Lerner takes the FIFTH

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How many Republicans are helped by the Sierra Club or moveon.org?

What are you talking about, on this very board we talked about how Sierra Club endorsed Patrick Mara and it was one of his biggest endorsements.

God you people have the memory of gnats.

[Anonymous]

" When CVFC, a conservative veterans’ group in California, applied for tax-exempt status with the Internal Revenue Service, its biggest expenditure that year was several thousand dollars in radio ads backing a Republican candidate for Congress.

The Wetumpka Tea Party, from Alabama, sponsored training for a get-out-the-vote initiative dedicated to the “defeat of President Barack Obama” while the I.R.S. was weighing its application.

And the head of the Ohio Liberty Coalition, whose application languished with the I.R.S. for more than two years, sent out e-mails to members about Mitt Romney campaign events and organized members to distribute Mr. Romney’s presidential campaign literature.

Representatives of these organizations have cried foul in recent weeks about their treatment by the I.R.S., saying they were among dozens of conservative groups unfairly targeted by the agency, harassed with inappropriate questionnaires and put off for months or years as the agency delayed decisions on their applications.

But a close examination of these groups and others reveals an array of election activities that tax experts and former I.R.S. officials said would provide a legitimate basis for flagging them for closer review."

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/us/politics/nonprofit-applicants-chafing-at-irs-tested-political-limits.html?hpw&_r=0

My favorite actually is when the president of the "Ohio Liberty Coalition" says that going door-to-door distributing Romney campaign material is not "political activity".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:" When CVFC, a conservative veterans’ group in California, applied for tax-exempt status with the Internal Revenue Service, its biggest expenditure that year was several thousand dollars in radio ads backing a Republican candidate for Congress.

The Wetumpka Tea Party, from Alabama, sponsored training for a get-out-the-vote initiative dedicated to the “defeat of President Barack Obama” while the I.R.S. was weighing its application.

And the head of the Ohio Liberty Coalition, whose application languished with the I.R.S. for more than two years, sent out e-mails to members about Mitt Romney campaign events and organized members to distribute Mr. Romney’s presidential campaign literature.

Representatives of these organizations have cried foul in recent weeks about their treatment by the I.R.S., saying they were among dozens of conservative groups unfairly targeted by the agency, harassed with inappropriate questionnaires and put off for months or years as the agency delayed decisions on their applications.

But a close examination of these groups and others reveals an array of election activities that tax experts and former I.R.S. officials said would provide a legitimate basis for flagging them for closer review."

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/us/politics/nonprofit-applicants-chafing-at-irs-tested-political-limits.html?hpw&_r=0

My favorite actually is when the president of the "Ohio Liberty Coalition" says that going door-to-door distributing Romney campaign material is not "political activity".

Democrats apologize far too fast. These groups deserved to be examined, and these examples plus the many others we all have seen prove it. The only error was not using neutral criteria for selecting groups to be investigated more intensively.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The IRS already apologized for targeting conservative groups after getting caught by the inspector general. Liberals live in a world of make believe. This issue is massive . Everybody fears a letter from the IRS . Unless the information is open and easily accessed, this issue will dominate the next year and more.

Both Republicans and Democrats agree that the tea party should not have been targeted. But the Republicans falsely claim that the motive was partisan politics.

This is a typical conservative pattern.
Liberal: We want to make sure all gun sales have a background check
Conservative: You are trying to take our guns


We are on to your BS.

Can we agree that tea party groups are political? and not liberal? and that they were targeted? Why do you think that happened?

Because they are filled with the cray cray?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The IRS already apologized for targeting conservative groups after getting caught by the inspector general. Liberals live in a world of make believe. This issue is massive . Everybody fears a letter from the IRS . Unless the information is open and easily accessed, this issue will dominate the next year and more.

Both Republicans and Democrats agree that the tea party should not have been targeted. But the Republicans falsely claim that the motive was partisan politics.

This is a typical conservative pattern.
Liberal: We want to make sure all gun sales have a background check
Conservative: You are trying to take our guns


We are on to your BS.

Can we agree that tea party groups are political? and not liberal? and that they were targeted? Why do you think that happened?

Because they are filled with the cray cray?

And you expect to be taken seriously after typing that.

The simple fact is that the IRS, unfortunately, has the power to destroy anyone it wants to destroy, which is why a lot of democrats are outraged by this as well. And they should be.

For those thinking this is a manufactured crisis or that this type of targeting is ok, I don't think you've gotten all the details as to what kind of questions were asked, the tactics used, etc. If you did, you would understand why this is serious stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The IRS already apologized for targeting conservative groups after getting caught by the inspector general. Liberals live in a world of make believe. This issue is massive . Everybody fears a letter from the IRS . Unless the information is open and easily accessed, this issue will dominate the next year and more.

Both Republicans and Democrats agree that the tea party should not have been targeted. But the Republicans falsely claim that the motive was partisan politics.

This is a typical conservative pattern.
Liberal: We want to make sure all gun sales have a background check
Conservative: You are trying to take our guns


We are on to your BS.

Can we agree that tea party groups are political? and not liberal? and that they were targeted? Why do you think that happened?

Because they are filled with the cray cray?

And you expect to be taken seriously after typing that.

The simple fact is that the IRS, unfortunately, has the power to destroy anyone it wants to destroy, which is why a lot of democrats are outraged by this as well. And they should be.

For those thinking this is a manufactured crisis or that this type of targeting is ok, I don't think you've gotten all the details as to what kind of questions were asked, the tactics used, etc. If you did, you would understand why this is serious stuff.

Oh they didn't "destroy" anyone. All they did was delay giving 501 c 4 status to a bunch of groups which could have just as easily filed as 527's.

I read one of the groups that complained in detail about their questions, and it turns out they were asked primarily to define their speakers (ie to make sure these events weren't rallies for campaigning politicians) and they wanted to know if there was a connection to another local group which was actively campaigning for politicians. Really tough stuff, there.

This is why the Tea Party applications should have been reviewed very carefully. Look at this example:

http://northtexasteaparty.org/teaapproved/

What do you see? A bunch of candidate endorsements. Now scroll down. What do you see? "The North Texas Tea Party- to support the 5 principles- has decided the only way to do so effectively is to work directly for the election of candidates for public office". So guess what? They became a PAC, like they should. Lots of other Tea Party groups did the same thing but tried to get 501 c 4 status.

[Anonymous]

If the tables were reversed, the people on this message board, who currently support the IRS targeting the tea party, would go ballistic that the IRS was illegally targeting their side!

This is a matter of fairness. Every group should be treated exactly the same way by the IRS.

Let's see what we find out in the hearings. What kinds of questions did the IRS ask the Tea Party groups?

This issue will not be going away any time soon. It may also propel a Republican into the White House in 2016. (I'm a Dem, and that makes me sad. But my team sucks big time right now.)

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:If the tables were reversed, the people on this message board, who currently support the IRS targeting the tea party, would go ballistic that the IRS was illegally targeting their side!

This is a matter of fairness. Every group should be treated exactly the same way by the IRS.

Let's see what we find out in the hearings. What kinds of questions did the IRS ask the Tea Party groups?

This issue will not be going away any time soon. It may also propel a Republican into the White House in 2016. (I'm a Dem, and that makes me sad. But my team sucks big time right now.)

While I think the IRS used poor criteria for targeting possible tax-exemption abuse -- after all, some of the most egregious violators were ignored -- it is not clear that what the IRS did was illegal. As a good Democrat, I'm sure that you would want to wait for the facts before determining that crimes were committed.

[Anonymous]

If the tables were reversed, the people on this message board, who currently support the IRS targeting the tea party, would go ballistic that the IRS was illegally targeting their side!

This is a matter of fairness. Every group should be treated exactly the same way by the IRS.

Let's see what we find out in the hearings. What kinds of questions did the IRS ask the Tea Party groups?

This issue will not be going away any time soon. It may also propel a Republican into the White House in 2016. (I'm a Dem, and that makes me sad. But my team sucks big time right now.)

So if you fill out an application for non profit status, the application should never be reviewed? It should just be approved? These group asked the IRS to look in to them. They self selected themselves for review. The IRS did not stop any of freedom of speech by these groups. It was about tax status...should the government subsidizes these group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If the tables were reversed, the people on this message board, who currently support the IRS targeting the tea party, would go ballistic that the IRS was illegally targeting their side!

This is a matter of fairness. Every group should be treated exactly the same way by the IRS.

Let's see what we find out in the hearings. What kinds of questions did the IRS ask the Tea Party groups?

This issue will not be going away any time soon. It may also propel a Republican into the White House in 2016. (I'm a Dem, and that makes me sad. But my team sucks big time right now.)

as we have already posted, one of the only groups actually rejected was a liberal women's group. No outrage.

Btw glad to see that you have developed such a compelling value proposition for the Republicsn Party. All that soul searching has worked wonders. Lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

If the tables were reversed, the people on this message board, who currently support the IRS targeting the tea party, would go ballistic that the IRS was illegally targeting their side!

This is a matter of fairness. Every group should be treated exactly the same way by the IRS.

Let's see what we find out in the hearings. What kinds of questions did the IRS ask the Tea Party groups?

This issue will not be going away any time soon. It may also propel a Republican into the White House in 2016. (I'm a Dem, and that makes me sad. But my team sucks big time right now.)

So if you fill out an application for non profit status, the application should never be reviewed? It should just be approved? These group asked the IRS to look in to them. They self selected themselves for review. The IRS did not stop any of freedom of speech by these groups. It was about tax status...should the government subsidizes these group.

Im not the poster you quoted, but could you try harder to ignore what that poster said in your response??

No one says for the IRS not to review the applications. Conservatives here advocate that the IRS simply treat conservative and liberal groups applying for 501 status the same. That wasn't done. The IRS IG report states clearly that is the case. Why do you not care that the IRS behaved in an abusive/unethical way. It remains to be seen if it behaved in an illegal way, but I wonder why so many liberals have such low standards for the government. Actually, I think I know. When your guy is in office, you pretty much don't give a crap what the government does. If you reversed the political affiliation of the president and the IRS screening here, you would be freaking out right now. And you'd be right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
If the tables were reversed, the people on this message board, who currently support the IRS targeting the tea party, would go ballistic that the IRS was illegally targeting their side!

This is a matter of fairness. Every group should be treated exactly the same way by the IRS.

Let's see what we find out in the hearings. What kinds of questions did the IRS ask the Tea Party groups?

This issue will not be going away any time soon. It may also propel a Republican into the White House in 2016. (I'm a Dem, and that makes me sad. But my team sucks big time right now.)

So if you fill out an application for non profit status, the application should never be reviewed? It should just be approved? These group asked the IRS to look in to them. They self selected themselves for review. The IRS did not stop any of freedom of speech by these groups. It was about tax status...should the government subsidizes these group.


Im not the poster you quoted, but could you try harder to ignore what that poster said in your response??

No one says for the IRS not to review the applications. Conservatives here advocate that the IRS simply treat conservative and liberal groups applying for 501 status the same. That wasn't done. The IRS IG report states clearly that is the case. Why do you not care that the IRS behaved in an abusive/unethical way. It remains to be seen if it behaved in an illegal way, but I wonder why so many liberals have such low standards for the government. Actually, I think I know. When your guy is in office, you pretty much don't give a crap what the government does. If you reversed the political affiliation of the president and the IRS screening here, you would be freaking out right now. And you'd be right.

When will you consevatives stop making things up? The IG was tasked with looking if Tea Party groups were targeted. They did not investigate how other groups were filtered. As we get more information, it looks like these conservative groups were committing fraud. I hope they go after these "groups" and put people in jail. But conservatives play by different rules. Conservatives break the law, they just get their congressman to run interference.

[Anonymous]

Can you show me links to show the conservative groups committed fraud?

I don't understand why an apology would be made by the IRS if there was no wrong-doing on their part.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can you show me links to show the conservative groups committed fraud?

I don't understand why an apology would be made by the IRS if there was no wrong-doing on their part.

i can show you a tea party group who was sent questions, refused to answer, and then went on to directly work for the election of candidates. Clear lake tea party comes to mind.

[Anonymous]

When will you consevatives stop making things up? The IG was tasked with looking if Tea Party groups were targeted. They did not investigate how other groups were filtered. As we get more information, it looks like these conservative groups were committing fraud. I hope they go after these "groups" and put people in jail. But conservatives play by different rules. Conservatives break the law, they just get their congressman to run interference.

I don't think you have read the report.