Disagreeing on when to retire with spouse

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

NP - I just ran the numbers for an ACA plan in Maryland. Our income makes us ineligible for federal subsidies. Estimated premiums were nearly $1,600 a month for a family of four, or around $20k per year. Like a PP said, the ACA is a good option but not an inexpensive one, unless you qualify for federal subsidies.

I'm the PP you and others have quoted. I do plan on receiving subsidies, and the figures cited above—including being unable to find a way to get the healthcare spend for a family of four to reach $2K per month, even with a family member with a chronic condition that causes us to hit the OOP max—assume the use of subsidies. However, keeping one's taxable income down in retirement is an essential part of financial planning, and it is not difficult to qualify for subsidies.

For example, if retiring early with $4M and using a 3% withdrawal rate, that $120K income qualifies a family of four as "low-income" and eligible for subsidies. However, notwithstanding this classification, that income still affords a great quality of life. The federal income tax due would be $0 due to the capital gains tax laws. None of that $120K needs to go toward 401(k)s, IRAs, etc. Assuming the house is paid off when retired, none of the $120K needs to go to mortgage payments. It's all disposable income and is likely on par with that available to an UMC family earning $300K. Therefore, only the very wealthy and the very poor planners are not eligible for subsidies.

And lastly, many here overstate the importance and magnitude of the subsidies. As mentioned, I am currently paying $2K PER YEAR for my plan (with no subsidies since I still work), so barring someone with very serious health problems, options are available for everyone that are much cheaper than the figures often cited here.

Holy F if we are subsidizing health care for 40 year old retirees with $4m in assets, that is messed up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

NP - I just ran the numbers for an ACA plan in Maryland. Our income makes us ineligible for federal subsidies. Estimated premiums were nearly $1,600 a month for a family of four, or around $20k per year. Like a PP said, the ACA is a good option but not an inexpensive one, unless you qualify for federal subsidies.

I'm the PP you and others have quoted. I do plan on receiving subsidies, and the figures cited above—including being unable to find a way to get the healthcare spend for a family of four to reach $2K per month, even with a family member with a chronic condition that causes us to hit the OOP max—assume the use of subsidies. However, keeping one's taxable income down in retirement is an essential part of financial planning, and it is not difficult to qualify for subsidies.

For example, if retiring early with $4M and using a 3% withdrawal rate, that $120K income qualifies a family of four as "low-income" and eligible for subsidies. However, notwithstanding this classification, that income still affords a great quality of life. The federal income tax due would be $0 due to the capital gains tax laws. None of that $120K needs to go toward 401(k)s, IRAs, etc. Assuming the house is paid off when retired, none of the $120K needs to go to mortgage payments. It's all disposable income and is likely on par with that available to an UMC family earning $300K. Therefore, only the very wealthy and the very poor planners are not eligible for subsidies.

And lastly, many here overstate the importance and magnitude of the subsidies. As mentioned, I am currently paying $2K PER YEAR for my plan (with no subsidies since I still work), so barring someone with very serious health problems, options are available for everyone that are much cheaper than the figures often cited here.

Holy F if we are subsidizing health care for 40 year old retirees with $4m in assets, that is messed up.

Agree. Why doesn't the means test also consider one's net worth instead of just MAGI? I would like to see this policy changed. I don't want to subsidize 40-year retirees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

DP but my Hi deductible plan is also $2k/month for 2 people. In MD. Plans are age adjusted so at 60+ we pay much more than a 40 year old. But agree people should do their own research.

it's the age---I'm the $2K poster from above. I plugged in 42 for both spouses and my rate dropped to $1000 (from $2000 for 55 ages). It's the age. The above poster is not very bright if they cannot find a scenario with the $2K price. I literally stated our ages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:100 percent of my friends wives are SAHM wives so I find this discussion interesting. All were professionals. But between 32-37 all dropped out.

None of the wives have any desire for husband to retire early. My wife has been home with kids since 2001 the youngest finally graduating HS soon.

My wife 90 percent her friends have been home with kids 20-30 years. They have their own lives and what is rush to have husband home all day.

None of the men are resentful they work and none of women have a desire to go back to work after working their butts off to raise kids.

It might be a little they only have been saving for retirement on one income so they need to stay. Or maybe since they devoted their whole life to work and wife to raising kids they feel out of place at home or wife views them as one more kid to watch.

That's our situation, except I've told my husband he can retire whenever he wants. He's not working for $$, we already have more than needed. I suspect he would be bored at home, and not having a place where he is fully in charge and everyone looks up to you (he's a CEO and has been for 15 years). I've told him to retire when he wants, and if desired pick up consulting or being a board advisor for companies---something that keeps him happy but that is minimal work and FLEXIBLE work, and would allow us to travel extensively. Or he can do nothing. I don't care---but I suspect the transition from a high power position to doing nothing might not be the exact best path in your 50s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

I am not the PP your are quoting, but we pay 2K/month total with a 6K deductible/person. We are both health and have no chronic conditions. I think it's easy for you to play fast and lose with healthcare at this point with no kids. You really should check your disdain, and stop putting "your" situation out there as a universal truth.

+1

I'm the PP. Those numbers were not made up. They were quotes for the "bestACA plan" in our
area for someone in their 50s. Huge difference between 42 and 56. If I was 42 I could get the same plan for $1000.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

I am not the PP your are quoting, but we pay 2K/month total with a 6K deductible/person. We are both health and have no chronic conditions. I think it's easy for you to play fast and lose with healthcare at this point with no kids. You really should check your disdain, and stop putting "your" situation out there as a universal truth.

Maybe you're not an astute shopper - I don't know your situation. But I never suggested anyone should take my word for it or that my situation was representative of anyone else's. I explicitly said people need to run quotes for themselves and not listen to "suggestions" or approximations from others.

You are comparing apples to oranges. You are 42, we are mid 50s (as was stated). I can get the same plan for $1K if we were 42.
If you had run numbers for that age, you would see that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

I am not the PP your are quoting, but we pay 2K/month total with a 6K deductible/person. We are both health and have no chronic conditions. I think it's easy for you to play fast and lose with healthcare at this point with no kids. You really should check your disdain, and stop putting "your" situation out there as a universal truth.

Maybe you're not an astute shopper - I don't know your situation. But I never suggested anyone should take my word for it or that my situation was representative of anyone else's. I explicitly said people need to run quotes for themselves and not listen to "suggestions" or approximations from others.

Yes you did. "This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely"

Whatever the case, I am no willing to gamble on my health so we pay for a top PPO. You're a single guy who is in a completely different situation, but present your situation as what it should be for everyone.

I'm the PP he was insulting because he didn't use facts.

On ACA there are no PPOs in my state. So we will go with an EPO when needed, and a Gold Plan. Doing the work to see if a Silver or Bronze will work out better---they might since then with a lower payment, the money put towards deductible and medical expenses goes to the $9K/18K max OOP.

Fact is if you don't qualify for subsidies (we wont, even when we retire, we will earn $700K+ in interest/dividends from cash/Bonds/Cash Equivalent), fact is insurance is expensive and increases with Age. Also, if you don't qualify for subsidies, you will pay similar for Medicare B/C/D It's not low cost if you have the $. Despite having paid millions into medicare tax
So we will be paying $1500-2K even on Medicare

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

NP - I just ran the numbers for an ACA plan in Maryland. Our income makes us ineligible for federal subsidies. Estimated premiums were nearly $1,600 a month for a family of four, or around $20k per year. Like a PP said, the ACA is a good option but not an inexpensive one, unless you qualify for federal subsidies.

I'm the PP you and others have quoted. I do plan on receiving subsidies, and the figures cited above—including being unable to find a way to get the healthcare spend for a family of four to reach $2K per month, even with a family member with a chronic condition that causes us to hit the OOP max—assume the use of subsidies. However, keeping one's taxable income down in retirement is an essential part of financial planning, and it is not difficult to qualify for subsidies.

For example, if retiring early with $4M and using a 3% withdrawal rate, that $120K income qualifies a family of four as "low-income" and eligible for subsidies. However, notwithstanding this classification, that income still affords a great quality of life. The federal income tax due would be $0 due to the capital gains tax laws. None of that $120K needs to go toward 401(k)s, IRAs, etc. Assuming the house is paid off when retired, none of the $120K needs to go to mortgage payments. It's all disposable income and is likely on par with that available to an UMC family earning $300K. Therefore, only the very wealthy and the very poor planners are not eligible for subsidies.

And lastly, many here overstate the importance and magnitude of the subsidies. As mentioned, I am currently paying $2K PER YEAR for my plan (with no subsidies since I still work), so barring someone with very serious health problems, options are available for everyone that are much cheaper than the figures often cited here.

Holy F if we are subsidizing health care for 40 year old retirees with $4m in assets, that is messed up.

Agree. Why doesn't the means test also consider one's net worth instead of just MAGI? I would like to see this policy changed. I don't want to subsidize 40-year retirees.

Agreed!! If you retire early, you should not get subsidies, certainly not in your 40s. Maybe at 58+ or something like that (since ageism is real)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:100 percent of my friends wives are SAHM wives so I find this discussion interesting. All were professionals. But between 32-37 all dropped out.

None of the wives have any desire for husband to retire early. My wife has been home with kids since 2001 the youngest finally graduating HS soon.

My wife 90 percent her friends have been home with kids 20-30 years. They have their own lives and what is rush to have husband home all day.

None of the men are resentful they work and none of women have a desire to go back to work after working their butts off to raise kids.

It might be a little they only have been saving for retirement on one income so they need to stay. Or maybe since they devoted their whole life to work and wife to raising kids they feel out of place at home or wife views them as one more kid to watch.

This is so sad! I too am a SAHM but I love having my husband around and can't wait for him to retire early and we are saving accordingly. What you are describing sounds very cold and transactional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

I am not the PP your are quoting, but we pay 2K/month total with a 6K deductible/person. We are both health and have no chronic conditions. I think it's easy for you to play fast and lose with healthcare at this point with no kids. You really should check your disdain, and stop putting "your" situation out there as a universal truth.

Maybe you're not an astute shopper - I don't know your situation. But I never suggested anyone should take my word for it or that my situation was representative of anyone else's. I explicitly said people need to run quotes for themselves and not listen to "suggestions" or approximations from others.

Yes you did. "This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely"

Whatever the case, I am no willing to gamble on my health so we pay for a top PPO. You're a single guy who is in a completely different situation, but present your situation as what it should be for everyone.

I'm the PP he was insulting because he didn't use facts.

On ACA there are no PPOs in my state. So we will go with an EPO when needed, and a Gold Plan. Doing the work to see if a Silver or Bronze will work out better---they might since then with a lower payment, the money put towards deductible and medical expenses goes to the $9K/18K max OOP.

Fact is if you don't qualify for subsidies (we wont, even when we retire, we will earn $700K+ in interest/dividends from cash/Bonds/Cash Equivalent), fact is insurance is expensive and increases with Age. Also, if you don't qualify for subsidies, you will pay similar for Medicare B/C/D It's not low cost if you have the $. Despite having paid millions into medicare tax
So we will be paying $1500-2K even on Medicare

I'm the PP you're responding to. And agreed. My DH is just going on Medicare A, B, D, N. Given our HHI he will continue to pay almost as much as I do for private pay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:100 percent of my friends wives are SAHM wives so I find this discussion interesting. All were professionals. But between 32-37 all dropped out.

None of the wives have any desire for husband to retire early. My wife has been home with kids since 2001 the youngest finally graduating HS soon.

My wife 90 percent her friends have been home with kids 20-30 years. They have their own lives and what is rush to have husband home all day.

None of the men are resentful they work and none of women have a desire to go back to work after working their butts off to raise kids.

It might be a little they only have been saving for retirement on one income so they need to stay. Or maybe since they devoted their whole life to work and wife to raising kids they feel out of place at home or wife views them as one more kid to watch.

That's our situation, except I've told my husband he can retire whenever he wants. He's not working for $$, we already have more than needed. I suspect he would be bored at home, and not having a place where he is fully in charge and everyone looks up to you (he's a CEO and has been for 15 years). I've told him to retire when he wants, and if desired pick up consulting or being a board advisor for companies---something that keeps him happy but that is minimal work and FLEXIBLE work, and would allow us to travel extensively. Or he can do nothing. I don't care---but I suspect the transition from a high power position to doing nothing might not be the exact best path in your 50s.

Speak for yourself. That’s exactly what I did and it’s been GREAT!

[Anonymous]

Plan to retire at age 75

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:100 percent of my friends wives are SAHM wives so I find this discussion interesting. All were professionals. But between 32-37 all dropped out.

None of the wives have any desire for husband to retire early. My wife has been home with kids since 2001 the youngest finally graduating HS soon.

My wife 90 percent her friends have been home with kids 20-30 years. They have their own lives and what is rush to have husband home all day.

None of the men are resentful they work and none of women have a desire to go back to work after working their butts off to raise kids.

It might be a little they only have been saving for retirement on one income so they need to stay. Or maybe since they devoted their whole life to work and wife to raising kids they feel out of place at home or wife views them as one more kid to watch.

That's our situation, except I've told my husband he can retire whenever he wants. He's not working for $$, we already have more than needed. I suspect he would be bored at home, and not having a place where he is fully in charge and everyone looks up to you (he's a CEO and has been for 15 years). I've told him to retire when he wants, and if desired pick up consulting or being a board advisor for companies---something that keeps him happy but that is minimal work and FLEXIBLE work, and would allow us to travel extensively. Or he can do nothing. I don't care---but I suspect the transition from a high power position to doing nothing might not be the exact best path in your 50s.

Speak for yourself. That’s exactly what I did and it’s been GREAT!

Glad it worked for well for you! How old were you?

I'm speaking for our family---and my husband whom I suspect is not quite ready to go from a high powered, in control, important person to everyone to dropping that cold turkey and just staying home and "doing nothing" at 55. At home we are equals and quite frankly I've been running the "household" for 25-30+ years, so I would be considered the "expert" at most of that.

I think he might be happier with something in between at that age, as a transition towards full retirement. Just a little something. I might be wrong. Thankfully, finances will allow him to retire Whenever the hell he wants.

I just know once you give up a FT job as a high level exec, one that you know everyone and everything for over a decade, if you decide you still want to "work FT" starting over at a new company could end up being way more stressful---when you are the new person and literally don't know anyone on the team. And that's if you can find "the right position".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We have around $2.5-3m in assets, excluding any home equity in our primary residence. I feel like we can live on just my spouse's income, maybe cutting back just slightly. My spouse does not want to cut back on our lifestyle at all.

Seems fair.
what if spouses wants to retire today too?

OP here. I already answered that and said it would be fine.

Then what would you do for healthcare? I think you're too young to fully understand how things change wrt what you need medically as you get older.

Also, ACA is great, you have some options. But it is NOT cheap. in our 50s, coverage for 2, with VSP and Dental will run $2K/month, with a $6K/12K deductible and max OOP of $9K/$18K. No Out of Network Coverage, except urgent care and ER.

In comparison, we pay $270/month for FULL Family (worker/spouse/all kids) for a PPO (not EPO), $1250/$2500 deductible Ind/Family and max OOP $3500/7K. And we have Out of network OOP capped at $7K/$14K. I believe COBRA costs would be $1900/month. So about the same but for way less coverage and No OON coverage. Not an issue normally, but it is nice to know that if you have some rare medical condition, you can choose to go anywhere in USA and at max pay $7K. With ACA, you are left locally to choose (and we have excellent choices)

This is totally false—or, charitably, I can say it's extremely unlikely.

I suggest everyone considering and nearing early retirement check out their exchange to get exact prices for themselves or their family. At least for Maryland, the figures I have seen are nothing close to what the fearmongers here suggest ("Plan on $2K/month for two people!"). I am a 42-year-old man and I currently pay $2K PER YEAR on the exchange for my health insurance (I have a $10K deductible, but that works for me because I'm healthy). I plan on retiring at 45 so the cost of healthcare is a big question.

I ran lots of quotes for various scenarios: insuring me alone in 10-15 years, insuring a family of 4 in the event I get married, insuring a family member with a chronic condition that causes me to frequently hit the deductible and OOP max. In virtually no scenario could I figure out how to even arrive at a $2K/month spend—and this included plan premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Yet, to hear DCUM talk, you need to plan for $2K/month in premiums alone for two people. Utterly absurd. Potential early retirees, you must run quotes for yourself, as this field is fraught with misinformation.

NP - I just ran the numbers for an ACA plan in Maryland. Our income makes us ineligible for federal subsidies. Estimated premiums were nearly $1,600 a month for a family of four, or around $20k per year. Like a PP said, the ACA is a good option but not an inexpensive one, unless you qualify for federal subsidies.

I'm the PP you and others have quoted. I do plan on receiving subsidies, and the figures cited above—including being unable to find a way to get the healthcare spend for a family of four to reach $2K per month, even with a family member with a chronic condition that causes us to hit the OOP max—assume the use of subsidies. However, keeping one's taxable income down in retirement is an essential part of financial planning, and it is not difficult to qualify for subsidies.

For example, if retiring early with $4M and using a 3% withdrawal rate, that $120K income qualifies a family of four as "low-income" and eligible for subsidies. However, notwithstanding this classification, that income still affords a great quality of life. The federal income tax due would be $0 due to the capital gains tax laws. None of that $120K needs to go toward 401(k)s, IRAs, etc. Assuming the house is paid off when retired, none of the $120K needs to go to mortgage payments. It's all disposable income and is likely on par with that available to an UMC family earning $300K. Therefore, only the very wealthy and the very poor planners are not eligible for subsidies.

And lastly, many here overstate the importance and magnitude of the subsidies. As mentioned, I am currently paying $2K PER YEAR for my plan (with no subsidies since I still work), so barring someone with very serious health problems, options are available for everyone that are much cheaper than the figures often cited here.

Holy F if we are subsidizing health care for 40 year old retirees with $4m in assets, that is messed up.

Agree. Why doesn't the means test also consider one's net worth instead of just MAGI? I would like to see this policy changed. I don't want to subsidize 40-year retirees.

For the same reasons that Kamala's tax on unrealized capital gains is DOA: the government does not collect information about net worth; it would likely be illegal for it to do so; and it would be extremely difficult to collect this information as a practical matter. It's easy enough to assess the value of stocks and bonds. But is every neighborhood gas station owner supposed to get an annual appraisal of his business? Will a farmer qualify for ACA subsidies one year and none the next, depending on the price of farmland and despite the fact that he cannot easily sell a small fraction of his land? Will every piece of art and bottle of wine need to be appraised annually?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How old are you and your spouse?

We are in our mid-late 30s. This is when I had planned on retiring.

Troll.

And if not a troll, I would divorce you if you just up and quit your job when we still had kids to pay for.