Why so much hate with EOTP vs WOTP parents

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People are always saying the Hill is so diverse but where are the Asians? I hardly see any.

And the people from Latin America and the islands? Africans? Nope.

When self-congratulatory people on dcum verbally pat themselves on the back for their "diverse" District neighborhood, they always mean "more African Americans [that haven't -yet- been displaced ] than Spring Valley. "

I'd put my CCDC neighborhood up against any 4-block area of actual Capitol Hill for true diversity in the dictionary definition.

Hello! Latino here loving life on Capitol Hill. When I lived in AU park my wife was routinely called a nanny when she went to care for our kids. Like maybe once every two days. Glad to have moved. Please stop spreading uninformed opinions online.

If it's any consolation, I've also been taken for a nanny in AU Park, and I'm northern European. It's not necessarily because of ethnicity, there just aren't many SAHMs in this neighborhood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Look at the crime maps. There is a dramatic difference in the incidence of violent crime east and west of the park. It's not a matter of opinion, and certainly no lie.

Again, OP is considering North Portal Estates. It is EOTP by a few hundred yards (very isolated) and has similar or less crime than a lot of WOTP.

Of course there are low crime areas EOTP as well. I was speaking generally, and PP was talking about Capitol Hill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Huh? I live in NWDC and take a metro 5 stops to my federal job. I walk to tons of stuff. Maybe not the Smithsonian, but I can walk to the zoo, hike Rock Creek, etc. not to mention a movie theater, a library, restaurants and bars.

RE friendliness, we've met lots of friends in our neighborhood. Meanwhile, I have friends who live on the Hill for years who know like 3 people on their block.

Please let's not generalize and give the OP false information.

Check out those nice 18 minute metro delays today on the redline. And yes there are some old Lady restaurants and bars. Listen if I was OP I would move to NW DC just for deal since she has a 5th grader. But NW DC sucks.

You sound like an expert on NWDC! I think your type of hostility is more prevalent than in the other direction. People WOTP have no reason to hate on EOTP. They may not want to live there or deal with the schools, but they don't have such animosity, which is obviously rooted in insecurity. You covet the schools (you'd move just for Deal!), but you'd rather not because the area "sucks".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Huh? I live in NWDC and take a metro 5 stops to my federal job. I walk to tons of stuff. Maybe not the Smithsonian, but I can walk to the zoo, hike Rock Creek, etc. not to mention a movie theater, a library, restaurants and bars.

RE friendliness, we've met lots of friends in our neighborhood. Meanwhile, I have friends who live on the Hill for years who know like 3 people on their block.

Please let's not generalize and give the OP false information.

Check out those nice 18 minute metro delays today on the redline. And yes there are some old Lady restaurants and bars. Listen if I was OP I would move to NW DC just for deal since she has a 5th grader. But NW DC sucks.

You sound like an expert on NWDC! I think your type of hostility is more prevalent than in the other direction. People WOTP have no reason to hate on EOTP. They may not want to live there or deal with the schools, but they don't have such animosity, which is obviously rooted in insecurity. You covet the schools (you'd move just for Deal!), but you'd rather not because the area "sucks".

"They may not want to live there".........wow you do realize there are communities east of the park such as North Portal Estates, Crestwood, 16th St Heights, and etc that are just as nice if not nice than the neighborhoods in Ward 3.

[Anonymous]

I live EOTP, and our school is quite diverse: majority Hispanic, but with measurable African American, Caucasian, and Asian American populations. I really like our school community; it's really friendly. The dual language curriculum is challenging my child thus far.

I know lots of nice families WOTP. I don't rule out moving there someday. I am however, troubled by some things. The sense of entitlement, whether it's keeping OOB families out of the school or keeping senseless 40 year old boundaries, seems really venal. This is especially true given that the evidence suggests that if you don't send your kid to a high poverty school, the school affects your child's outcomes much less than your own level of education. I don't understand the disdain for Hearst, especially given the educational level.of most OOB Hearst families I know. I am also bothered by City Councilmembers donating lunch with themselves to be auctioned off to the highest bidder at some of these school auctions. That seems completely unethical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I live EOTP, and our school is quite diverse: majority Hispanic, but with measurable African American, Caucasian, and Asian American populations. I really like our school community; it's really friendly. The dual language curriculum is challenging my child thus far.

I know lots of nice families WOTP. I don't rule out moving there someday. I am however, troubled by some things. The sense of entitlement, whether it's keeping OOB families out of the school or keeping senseless 40 year old boundaries, seems really venal. This is especially true given that the evidence suggests that if you don't send your kid to a high poverty school, the school affects your child's outcomes much less than your own level of education. I don't understand the disdain for Hearst, especially given the educational level.of most OOB Hearst families I know. I am also bothered by City Councilmembers donating lunch with themselves to be auctioned off to the highest bidder at some of these school auctions. That seems completely unethical.

Why is lunch with a councilman unethical? Majority of the time its bought by a parent who would like to discuss education initiatives, all of which can be done for free by calling the CM's office ahead of time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Huh? I live in NWDC and take a metro 5 stops to my federal job. I walk to tons of stuff. Maybe not the Smithsonian, but I can walk to the zoo, hike Rock Creek, etc. not to mention a movie theater, a library, restaurants and bars.

RE friendliness, we've met lots of friends in our neighborhood. Meanwhile, I have friends who live on the Hill for years who know like 3 people on their block.

Please let's not generalize and give the OP false information.

Check out those nice 18 minute metro delays today on the redline. And yes there are some old Lady restaurants and bars. Listen if I was OP I would move to NW DC just for deal since she has a 5th grader. But NW DC sucks.

You sound like an expert on NWDC! I think your type of hostility is more prevalent than in the other direction. People WOTP have no reason to hate on EOTP. They may not want to live there or deal with the schools, but they don't have such animosity, which is obviously rooted in insecurity. You covet the schools (you'd move just for Deal!), but you'd rather not because the area "sucks".

"They may not want to live there".........wow you do realize there are communities east of the park such as North Portal Estates, Crestwood, 16th St Heights, and etc that are just as nice if not nice than the neighborhoods in Ward 3.

. I lived in Crestwood and Shepherd Park prior to moving to Forest Hills WoTP. Comparing these neighborhoods and proclaiming them to be just as nice is a bit of a stretch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Huh? I live in NWDC and take a metro 5 stops to my federal job. I walk to tons of stuff. Maybe not the Smithsonian, but I can walk to the zoo, hike Rock Creek, etc. not to mention a movie theater, a library, restaurants and bars.

RE friendliness, we've met lots of friends in our neighborhood. Meanwhile, I have friends who live on the Hill for years who know like 3 people on their block.

Please let's not generalize and give the OP false information.

Check out those nice 18 minute metro delays today on the redline. And yes there are some old Lady restaurants and bars. Listen if I was OP I would move to NW DC just for deal since she has a 5th grader. But NW DC sucks.

You sound like an expert on NWDC! I think your type of hostility is more prevalent than in the other direction. People WOTP have no reason to hate on EOTP. They may not want to live there or deal with the schools, but they don't have such animosity, which is obviously rooted in insecurity. You covet the schools (you'd move just for Deal!), but you'd rather not because the area "sucks".

"They may not want to live there".........wow you do realize there are communities east of the park such as North Portal Estates, Crestwood, 16th St Heights, and etc that are just as nice if not nice than the neighborhoods in Ward 3.

. I lived in Crestwood and Shepherd Park prior to moving to Forest Hills WoTP. Comparing these neighborhoods and proclaiming them to be just as nice is a bit of a stretch.

Oh ok because you have a higher price tag and less blacks than of course it can't be comparable. Shepherd Park has culture, history, and has been home to some of the most prominent AA families (i.e. Jarvis) in the city.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Huh? I live in NWDC and take a metro 5 stops to my federal job. I walk to tons of stuff. Maybe not the Smithsonian, but I can walk to the zoo, hike Rock Creek, etc. not to mention a movie theater, a library, restaurants and bars.

RE friendliness, we've met lots of friends in our neighborhood. Meanwhile, I have friends who live on the Hill for years who know like 3 people on their block.

Please let's not generalize and give the OP false information.

Check out those nice 18 minute metro delays today on the redline. And yes there are some old Lady restaurants and bars. Listen if I was OP I would move to NW DC just for deal since she has a 5th grader. But NW DC sucks.

You sound like an expert on NWDC! I think your type of hostility is more prevalent than in the other direction. People WOTP have no reason to hate on EOTP. They may not want to live there or deal with the schools, but they don't have such animosity, which is obviously rooted in insecurity. You covet the schools (you'd move just for Deal!), but you'd rather not because the area "sucks".

"They may not want to live there".........wow you do realize there are communities east of the park such as North Portal Estates, Crestwood, 16th St Heights, and etc that are just as nice if not nice than the neighborhoods in Ward 3.

PP here. What I wrote doesn't imply that every person WOTP wouldn't want to live in any EOTP neighborhood, so no need to be so defensive. My point was simply that even if someone doesn't want to live EOTP, it doesn't mean they feel disdain for those parts of the city. And just for record, I personally would have no problem buying in the EOTP neighborhoods zoned for Deal/Wilson. Back when we were house hunting we even looked in Capitol Hill, Shaw, and Columbia Heights (although the latter with great reservations), and it was by pure chance that the house that met our requirements within our budget was in upper NW.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to NW DC from NYC. I thought I was suffocating. It felt very, very suburban. I ended up moving to Capitol Hill where I was much happier.

Points for NWDC- definitely better schools and a better high school feeder plan. Like dramatically better middle/high schools.

Points against- you're either driving forever or on the train forever if you work for most federal agencies. The subway here blows. Almost everything is driving distance in NW DC. If you're a minority you might feel uncomfortable (I did). No one is very friendly. I made lots of friends (I'm a friendly person), but it's not like NYC where you introduce yourself to other parents at the park.

Points For EOTP (really Capitol Hill)- more diverse, closer to downtown, nicer, friendlier Neighborhoods, much more walkable. You are close to the Smithsonian. Lots more active moms/dads groups like moms on the hill (MOTH).

Points against- terrible schools in some areas, bad middle/high schools throughout

There is crime all over DC. This was a shock to me coming from NYC because crime wasn't so much a part of life as it is here. People in Ward 3 claim it's less of an issue, but that's a lie. The metro SUCKS. Driving here sucks too.

Huh? I live in NWDC and take a metro 5 stops to my federal job. I walk to tons of stuff. Maybe not the Smithsonian, but I can walk to the zoo, hike Rock Creek, etc. not to mention a movie theater, a library, restaurants and bars.

RE friendliness, we've met lots of friends in our neighborhood. Meanwhile, I have friends who live on the Hill for years who know like 3 people on their block.

Please let's not generalize and give the OP false information.

Check out those nice 18 minute metro delays today on the redline. And yes there are some old Lady restaurants and bars. Listen if I was OP I would move to NW DC just for deal since she has a 5th grader. But NW DC sucks.

You sound like an expert on NWDC! I think your type of hostility is more prevalent than in the other direction. People WOTP have no reason to hate on EOTP. They may not want to live there or deal with the schools, but they don't have such animosity, which is obviously rooted in insecurity. You covet the schools (you'd move just for Deal!), but you'd rather not because the area "sucks".

"They may not want to live there".........wow you do realize there are communities east of the park such as North Portal Estates, Crestwood, 16th St Heights, and etc that are just as nice if not nice than the neighborhoods in Ward 3.

. I lived in Crestwood and Shepherd Park prior to moving to Forest Hills WoTP. Comparing these neighborhoods and proclaiming them to be just as nice is a bit of a stretch.

I lived WOTP before buying in Shepherd Park. Why is comparing them a stretch? I am really curious. Other than WOTP has fewer AAs ans houses are about $100-$200k more, crime is similar, schools are similar. Please do tell how they are "so far apart"?

On another note regarding Shepherd Park, I was just made aware (via listserv) that one of the Littlerock Nine lives in SP. Pretty cool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I lived EOTP for 10+ years, and now live WOTP. People are not really much different. Most neighbors are generally good down to earth people on both sides. Most are just worried about their kids and family. There are a handful of jerks, and a handful of busy bodies, and a handful of gossips in every neighborhood, and the same is true whether you're EOTP or WOTP.

EOTP, people worry about crime and the poor state of schools, but they feel superior to the suckers who live WOTP because they are getting more house for their money and think they have a more diverse array of neighbors. EOTP, people also worry that the WOTP crowd is getting special favors from government, like more snow plows or better garbage pickup.

WOTP, people worry less about schools or crime, and seem happy to have paid more to get those benefits. The biggest school worry WOTP is that the schools are too overcrowded, especially from people outside the neighborhoods. People don't seem to think much negative about EOTP, or really at all; it's just far away "over there."

I think the level of hostility on DCUM flows mostly from the intense focus on schools here. This is where many EOTP people feel they are entitled to attend the WOTP schools because they've been planning on that for years. Their frustration at getting zoned out is understandable. But similarly, the WOTP people feel entitled to get first dibs on the WOTP schools because those are their own neighborhood schools, and the EOTP families have other schools in their own neighborhoods. Their frustration at overcrowding from OOB kids is understandable too.

That's my two cents at least.

"Frustration at getting zoned out": are you referring to actually being zoned out or just fewer OOB spots available? I'm not clear what you intended to mean in the second half of your post. Most people I know EOTP are preoccupied with their neighborhood elementary, or middle/high if Capitol Hill, and charters. No-one expects to attend janney OOB. People do attend Hearst and Eaton. Hearst is 75 percent OOB? Again just not clear on your post.

[Anonymous]

This debate and the SAHM/WOHM debate are things I only see on DCUM, never in real life.

[Anonymous]

Sometimes I think everyone that posts here lives in Shepherd Park. There are seriously a lot of us.

[Anonymous]

Seems like OP must have parachuting in from Mars (not NYC). DC has a long and storied history infused with socioeconomic and racial issues. Throw in charters and the past 15 years of gentrification/displacement and tons of new development and all sorts of other dynamics. Seriously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live EOTP, and our school is quite diverse: majority Hispanic, but with measurable African American, Caucasian, and Asian American populations. I really like our school community; it's really friendly. The dual language curriculum is challenging my child thus far.

I know lots of nice families WOTP. I don't rule out moving there someday. I am however, troubled by some things. The sense of entitlement, whether it's keeping OOB families out of the school or keeping senseless 40 year old boundaries, seems really venal. This is especially true given that the evidence suggests that if you don't send your kid to a high poverty school, the school affects your child's outcomes much less than your own level of education. I don't understand the disdain for Hearst, especially given the educational level.of most OOB Hearst families I know. I am also bothered by City Councilmembers donating lunch with themselves to be auctioned off to the highest bidder at some of these school auctions. That seems completely unethical.

Why is lunch with a councilman unethical? Majority of the time its bought by a parent who would like to discuss education initiatives, all of which can be done for free by calling the CM's office ahead of time.

Selling access to the highest bidder is unethical.

I don't really believe I can get on a council member's calendar just by calling them, but even if I could, I would prefer that our paid lawmakers discuss education initiatives with people who actually know something about education, I.e., people publishing peer reviewed research or classroom teachers.