Predictions for what happens when the SC bans affirmative action?

[Anonymous]

General, unskilled legal immigration doesn’t exist in the U.S. (besides immigrants being sponsored by wealthy family members who are already here & refugees) so you can’t compare the outcomes of “penniless” immigrants to the outcomes of the descendants of people who were forcefully brought here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

Yes, I wonder why self-selected newcomers, who are coming here with college degrees (debt-free), no generational trauma and the ability to navigate the immigration bureaucracy are succeeding. I also wonder why people who’ve shown they were able to pay thousands of dollars in plane tickets, boat trips or or to pay off smugglers are succeeding.

You miss the point entirely. It's not just Indian immigrants. It's immigrants from Ghana, Nigeria etc also. Even dirt poor Vietnamese refugees who arrived here with little or no language skills have bootstrapped their way to more success than native blacks within a single generation. Systemic racism didn't hold them back. Natives can also accumulate these same cultural capital traits. If they as a community put their heart into it. So quit whining.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

https://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8

The only Indian immigrants who make it into the U.S. legally are already highly-educated, talented workers. Skilled enough to get a job at FAANG or into a funded PhD program. These folks are UMC/wealthy in India.

Flawed reasoning. What about Vietnamese refugees who came here in the 79's? It's got nothing to do with your status in the home country. It's got everything to do with the cultural capital you bring to America

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

https://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8

Do you have any idea how difficult it is to legally immigrate to the U.S. in order to be able to legally work full-time here? There is a filter that you don’t seem to be aware of.

So what? You are making my point. If you accumulate the right cultural capital, you can arrive here dirt poor and still wipe the floor compared to the natives. That's truly possible in America

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

Yeah but none of them ever dealing with systematic oppression by the whites.

Because wait for it...... THERE IS NONE. Only lazy race huksters point to systemic racism as THE REASON, THEY ARE NOT MAKING PROGRESS. Because if America was systemically racist, you think Nigerian and Ghanaian immigrants would succeed here? Vietnamese refugees would succeed here? A person like Ilhan Omar would be in Congress?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

https://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8

The only Indian immigrants who make it into the U.S. legally are already highly-educated, talented workers. Skilled enough to get a job at FAANG or into a funded PhD program. These folks are UMC/wealthy in India.

Flawed reasoning. What about Vietnamese refugees who came here in the 79's? It's got nothing to do with your status in the home country. It's got everything to do with the cultural capital you bring to America

It’s not 1979. The only legal immigrants coming to the U.S. nowadays from Nigeria, Ethiopia, Ghana, India, Vietnam etc are the best & brightest in their respective countries. If they don’t already have a bachelor’s degree when they get here, they’re coming for undergrad as a full-pay international student. They’re coming here AFTER being hired for FAANG jobs, accepted to fully-funded PhD programs, for professorships or for medical residencies. I’m not sure how you think a “dirt poor” person would get to U.S. soil from an African country or from India. Do you have any idea how much a flight costs, especially for a family (it’s common for an adult international PhD student to bring their spouse & kids)? $4,000 at minimum.

What do you mean “it’s got nothing to do with your status in your home country”? Do you think the U.S. is letting any random Kenya resident come here & start working full-time? How do you think they’d get to the U.S.? How you do think they’d afford immigration paperwork, housing or flights?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

Yeah but none of them ever dealing with systematic oppression by the whites.

Because wait for it...... THERE IS NONE. Only lazy race huksters point to systemic racism as THE REASON, THEY ARE NOT MAKING PROGRESS. Because if America was systemically racist, you think Nigerian and Ghanaian immigrants would succeed here? Vietnamese refugees would succeed here? A person like Ilhan Omar would be in Congress?

Basically the only Ghanan & Nigerian immigrants being selected to come to the U.S. legally are doctors, software engineers or PhD students who were educated in their home countries & are among the elite there. I’m curious how you think a “dirt poor” person might transport themselves from Ghana to the U.S…by Greyhound bus?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it will vary. Some schools will be happy to just enroll the best students and other will drop aa in favor of economic diversity

You make it sound like wanting diversity is at odds with enrolling the best students. I find these assumptions to be suspect. Like the posters who define merit as whatever benefits them the most.

The way diversity is defined and implemented today, yes, it is absolutely at odds at enrolling the best students. There is such a huge skills gap between the average URM and non URM applicant, that there is a serious shortage of equivalently qualified URM applicants in the application pipeline. If a college insists on getting anything close to proportional representation despite this, then by definition they have to pick lower qualified URM students to fill their class. The only way to claim that diversity does not affect quality today, is to redefine the very meaning of the word merit to something nonsensical, like Harvard did by introducing spurious variables like the personality ratings into the mix.

Also in every country where diversity is actually present, it has led to destruction of social cohesion, social trust and increase in friction. The former Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Myanmar being some examples) Diversity advocate have only recently recognized this because now they are insisting on "inclusion" as being another responsibility of the non URM pool. This is just code for non URM's having to walk on eggshells, so as not to trigger or piss off URM's on campus. It's a fool's errand. Human kind is tribal by nature and just like diversity brought strife all over the world, it is destroying America's campus environment today.

So what is your solution? Whine endlessly about it? Or have no diversity and every racial group sticks to themselves? It’s too late for that. This country is diverse and we’d better continue to figure out ways to get along and include everyone because diversity isn’t going anywhere.

Seems like AAs are the only group needing assistance. Look at the makeup of colleges in Texas. Unfortunately, AAs are still very much struggling in this country.

Maybe they should pick up a few tips from here about how and why certain immigrant communities succeed, instead of constantly whining about how pervasive systemic racism in America is? If America is that bad, how come all these newcomers are leaving native born blacks and whites in the dust? Simple. It's all about cultural capital, a term that's taboo in leftist circles

httphttps://youtu.be/-eMLAFV4cx8be/-eMLAFV4cx8

Yeah but none of them ever dealing with systematic oppression by the whites.

Because wait for it...... THERE IS NONE. Only lazy race huksters point to systemic racism as THE REASON, THEY ARE NOT MAKING PROGRESS. Because if America was systemically racist, you think Nigerian and Ghanaian immigrants would succeed here? Vietnamese refugees would succeed here? A person like Ilhan Omar would be in Congress?

You’re proving my point. Ilhan Omar’s father was a prominent senior officer in the Somali National Army before they immigrated. They were not at all “dirt poor.”

[Anonymous]

I think what the systemic racism people and the muh bootstraps people agree on is the percentage of blacks at elite institutions will go way down in absence of affirmative action. Even if admissions offices use proxies. So the other arguments are irrelevant to the thread.

[Anonymous]

Black people are not losing any sleep about how the SC will rule; and we definitely not creating multiple posts about it. At one point we were denied an education! When we were allowed to get educated we could go to certain schools so HBCUs were created. We are a resilient people; whatever ever the decision, we will be fine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Black people are not losing any sleep about how the SC will rule; and we definitely not creating multiple posts about it. At one point we were denied an education! When we were allowed to get educated we could go to certain schools so HBCUs were created. We are a resilient people; whatever ever the decision, we will be fine.

Don't speak for everyone. A lot of black families have legacy at places like Harvard and they're likely to be at least moderately upset. Your average black American, certainly not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One school’s take.
https://thesandb.com/41276/article/office-of-admissions-braces-for-impact-of-predicted-end-of-affirmative-action/

That deposition should be fun once someone gets around to suing Grinnell over its admissions

The president basically says that they will work to make Grinnell a good place for minorities. That doesn’t seem objectionable. She rejects some of the other ideas which are proxies for race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Black people are not losing any sleep about how the SC will rule; and we definitely not creating multiple posts about it. At one point we were denied an education! When we were allowed to get educated we could go to certain schools so HBCUs were created. We are a resilient people; whatever ever the decision, we will be fine.

Don't speak for everyone. A lot of black families have legacy at places like Harvard and they're likely to be at least moderately upset. Your average black American, certainly not.

Legacy & sports recruiting aren’t going anywhere. Two SCOTUS judges have kids at their alma maters as legacies right now. Another SCOTUS judge has a child who is a junior in HS & actively pursuing being an athletic recruit to a top school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Black people are not losing any sleep about how the SC will rule; and we definitely not creating multiple posts about it. At one point we were denied an education! When we were allowed to get educated we could go to certain schools so HBCUs were created. We are a resilient people; whatever ever the decision, we will be fine.

This!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Black people are not losing any sleep about how the SC will rule; and we definitely not creating multiple posts about it. At one point we were denied an education! When we were allowed to get educated we could go to certain schools so HBCUs were created. We are a resilient people; whatever ever the decision, we will be fine.

Don't speak for everyone. A lot of black families have legacy at places like Harvard and they're likely to be at least moderately upset. Your average black American, certainly not.

That’s because the average black American doesn’t benefit from affirmative action. The wealthy blacks who already are doing well are the ones who benefit the most. That’s the problem with the system. Affirmative action is a bandaid. It makes it look like there is progress because the top institutions are 15% black. But the average black kid lives in a less affluent area and receives an inferior education. We need to focus on improving the education for these kids as well as adding support systems for them so that they can have upward mobility. Affirmative action being used to help children of wealthy black parents doesn’t do anything to improve social mobility.