Mean girls mean moms

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

I’m a high school teacher and to some degree all of these behaviors are typical and age appropriate all through k-12. (Excluding extremes such as bullying but that’s not what you’re describing.)

They may be typical at a certain age, but using the word "appropriate" when it comes to them and saying they are not bullying is BS!!!!

Excluding, making fun of, or telling other kids not to play with a specific person is, in fact, classic bullying.

I would hate to know what you think qualifies as bullying.

Some teacher you must be. The ultimate useless bystander.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

Find me the kids and adults including everyone, never making fun of anyone, playing with everyone, and I’ll find you people who are only being nice on the surface (called out as mean by someone earlier on this thread) or a doormat who doesn’t walk away when hurt by someone else being mean.

Find me the kid telling everyone to play with everyone, and I’ll show you a girl who’s unable to empathize with very normal kids, dismissing of their feelings, and/or being judgmental.

I don’t know how to explain it to you, but your worldview is a self fulfilling prophecy. You are unconsciously causing this to happen.

Your expectation is that everyone is gossiping and forming cliques. You don’t want to end up being gossiped about or find yourself out of the group, so you find ways to put yourself on top by gossiping and forming cliques yourself. You feel like being a mom of an elementary schooler is like being on Survivor because you are making it that way.

Probably that’s what you saw your mom doing when you were growing up. She probably gossiped to you about other girls or other families, and you just think that’s what people do.

But whenever you aren’t there, there are groups of people who just aren’t like this. They don’t gossip and are open minded about being friends with anyone. I would say that most adults are like this. People talk about books and movies and kids and money and religion.

Most people really aren’t jealous of other adults or waiting for them to make a misstep so they can gossip about it.

No, I don’t expect everyone to gossip or form cliques. I also don’t expect everyone to always get along. Not everyone will be friends or play with everyone. Not everyone who does something mean is mean all the time. No one is genuinely friends with everyone

Of course not everyone is genuinely friends with everyone. People only have so much time and capacity for friendships.
But at the same time, most people are open to being friends with everyone and don’t really gossip about other people.


I do agree that “mean” isn’t the way to put it. It’s more like “creating a social hierarchy with yourself at the top.”

WTF? Mean is mean is mean. Creating a social hierarchy with yourself at the top that involves putting others down to get there is.....mean!!

Teach your kids to be kind, good listeners, etc and they can have friends and not be mean. This is possible and preferable.

Honestly, so many people on here with excuses. No wonder there are so many mean kids. They have useless, clueless parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

I’m a high school teacher and to some degree all of these behaviors are typical and age appropriate all through k-12. (Excluding extremes such as bullying but that’s not what you’re describing.)

They may be typical at a certain age, but using the word "appropriate" when it comes to them and saying they are not bullying is BS!!!!

Excluding, making fun of, or telling other kids not to play with a specific person is, in fact, classic bullying.

I would hate to know what you think qualifies as bullying.

Some teacher you must be. The ultimate useless bystander.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the moms crapping all over the kids for developmentally appropriate behavior any better? If their kids were the queen bee, they’d be fine with it.

No they wouldn’t. My daughter would be in a lot of trouble if I found out that she was singling out other kids and teasing them or I found a note making fun of one of the girls in her class. I don’t know very many people who would be fine with it.

This. I have absolutely caught my DD engaging in relational aggression and we address it immediately.

Also, the idea that "queen bee" behaviors are developmental appropriate is a bit off. This behavior is not uncommon in elementary age kids, and it's something a lot of kids try out at an early age as they attempt to resolve social issues. But that doesn't mean it's inevitable or that all kids have to go through this phase. It's what's called "maladaptive" behavior. That doesn't mean all kids who do it are bad kids (I don't think of kids as good/bad). But it does mean that when it crops up, it needs to be addressed and is not likely to just go away on its own without some kind of intervention that provides that kid with better solutions to social issues.

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the moms crapping all over the kids for developmentally appropriate behavior any better? If their kids were the queen bee, they’d be fine with it.

Would you be fine with your daughter being mean to other people?

No, I wouldn’t be okay with that. Stupid question. I just don’t think the adults on this board bashing kids for going through a normal phase are any better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just like women who can't get along with their MILs are going to have DILs who can't get along with them. It's cyclical.

Not true. Sometimes women fall in love with a man from a not nice or warm or welcoming family, but instead cold and insular. The man will deliberately choose a woman having the opposite disposition of his mother.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

I’m a high school teacher and to some degree all of these behaviors are typical and age appropriate all through k-12. (Excluding extremes such as bullying but that’s not what you’re describing.)

They may be typical at a certain age, but using the word "appropriate" when it comes to them and saying they are not bullying is BS!!!!

Excluding, making fun of, or telling other kids not to play with a specific person is, in fact, classic bullying.

I would hate to know what you think qualifies as bullying.

Some teacher you must be. The ultimate useless bystander.

“ I guess so. I mean, if a kid is going out of their way to tease my child and tell her friends not to play with her, then I’m going to tell my kid not to be friends with her.”

If a child’s acting out because say of a divorce, and all parents this acting out child says this to their kids, guess who’s doing the excluding? The “nice” moms. Also probably gossiping about why that kid is so mean.

Oh did you call that classic bullying?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the moms crapping all over the kids for developmentally appropriate behavior any better? If their kids were the queen bee, they’d be fine with it.

Would you be fine with your daughter being mean to other people?

No, I wouldn’t be okay with that. Stupid question. I just don’t think the adults on this board bashing kids for going through a normal phase are any better.

It's not a normal phase. It's normal to experiment to experiment with social groups and skills and to not get it right at first. It is not normal to develop a consistent approach to socializing that involves gossip, exclusion, and verbal bullying.

Some of the individual behaviors are normal to try out, but if your kid is in a "phase" that involves consistent use of these behaviors, and you aren't proactively trying to address it, then you deserve the reprobation of other parents. Kids don't outgrow this on their own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the moms crapping all over the kids for developmentally appropriate behavior any better? If their kids were the queen bee, they’d be fine with it.

Would you be fine with your daughter being mean to other people?

No, I wouldn’t be okay with that. Stupid question. I just don’t think the adults on this board bashing kids for going through a normal phase are any better.

It's not a normal phase. It's normal to experiment to experiment with social groups and skills and to not get it right at first. It is not normal to develop a consistent approach to socializing that involves gossip, exclusion, and verbal bullying.

Some of the individual behaviors are normal to try out, but if your kid is in a "phase" that involves consistent use of these behaviors, and you aren't proactively trying to address it, then you deserve the reprobation of other parents. Kids don't outgrow this on their own.

It’s still not OK for the adults on here to be ripping on kids exhibiting the behaviors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

I’m a high school teacher and to some degree all of these behaviors are typical and age appropriate all through k-12. (Excluding extremes such as bullying but that’s not what you’re describing.)

They may be typical at a certain age, but using the word "appropriate" when it comes to them and saying they are not bullying is BS!!!!

Excluding, making fun of, or telling other kids not to play with a specific person is, in fact, classic bullying.

I would hate to know what you think qualifies as bullying.

Some teacher you must be. The ultimate useless bystander.

“ I guess so. I mean, if a kid is going out of their way to tease my child and tell her friends not to play with her, then I’m going to tell my kid not to be friends with her.”

If a child’s acting out because say of a divorce, and all parents this acting out child says this to their kids, guess who’s doing the excluding? The “nice” moms. Also probably gossiping about why that kid is so mean.

Oh did you call that classic bullying?

I get what you are saying. (Minus the moms gossiping about why a child is mean. No one does this.)

If the child is acting out because of something going on in her life, that’s really difficult, and I feel for her. If she was my therapy patient, I would do my best for her.
But my daughter isn’t her therapist. She’s just another second grader with her own sh!t to figure out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

I’m a high school teacher and to some degree all of these behaviors are typical and age appropriate all through k-12. (Excluding extremes such as bullying but that’s not what you’re describing.)

They may be typical at a certain age, but using the word "appropriate" when it comes to them and saying they are not bullying is BS!!!!

Excluding, making fun of, or telling other kids not to play with a specific person is, in fact, classic bullying.

I would hate to know what you think qualifies as bullying.

Some teacher you must be. The ultimate useless bystander.

“ I guess so. I mean, if a kid is going out of their way to tease my child and tell her friends not to play with her, then I’m going to tell my kid not to be friends with her.”

If a child’s acting out because say of a divorce, and all parents this acting out child says this to their kids, guess who’s doing the excluding? The “nice” moms. Also probably gossiping about why that kid is so mean.

Oh did you call that classic bullying?

I get what you are saying. (Minus the moms gossiping about why a child is mean. No one does this.)

If the child is acting out because of something going on in her life, that’s really difficult, and I feel for her. If she was my therapy patient, I would do my best for her.
But my daughter isn’t her therapist. She’s just another second grader with her own sh!t to figure out.

All kids are. So give them space to figure it out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My daughter’s teacher told her to stop trying to get those girls to like her. They never would.
Instead, she should look for friends among the girls who want to be her friend and will be a good friend.

I thought this was good advice. Those girls are only going to get meaner in middle school and high school.

This is the problem. People want what they can’t have. In this case and many like it, girls that are insecure seek out the “popular” girls and want so badly to be liked by them

+1

Some moms micromanage, too - so watch out - on both sides.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don't give them an opportunity to be mean to you. Ignore them!

x100000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mean is subjective. What exactly are the girls and moms doing you find to be so mean, OP?

- Excluding other girls
- Making fun of other girls or boys (verbally or in notes/pictures that are passed around the classroom)
- Telling kids not to play with or be friends with certain girls or boys.

It feels weird to be an adult referring to a 9 year old as a “mean girl.” I don’t think they are bad kids. They are just navigating the culture of the classroom in a way that works best for them.
I don’t think the moms are bad people either. They don’t deliberately set out to hurt people. They just see the world in terms of these social hierarchies and are trying to come out on top.

I’m a high school teacher and to some degree all of these behaviors are typical and age appropriate all through k-12. (Excluding extremes such as bullying but that’s not what you’re describing.)

They may be typical at a certain age, but using the word "appropriate" when it comes to them and saying they are not bullying is BS!!!!

Excluding, making fun of, or telling other kids not to play with a specific person is, in fact, classic bullying.

I would hate to know what you think qualifies as bullying.

Some teacher you must be. The ultimate useless bystander.

“ I guess so. I mean, if a kid is going out of their way to tease my child and tell her friends not to play with her, then I’m going to tell my kid not to be friends with her.”

If a child’s acting out because say of a divorce, and all parents this acting out child says this to their kids, guess who’s doing the excluding? The “nice” moms. Also probably gossiping about why that kid is so mean.

Oh did you call that classic bullying?

I get what you are saying. (Minus the moms gossiping about why a child is mean. No one does this.)

If the child is acting out because of something going on in her life, that’s really difficult, and I feel for her. If she was my therapy patient, I would do my best for her.
But my daughter isn’t her therapist. She’s just another second grader with her own sh!t to figure out.

All kids are. So give them space to figure it out

Of course. I am positive that these girls have been damaged by their home lives.
But they need to figure it out without my daughter’s help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the moms crapping all over the kids for developmentally appropriate behavior any better? If their kids were the queen bee, they’d be fine with it.

No they wouldn’t. My daughter would be in a lot of trouble if I found out that she was singling out other kids and teasing them or I found a note making fun of one of the girls in her class. I don’t know very many people who would be fine with it.

This. I have absolutely caught my DD engaging in relational aggression and we address it immediately.

Also, the idea that "queen bee" behaviors are developmental appropriate is a bit off. This behavior is not uncommon in elementary age kids, and it's something a lot of kids try out at an early age as they attempt to resolve social issues. But that doesn't mean it's inevitable or that all kids have to go through this phase. It's what's called "maladaptive" behavior. That doesn't mean all kids who do it are bad kids (I don't think of kids as good/bad). But it does mean that when it crops up, it needs to be addressed and is not likely to just go away on its own without some kind of intervention that provides that kid with better solutions to social issues.

+2

+3