It referred to the top 50, not the top 14 like now.

When did you go to law school? Fifty years ago?

No, not 50 years ago.

When did you go to law school? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Never. You’re one of the mommies, right? Obsessing over things like this because you want your kid to go to law school? Yep. That’s what I thought.

DP
I went to law school 30 years (been practicing ever since) and I would not recommend my kid go to law school if they couldn't go to a pretty good one and top 50 ain't it.
Top 10 maybe top 20,but not top 50

I agree. I went to law school 25 years ago (at T10), and I would have the same advice for my kids.

I’m surprised that you both say this. I am also a practicing lawyer for 30 plus years, as is my spouse, as are many friends, and of course colleagues. I’ve worked in big law and in house, and know many attorneys well who have worked in both areas plus government, nonprofits, smaller firms, and left the law entirely. I’m sure your circles are similar.

But I have the opposite view as you do. The more experienced I am, the more I encounter attorneys in senior positions who have graduated from a variety of law schools. It’s a big world out there! I see the obsession with T14 schools usually at mid level associates and below (probably because they are trying to distinguish themselves). Those with more experience realize that there is a lot more to being strong in one’s field beyond where they went to law school. Many attorneys from top schools just don’t have it or haven’t yet found their niche, and conversely many great attorneys graduated from GW, American, Fordham, so on.

I do find that I can usually tell in meetings when someone is/has been a practicing attorney (regardless of the school) because they approach the matter in an analytic way. another saying that non-lawyers don’t do that or that all lawyers do, but there is a consistency.

I’d discourage my own kids from going to law school entirely, but that’s a different post

Both DH and I are lawyers and would not want either of our 3 DC to go to law school. But not going to T14 will limit where you end up. DH says that at his big law firm, they do not recruit anywhere below Georgetown. There are absolutely no grads or lawyers from non top law schools except for a few rain making partners who have a chip on their shoulder but went to a lower ranked law school and are only at the firm because of they business they bring in their particular niche. And you can tell by tier of firm, how analytical the lawyers are. DH has worked at several big law firms in the span of 30 years and has noticed quality of associates declines with reputation of firm, which is really reputation of law schools they came from.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:FWIW, The current USNWR rankings are
Georgetown 14 (tied with others)
GW and Mason tied at 31 (with several others, including W&M)
Catholic 71 (tied)
American 104

I went to AU law when it was ranked in the top 50 and liked it, have had good jobs since graduation. But it was outrageously expensive then and seems to be so now. I can’t fathom what it has done to fall so far in the rankings.

If I had it to do all over again and wanted to be in this area, I would live in VA and go to Mason law school. Well ranked and a lot less expensive.

Yeah, what's going on at AU Law?

Likely nothing is "going on at AU Law," the rankings have never meant much beyond top 15 or so and they have shifted like crazy for many, many schools in recent history, and usually for no obvious reason. I attended Tulane when it was just inside the first tier at 40 and now it's 78. Nothing "going on" (although there were some issues when Katrina hit, that was over 20 years ago).

LOL. The "first tier" stops way short of no. 40.

Not when I went to law school it didn't. It referred to the top 50, not the top 14 like now.

When did you go to law school? Fifty years ago?

No, not 50 years ago.

When did you go to law school? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Never. You’re one of the mommies, right? Obsessing over things like this because you want your kid to go to law school? Yep. That’s what I thought.

DP
I went to law school 30 years (been practicing ever since) and I would not recommend my kid go to law school if they couldn't go to a pretty good one and top 50 ain't it.
Top 10 maybe top 20,but not top 50

I agree. I went to law school 25 years ago (at T10), and I would have the same advice for my kids.

I’m surprised that you both say this. I am also a practicing lawyer for 30 plus years, as is my spouse, as are many friends, and of course colleagues. I’ve worked in big law and in house, and know many attorneys well who have worked in both areas plus government, nonprofits, smaller firms, and left the law entirely. I’m sure your circles are similar.

But I have the opposite view as you do. The more experienced I am, the more I encounter attorneys in senior positions who have graduated from a variety of law schools. It’s a big world out there! I see the obsession with T14 schools usually at mid level associates and below (probably because they are trying to distinguish themselves). Those with more experience realize that there is a lot more to being strong in one’s field beyond where they went to law school. Many attorneys from top schools just don’t have it or haven’t yet found their niche, and conversely many great attorneys graduated from GW, American, Fordham, so on.

I do find that I can usually tell in meetings when someone is/has been a practicing attorney (regardless of the school) because they approach the matter in an analytic way. another saying that non-lawyers don’t do that or that all lawyers do, but there is a consistency.

I’d discourage my own kids from going to law school entirely, but that’s a different post

Both DH and I are lawyers and would not want either of our 3 DC to go to law school. But not going to T14 will limit where you end up. DH says that at his big law firm, they do not recruit anywhere below Georgetown. There are absolutely no grads or lawyers from non top law schools except for a few rain making partners who have a chip on their shoulder but went to a lower ranked law school and are only at the firm because of they business they bring in their particular niche. And you can tell by tier of firm, how analytical the lawyers are. DH has worked at several big law firms in the span of 30 years and has noticed quality of associates declines with reputation of firm, which is really reputation of law schools they came from.

There is not a single large firm in any major market where there are "no grads or lawyers from non stop law schools" other than rainmakers. Zero. None. Not in DC, not in NYC, not in LA, not in Chicago. Nowhere. The demand for associates in Biglaw exceeds the supply of T14 graduates, requiring that EVERY SINGLE FIRM dip a little lower.

I'm not saying that you're better off attending a T14, but you absolutely can get a job at ANY major law firm in the United States coming out of a lower ranked one. Yes, you will have to have done well, often extraordinarily well. But it can be done and IS being done.

Prove me wrong. Provide a link to a Biglaw firm without a single associate who graduated from a law school below Georgetown. I'll wait.

[Anonymous]

PP here. For example, I just looked at Cravath's website. At least 32 current associates are from "below" Georgtown. BYU, Ohio State, Syracuse, Buffalo, etc. And there aren't a lot of Biglaw firms more prestigious and selective than Cravath.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The Above the Law Rankings are heavily weighted by outcomes—e.g. employment after graduation—and GMU is not ranked in the top 50. It wasn’t ranked in the top 50 last year either.

Georgetown, GWU, William & Mary and Howard are all ranked both years.

https://abovethelaw.com/2025/06/2025-top-50-law-school-rankings/

No one cites Above the Law for law school rankings. No one. It’s USNWR, and top 14, that everyone talks about, where Scalia is ranked 31z https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/george-mason-university-03159

Right. GMU is ranked 31st but still does a relatively shitty job of getting its grads top jobs. That's why I cited ATL. For that metric only.

If you had bothered to google “Scalia job placement “ before shooting off your mouth, AI could have instructed you thusly:

Antonin Scalia Law School (George Mason University) boasts strong employment outcomes, with 97.5% of the Class of 2023 employed, primarily in private practice ($149,784 median salary) and the public sector ($74,672 median salary). The school excels in judicial clerkships, securing 102 for 2025-2028 terms, and leverages a strong DC-area network and focus on law


Employment and Salary Highlights
High Employment Rate: 99.4% of the Class of 2023 were employed or in graduate studies shortly after graduation, according to the NALP report.

Employment Sectors (Class of 2023): 49.1% entered the private sector, while 50.9% entered the public sector, including government and public interest.
Salaries: The median salary for the private sector was $149,784, while the median for the public sector was $74,672.
Location: Most graduates are employed in the Washington, D.C. metropolitan area.


Key Opportunities and Clerkships
Clerkships: Strong performance in placing graduates in federal and state courts, with 72 federal clerkships (including 31 U.S. Courts of Appeals) secured for the 2025-2028 terms.
Law & Economics Focus: The school's emphasis on the intersection of law and economics provides unique networking opportunities through the Law & Economics Center.

Networking and Recruitment: Active Fall and Spring recruiting programs are available, with opportunities to connect with top law firms and government agencies, note users on Reddit.

Career Services: The Career and Academic Services Office provides resources for job placement, including counseling and on-campus interviews.

Networking: The school connects students with employers through various, often intimate, settings.

For more detailed data, you can view the official 2023 NALP report and employment statistics on the Scalia Law School website.

I love how someone claims to be such an expert and then cites AI. If you are a lawyer, shame on you. But you probably are not.

Anyways, there was something telling in your AI summary. The median salary for the private sector for Scalia grads was just $149,784. That's really really low for first year lawyers, and waaaay below big law salaries. This tells me Scalia grads are not doing so well in the job market.

Also I have worked in big law. We did not hire at Scalia. I have also taught at Scalia. The quality of the students was highly variable. The top 2-3 students in each class were quite good, the bottom few were really ... not good. The big group in the middle were just ok. The only ones comparable to my colleages in biglaw and my classmates at at T14 law school were the 2-3 at the top.

This board is full of biglaw attorneys and frankly, you sound young and full of yourself.
Sure we don't recruit a ton from GMU but look at the partners at almost every law firm and you will see a farily broad sampling of law schools. The first year associates are frequently from big name law schools but our laterals frequently went to places like GMU. It's unlikely to happen to anyu particular GMU student but it's not limited to 2 or 3 per class.

Ha! I can assure you I am not young. I'm sure you meant to insult me but I'm old enough to take being called young as a compliment. So thanks, I guess?

Why am I full of myself to tell the truth that my biglaw firm did not recruit from Scalia? Why is this so triggering to you?

Yes, attorneys from lesser ranked law schools can do well and make it to biglaw but it's a harder path and fewer of them do. And there are many many more from the top schools. That is just the reality. Sorry it's hard for you to accept.

I didn't say you look young. I said you sound young as in immature. I would bet money you are an associate.
You can tell people that GMU is not likely to lead to a starting job in biglaw without making the additional unnecessary assertion that all but 2 or 3 of the students at GMU are not "comparable to your colleagues in biglaw" (that's thepart that makes you sound full of yourself).
I have taught as an adjunct at both GMU and Georgetown and the difference between the top of GMU and the bottom of Georgetown can be hard to see.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:FWIW, The current USNWR rankings are
Georgetown 14 (tied with others)
GW and Mason tied at 31 (with several others, including W&M)
Catholic 71 (tied)
American 104

I went to AU law when it was ranked in the top 50 and liked it, have had good jobs since graduation. But it was outrageously expensive then and seems to be so now. I can’t fathom what it has done to fall so far in the rankings.

If I had it to do all over again and wanted to be in this area, I would live in VA and go to Mason law school. Well ranked and a lot less expensive.

Yeah, what's going on at AU Law?

Likely nothing is "going on at AU Law," the rankings have never meant much beyond top 15 or so and they have shifted like crazy for many, many schools in recent history, and usually for no obvious reason. I attended Tulane when it was just inside the first tier at 40 and now it's 78. Nothing "going on" (although there were some issues when Katrina hit, that was over 20 years ago).

LOL. The "first tier" stops way short of no. 40.

Not when I went to law school it didn't. It referred to the top 50, not the top 14 like now.

When did you go to law school? Fifty years ago?

No, not 50 years ago.

When did you go to law school? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Never. You’re one of the mommies, right? Obsessing over things like this because you want your kid to go to law school? Yep. That’s what I thought.

DP
I went to law school 30 years (been practicing ever since) and I would not recommend my kid go to law school if they couldn't go to a pretty good one and top 50 ain't it.
Top 10 maybe top 20,but not top 50

I agree. I went to law school 25 years ago (at T10), and I would have the same advice for my kids.

I’m surprised that you both say this. I am also a practicing lawyer for 30 plus years, as is my spouse, as are many friends, and of course colleagues. I’ve worked in big law and in house, and know many attorneys well who have worked in both areas plus government, nonprofits, smaller firms, and left the law entirely. I’m sure your circles are similar.

But I have the opposite view as you do. The more experienced I am, the more I encounter attorneys in senior positions who have graduated from a variety of law schools. It’s a big world out there! I see the obsession with T14 schools usually at mid level associates and below (probably because they are trying to distinguish themselves). Those with more experience realize that there is a lot more to being strong in one’s field beyond where they went to law school. Many attorneys from top schools just don’t have it or haven’t yet found their niche, and conversely many great attorneys graduated from GW, American, Fordham, so on.

I do find that I can usually tell in meetings when someone is/has been a practicing attorney (regardless of the school) because they approach the matter in an analytic way. another saying that non-lawyers don’t do that or that all lawyers do, but there is a consistency.

I’d discourage my own kids from going to law school entirely, but that’s a different post

Previous previous poster here. I absolutely believe you can be a good lawyer from any law school. But I don't think you get similar opportunities from all law schools.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, The current USNWR rankings are
Georgetown 14 (tied with others)
GW and Mason tied at 31 (with several others, including W&M)
Catholic 71 (tied)
American 104

I went to AU law when it was ranked in the top 50 and liked it, have had good jobs since graduation. But it was outrageously expensive then and seems to be so now. I can’t fathom what it has done to fall so far in the rankings.

If I had it to do all over again and wanted to be in this area, I would live in VA and go to Mason law school. Well ranked and a lot less expensive.

Yeah, what's going on at AU Law?

Likely nothing is "going on at AU Law," the rankings have never meant much beyond top 15 or so and they have shifted like crazy for many, many schools in recent history, and usually for no obvious reason. I attended Tulane when it was just inside the first tier at 40 and now it's 78. Nothing "going on" (although there were some issues when Katrina hit, that was over 20 years ago).

LOL. The "first tier" stops way short of no. 40.

Not when I went to law school it didn't. It referred to the top 50, not the top 14 like now.

When did you go to law school? Fifty years ago?

No, not 50 years ago.

When did you go to law school? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Never. You’re one of the mommies, right? Obsessing over things like this because you want your kid to go to law school? Yep. That’s what I thought.

I am a law school graduate.

Sure, Jan.

Why on earth is that so hard to believe? This board—like this town—is full of lawyers.

If you disagree with what I’m saying, fine, prove me wrong. Simply writing me off as a non-lawyer when it isn’t true is hardly a lawyerly approach to an argument.

“law school grad” = didn’t pass the bar, right? That’s you.

You said I didn't go to law school. That's the question I answered. Now you're saying I didn't pass the bar, so I'll answer that one too. Yes, I passed the bar. The DC bar to be exact.

Weirdo.

Most big law lawyers took NY bar. Nobody really takes DC bar. You just waive into it later.

Bullshit. More than 2200 sat for the most recent DC bar exam. Of the 51 state bars and DC, only 5 (NY, CA, IL, FL and TX) had more people sit for their exams. All five are much larger jurisdictions.

Maybe life has changed in the quarter century since I took the bar but zero of the first year class in the DC office of the firm that I joined out of law school took the DC bar. We were pretty evenly split between NY, MD, VA and home state other than NY/MD/VA. Then we waived into DC.

How big was the first year class in your DC office? Was it big law? And how do you know the number is zero? Were you stalking your colleagues?

I joined a DC-based Biglaw firm before you. I took the the DC bar. So did many of my fellow first years. Yes, many others elected to waive in. But I couldn't give you an exact breakdown because I didn't stalk my colleagues.

18 in the DC office. AM Law took 50 firm. Not stalking. We actually spoke to one another - including "hey, I'm heading back to State X this week to be sworn in".

Pretty extraordinary for you to remember what all 18 first years in your law firm did over a quarter century ago to become bar members.

DP here I don't know if anyone took the DC bar that long ago. The DC bar was notoriously difficult and waiving in from maryland or even NY was consiidered easier.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP here. For example, I just looked at Cravath's website. At least 32 current associates are from "below" Georgtown. BYU, Ohio State, Syracuse, Buffalo, etc. And there aren't a lot of Biglaw firms more prestigious and selective than Cravath.

DP

I think they might be overstating their case but look at Cravath's summer associate class and tell me how many students you see from Ohio State.

But your point is generally well taken, at some point after maybe 3rd or 4th year you are looking for experience and not transcripts.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The Above the Law Rankings are heavily weighted by outcomes—e.g. employment after graduation—and GMU is not ranked in the top 50. It wasn’t ranked in the top 50 last year either.

Georgetown, GWU, William & Mary and Howard are all ranked both years.

https://abovethelaw.com/2025/06/2025-top-50-law-school-rankings/

No one cites Above the Law for law school rankings. No one. It’s USNWR, and top 14, that everyone talks about, where Scalia is ranked 31z https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/george-mason-university-03159

Right. GMU is ranked 31st but still does a relatively shitty job of getting its grads top jobs. That's why I cited ATL. For that metric only.

If you had bothered to google “Scalia job placement “ before shooting off your mouth, AI could have instructed you thusly:

Antonin Scalia Law School (George Mason University) boasts strong employment outcomes, with 97.5% of the Class of 2023 employed, primarily in private practice ($149,784 median salary) and the public sector ($74,672 median salary). The school excels in judicial clerkships, securing 102 for 2025-2028 terms, and leverages a strong DC-area network and focus on law


Employment and Salary Highlights
High Employment Rate: 99.4% of the Class of 2023 were employed or in graduate studies shortly after graduation, according to the NALP report.

Employment Sectors (Class of 2023): 49.1% entered the private sector, while 50.9% entered the public sector, including government and public interest.
Salaries: The median salary for the private sector was $149,784, while the median for the public sector was $74,672.
Location: Most graduates are employed in the Washington, D.C. metropolitan area.


Key Opportunities and Clerkships
Clerkships: Strong performance in placing graduates in federal and state courts, with 72 federal clerkships (including 31 U.S. Courts of Appeals) secured for the 2025-2028 terms.
Law & Economics Focus: The school's emphasis on the intersection of law and economics provides unique networking opportunities through the Law & Economics Center.

Networking and Recruitment: Active Fall and Spring recruiting programs are available, with opportunities to connect with top law firms and government agencies, note users on Reddit.

Career Services: The Career and Academic Services Office provides resources for job placement, including counseling and on-campus interviews.

Networking: The school connects students with employers through various, often intimate, settings.

For more detailed data, you can view the official 2023 NALP report and employment statistics on the Scalia Law School website.

I love how someone claims to be such an expert and then cites AI. If you are a lawyer, shame on you. But you probably are not.

Anyways, there was something telling in your AI summary. The median salary for the private sector for Scalia grads was just $149,784. That's really really low for first year lawyers, and waaaay below big law salaries. This tells me Scalia grads are not doing so well in the job market.

Also I have worked in big law. We did not hire at Scalia. I have also taught at Scalia. The quality of the students was highly variable. The top 2-3 students in each class were quite good, the bottom few were really ... not good. The big group in the middle were just ok. The only ones comparable to my colleages in biglaw and my classmates at at T14 law school were the 2-3 at the top.

This board is full of biglaw attorneys and frankly, you sound young and full of yourself.
Sure we don't recruit a ton from GMU but look at the partners at almost every law firm and you will see a farily broad sampling of law schools. The first year associates are frequently from big name law schools but our laterals frequently went to places like GMU. It's unlikely to happen to anyu particular GMU student but it's not limited to 2 or 3 per class.

Ha! I can assure you I am not young. I'm sure you meant to insult me but I'm old enough to take being called young as a compliment. So thanks, I guess?

Why am I full of myself to tell the truth that my biglaw firm did not recruit from Scalia? Why is this so triggering to you?

Yes, attorneys from lesser ranked law schools can do well and make it to biglaw but it's a harder path and fewer of them do. And there are many many more from the top schools. That is just the reality. Sorry it's hard for you to accept.

I didn't say you look young. I said you sound young as in immature. I would bet money you are an associate.
You can tell people that GMU is not likely to lead to a starting job in biglaw without making the additional unnecessary assertion that all but 2 or 3 of the students at GMU are not "comparable to your colleagues in biglaw" (that's thepart that makes you sound full of yourself).
I have taught as an adjunct at both GMU and Georgetown and the difference between the top of GMU and the bottom of Georgetown can be hard to see.

How much money do you want to bet? Because you would be wrong. I guess we can't all be at your maturity level. It takes a really mature person to sling insults anonymously on the internet.

I think you are making my point. The top of GMU was comparable to my classmates at a T14 school and my colleages at BigLaw (sorry that is so triggering to you). So it makes sense that it was hard for you to see the difference between the bottom of GU and the top of GMU. At my T14 law school, nearly everyone in the class was quite talented. While at GMU, only the tippy top of the class was.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:FWIW, The current USNWR rankings are
Georgetown 14 (tied with others)
GW and Mason tied at 31 (with several others, including W&M)
Catholic 71 (tied)
American 104

I went to AU law when it was ranked in the top 50 and liked it, have had good jobs since graduation. But it was outrageously expensive then and seems to be so now. I can’t fathom what it has done to fall so far in the rankings.

If I had it to do all over again and wanted to be in this area, I would live in VA and go to Mason law school. Well ranked and a lot less expensive.

Yeah, what's going on at AU Law?

Likely nothing is "going on at AU Law," the rankings have never meant much beyond top 15 or so and they have shifted like crazy for many, many schools in recent history, and usually for no obvious reason. I attended Tulane when it was just inside the first tier at 40 and now it's 78. Nothing "going on" (although there were some issues when Katrina hit, that was over 20 years ago).

LOL. The "first tier" stops way short of no. 40.

Not when I went to law school it didn't. It referred to the top 50, not the top 14 like now.

When did you go to law school? Fifty years ago?

No, not 50 years ago.

When did you go to law school? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Never. You’re one of the mommies, right? Obsessing over things like this because you want your kid to go to law school? Yep. That’s what I thought.

DP
I went to law school 30 years (been practicing ever since) and I would not recommend my kid go to law school if they couldn't go to a pretty good one and top 50 ain't it.
Top 10 maybe top 20,but not top 50

I agree. I went to law school 25 years ago (at T10), and I would have the same advice for my kids.

I’m surprised that you both say this. I am also a practicing lawyer for 30 plus years, as is my spouse, as are many friends, and of course colleagues. I’ve worked in big law and in house, and know many attorneys well who have worked in both areas plus government, nonprofits, smaller firms, and left the law entirely. I’m sure your circles are similar.

But I have the opposite view as you do. The more experienced I am, the more I encounter attorneys in senior positions who have graduated from a variety of law schools. It’s a big world out there! I see the obsession with T14 schools usually at mid level associates and below (probably because they are trying to distinguish themselves). Those with more experience realize that there is a lot more to being strong in one’s field beyond where they went to law school. Many attorneys from top schools just don’t have it or haven’t yet found their niche, and conversely many great attorneys graduated from GW, American, Fordham, so on.

I do find that I can usually tell in meetings when someone is/has been a practicing attorney (regardless of the school) because they approach the matter in an analytic way. another saying that non-lawyers don’t do that or that all lawyers do, but there is a consistency.

I’d discourage my own kids from going to law school entirely, but that’s a different post

Previous previous poster here. I absolutely believe you can be a good lawyer from any law school. But I don't think you get similar opportunities from all law schools.

Exactly. You can make it from anywhere. But far fewer do and it's a much harder and less certain path. YOur prospects are much, much better coming from a highly ranked law school. And since it costs a lot to go to law school, you have to think carefully about rate of return after a certain point.

[Anonymous]

I think someone here went to GMU and is trying to boost it.

[Anonymous]

Catholic is good for regulatory law (securities, commodities, energy).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here. For example, I just looked at Cravath's website. At least 32 current associates are from "below" Georgtown. BYU, Ohio State, Syracuse, Buffalo, etc. And there aren't a lot of Biglaw firms more prestigious and selective than Cravath.

DP

I think they might be overstating their case but look at Cravath's summer associate class and tell me how many students you see from Ohio State.

But your point is generally well taken, at some point after maybe 3rd or 4th year you are looking for experience and not transcripts.

The 32 associates from "below Georgetown" are not, I am sure, all or even mostly third or fourth year laterals. That's not how Cravath hires.

In any event, Cravath's own website says the summer associate class of 2025 came from 24 law schools, and there aren't 24 law schools in the top 14.

So try again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Above the Law Rankings are heavily weighted by outcomes—e.g. employment after graduation—and GMU is not ranked in the top 50. It wasn’t ranked in the top 50 last year either.

Georgetown, GWU, William & Mary and Howard are all ranked both years.

https://abovethelaw.com/2025/06/2025-top-50-law-school-rankings/

No one cites Above the Law for law school rankings. No one. It’s USNWR, and top 14, that everyone talks about, where Scalia is ranked 31z https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/george-mason-university-03159

Right. GMU is ranked 31st but still does a relatively shitty job of getting its grads top jobs. That's why I cited ATL. For that metric only.

If you had bothered to google “Scalia job placement “ before shooting off your mouth, AI could have instructed you thusly:

Antonin Scalia Law School (George Mason University) boasts strong employment outcomes, with 97.5% of the Class of 2023 employed, primarily in private practice ($149,784 median salary) and the public sector ($74,672 median salary). The school excels in judicial clerkships, securing 102 for 2025-2028 terms, and leverages a strong DC-area network and focus on law


Employment and Salary Highlights
High Employment Rate: 99.4% of the Class of 2023 were employed or in graduate studies shortly after graduation, according to the NALP report.

Employment Sectors (Class of 2023): 49.1% entered the private sector, while 50.9% entered the public sector, including government and public interest.
Salaries: The median salary for the private sector was $149,784, while the median for the public sector was $74,672.
Location: Most graduates are employed in the Washington, D.C. metropolitan area.


Key Opportunities and Clerkships
Clerkships: Strong performance in placing graduates in federal and state courts, with 72 federal clerkships (including 31 U.S. Courts of Appeals) secured for the 2025-2028 terms.
Law & Economics Focus: The school's emphasis on the intersection of law and economics provides unique networking opportunities through the Law & Economics Center.

Networking and Recruitment: Active Fall and Spring recruiting programs are available, with opportunities to connect with top law firms and government agencies, note users on Reddit.

Career Services: The Career and Academic Services Office provides resources for job placement, including counseling and on-campus interviews.

Networking: The school connects students with employers through various, often intimate, settings.

For more detailed data, you can view the official 2023 NALP report and employment statistics on the Scalia Law School website.

I love how someone claims to be such an expert and then cites AI. If you are a lawyer, shame on you. But you probably are not.

Anyways, there was something telling in your AI summary. The median salary for the private sector for Scalia grads was just $149,784. That's really really low for first year lawyers, and waaaay below big law salaries. This tells me Scalia grads are not doing so well in the job market.

Also I have worked in big law. We did not hire at Scalia. I have also taught at Scalia. The quality of the students was highly variable. The top 2-3 students in each class were quite good, the bottom few were really ... not good. The big group in the middle were just ok. The only ones comparable to my colleages in biglaw and my classmates at at T14 law school were the 2-3 at the top.

This board is full of biglaw attorneys and frankly, you sound young and full of yourself.
Sure we don't recruit a ton from GMU but look at the partners at almost every law firm and you will see a farily broad sampling of law schools. The first year associates are frequently from big name law schools but our laterals frequently went to places like GMU. It's unlikely to happen to anyu particular GMU student but it's not limited to 2 or 3 per class.

Ha! I can assure you I am not young. I'm sure you meant to insult me but I'm old enough to take being called young as a compliment. So thanks, I guess?

Why am I full of myself to tell the truth that my biglaw firm did not recruit from Scalia? Why is this so triggering to you?

Yes, attorneys from lesser ranked law schools can do well and make it to biglaw but it's a harder path and fewer of them do. And there are many many more from the top schools. That is just the reality. Sorry it's hard for you to accept.

I didn't say you look young. I said you sound young as in immature. I would bet money you are an associate.
You can tell people that GMU is not likely to lead to a starting job in biglaw without making the additional unnecessary assertion that all but 2 or 3 of the students at GMU are not "comparable to your colleagues in biglaw" (that's thepart that makes you sound full of yourself).
I have taught as an adjunct at both GMU and Georgetown and the difference between the top of GMU and the bottom of Georgetown can be hard to see.

How much money do you want to bet? Because you would be wrong. I guess we can't all be at your maturity level. It takes a really mature person to sling insults anonymously on the internet.

I think you are making my point. The top of GMU was comparable to my classmates at a T14 school and my colleages at BigLaw (sorry that is so triggering to you). So it makes sense that it was hard for you to see the difference between the bottom of GU and the top of GMU. At my T14 law school, nearly everyone in the class was quite talented. While at GMU, only the tippy top of the class was.

Omg, it’s the “Tippy top” mom again. Sorry, you lost all credibility now. And why the need to bash on Scalia? It serves its purpose and has done very well. You do sound immature

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think someone here went to GMU and is trying to boost it.

No, “tippy top” mom lawyer wants to bash it for some reason.