7/24/23 Trial of Usman Shahid -- driver who killed two Oakton teens

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If he is not going to get the maximum of 20 years then how much jail sentence will he get? Will they release him to go home for a while until the civil case is over? How does this work.? Can someone explain it? is there a possibility of house arrest? I mean, he didn’t do this on purpose. It was reckless and stupid. He was only 18. Maybe I watch too many movies, but they will absolutely destroy him in a federal prison. A young 20 year old boy going in with hardened inmates?

You can at least reassure yourself that he won’t be going to federal prison.

[Anonymous]

Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

Fwiw, we don’t know for sure that the person posting here is a family member or even knows him. It could be just some troll trying to rile people up.

[Anonymous]

Did he even reach out to his victims’ families, apologize, do anything to show remorse before conviction?
Visit the one who survived in hospital? Try to pay off the medical bills with them?
???????

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

As someone noted upthread, a defendant is advised by his lawyer not to show any emotion during the trial, since any emotion could be misinterpreted by the jury. During sentencing, that is the time for the defendant to show remorse.

FWIW, I think the poster on this thread defending him is a friend rather than family member, but I could be wrong. Either way, they seem very young and I don't read anything into their posts against the defendant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If he is not going to get the maximum of 20 years then how much jail sentence will he get? Will they release him to go home for a while until the civil case is over? How does this work.? Can someone explain it? is there a possibility of house arrest? I mean, he didn’t do this on purpose. It was reckless and stupid. He was only 18. Maybe I watch too many movies, but they will absolutely destroy him in a federal prison. A young 20 year old boy going in with hardened inmates?

No one knows what the sentence will be. It's rare to see a case like this go to trial. Most defendants facing clear-cut vehicular manslaughter charges (often from a DUI) plead guilty. I expect that he could have gotten 2-3 years in a plea, and maybe he'll get 4-8 years now, but we'll just have to wait and see.

The civil case has no relevance to when he'll begin serving his sentence. I expect that he'll start serving it immediately. It's possible that the judge will defer the start date until he issues the sentence, but that seems unlikely given that the judge ordered his incarceration yesterday.

He was convicted of a state crime and will go to state prison, not federal prison. Regardless, the movies tend to exaggerate how bad conditions are; he'll be fine if he keeps to himself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

Fwiw, we don’t know for sure that the person posting here is a family member or even knows him. It could be just some troll trying to rile people up.

That's what I thought at the very start, but then his defense went with more or less the same strategy as the anonymous poster here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

Fwiw, we don’t know for sure that the person posting here is a family member or even knows him. It could be just some troll trying to rile people up.

Ugh they are like full force making excuses on Reddit nova …

Okay couple posts ago it was his family and a school friend posting and now this person is saying it’s a troll…

You have to believe people the first time!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

Fwiw, we don’t know for sure that the person posting here is a family member or even knows him. It could be just some troll trying to rile people up.

If it was a troll the moderator would have removed their posts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has he or his family ever ever shown any public remorse? Seems like all they want to do is make excuses.

Fwiw, we don’t know for sure that the person posting here is a family member or even knows him. It could be just some troll trying to rile people up.

If it was a troll the moderator would have removed their posts.

Only if someone was reporting all of them.

My guess is he’ll get five years.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:For everyone saying “if he was never speeding, this could’ve happened” it’s the same as “if the other car yielded and never blocked the road, this would’ve never happened” just use some brain cells here y’all. They’re both at fault

When you are driving, if someone pulls in front of you or turns in front of you, then you brake to avoid them. You don't accelerate and try to drive around them.

You, being an experienced, licensed driver? Sure. That probably happens most of the time.

Since you seem to be an inexperienced driver, I am informing you how to drive safely.

You are confusing posters.

If you’re going to teach anyone how to drive tell the 4Runner to wait until it’s clear before turning.

Maybe tell that loser not to drive 81 mph when he’s not even legally licensed.

Yes, obviously. Shahid made multiple errors.

But he wasn’t the only one at fault here.

Maybe. But “right of way” does not equal “right to hit”. The driver with the right of way still has a legal obligation to try and avoid an accident, even if the other driver has made an error. Knowingly driving without a valid license and exceeding the speed limit by more than double in a residential area clearly indicate disregard for that responsibility.

I also came across some information that seems to indicate three exceptions to an automatic ruling of fault against a left turn driver in situations like this, and Shahid meets two of them - that the right of way driver was speeding, and that the left-turn driver had a clear path when he or she began the turn, but something caused a delay in the maneuver.

Did the 4Runner driver make a mistake? Maybe. But that’s irrelevant to this case. Driving is not a right but a privilege that comes with responsibility, and Shahid knowingly and recklessly failed to respect that.

Agree 100% that it's irrelevant to this case. Shahid should absolutely be held accountable for his actions.

The 4Runner should still be held accountable for his mistake which did contribute to their deaths. Hopefully that happens in the civil case.

Maybe a harsh penalty will make the bad drivers in this area start to pay attention to the other drivers and pedestrians around them.

The 4Runner did nothing wrong! What are you talking about. I feel badly for them. Someone else makes a deadly mistake and your life is upended for years because you happened to be nearby.

Huh? Of course he did. That’s why he took immunity.

Shahid’s actions were much, much worse but that doesn’t mean the 4Runner did nothing wrong.

It isn’t an either/or.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Did he even reach out to his victims’ families, apologize, do anything to show remorse before conviction?
Visit the one who survived in hospital? Try to pay off the medical bills with them?
???????

You cannot be serious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For everyone saying “if he was never speeding, this could’ve happened” it’s the same as “if the other car yielded and never blocked the road, this would’ve never happened” just use some brain cells here y’all. They’re both at fault

When you are driving, if someone pulls in front of you or turns in front of you, then you brake to avoid them. You don't accelerate and try to drive around them.

You, being an experienced, licensed driver? Sure. That probably happens most of the time.

Since you seem to be an inexperienced driver, I am informing you how to drive safely.

You are confusing posters.

If you’re going to teach anyone how to drive tell the 4Runner to wait until it’s clear before turning.

Maybe tell that loser not to drive 81 mph when he’s not even legally licensed.

Yes, obviously. Shahid made multiple errors.

But he wasn’t the only one at fault here.

Maybe. But “right of way” does not equal “right to hit”. The driver with the right of way still has a legal obligation to try and avoid an accident, even if the other driver has made an error. Knowingly driving without a valid license and exceeding the speed limit by more than double in a residential area clearly indicate disregard for that responsibility.

I also came across some information that seems to indicate three exceptions to an automatic ruling of fault against a left turn driver in situations like this, and Shahid meets two of them - that the right of way driver was speeding, and that the left-turn driver had a clear path when he or she began the turn, but something caused a delay in the maneuver.

Did the 4Runner driver make a mistake? Maybe. But that’s irrelevant to this case. Driving is not a right but a privilege that comes with responsibility, and Shahid knowingly and recklessly failed to respect that.

Agree 100% that it's irrelevant to this case. Shahid should absolutely be held accountable for his actions.

The 4Runner should still be held accountable for his mistake which did contribute to their deaths. Hopefully that happens in the civil case.

Maybe a harsh penalty will make the bad drivers in this area start to pay attention to the other drivers and pedestrians around them.

The 4Runner did nothing wrong! What are you talking about. I feel badly for them. Someone else makes a deadly mistake and your life is upended for years because you happened to be nearby.

Huh? Of course he did. That’s why he took immunity.

Shahid’s actions were much, much worse but that doesn’t mean the 4Runner did nothing wrong.

It isn’t an either/or.

You guys are whacked. Shahid engaged in criminal activity. The SUV driver did not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For everyone saying “if he was never speeding, this could’ve happened” it’s the same as “if the other car yielded and never blocked the road, this would’ve never happened” just use some brain cells here y’all. They’re both at fault

When you are driving, if someone pulls in front of you or turns in front of you, then you brake to avoid them. You don't accelerate and try to drive around them.

You, being an experienced, licensed driver? Sure. That probably happens most of the time.

Since you seem to be an inexperienced driver, I am informing you how to drive safely.

You are confusing posters.

If you’re going to teach anyone how to drive tell the 4Runner to wait until it’s clear before turning.

Maybe tell that loser not to drive 81 mph when he’s not even legally licensed.

Yes, obviously. Shahid made multiple errors.

But he wasn’t the only one at fault here.

Maybe. But “right of way” does not equal “right to hit”. The driver with the right of way still has a legal obligation to try and avoid an accident, even if the other driver has made an error. Knowingly driving without a valid license and exceeding the speed limit by more than double in a residential area clearly indicate disregard for that responsibility.

I also came across some information that seems to indicate three exceptions to an automatic ruling of fault against a left turn driver in situations like this, and Shahid meets two of them - that the right of way driver was speeding, and that the left-turn driver had a clear path when he or she began the turn, but something caused a delay in the maneuver.

Did the 4Runner driver make a mistake? Maybe. But that’s irrelevant to this case. Driving is not a right but a privilege that comes with responsibility, and Shahid knowingly and recklessly failed to respect that.

Agree 100% that it's irrelevant to this case. Shahid should absolutely be held accountable for his actions.

The 4Runner should still be held accountable for his mistake which did contribute to their deaths. Hopefully that happens in the civil case.

Maybe a harsh penalty will make the bad drivers in this area start to pay attention to the other drivers and pedestrians around them.

The 4Runner did nothing wrong! What are you talking about. I feel badly for them. Someone else makes a deadly mistake and your life is upended for years because you happened to be nearby.

Huh? Of course he did. That’s why he took immunity.

Shahid’s actions were much, much worse but that doesn’t mean the 4Runner did nothing wrong.

It isn’t an either/or.

No. In this case, it is one car at fault.

[Anonymous]

The prosecution had to give him immunity so he would testify. Otherwise he would refuse to testify since he's a defendant in the civil trial. That's all there is to it.

Greenspun knows exactly how it works but tried to make a big deal out of immunity, knowing that juries and observers will draw the wrong conclusion.