We keep arguing about work and home responsibilities because we're both overwhelmed.

[Anonymous]

Pp here. OP’s husband doesn’t earn enough for him to not help more. I was the default flexible parent and I earned more than OP’s DH. DH earns seven figures now. I kept working less and eventually stopped working.

The women I know who are the least unhappy in their marriages are the ones who have to do it all - do all the kid stuff and also is the breadwinner.

Most moms I know do most of the kid stuff regardless of their working status. This has always been the case since preschool to high school.

[Anonymous]

*meant to say women who are most unhappy are the ones who do both kid stuff and also breadwinner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He’s putting too much on you. Tell him you will have to go part time if he doesn’t do x , y, and z and he specific.

He's not putting too much on her. His job is a more-than-40-hours a week job, and so he physically cannot be there for mornings and the immediate after school tasks. That's not dumping stuff on her. That's just the realities of a job that is paying 2/3 of their household costs.

If she finds doing the morning and after-aftercare routine by herself is too hard, she needs to outsource some of it. That's an easy solution.

But shes doing more than 2/3 of childcare and household responsibilities so hes still getting the easy side.

If he's working 2 more hours a day AND comes home and jumps right in on childcare, then I'd say they are splitting pretty evenly. OP didn't say he was one of those layabout dads who just sits around the house while she does everything. She

She said he comes home later than her, and then they split the putting to bed work.

Assuming his job does in fact require those hours (which OP isn't disputing; in fact, she suggested he get a different easier job), then I'd argue HE is contributing more than OP, because they are both "working" the same number of hours per day (when you take into account job-hours and childcare/house-hours), only he is making almost double her salary. His side of the story is probably that he wishes OP made more money. $100k is starting salaries out of college these days.

No it is not. None of the teachers or administration you interact with on a daily basis make 100k. Nurses dont even make 100k starting out. You have an inflated sense of middle-class careers and incomes- even in the DC area.

And no, she did not state that he immediately comes home and gets to work. He also takes X time to himself every morning to go workout.

He also only works 5-10 hours more per week than OP "Even after dropping down to a "chill" job, it's 45-50 hours/week, 170k salary... "He works out in the mornings and then is at work until 6....in the evenings, we have to divide and conquer with the kids (activities, homework help, toddler wrangling) if he's not working. After bedtime, he helps clean up the kitchen and do some mental load stuff, like forms, activity signups, bills, order stuff on Amazon, etc. Sometimes he has to work."

Unless he has an hour+ commute, the timing here doesnt make sense. He isnt available in the mornings at 7/8 (thats a graciously late start to the day with kids btw and she says he isnt available in the mornings) and then is at work until 6pm. She is available for because he isnt. Thats 10 hours right there and then he sometimes has to work evenings. Likely he is leaving earlier than that and working out and then having a leisurely breakfast and then going into work at 830/9- Id be interested to learn his actual start time because working until 6 and then 45-50 hours doesnt add up.

Its not just the divide and conquer its the stress-levels and how much personal/free time the other person gets too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:He’s putting too much on you. Tell him you will have to go part time if he doesn’t do x , y, and z and he specific.

This.

Don’t hire help. At 270k, you really can’t afford it unless you are cutting drastically in some other really needed category.

I have done this with my DH and it’s worked. Yours will have to grow a spine and set some boundaries at work. He can do it, but he might need some encouragement. Also, workouts after needs are met, just like you.

[Anonymous]

PP: that’s assuming work is the problem (like he’s consistently working 50 hours in the office). If personal time is the problem, he just needs to grow up and be a man.

[Anonymous]

Why can't he work out, and then come back to the family to help with drop offs? I know many people, male and female, who do this (most have a pelaton in the house.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have a nanny/PA who works from 12-6pm. They do the kids laundry, receive deliveries (groceries, etc.), walk the dog, pick up dry-cleaning, and get the kids from school and supervise them doing homework, taking them to after-school activities, setting the table for dinner, etc.

Then, we have cleaning people twice a week. OP, throw money at this problem.

This op. Divorce would be more expensive. You’ll both feel better without the added pressure. It’s hard with 2 full time jobs, no matter how you try to split it.

Sounds perfect. I’m not sure they can afford this- that is the problem. It may mess with the current daycare arrangement for the younger child also as not all allow PT..

they need at least someone to offer some relief to op. So it doesn’t need to be someone from 12-6 every day, which pretty much will end up costing as much as a full time nanny.

It could be someone who comes in 2 or 3 times per week for a few hours just to cook a few meals, which seem to be the issue mainly, and could either do laundry or some tidying up (though in my experience it seems people who are willing to cook don’t like cleaning much). 5-10 per week is already a huge load off op’s back, but op needs to think well what would free up her own time and duties.

[Anonymous]

His morning workouts have to go or he can’t go everyday. As others have mentioned, lots of people work out and then drop kids off.

DH is a surgeon and I have always done both morning and afternoons. I was at my breaking point when my older one started kindergarten and I had one in preschool. Two drop offs and two pick ups on my own was really hard so I feel you. When my older one started elementary, I thought it would get easier but it was harder! There were so many days off, snow days, 2 hour delays, early releases, Fun Fridays and all these events in the middle of the day. DH never took a sick day if a kid had a fever. He wasn’t going to cancel a full day of patients or cancel surgeries because our kid had to stay home for a 101 fever. It was always me.

[Anonymous]

It would make sense for you to reduce your work hours to part-time. If you hire more help, the cost coming out of your net pay is more than the gross pay you earn during that time.

Your lifestyle is not sustainable. I'm sorry you are going through this.
Mothers of young children should only work part-time, for the sanity and happiness of all family members.

[Anonymous]

There are plenty of dads of young children at his salary level that get their work done in a way that allows them to be a contributing partner at home.

Oh I wasn't saying it can't be done. I'm saying OP's DH is presenting this as a fait accompli; his hours are inflexible, his workouts are a priority, therefore she's gotta handle it all. OK. Well, but it seems he's also expecting her to do everything for these kids. There's a name for that: it's a SAHM. As long as he wants OP to have a job, and he wants nothing to change for him, that means they outsource. And on $270K combined salary in this area, that's either tricky or impossible while also paying for daycare. So. He wants his job to be the only contribution (and frankly to have this 1955 arrangement)? Time to bring in more money dude.

Now of course the easier, more equitable, healthier, and better-choice-as-a-father choice, is him actually participating in the family he created and working with his wife to help life move forward. But that's "impossible" because he's so "thorough", can't "multi-task", etc.

It's BS. And yes I sound annoyed. As another PP pointed out, DH is running quite the con, and OP sounds like she's genuinely struggling. I think that sucks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

There are plenty of dads of young children at his salary level that get their work done in a way that allows them to be a contributing partner at home.

Oh I wasn't saying it can't be done. I'm saying OP's DH is presenting this as a fait accompli; his hours are inflexible, his workouts are a priority, therefore she's gotta handle it all. OK. Well, but it seems he's also expecting her to do everything for these kids. There's a name for that: it's a SAHM. As long as he wants OP to have a job, and he wants nothing to change for him, that means they outsource. And on $270K combined salary in this area, that's either tricky or impossible while also paying for daycare. So. He wants his job to be the only contribution (and frankly to have this 1955 arrangement)? Time to bring in more money dude.

Now of course the easier, more equitable, healthier, and better-choice-as-a-father choice, is him actually participating in the family he created and working with his wife to help life move forward. But that's "impossible" because he's so "thorough", can't "multi-task", etc.

It's BS. And yes I sound annoyed. As another PP pointed out, DH is running quite the con, and OP sounds like she's genuinely struggling. I think that sucks.

I posted before that I now stay home but used to be in a similar situation. I actually also worked in finance and kept cutting down. At the end, I was doing more accounting and budgeting for flexibility, which is far different than more glamorous finance jobs in nyc.

In OP’s situation, I think her DH should try to get a higher paying job. 170 is pretty low. I made more than that fresh out of grad school 20 years ago. If he isn’t helping much around the house, he should at least earn more to get you more paid help.

In my house, I told Dh to go hard in his career and he did. He doesn’t worry about pick up or drop off or getting a kid to dance or soccer. I don’t get mad at him for never going grocery shopping or buying a birthday gift. I stopped working when he earned 800k. He now earns $2-3m.

[Anonymous]

It seems the threshold issue isn’t actual logistics (meal prep, etc) but that OP isn’t feeling seen or heard by her DH and that’s feeling the brunt of the status quo. Op - does your DH think the status quo is an issue? Other than the fighting? Does he see how much this is for you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There are plenty of dads of young children at his salary level that get their work done in a way that allows them to be a contributing partner at home.

Oh I wasn't saying it can't be done. I'm saying OP's DH is presenting this as a fait accompli; his hours are inflexible, his workouts are a priority, therefore she's gotta handle it all. OK. Well, but it seems he's also expecting her to do everything for these kids. There's a name for that: it's a SAHM. As long as he wants OP to have a job, and he wants nothing to change for him, that means they outsource. And on $270K combined salary in this area, that's either tricky or impossible while also paying for daycare. So. He wants his job to be the only contribution (and frankly to have this 1955 arrangement)? Time to bring in more money dude.

Now of course the easier, more equitable, healthier, and better-choice-as-a-father choice, is him actually participating in the family he created and working with his wife to help life move forward. But that's "impossible" because he's so "thorough", can't "multi-task", etc.

It's BS. And yes I sound annoyed. As another PP pointed out, DH is running quite the con, and OP sounds like she's genuinely struggling. I think that sucks.

I posted before that I now stay home but used to be in a similar situation. I actually also worked in finance and kept cutting down. At the end, I was doing more accounting and budgeting for flexibility, which is far different than more glamorous finance jobs in nyc.

In OP’s situation, I think her DH should try to get a higher paying job. 170 is pretty low. I made more than that fresh out of grad school 20 years ago. If he isn’t helping much around the house, he should at least earn more to get you more paid help.

In my house, I told Dh to go hard in his career and he did. He doesn’t worry about pick up or drop off or getting a kid to dance or soccer. I don’t get mad at him for never going grocery shopping or buying a birthday gift. I stopped working when he earned 800k. He now earns $2-3m.

These are unrealistic standards and not applicable to most people and their careers nor is it statistically probable for every 2-parent working household to obtain a HHI income at these levels.

Im glad it worked out for you but that isnt a realistic outcome for most people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There are plenty of dads of young children at his salary level that get their work done in a way that allows them to be a contributing partner at home.

Oh I wasn't saying it can't be done. I'm saying OP's DH is presenting this as a fait accompli; his hours are inflexible, his workouts are a priority, therefore she's gotta handle it all. OK. Well, but it seems he's also expecting her to do everything for these kids. There's a name for that: it's a SAHM. As long as he wants OP to have a job, and he wants nothing to change for him, that means they outsource. And on $270K combined salary in this area, that's either tricky or impossible while also paying for daycare. So. He wants his job to be the only contribution (and frankly to have this 1955 arrangement)? Time to bring in more money dude.

Now of course the easier, more equitable, healthier, and better-choice-as-a-father choice, is him actually participating in the family he created and working with his wife to help life move forward. But that's "impossible" because he's so "thorough", can't "multi-task", etc.

It's BS. And yes I sound annoyed. As another PP pointed out, DH is running quite the con, and OP sounds like she's genuinely struggling. I think that sucks.

I posted before that I now stay home but used to be in a similar situation. I actually also worked in finance and kept cutting down. At the end, I was doing more accounting and budgeting for flexibility, which is far different than more glamorous finance jobs in nyc.

In OP’s situation, I think her DH should try to get a higher paying job. 170 is pretty low. I made more than that fresh out of grad school 20 years ago. If he isn’t helping much around the house, he should at least earn more to get you more paid help.

In my house, I told Dh to go hard in his career and he did. He doesn’t worry about pick up or drop off or getting a kid to dance or soccer. I don’t get mad at him for never going grocery shopping or buying a birthday gift. I stopped working when he earned 800k. He now earns $2-3m.

These are unrealistic standards and not applicable to most people and their careers nor is it statistically probable for every 2-parent working household to obtain a HHI income at these levels.

Im glad it worked out for you but that isnt a realistic outcome for most people.

Yes, Dh is a high earner. OP said her husband was an investment analyst. I’m not sure what his area of expertise is but there are a lot of positions where he can earn more than 170k.

[Anonymous]

OP here. It is helpful to read about how other families handle these challenges. I have to clarify that my DH did used to work a high-powered finance job where he earned 500k-600k. He was working 60+ hours/week. I freelanced. Neither of us liked that setup. I missed him, the kids missed him, he was stressed.

I also have to clarify that he doesn't have depression. We've been together since college, and he was always slow to get homework/readings done, to run errands, etc. He just moves at a different pace. I think that's what the biggest challenge is. (Coincidentally, I am abnormally efficient -- my work is pretty intense but I fit it into 40 hours because I'm fast).

My DH is willing to move workouts or work to the evenings, but then that means no couple time. So I feel like I have to pick between his help with home/kids and connecting as a couple. He does see all as a problem, he isn't taking advantage of me, he just can't move fast. And he hates that, but I don't think it can be changed.

About outsourcing, I've had a hard time finding someone who will work just a couple of afternoon hours (make dinner and drive to pick up my kids). I agree this sounds like a good plan but I'm not sure how to find someone.