Reasons why one would not accept TJ offer?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

Interesting theory! Maybe if we all say it enough, pigs will fly too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

And, you're pushing the narrative that helps your unlikely back/hispanic but likely mediocre kids to get in LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We didn't believe our child would be in the top 10% or even the top 25% at TJ, so we declined the offer last year. Child was part of middle school math club, but there was significant gap between their math proficiency and that of students on the school's MathCounts team. We knew this gap would only be wider if our child were to attend TJ.

+1 here. The peer group at TJ is so high-achieving that if your kid isn't far-and-away the highest-achieving at his MS, DC will be mediocre at TJ. In that case, you/DC have to decide whether the opportunities at TJ outweigh the suppressed college choices.

People keep saying this but I'd like to see some data. I went to a magnet school in nyc and people said there was a penalty in college admissions because harvard wouldn't accept more than ~10 kids per year from my high school. After recent data released by harvard during the affirmative action litigation, it turns out that the penalty for attending my high school approximated the asian racial penalty. Staying at your base school doesn't make you any less asian, going to tjhsst doesn't make you any more asian. We don't know what the future looks like but i'd like to see data before believing that uva is flat out lying about discriminating against tj students.

Seems you already have the data.

I don't have a monopoly on data. I may be missing something but it seems to me that UVA admissions has been getting way more selective and TJ has been getting way more asian and those two factors combine to make it APPEAR as if it is harder to get into UVA from TJ

You explained Harvard.

I think up until last year, UVA also had affirmative action.

The combination of UVA going from 40% acceptance rate to 15% over the last 15 yearsd and TJ going from 50% asian to 75% asian in the same 15 years made TJ's admissions to all selective schools plummet. First because it plummeted for everyone but especially for asians. Look at who got into top schools from TJ last year. TJ is 75% asian. The kids getting into ivy+ are nowhere near 75% asian. This has been true for a while.

If we see UVA acceptances spike to what you would expect then UVA is pretty much telling the truth. They don't discrimmiante against TJ but they did practice affirmative action and this had a (unintended?) discriminatory effect on asians and all the asians at tj made it look like they were targetting tj but they were actually targetting asians (unintentionally?).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

And for most of MLB history most pitchers threw below 90 mph. The world has gotten more competitive.
Algebra 1 kids have NOT been doping splendidly.
By all accounts the algebra 1 kids struggle more frequently than the general population.
We should be making efforts to increase the rate of algebra ready 6th graders in every neighborhood.

You cannot impose equity at 9th grade while ignoring it from 1st through 8th.
You have to have aap kids in every neighborhood.
I mean if we can impose geographic quotas for tj, why not for aap?
If they never get into aap, it is not reasonable to expect them to be ready for tj in 9th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

Good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

What is the tactical advantage for algebra1 students to join freshman TJ class that has peers two years ahead?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

What is the tactical advantage for algebra1 students to join freshman TJ class that has peers two years ahead?

Going to TJ and the classes there.

There's no 2 years ahead, the freshmen all take Bio and English 9 and the sophomores all take Chem (or possibly AP Bio) and English 10, etc. Being in a different math class is just a different math class, not ahead. May allow Physics in 11th instead of 12th. Is that a tactical advantage in your opinion?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

What is the tactical advantage for algebra1 students to join freshman TJ class that has peers two years ahead?

Going to TJ and the classes there.

There's no 2 years ahead, the freshmen all take Bio and English 9 and the sophomores all take Chem (or possibly AP Bio) and English 10, etc. Being in a different math class is just a different math class, not ahead. May allow Physics in 11th instead of 12th. Is that a tactical advantage in your opinion?

Top quarter is two years ahead having completed Geometry and Algebra 2. The question was what are the advantages for algebra 1 students enrolling with peers that are two year ahead? The disadvantages have been outlined numerous times here already, starting with not being able to take calculus based physics, or any of the advanced courses beyond and including basic Calc BC unless they skipped math levels, not being able to participate in competitive stem teams that need advanced math, etc. Sure they benefit from peer to peer learning, collaborative learning, etc. what about competitive college admissions, student confidence, etc....?

[Anonymous]

Re: physics.

You know there are other sciences right? I get that you think that is the end all be all of science, because we all had that drunken discussion of what sciences are the most important (or where the crap line is above social sciences and potentially includes some of biology) but let’s remember that physics majors have some of the higher unemployment rates (6.1%) compared to electrical engineering (3.1%). Mathematics is 5.9% unemployment too.

Sure- some of us want our kids to invent new mathematics for quantum calculations or black hole modeling- but let’s be honest, the majority of us just want our kids to be gainfully employed and not hate us.

https://stacker.com/business-economy/college-majors-highest-and-lowest-unemployment-

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

Good.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

What is the tactical advantage for algebra1 students to join freshman TJ class that has peers two years ahead?

Going to TJ and the classes there.

There's no 2 years ahead, the freshmen all take Bio and English 9 and the sophomores all take Chem (or possibly AP Bio) and English 10, etc. Being in a different math class is just a different math class, not ahead. May allow Physics in 11th instead of 12th. Is that a tactical advantage in your opinion?

Top quarter is two years ahead having completed Geometry and Algebra 2. The question was what are the advantages for algebra 1 students enrolling with peers that are two year ahead? The disadvantages have been outlined numerous times here already, starting with not being able to take calculus based physics, or any of the advanced courses beyond and including basic Calc BC unless they skipped math levels, not being able to participate in competitive stem teams that need advanced math, etc. Sure they benefit from peer to peer learning, collaborative learning, etc. what about competitive college admissions, student confidence, etc....?

Students taking Algebra in 8th grade can take Calc BC and Physics C in their senior year if they choose, at TJ (or at a base school). There are also other sciences in the world than physics that they can take at TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

And for most of MLB history most pitchers threw below 90 mph. The world has gotten more competitive.
Algebra 1 kids have NOT been doping splendidly.
By all accounts the algebra 1 kids struggle more frequently than the general population.
We should be making efforts to increase the rate of algebra ready 6th graders in every neighborhood.

You cannot impose equity at 9th grade while ignoring it from 1st through 8th.
You have to have aap kids in every neighborhood.
I mean if we can impose geographic quotas for tj, why not for aap?
If they never get into aap, it is not reasonable to expect them to be ready for tj in 9th grade.

1) There are still pitchers in MLB who are very successful throwing in the neighborhood of 90mph for their fastball. But if you really want to take the analogy there, I'll play ball (haha).

Yes, the average fastball has spiked in velo over the last several years. And you know what else has happened? Tommy John and thoracic outlet surgeries have gone through the roof.

Because parents are sending their kids to enrichment opportunities at an earlier and earlier age to get their kids throwing harder while they chase scholarships and MLB draft positions. Dr. James Andrews (the earliest leading expert in ligament surgeries for sports) has acknowledged that the overwhelming majority of kids shouldn't be throwing harder than 80mph before they're 16 because the ligament that is stressed doesn't fully mature until age 26.

There is a direct analogy between this phenomenon and the fad of hyper-acceleration in math as parents chase TJ admissions and elite college outcomes for their kids. And you know what happens? They get burned out and resentful.

Are there a few kids who are outliers who should be throwing 90mph in high school? Sure! Are there a few kids who are outliers who should be studying pre-calc in 8th grade? Sure!

But it's the craven attempt to manufacture those outliers that is damaging to the kids.

2) Every single progressive will agree with you that we absolutely should be making more efforts to improve outcomes for students from disadvantaged backgrounds in grades K-8. Every. Single. One.

But it is a false choice to suggest that we can't both do that and improve access to TJ for those groups through the removal of barriers that are so easily manipulated by the test-prep industry.

And if you genuinely want to take this ground-up approach, you have to be diligent about voting for progressives in every single local election who want to raise taxes on those who can afford to support improved public education and who favor rebalancing local budgets to prioritize fully funding advanced educational services in low-income areas of Northern Virginia.

You cannot simultaneously advocate for a ground-up approach to increasing access to advanced academics and vote for conservatives who want to slash funding for one of the nation's best school systems. Not if you want to be taken seriously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A lot of these folks X" -> stereotyping a whole race based on experiences with a very small number -> racist.

If you got mugged by an African-American, would you go around talking about how black people are thugs?

DP. The person above is not stereotyping an entire race with that comment.

The fact that there are a large number of upper-middle class and "wealthy" Asians who are attempting to protect their prior privileged access to an exceptional academic opportunity says nothing about Asians more broadly.

The fact that by and large, they are not publicly joined by members of other races (except occasionally by people who are married to Asians acting in the self interest of their biracial children or Asian stepchildren) is what permits the person above to refer to the group as "Asian".

It is Asians who are making this argument publicly, but it is far from all Asians.

There is a school similar to TJ in NYC where they also tried to change the admissions criteria for similar reasons. The school was almost 80% asian and they talked about how asian families were buying their way into the school. Then it was pointed out that asians have a higher poverty rate than blacks or hispanics in NYC because they are all immigrants. Most of the asian students were on free/reduced lunch, a higher propiortion than the school in general which was about 40% free/reduced lunch. Money has nothing to do with it, it's all about race.

If money is what gets you into tj, there would have been more white kids. White people in northern virginia are wealthier than asians and yet the biggest absolute increase in population under the new admissions process was among white students.

It is clear that some parents want their kids to get great opportunities but don't necessarily want their kids to stress out and bust their ass to earn them.

Counter-point: the previous admissions process was incentivizing behavior that took "stressing out" and "busting your ass" to a deeply unhealthy level for many students, who would then get in to TJ and crash hard. It wouldn't appear that they were crashing hard because of the sheer volume of external support they were receiving, but the evidence came in the form of self-harming behavior.

The previous method was competitive and merit based. The current method looks pretty random.

Allocating social resources based on merit might create more stress but it also leads to more efficient allocation.
Academic stress happens everywhere, if those kids don't get into tj, their parents don't give up on their kids. The academic stress is still there.
It's not like tj has the highest suicide rate in the area.

Sure it does not. But is the idea behind admitting under-qualified 8th grade algebra 1 students and setting them up to face TJ rigor and inhumanely subject them to stress?

There have ALWAYS been Algebra 1 students who got into TJ. Indeed, for most of the school’s early existence, the majority of students entering were coming in from Alg1.

Some of the school’s most outstanding graduates, even in recent years, have entered from Alg1.

But you’re going to sit here and pretend that you care about them and their well-being as an excuse to advance your pernicious self-serving narrative that TJ should only be for kids who are in Geometry or higher - or that kids who are in Pre-calc or above should be automatic admits.

Alg1 TJ students do not need your support. They have been doing splendidly and will continue to do so while you cry your crocodile tears. Enough already with this nonsense.

In the years ( 2020, 2019, etc.) right before admissions change, were the algebra 1 students more than 20+ and with the admissions change (2021) that count went upto 130+?

algebra1 offers were 4%, after admissions change it's almost 30%.

What is the tactical advantage for algebra1 students to join freshman TJ class that has peers two years ahead?

Going to TJ and the classes there.

There's no 2 years ahead, the freshmen all take Bio and English 9 and the sophomores all take Chem (or possibly AP Bio) and English 10, etc. Being in a different math class is just a different math class, not ahead. May allow Physics in 11th instead of 12th. Is that a tactical advantage in your opinion?

Top quarter is two years ahead having completed Geometry and Algebra 2. The question was what are the advantages for algebra 1 students enrolling with peers that are two year ahead? The disadvantages have been outlined numerous times here already, starting with not being able to take calculus based physics, or any of the advanced courses beyond and including basic Calc BC unless they skipped math levels, not being able to participate in competitive stem teams that need advanced math, etc. Sure they benefit from peer to peer learning, collaborative learning, etc. what about competitive college admissions, student confidence, etc....?

It might surprise you to find out that for these students, access to peer to peer learning and collaboration has a strongly positive impact on competitive college admissions and student confidence.

It might also surprise you to learn that the vast majority of students at TJ do not study physics at a level that is inaccessible to students that take Algebra in 8th grade. They never have. It's always been a relatively small cohort and it will continue to be so. The area that's overloaded at TJ is CS and AI, and that's going to continue to be the case for the foreseeable future.

You need to stop pretending like a primary concern for you is for the kids who are, in your view, "coming in behind their peers". The culture of the school is moving away from the stratification and comparison ethic that it used to have.