Race in college admissions is back in front of the Supreme Court Oral Argument on Oct. 31 (Monday)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
? how is a math test racist? Can you give me an example of a racist math question on the SAT?

A restaurant bill is $120. What is the total after 5% sales tax and 18% tip?

Blacks don't have money to go to restaurants, and would not be aware of tipping, and whether the tip applies after the sales tax or before.

LOL blacks will stiff you on the tip and they know damn well they are doing it.

(Former waitress)

I can see why they didn't tip you.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/01/21/whats-behind-racial-differences-in-restaurant-tipping/

Interesting.

To date, these additional causes remain elusive. Nevertheless, what we do know is that this interracial tipping difference exists – as do the negative, downstream effects of such differences: server prejudices and discriminatory behaviors. Failing to acknowledge and openly discuss this issue will only perpetuate a status quo that harms businesses and consumers alike.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

None of this adds up to 100% If you include white, asian, blacks, hispanics = > 100

And accounting for only white black asian = 84.1%

It's not supposed to add up to 100%. It is the chance of admission of each group, not the percent of the admitted that are that race.

as compared to the whole or compared to their own group? or as a percentage of the total applicants of the whole?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

It's interest that the top academic African Applicant's have a better than 50% chance of admission, but that it's still long odds for white and asians and somehow that isn't evidence of racial discrimination

Just in case no one has mentioned this yet (I’m still reading through the thread), it’s likely that the numbers of white students and Asian students who apply are astronomically larger than the numbers of African American students. Native Americans don’t even get a column. So understanding the numbers and what they mean is very limited without knowing how many students are in each category. And of course the racial categories cross with other categories such as sports and legacies. So one reason the admission stats might be so high for the African American and Hispanic students could be because they are relatively very small numbers. ( As in 56 % of 10 students vs 13 % of 100 students will yield 5 students vs 13 ).

So you're saying there is a racial quota? I can't wait for this decision to come down

NP. Or it could be fewer black students even apply and the ones who do are actually qualified.

Closer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

It's interest that the top academic African Applicant's have a better than 50% chance of admission, but that it's still long odds for white and asians and somehow that isn't evidence of racial discrimination

Just in case no one has mentioned this yet (I’m still reading through the thread), it’s likely that the numbers of white students and Asian students who apply are astronomically larger than the numbers of African American students. Native Americans don’t even get a column. So understanding the numbers and what they mean is very limited without knowing how many students are in each category. And of course the racial categories cross with other categories such as sports and legacies. So one reason the admission stats might be so high for the African American and Hispanic students could be because they are relatively very small numbers. ( As in 56 % of 10 students vs 13 % of 100 students will yield 5 students vs 13 ).

So you're saying there is a racial quota? I can't wait for this decision to come down

NP. Or it could be fewer black students even apply and the ones who do are actually qualified.

If they are equally qualified but 4 times more likely to get in based on race, that seems a lot like discrimination.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
? how is a math test racist? Can you give me an example of a racist math question on the SAT?

A restaurant bill is $120. What is the total after 5% sales tax and 18% tip?

Blacks don't have money to go to restaurants, and would not be aware of tipping, and whether the tip applies after the sales tax or before.

WTF???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

It's interest that the top academic African Applicant's have a better than 50% chance of admission, but that it's still long odds for white and asians and somehow that isn't evidence of racial discrimination

Just in case no one has mentioned this yet (I’m still reading through the thread), it’s likely that the numbers of white students and Asian students who apply are astronomically larger than the numbers of African American students. Native Americans don’t even get a column. So understanding the numbers and what they mean is very limited without knowing how many students are in each category. And of course the racial categories cross with other categories such as sports and legacies. So one reason the admission stats might be so high for the African American and Hispanic students could be because they are relatively very small numbers. ( As in 56 % of 10 students vs 13 % of 100 students will yield 5 students vs 13 ).

So you're saying there is a racial quota? I can't wait for this decision to come down

NP. Or it could be fewer black students even apply and the ones who do are actually qualified.

If they are equally qualified but 4 times more likely to get in based on race, that seems a lot like discrimination.

More supply and demand.

Fewer qualified African American applicants for highly rejective schools so more competition.

Not talking about the schools with 70%+ acceptance rates or community colleges here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope this shakes out into the workplace too.

Same. My boss was just denied a promotion and flat out told that it looked better for them to promote a female than another white male. I know another white male who was told by his boss, the VP of Sales, that he would never be promoted because he was a white male. And our VP of HR said he was only considering “diverse candidates” for an open position on his team. He settled for a white gay male but was open about his preference for a black female.

There are ways around it. I am an asian female in tech (with MBA from Top 20) denied promotion for the team that I was leading after my prior manager left. White male (less experience and only a BBA) was promoted because he had a prior relationship with the VP, so yes favoritism rules ! BTW my company has big diversity rules and requires interviewing atleast one diversity candidate for every job req. Most managers have openly told me, that they would interview female candidates per the rules, but would still hire who they want to, in this case white male

[Anonymous]

I think socio-economic based affirmative action would be a lot more fair than race based. Why isn't that used instead?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

It's interest that the top academic African Applicant's have a better than 50% chance of admission, but that it's still long odds for white and asians and somehow that isn't evidence of racial discrimination

Just in case no one has mentioned this yet (I’m still reading through the thread), it’s likely that the numbers of white students and Asian students who apply are astronomically larger than the numbers of African American students. Native Americans don’t even get a column. So understanding the numbers and what they mean is very limited without knowing how many students are in each category. And of course the racial categories cross with other categories such as sports and legacies. So one reason the admission stats might be so high for the African American and Hispanic students could be because they are relatively very small numbers. ( As in 56 % of 10 students vs 13 % of 100 students will yield 5 students vs 13 ).

So you're saying there is a racial quota? I can't wait for this decision to come down

NP. Or it could be fewer black students even apply and the ones who do are actually qualified.

If they are equally qualified but 4 times more likely to get in based on race, that seems a lot like discrimination.

How do you know there are being selected based on race?
Could it be cultural and social differences that make them stand out?

[Anonymous]

Here's why socio-economic based affirmative action is not desired ... according to The Journal of Blacks in Higher Education: https://www.jbhe.com/news_views/56_income-based_action.html
"Asian Americans would undoubtedly be the major beneficiaries of affirmative action programs based on socioeconomic status. Asians’ average scores on standardized tests are even higher than the average scores for whites. There are many recent immigrant families from Korea, Thailand, Vietnam, and other Asian nations that have not achieved middle-class status but whose children perform extremely well in school. High-achieving Asian students from these lower-income families would garner many places at the nation’s most prestigious universities which previously had gone to blacks under race-sensitive admissions."

So it's not really about helping underprivileged people, but just achieving race quotas

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think socio-economic based affirmative action would be a lot more fair than race based. Why isn't that used instead?

Because no one in academia cares about poor white or asian kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

It's interest that the top academic African Applicant's have a better than 50% chance of admission, but that it's still long odds for white and asians and somehow that isn't evidence of racial discrimination

Just in case no one has mentioned this yet (I’m still reading through the thread), it’s likely that the numbers of white students and Asian students who apply are astronomically larger than the numbers of African American students. Native Americans don’t even get a column. So understanding the numbers and what they mean is very limited without knowing how many students are in each category. And of course the racial categories cross with other categories such as sports and legacies. So one reason the admission stats might be so high for the African American and Hispanic students could be because they are relatively very small numbers. ( As in 56 % of 10 students vs 13 % of 100 students will yield 5 students vs 13 ).

So you're saying there is a racial quota? I can't wait for this decision to come down

NP. Or it could be fewer black students even apply and the ones who do are actually qualified.

If they are equally qualified but 4 times more likely to get in based on race, that seems a lot like discrimination.

How do you know there are being selected based on race?
Could it be cultural and social differences that make them stand out?

This thread is like a never ending circle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

It's interest that the top academic African Applicant's have a better than 50% chance of admission, but that it's still long odds for white and asians and somehow that isn't evidence of racial discrimination

Just in case no one has mentioned this yet (I’m still reading through the thread), it’s likely that the numbers of white students and Asian students who apply are astronomically larger than the numbers of African American students. Native Americans don’t even get a column. So understanding the numbers and what they mean is very limited without knowing how many students are in each category. And of course the racial categories cross with other categories such as sports and legacies. So one reason the admission stats might be so high for the African American and Hispanic students could be because they are relatively very small numbers. ( As in 56 % of 10 students vs 13 % of 100 students will yield 5 students vs 13 ).

So you're saying there is a racial quota? I can't wait for this decision to come down

NP. Or it could be fewer black students even apply and the ones who do are actually qualified.

If they are equally qualified but 4 times more likely to get in based on race, that seems a lot like discrimination.

How do you know there are being selected based on race?
Could it be cultural and social differences that make them stand out?

occam's razor, unless you want to tell me that black applicants as a whole have cultural or social distances that explain a 50%+ admit rate (vs less than 20%) for the top academic performers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
? how is a math test racist? Can you give me an example of a racist math question on the SAT?

A restaurant bill is $120. What is the total after 5% sales tax and 18% tip?

Blacks don't have money to go to restaurants, and would not be aware of tipping, and whether the tip applies after the sales tax or before.

"Blacks don't have money to go to restaurants"???? How is this statement NOT racist???

I have money to go to restaurants, but my family prefers to eat at home. So do I get a pass on this question if I get it wrong because I don't go to restaurants, and not because I absolutely suck at math?

You've taken trolling to a whole new level!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:wow this is crazy, you can be the 4th lowest decile aa and still be way above asians. crazy no wonder asians feel discriminated

Standardized tests are culturally biased and we're originally implemented by a racist.

If the index was normalized for tests, this alleged disparity ( SFFA is the source of this massaged data) would be much lower.

Anyways, the SAT / ACT impact will continue to diminish over time.

What are Asians and Whites in common but so much different for Blacks? culturally

What biase are we talking about?

What?

DP.. apparently, SATs are culturally bias, hence Black people score lower on SATs. But since Asian Americans score higher on SATs that must mean that they have more in common with white people.

That's the argument. And yes, it's laughable and ignorant.

Then what is your reason for AA people scoring lower?

Go ahead, say it out loud. I dare you. You know you think it. Have some courage and show everyone what you really think.

And that, right there, ladies and gents, is why colleges have the current policy.

How would anyone other than the kid know why they score lower?

I'll ask you this: how does an admission office who has never met the student give that student a low "personality" score even as the interviewer gave that student a high personality score.

Go ahead, say it out loud. I dare you. You know you think it. Have some courage and show everyone what you really think.

The argument that black kids don't do as well on SATs compared to Asian kids must mean that the SAT is culturally bias is a dumb argument, as if an Asian American is culturally closer to white America than a black kid whose ancestors have probably lived in the US for many generations.

I have no idea why they score lower. I was not making a claim to know. PP made a claim what they knew it wasn't.

You understand that difference, right?

And we are not talking about "the kid" taking the test, which is an absurd reference. We're talking about races of people and a policy designed by colleges to ensure they can get the students they want to build the class they need. These questions of why are gigantic academic and intellectual ones which we may never solve in our lifetime. However, we can ensure those reasons - whatever they are - don't continue to hurt people and stop colleges from building the class they want.

The "build the class they want" argument is the same argument that white people used way back to implement holistic admissions to keep out the Jews. It's basically social engineering in favor of one side over the other.

No it is not the same argument. In any way. One was designed to exclude a certain type of people, and the other is done to ensure one type of person is not excluded. This is so obvious and the fact that you deny it shows your bias