Anonymous wrote:Why do many teenage AAs make a show of being in a bookstore (maybe not much longer seeing how many are closing)? Is this something similar to how some attractive people feel the need to prove their intelligence?

Anonymous wrote:Is going to college and having a college degree akin to having the latest and most expensive basketball shoes, jackets and cell phones for AAs? Is there a sense of entitlement to higher education and it is pursued more because it had been out of reach for many in the past than for educational interest and advancement?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do many teenage AAs make a show of being in a bookstore (maybe not much longer seeing how many are closing)? Is this something similar to how some attractive people feel the need to prove their intelligence?

What do you mean, they make a show of it?

I've never noticed anyone "making a show" of being in a bookstore.

Anonymous wrote:I have two questions...

1. How do distinguish between rude, dismissive behavior and rude, dismissive behavior that is racist? If there is no overt mention of race or race related issues, how do you know that the negative behavior is due to race and not that that person would have been negative to anyone.

2. I only have one close friend who is black. She is the one who stereotypes black people all the time as in she says...Black women don't do...We're black, we do.... She obviously has ideas that she thinks are shared by the black community or by black women etc... Is this type of stereotyping as bad as others stereotyping a race?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do many teenage AAs make a show of being in a bookstore (maybe not much longer seeing how many are closing)? Is this something similar to how some attractive people feel the need to prove their intelligence?

What do you mean, they make a show of it?

I've never noticed anyone "making a show" of being in a bookstore.

Anonymous wrote:Is going to college and having a college degree akin to having the latest and most expensive basketball shoes, jackets and cell phones for AAs? Is there a sense of entitlement to higher education and it is pursued more because it had been out of reach for many in the past than for educational interest and advancement?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have two questions...

1. How do distinguish between rude, dismissive behavior and rude, dismissive behavior that is racist? If there is no overt mention of race or race related issues, how do you know that the negative behavior is due to race and not that that person would have been negative to anyone.

2. I only have one close friend who is black. She is the one who stereotypes black people all the time as in she says...Black women don't do...We're black, we do.... She obviously has ideas that she thinks are shared by the black community or by black women etc... Is this type of stereotyping as bad as others stereotyping a race?

1. It's really hard to say. It sounds bad, but honestly unless you're a minority, you probably won't get it. But many black people are very *aware*. Sometimes this can be a bad thing and you do have people who are quick to take something as racist, but more times than not, the black person has called it correctly. It doesn't mean that the person meant it maliciously; it just means that what they said was insensitive. I had an older white guy (60'ish) come to my home to work on my garage door. It was really friendly and somehow during the conversation he mentioned that he was okay with all people and knew a great "colored" guy. What that offensive to me? Yes. Did I take offense and react badly? No...I figured the guy didn't mean much harm, plus he's "old-school" and that was an accepted term then.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never denied that some kids are just picked on for being dorky. I actually stated that of course, social dynamics differ from school to school and area to area, so what was true for me won't be true for others, and vice versa. It was others PPs who denied my statements, saying that it was all/mostly due to being perceived as nerdy or bourgeois.

I will add that many of my friends/family members who attended all/predominantly-black schools didn't have this problem as frequently, because there was a wider range of possible black identities presented. My school was mixed, but blacks were underrepresented in the honors and advanced classes. The few academically successful blacks were made fun of by the majority.

But of y'all want to continue insisting that slurs of "acting white" are only becuase of dorkiness or stuck-up behavior (which, as a sidenote, is a problematic charge in itself because what qualifies as stuck-up to some is often related to what in reality is introversion or simply based on phenotype...) and denying the existence of the widely-recognized phenomenon, keep on, DCUM sociologists.

http://www.economics.harvard.edu/faculty/fryer/files/aw_ednext.pdf
 http://madamenoire.com/42302/acting-white-is-the-new-black/

I don't think it was your experience that turned people off, but rather the disdain you had towards these other kids. Was just pointing out that they probably picked up on this "elitism" and reacted negatively. Not saying bullying is ever okay....Hope you are past this now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is going to college and having a college degree akin to having the latest and most expensive basketball shoes, jackets and cell phones for AAs? Is there a sense of entitlement to higher education and it is pursued more because it had been out of reach for many in the past than for educational interest and advancement?

No. This is one of the things that frustrate me the most honestly. The idea that blacks don't like to learn. This is the best way I can explain it:

-During slavery time, it was forbidden for blacks to read/write. So in effect, they were not allowed to "learn". What type of parent will this create (to the extent that slaves were even allowed to parent their children)? It creates a parent who fears education and teaches her children the same (and even warns them against trying to learn to read/write).

-After emancipation, Blacks were displaced and poor. The focus was not on education but rather earning a living to survive. For those interested in higher education, severe Jim Crow laws prevented them from doing so. This continued over GENERATIONS. What type of parents do you think this produced? Parents who eventually accepted that education was "for whites" and they instead taught their children domestic tasks that would help them earn a living. Some parents may have even taken an "Eff education" stance. Understanding and teaching the value of an education after you've been denied for so long is a VERY difficult cycle to break. Once we were allowed "in", many took advantage...and many probably felt contempt and didn't want anything to do with it.

Blacks are slowly, but surely, breaking this cycle. But it will not happen overnight. You can't reverse 300+ years of oppression in under 50 years. But we are making great strides and I expect this to improve as we get further and further away from the oppression of the past.

-AA female

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have two questions...

1. How do distinguish between rude, dismissive behavior and rude, dismissive behavior that is racist? If there is no overt mention of race or race related issues, how do you know that the negative behavior is due to race and not that that person would have been negative to anyone.

2. I only have one close friend who is black. She is the one who stereotypes black people all the time as in she says...Black women don't do...We're black, we do.... She obviously has ideas that she thinks are shared by the black community or by black women etc... Is this type of stereotyping as bad as others stereotyping a race?

1. It's really hard to say. It sounds bad, but honestly unless you're a minority, you probably won't get it. But many black people are very *aware*. Sometimes this can be a bad thing and you do have people who are quick to take something as racist, but more times than not, the black person has called it correctly. It doesn't mean that the person meant it maliciously; it just means that what they said was insensitive. I had an older white guy (60'ish) come to my home to work on my garage door. It was really friendly and somehow during the conversation he mentioned that he was okay with all people and knew a great "colored" guy. What that offensive to me? Yes. Did I take offense and react badly? No...I figured the guy didn't mean much harm, plus he's "old-school" and that was an accepted term then.

Thanks, I agree I probably can't get it. I guess what I don't get most is when someone says something like..that cab didn't stop for me because I'm black. Given I'm white and I've had cabs not stop for me either, I always wonder how they knew the cab didn't stop for them because of being black. Same with the rude behavior. Someone told me how a store clerk had been nasty to him because he was black and he called her a racist. I was in the store two days later and the same clerk was extremely rude / nasty to me as well. Yet to him it was because he was black, to me it was because she has a horrible life / is not a nice person etc... So as black person (or any minority) when do you assume it was your race / minority status versus assuming it was not race related.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do many teenage AAs make a show of being in a bookstore (maybe not much longer seeing how many are closing)? Is this something similar to how some attractive people feel the need to prove their intelligence?

What do you mean, they make a show of it?

I've never noticed anyone "making a show" of being in a bookstore.

I've never seen it either. Never knew that bookstores were the new teen hang-out spot. Kids are too busy on their iPads/iPhones/etc.

Anonymous wrote:DH and I are white and adopted an Af-Am baby last year. What are the top things he will miss out on not being in a family of his own race, do you think, and what can we do to mitigate this?

(We talked to friends and professionals about this sort of thing before adopting . . . curious for other perspectives)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is going to college and having a college degree akin to having the latest and most expensive basketball shoes, jackets and cell phones for AAs? Is there a sense of entitlement to higher education and it is pursued more because it had been out of reach for many in the past than for educational interest and advancement?

No. This is one of the things that frustrate me the most honestly. The idea that blacks don't like to learn. This is the best way I can explain it:

-During slavery time, it was forbidden for blacks to read/write. So in effect, they were not allowed to "learn". What type of parent will this create (to the extent that slaves were even allowed to parent their children)? It creates a parent who fears education and teaches her children the same (and even warns them against trying to learn to read/write).

-After emancipation, Blacks were displaced and poor. The focus was not on education but rather earning a living to survive. For those interested in higher education, severe Jim Crow laws prevented them from doing so. This continued over GENERATIONS. What type of parents do you think this produced? Parents who eventually accepted that education was "for whites" and they instead taught their children domestic tasks that would help them earn a living. Some parents may have even taken an "Eff education" stance. Understanding and teaching the value of an education after you've been denied for so long is a VERY difficult cycle to break. Once we were allowed "in", many took advantage...and many probably felt contempt and didn't want anything to do with it.

Blacks are slowly, but surely, breaking this cycle. But it will not happen overnight. You can't reverse 300+ years of oppression in under 50 years. But we are making great strides and I expect this to improve as we get further and further away from the oppression of the past.

-AA female

Wow PP, you nailed it. My grandmother, born in 1921, fit this description. She did not understand my desire to go to college. She thought Whites would harm me because of my education. And she also thought that I would look with disdain on other Blacks who had little education. It wasnt until I received my first degree that she understood and accepted. And yes, she was so very proud.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is going to college and having a college degree akin to having the latest and most expensive basketball shoes, jackets and cell phones for AAs? Is there a sense of entitlement to higher education and it is pursued more because it had been out of reach for many in the past than for educational interest and advancement?

No. This is one of the things that frustrate me the most honestly. The idea that blacks don't like to learn. This is the best way I can explain it:

-During slavery time, it was forbidden for blacks to read/write. So in effect, they were not allowed to "learn". What type of parent will this create (to the extent that slaves were even allowed to parent their children)? It creates a parent who fears education and teaches her children the same (and even warns them against trying to learn to read/write).

-After emancipation, Blacks were displaced and poor. The focus was not on education but rather earning a living to survive. For those interested in higher education, severe Jim Crow laws prevented them from doing so. This continued over GENERATIONS. What type of parents do you think this produced? Parents who eventually accepted that education was "for whites" and they instead taught their children domestic tasks that would help them earn a living. Some parents may have even taken an "Eff education" stance. Understanding and teaching the value of an education after you've been denied for so long is a VERY difficult cycle to break. Once we were allowed "in", many took advantage...and many probably felt contempt and didn't want anything to do with it.

Blacks are slowly, but surely, breaking this cycle. But it will not happen overnight. You can't reverse 300+ years of oppression in under 50 years. But we are making great strides and I expect this to improve as we get further and further away from the oppression of the past.

-AA female

Wow PP, you nailed it. My grandmother, born in 1921, fit this description. She did not understand my desire to go to college. She thought Whites would harm me because of my education. And she also thought that I would look with disdain on other Blacks who had little education. It wasnt until I received my first degree that she understood and accepted. And yes, she was so very proud.

My experience was the polar opposite of this. My father dropped out of HS to join the army, and my mother went to secretarial school. Two of us three kids went to Ivy league universities because of the sacrifices our parents made to ensure we got a good education. My mother was the one always up at t school making sure they were treating us right and getting us all the support and challenge we needed. Nothing was more important to our parents than us receiving a good education.
There were black kids in my neighborhood going nowhere fast, but there were white kids going nowhere just as fast if not faster. And there were black and white kids working hard to succeed. There were very few of us black kids in the AP and honors classes. But now 20 years later, many of the black kids in the middle of the pack are now extremely successful.
AA female with a different experience

Anonymous wrote:I think the problem is that as a black person, you are never sure. I think some black people are quick to assume a bad experience was due to race, but even for those of us that tend to give a person the benefit of the doubt, there's always that question in the back of our head, "is it because I'm black?" E.g. - I'm an attorney, and was working as an associate at a big law firm - we had lots of contract/staff attorneys who would often assume I was one of them instead of an associate. I don't know why they assumed this, but as one of the few black associates at the firm, I often wondered whether that was the reason. But I will never know for sure because I never asked them (and even if I had, would they tell the truth?) It's frustrating, and I think some black people deal with that frustration by erring on the side of whatever experience being due to racism rather than some other reason.