Wizards and Caps could be moving to Potomac Yard

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Axios piece today shows that DC could not overcome what Youngkin promised (and apparently planned in advance with Leonsis).

Crime does not seem to be one of the factors for departure: https://www.axios.com/local/washington-dc/2023/12/14/capitals-wizards-stadium-virginia-how-it-happened

Leonsis’s portion of the 2B investment is only $403M. It’s really tough to complete with that.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I live in Fairfax and have partial season tix to the Caps and Wiz and like that I can pay $15 to park ~ a block away and then be home in 35/40 minutes post game. Neither of those things are going to happen in PY so I will give up my tix and maybe go to a couple of games a year, well planned and on a weekend afternoon.

From the arena, you can take the bus rapid transit to car parks in Crystal City, Pentagon City, or Old Town.

Again, that is adding at least a half hour each way on a commute to the games as compared to Gallery Place. for most fans, it won't be worth the time. For many fans, it won't even be a viable option. I hope Ted assumes that everyone who lives in "Potomac Landing" and Del ray will be season ticket holders, because the existing fan bases won't put up with the additional hassle.

I live in upper NW and would gladly spend an extra 30 minutes in traffic rather than subject my family to what Chinatown has become.

lol you people are like Chicken Little.

The area around CapOne was a lot worse when it opened in the 90s and people showed up in droves.

I’m down there pretty frequently on the weekends and it’s fine. It’s the same buskers and homeless that have been down there for the past 15 years.

The big issue is that due to the lack of office workers and foot traffic, one notices the homeless a lot more. So perception becomes a warped sense of reality. But on game days, there are so many people and big crowds that it’s a lot less of an issue. There’s safety in numbers.

This is just not true. I live in the neighborhood. 200 cars were broken into during a recent event. At least once a month I get an alarm about a middle of the day mugging or stabbing. Walgreens is a constant robbery target, plus the drug dealers right at the metro steps. Hell, the carjacking where the kid got shot was right down the road from the arena and on a game night.

The main issue is that crime is much mor random now and anyone can be a target.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Now that the Caps have cleared out of the market north of the Potomac, should the new NHL team be the Chesapeake Blue Crabs or the Baltimore Blue and Grey? Right off 95 on the water?

I think Chesapeake Blue and Grey would be killer and regional. Pulls in Delmarva for a tv market.

That name would wrap around the caps and pull in Virginia Beach and Norfolk 😂

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Axios piece today shows that DC could not overcome what Youngkin promised (and apparently planned in advance with Leonsis).

Crime does not seem to be one of the factors for departure: https://www.axios.com/local/washington-dc/2023/12/14/capitals-wizards-stadium-virginia-how-it-happened

Leonsis’s portion of the 2B investment is only $403M. It’s really tough to complete with that.

It's impossible to compete with that. The state of Virginia and city of Alexandria are on the hook for the other $1.6B. What if tax projections don't shake out? The city of Alexandria will be on the hook to pay back the bonds out of their other tax revenues. Good chance this blows a massive hole in Alexandria's budget for decades down the road.

I would not want to be an Alexandria taxpayer, small business, or parent reliant on the public schools.

[Anonymous]

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lol. never thought I’d see the day but indeed. Nimby power, activate!

What’s more interesting is to see the YIMBYs against this. I would be careful making this a standard YIMBY/NIMBY issue.

But it is kind of amazing to watch the ALX YIMBYs get frazzled when it happens in THEIR backyard.

Having a few more neighbors is different than thousands of new people clogging up your streets and parking spaces.

Yes, I get that. It’s amazing how your views change when a proposal impacts your home and neighborhood.

If it’s not your BY then YIMBY/NIMBY is irrelevant.

Nope, not true. YIMBYs frequently tell NIMBYs that they have no say over what happens in their backyard.

Also YIMBY means yes in my backyard. Meaning you are a YES for it happening in your backyard.

They are a yes for it happening in their own backyard.

Except they are not in this case. I watched several fairly prolific or self-professed YIMBYs either express skepticism or outright objections to this proposal.

In other words, they were YIMBYs until it happened in their backyard. And the defense is that this isn’t something they signed up for - except isn’t that always the case with NIMBYs?

So my broader point is that it’s easy to be a YIMBY when the proposal does not impact you. Most people are actually NIMBYs under the right circumstances.

You can be a YIMBY to denser housing, mixed use development, more transit options, the new Virginia Tech campus….but still oppose an arena that’s going to bring in a massive amount of traffic on roads that are already too small for today.

YIMBYs don’t have to say “Yes” to every horrible idea.

Listen, our parking and roads are for everyone, per the city. Parking and traffic congestion on smaller roads are not an objection, as we learned during the zoning debate.

Also this proposal is theoretically likely to spurn denser housing (and maybe more contributions to our affordable housing fund), result in $200M for transit, and higher quality mixed use development.

You’re equating adding a few new neighbors with THOUSANDS of workers and spectators?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DC now is thinking about turning Capital One arena into a casino that will be larger than MGM National Harbor!

Casino ugh. The traditional last gasp of the economically desperate. Rental units and casinos. We're screwed.

Don’t forget the homeless vouchers for housing. Plus, we know how DC loves the portable potty‘s placed around the homeless tent encampments. Sorry, not sorry DC city is trash.

And the dangerous propane tanks that they never do anything about...

[Anonymous]

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lol. never thought I’d see the day but indeed. Nimby power, activate!

What’s more interesting is to see the YIMBYs against this. I would be careful making this a standard YIMBY/NIMBY issue.

But it is kind of amazing to watch the ALX YIMBYs get frazzled when it happens in THEIR backyard.

Having a few more neighbors is different than thousands of new people clogging up your streets and parking spaces.

Yes, I get that. It’s amazing how your views change when a proposal impacts your home and neighborhood.

If it’s not your BY then YIMBY/NIMBY is irrelevant.

Nope, not true. YIMBYs frequently tell NIMBYs that they have no say over what happens in their backyard.

Also YIMBY means yes in my backyard. Meaning you are a YES for it happening in your backyard.

They are a yes for it happening in their own backyard.

Except they are not in this case. I watched several fairly prolific or self-professed YIMBYs either express skepticism or outright objections to this proposal.

In other words, they were YIMBYs until it happened in their backyard. And the defense is that this isn’t something they signed up for - except isn’t that always the case with NIMBYs?

So my broader point is that it’s easy to be a YIMBY when the proposal does not impact you. Most people are actually NIMBYs under the right circumstances.

You can be a YIMBY to denser housing, mixed use development, more transit options, the new Virginia Tech campus….but still oppose an arena that’s going to bring in a massive amount of traffic on roads that are already too small for today.

YIMBYs don’t have to say “Yes” to every horrible idea.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

I think it’s both gross and dumb for Alexandria to try and outbid DC for this complex

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

lol. never thought I’d see the day but indeed. Nimby power, activate!

What’s more interesting is to see the YIMBYs against this. I would be careful making this a standard YIMBY/NIMBY issue.

But it is kind of amazing to watch the ALX YIMBYs get frazzled when it happens in THEIR backyard.

Having a few more neighbors is different than thousands of new people clogging up your streets and parking spaces.

Yes, I get that. It’s amazing how your views change when a proposal impacts your home and neighborhood.

If it’s not your BY then YIMBY/NIMBY is irrelevant.

Nope, not true. YIMBYs frequently tell NIMBYs that they have no say over what happens in their backyard.

Also YIMBY means yes in my backyard. Meaning you are a YES for it happening in your backyard.

They are a yes for it happening in their own backyard.

Except they are not in this case. I watched several fairly prolific or self-professed YIMBYs either express skepticism or outright objections to this proposal.

In other words, they were YIMBYs until it happened in their backyard. And the defense is that this isn’t something they signed up for - except isn’t that always the case with NIMBYs?

So my broader point is that it’s easy to be a YIMBY when the proposal does not impact you. Most people are actually NIMBYs under the right circumstances.

Then they were misnamed YIMBY if they were pushing proposals that don’t affect them.

People can be ok with some changes that affect them but not other changes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The arena will hold events throughout the year why is the focus strictly on the two teams? I personally would love to take my children to see Taylor Swift without feeling unsafe in DC.

You are no going to make up for the 80+ nights automatically gone by moving the teams.

Its really sad what happened to this city in just 3 years.

I'd say more like 5 years, a lot of businesses were leaving GP by 2019. But, yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in Fairfax and have partial season tix to the Caps and Wiz and like that I can pay $15 to park ~ a block away and then be home in 35/40 minutes post game. Neither of those things are going to happen in PY so I will give up my tix and maybe go to a couple of games a year, well planned and on a weekend afternoon.

From the arena, you can take the bus rapid transit to car parks in Crystal City, Pentagon City, or Old Town.

Again, that is adding at least a half hour each way on a commute to the games as compared to Gallery Place. for most fans, it won't be worth the time. For many fans, it won't even be a viable option. I hope Ted assumes that everyone who lives in "Potomac Landing" and Del ray will be season ticket holders, because the existing fan bases won't put up with the additional hassle.

I live in upper NW and would gladly spend an extra 30 minutes in traffic rather than subject my family to what Chinatown has become.

Same. Last weekend day game I took my kids too there was a knife fight between vagrants, people sitting on the sidewalk shooting up and a pool of blood on the sidewalk. Nope, not family friendly in the slightest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in Fairfax and have partial season tix to the Caps and Wiz and like that I can pay $15 to park ~ a block away and then be home in 35/40 minutes post game. Neither of those things are going to happen in PY so I will give up my tix and maybe go to a couple of games a year, well planned and on a weekend afternoon.

From the arena, you can take the bus rapid transit to car parks in Crystal City, Pentagon City, or Old Town.

Again, that is adding at least a half hour each way on a commute to the games as compared to Gallery Place. for most fans, it won't be worth the time. For many fans, it won't even be a viable option. I hope Ted assumes that everyone who lives in "Potomac Landing" and Del ray will be season ticket holders, because the existing fan bases won't put up with the additional hassle.

I live in upper NW and would gladly spend an extra 30 minutes in traffic rather than subject my family to what Chinatown has become.

Same. Last weekend day game I took my kids too there was a knife fight between vagrants, people sitting on the sidewalk shooting up and a pool of blood on the sidewalk. Nope, not family friendly in the slightest.

Some people would consider that the undercard

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in Fairfax and have partial season tix to the Caps and Wiz and like that I can pay $15 to park ~ a block away and then be home in 35/40 minutes post game. Neither of those things are going to happen in PY so I will give up my tix and maybe go to a couple of games a year, well planned and on a weekend afternoon.

From the arena, you can take the bus rapid transit to car parks in Crystal City, Pentagon City, or Old Town.

Again, that is adding at least a half hour each way on a commute to the games as compared to Gallery Place. for most fans, it won't be worth the time. For many fans, it won't even be a viable option. I hope Ted assumes that everyone who lives in "Potomac Landing" and Del ray will be season ticket holders, because the existing fan bases won't put up with the additional hassle.

I live in upper NW and would gladly spend an extra 30 minutes in traffic rather than subject my family to what Chinatown has become.

lol you people are like Chicken Little.

The area around CapOne was a lot worse when it opened in the 90s and people showed up in droves.

I’m down there pretty frequently on the weekends and it’s fine. It’s the same buskers and homeless that have been down there for the past 15 years.

The big issue is that due to the lack of office workers and foot traffic, one notices the homeless a lot more. So perception becomes a warped sense of reality. But on game days, there are so many people and big crowds that it’s a lot less of an issue. There’s safety in numbers.

This is just not true. I live in the neighborhood. 200 cars were broken into during a recent event. At least once a month I get an alarm about a middle of the day mugging or stabbing. Walgreens is a constant robbery target, plus the drug dealers right at the metro steps. Hell, the carjacking where the kid got shot was right down the road from the arena and on a game night.

The main issue is that crime is much more random now and anyone can be a target.

+1

[Anonymous]

I stopped taking my kids to games because the "scenery" is just too much to subject them to in order to get to a game. This all started in 2020 when our elected officials let our city be completely destroyed. But we have BLM Plaza at least! Hooray!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

lol. never thought I’d see the day but indeed. Nimby power, activate!

What’s more interesting is to see the YIMBYs against this. I would be careful making this a standard YIMBY/NIMBY issue.

But it is kind of amazing to watch the ALX YIMBYs get frazzled when it happens in THEIR backyard.

Having a few more neighbors is different than thousands of new people clogging up your streets and parking spaces.

Yes, I get that. It’s amazing how your views change when a proposal impacts your home and neighborhood.

If it’s not your BY then YIMBY/NIMBY is irrelevant.

Nope, not true. YIMBYs frequently tell NIMBYs that they have no say over what happens in their backyard.

Also YIMBY means yes in my backyard. Meaning you are a YES for it happening in your backyard.

They are a yes for it happening in their own backyard.

Except they are not in this case. I watched several fairly prolific or self-professed YIMBYs either express skepticism or outright objections to this proposal.

In other words, they were YIMBYs until it happened in their backyard. And the defense is that this isn’t something they signed up for - except isn’t that always the case with NIMBYs?

So my broader point is that it’s easy to be a YIMBY when the proposal does not impact you. Most people are actually NIMBYs under the right circumstances.

You can be a YIMBY to denser housing, mixed use development, more transit options, the new Virginia Tech campus….but still oppose an arena that’s going to bring in a massive amount of traffic on roads that are already too small for today.

YIMBYs don’t have to say “Yes” to every horrible idea.

Listen, our parking and roads are for everyone, per the city. Parking and traffic congestion on smaller roads are not an objection, as we learned during the zoning debate.

Also this proposal is theoretically likely to spurn denser housing (and maybe more contributions to our affordable housing fund), result in $200M for transit, and higher quality mixed use development.

You’re equating adding a few new neighbors with THOUSANDS of workers and spectators?

No, I am equating thousands of worker and spectators with thousands of neighbors. Were you not paying attention to the plans for PY?

Look, I am a NIMBY myself. I was against ZFH (or at least the SFH component) and I am against the arena. I am just sick and tired of hearing what terrible, racist people we are even though I am liberal Dem. So I am somewhat bemused to see so many YIMBYs get bent out of shape when it happens in their backyard. Maybe we can stop the name calling and acknowledge we all have our own personal breaking points.