What are your thoughts about Anne Boleyn?

[Anonymous]

I just read a great book about this. Anne Boleyn: 500 Years of Lies. Admittedly I knew very little about her before I read the book, other than what was covered in AP European history in hs. She was a fascinating woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Could you summarize it for us? Thx

“To the naked eye, the margins of a doomed English queen’s prayer book looked blank.

A modern detective, using ultraviolet light (above), unlocked the secret of Anne Boleyn’s scribbled book—and of its mysterious disappearance after her execution.

It also revealed a chain of women who kept the book hidden for centuries. What was in the book? How did they hide it?”
https://email.nationalgeographic.com/H/2/v600000189c6dba8219238706e96c65848/cf69eca8-3533-4276-88bc-d3e072e7cfdd/HTML

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Could you summarize it for us? Thx

“To the naked eye, the margins of a doomed English queen’s prayer book looked blank.

A modern detective, using ultraviolet light (above), unlocked the secret of Anne Boleyn’s scribbled book—and of its mysterious disappearance after her execution.

It also revealed a chain of women who kept the book hidden for centuries. What was in the book? How did they hide it?”
https://email.nationalgeographic.com/H/2/v600000189c6dba8219238706e96c65848/cf69eca8-3533-4276-88bc-d3e072e7cfdd/HTML

Subscription only. Can you share a pdf?

[Anonymous]

Whoever recommended Not Just the Tudors, thank you thank you! I am obsessed and so enriched!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

She didn’t convert him to Protestant. She was also a catholic - but he wanted a divorce and to remarry and the Pope didn’t let him so he had a tantrum and declared himself the head of a new church.

Not quite accurate. Henry had an older brother Arthur who was expected to become king. That brother married Catherine of Aragon. After--according to lore--one night together, he was sent back to his books. He died unexpectedly, leaving Catherine his widow. Her father was the powerful Philip of Spain. What to do with the widow was a real problem. It wasn't clear whether he, who was I think 14 on their wedding night, had actually consummated the marriage.

The obvious solution was to marry her off to Henry, i.e., give Philip what he had bargained for: a daughter married to the Crown Prince of England. In Catholicism, you cannot marry your brother's widow. The pope granted Henry--really the English government--a dispensation from this rule so the marriage could take place.

Henry didn't want a divorce; he wanted an annulment. He wanted his marriage to Catherine to be annulled on the ground that he had married his brother's widow, which was prohibited. His argument was that this is God's law and the pope had no power to grant a dispensation. Understandably, the Church refused to state that a pope did not have this authority. So, Henry declared himself the observant Catholic who wouldn't accept the Pope's manipulation of God's law. He self-annulled his marriage to Catherine.

Now, in Catholicism, it's not only prohibited to marry your brother's widow, you are prohibited from having sex with the sibling of anyone you've slept with. It's basically the same prohibition. Ironically, by arguing that the Church could not grant him the dispensation to marry Catherine, Henry enforced the prohibition of having sex with the sibling of anyone you've had sex with. (Catherine had potentially done this by having sex with Arthur and his brother Henry.) By sleeping with Anne after sleeping with Mary, Henry also violated God's law, especially in the minds of the common people.

After giving birth to Elizabeth, Anne had several miscarriages. According to lore, one of these was a nearly full term male who was horribly deformed. Midwives allegedly saw this child and the news of how deformed it was spread through the kingdom. Such deformities were commonly viewed as God's punishment of sinful parents. So Henry's inability to have a male heir with Anne was seen as his punishment by God for abandoning Catherine AND for having slept with her after sleeping with her sister Mary.

That's why Henry charged Anne with witchcraft and with infidelity. He was trying to create the case that the deformity was the result of ANNE"S sins, not his.

Anne's brother was a leading Protestant and Anne's knowledge of the scriptures was very much formed by this brother, who probably convinced her to use what influence she had over Henry to steer him towards the Protestants and away from Catholicism. It was in her best interest to do this because Protestants did not have the same stricture against having intercourse with someone who has had sex with your sibling.

I think it's worth pointing out that most of the "lore" about Anne - her fingers, her babies, etc. - comes from Tudor propaganda after her death. The business about the "deformed baby" is almost certain lies and exaggerations. Her miscarriages occurred early - within the first or very early second trimester. There are letters from the Spanish ambassador (Chapuys, who hated Anne and worked very much for the King of Spain) from the days right after the miscarriage that say a lot of really nasty stuff, but the deformity is NOT mentioned and definitely would have been because Chapuys was in no way restrained about his sh*t-talk. It is possible that someone saw the results of the miscarriage and got freaked out by it, but there was no deformity and it would have been impossible to tell that it was male at no more than 15 weeks gestation.

Also Philip, while he was the King of Spain, was not Catherine's father. Catherine's father was Ferdinand of Aragon. Philip was his grandson. Philip's FATHER, Charles, was the Holy Roman Emperor starting about 10 years into Henry's marriage to Catherine. He was a major factor in why the Pope would not grant the annulment - there were times at which the Pope was literally held hostage by the Holy Roman Emperor to prevent him from doing what Henry wanted. Of course, because it's ALWAYS more complicated than that, but this was a big part of geopolitics in Europe at this time.

[Anonymous]

If you’re in the San Francisco area right now the Legion of Honor museum has a small but well worth the visit exhibit on the Tudors. They have one of King Henry the 8th’s suit of armors. That man was practically a giant!

[Anonymous]

Old King Henry was 42 when he married Anne.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

She didn’t convert him to Protestant. She was also a catholic - but he wanted a divorce and to remarry and the Pope didn’t let him so he had a tantrum and declared himself the head of a new church.

Not quite accurate. Henry had an older brother Arthur who was expected to become king. That brother married Catherine of Aragon. After--according to lore--one night together, he was sent back to his books. He died unexpectedly, leaving Catherine his widow. Her father was the powerful Philip of Spain. What to do with the widow was a real problem. It wasn't clear whether he, who was I think 14 on their wedding night, had actually consummated the marriage.

The obvious solution was to marry her off to Henry, i.e., give Philip what he had bargained for: a daughter married to the Crown Prince of England. In Catholicism, you cannot marry your brother's widow. The pope granted Henry--really the English government--a dispensation from this rule so the marriage could take place.

Henry didn't want a divorce; he wanted an annulment. He wanted his marriage to Catherine to be annulled on the ground that he had married his brother's widow, which was prohibited. His argument was that this is God's law and the pope had no power to grant a dispensation. Understandably, the Church refused to state that a pope did not have this authority. So, Henry declared himself the observant Catholic who wouldn't accept the Pope's manipulation of God's law. He self-annulled his marriage to Catherine.

Now, in Catholicism, it's not only prohibited to marry your brother's widow, you are prohibited from having sex with the sibling of anyone you've slept with. It's basically the same prohibition. Ironically, by arguing that the Church could not grant him the dispensation to marry Catherine, Henry enforced the prohibition of having sex with the sibling of anyone you've had sex with. (Catherine had potentially done this by having sex with Arthur and his brother Henry.) By sleeping with Anne after sleeping with Mary, Henry also violated God's law, especially in the minds of the common people.

After giving birth to Elizabeth, Anne had several miscarriages. According to lore, one of these was a nearly full term male who was horribly deformed. Midwives allegedly saw this child and the news of how deformed it was spread through the kingdom. Such deformities were commonly viewed as God's punishment of sinful parents. So Henry's inability to have a male heir with Anne was seen as his punishment by God for abandoning Catherine AND for having slept with her after sleeping with her sister Mary.

That's why Henry charged Anne with witchcraft and with infidelity. He was trying to create the case that the deformity was the result of ANNE"S sins, not his.

Anne's brother was a leading Protestant and Anne's knowledge of the scriptures was very much formed by this brother, who probably convinced her to use what influence she had over Henry to steer him towards the Protestants and away from Catholicism. It was in her best interest to do this because Protestants did not have the same stricture against having intercourse with someone who has had sex with your sibling.

I think it's worth pointing out that most of the "lore" about Anne - her fingers, her babies, etc. - comes from Tudor propaganda after her death. The business about the "deformed baby" is almost certain lies and exaggerations. Her miscarriages occurred early - within the first or very early second trimester. There are letters from the Spanish ambassador (Chapuys, who hated Anne and worked very much for the King of Spain) from the days right after the miscarriage that say a lot of really nasty stuff, but the deformity is NOT mentioned and definitely would have been because Chapuys was in no way restrained about his sh*t-talk. It is possible that someone saw the results of the miscarriage and got freaked out by it, but there was no deformity and it would have been impossible to tell that it was male at no more than 15 weeks gestation.

Also Philip, while he was the King of Spain, was not Catherine's father. Catherine's father was Ferdinand of Aragon. Philip was his grandson. Philip's FATHER, Charles, was the Holy Roman Emperor starting about 10 years into Henry's marriage to Catherine. He was a major factor in why the Pope would not grant the annulment - there were times at which the Pope was literally held hostage by the Holy Roman Emperor to prevent him from doing what Henry wanted. Of course, because it's ALWAYS more complicated than that, but this was a big part of geopolitics in Europe at this time.

+1 Claims that Anne Boleyn has 6 fingers and birthed deformed babies was propaganda after the fact to justify allegations of her being a witch and turning the public against her. It was misogyny. Of course she didn't deserve what happened to her no matter what type of person she was. No one deserves that.

[Anonymous]

Just listened to an episode on Not Just the Tudors about the myths surrounding Anne Boleyn.

They covered all of these issues discussed above.