Redshirting should be banned

[Anonymous]

Not reading all the pages. Has anyone suggested the schools quit expecting kids to learn how to read and count in Kindergarten? They're babies. This has nothing to do with intelligence and everything to do with maturity. Some kids are ready in K, others are not.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Agree, but because everyone does it, my August son is behind his peers and we're holding him back. We'd send him on time if the majority of kids weren't already over a year older than him. I've also seen the absolute drudgery and hell that is Kindergarten. Little to no movement, zero field trips, nonstop focused learning by yourself vs classroom learning. Kindergarteners aren't even allowed on the playground, so they have to just play in a courtyard with no toys (they do have chalk and balls). If your kid isn't way behind the curve, they get no attention and no help from teachers. I'm so excited to give him another year of fabulous Pre-K.

We sent our two summer girls on time.

Your school is bad. That's not what kindergarten is like at our (Title 1!) school.

How many redshirted kindergarteners are at your Title 1 school?

None. I've never encountered a redshirted kid at our school.

The fact that your school is full of redshirted kids AND apparently don't allow kindergarteners to go on the playground indicates YOUR SCHOOL IS BAD.

You care deeply about an issue that has no effect on you?

+1

Apparently that PP cares extremely deeply about an issue that is statistically fairly rare (there are studies on this) and does not impact her personally at all, to the point where she is raging bizarrely on DCUM. So odd.

What's bizarre is that pro-redshirters in this thread are simultaneously arguing that they "had" to redshirt because everyone else does, and also that it's incredibly rare and doesn't impact anyone else.

Which is it?

Oh, to be clear, I didn’t redshirt. I’m fascinated by the continually crazy anti-redshirters though, which is why I read these threads.

Anyone who claims “everyone does it” is simply bad at math and statistics. People bad at math and stats aren’t unusual, unfortunately, on both sides. Of course, there may be private schools that redshirt more than the population average, but that’s an admission policy of private schools who can admit whomever they want. I sometimes think a lot of these threads are started by tantruming private school K parents who apparently just learned that private schools can set their own admissions criteria. In any event, across the population redshirting is statistically quite rare. Go look at the studies of you don’t believe me.

Weird thing for you to be fascinated and obsessed about.

Oh come on. The anti-redshirt posters on DCUM are pretty entertaining for DCUM.

You are “entertained” in an obsessive, unhealthy, and unbalanced way. Entertain yourself with a therapist.

I see you don’t like the fact that people have observed how crazy DCUMs anti-redshirt posters are. I suppose it can be tough to see the truth about your group.

You would redshirt as you feel the need to “one-up” and bully your way through with you lack of emotional intelligence.

I could have redshirted and didn’t.

In any event, it is kind of obvious how detached from reality the anti-redshirters are. It doesn’t take a lot of observation. In this thread alone there is a poster who is apparently genuinely puzzled as to why anti-redshirting is not on the platform of the national Democratic Party. You cannot seriously argue that someone who is genuinely asking that question is grounded in any sort of reality.

No one cares that you “could have redshirted and didn’t.”
Get a life.

That poster isn’t wrong, though. Trying to shame parents for making a choice they are completely allowed to make under the guidelines is only a shade less crazy than lobbying for it to be a national political issue.

I do wonder if that’s the same poster who believes that redshirted kids should be barred from running for class office….

I bet you are right. I remember that poster. Total nutcase.

Obsessive, emotionally unbalanced sock puppet strikes again. And answers her own post for good measure.

Okay crazy. Go back to lobbying a national political party to add anti-redshirting to their platform and report back. Would love to hear how you progress on that particular adventure. Let us know when you hear back from Pelosi.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not reading all the pages. Has anyone suggested the schools quit expecting kids to learn how to read and count in Kindergarten? They're babies. This has nothing to do with intelligence and everything to do with maturity. Some kids are ready in K, others are not.

No. However, anti-redshirters in this thread are arguing that anti-redshirting should be a core component of the Democratic Party platform, in case you are trying to evaluate the sanity of this discussion.

[Anonymous]

I wish there were some way to see how many people are posting from each side of this issue.

If, as I suspect, this thread is being dominated by the same person who posts about this all the time using the same language: do you really think you’re changing anyone’s behavior with incessant posts? Or is this strictly a stress relief mechanism for you, like offgassing?

signed, a different person, who went to 10 rounds with you before on another thread, with you insisting that I should have put my kid through extensive intensive psychoeducational and developmental testing rather than just… waiting a year. Yeah, no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish there were some way to see how many people are posting from each side of this issue.

If, as I suspect, this thread is being dominated by the same person who posts about this all the time using the same language: do you really think you’re changing anyone’s behavior with incessant posts? Or is this strictly a stress relief mechanism for you, like offgassing?

signed, a different person, who went to 10 rounds with you before on another thread, with you insisting that I should have put my kid through extensive intensive psychoeducational and developmental testing rather than just… waiting a year. Yeah, no.

I think there are a few genuinely crazy and obsessed anti-redshirt posters who start these threads over and over. They use the same language, as you say. And they are very, very unhinged. I mean, look at the political platform poster. That is not the posting of a rational person.

[Anonymous]

Anti-redshirters would still be complaining if I sent my late August kid on time. He is very far from being able to read, not emotionally ready to sit still and be quiet all day. He has been a little late with almost every milestone and is tiny for his age. You’d all be complaining about how the teacher spends too much time focusing on the students that are struggling and that school isn’t challenging enough for your precocious Larla.

And give me a break with the “this is only an option for the UMC.” I bet the anti-redshirters on this thread send their kids to school with extremely low poverty rates and don’t care what is happening at high poverty schools. I kind of doubt UMC redshirting 4 year olds with summer birthdays is a high priority concern for high poverty schools.

I’m a summer birthday who went on time to Title I schools. I did fine. I remember being behind in reading until second grade and struggling. I also know that they expect more from kindergarteners now than they did when I was growing up. I know my kid best and know that he would not be fine right now starting kindergarten. He would struggle far more than I did. Let parents make the best choices for their kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Barring a recommendation by a free school evaluator for legitimate learning reasons, it should not be allowed.

Way too many UMC are doing it for non-academic reasons, simply so their children will be the leaders socially and athletically. And they will get their wish since that extra year of physical development naturally makes a difference.

Families who cannot easily afford to pay for an extra year of preschool are left behind.

You act like redshirting isn't extremely rare, which it is. Every year, a maximum of one student per state is redshirted.

[Anonymous]

A parent's job is to give their child as many advantages as they can afford. Otherwise, they're not doing their job as a parent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Barring a recommendation by a free school evaluator for legitimate learning reasons, it should not be allowed.

Way too many UMC are doing it for non-academic reasons, simply so their children will be the leaders socially and athletically. And they will get their wish since that extra year of physical development naturally makes a difference.

Families who cannot easily afford to pay for an extra year of preschool are left behind.

Don’t most countries in Europe start a 7, not 6? They also have fewer problems in school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I have a mid September birthday boy. School starts August 10th. Why in the world does it bother you in any way that my son started K at FIVE like nearly every other child got to, instead of four? Our child would begin college at 17 instead of 18, like most do. Now he will be 18 and turn 19 during his first year in college - like everyone else. I’m not sure how we “gamed” the system like so many of you are claiming. Sure, some parents are crazy holding back spring birthdays. But, most parents like me don’t want to make this decision and we didn’t make it easily.

You actually don’t have to “make this decision.” There is a published cut off. If you and everyone else were to just abide by the cut off, there would be no decision and no issue. You decided it was something you needed to choose when there wasn’t actually a process you needed to engage in. As a previous poster mentioned, NYC does not allow redshirting. They have a cut off and that is it. I personally agree with the OP that there is no need for most of these students to be held back.

I don’t care why NY does, starting kids in full day school at 4 years old is ridiculous. You know I’m right but don’t want to admit it.

Plenty of babies and toddlers go to daycare for many more hours than a kindergarten “full day” of school. I also hardly think a child who is two weeks away from turning 5 is developmentally able to enter kindergarten in all but the most extreme cases. Kindergarten isn’t exactly Calculus!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a mid September birthday boy. School starts August 10th. Why in the world does it bother you in any way that my son started K at FIVE like nearly every other child got to, instead of four? Our child would begin college at 17 instead of 18, like most do. Now he will be 18 and turn 19 during his first year in college - like everyone else. I’m not sure how we “gamed” the system like so many of you are claiming. Sure, some parents are crazy holding back spring birthdays. But, most parents like me don’t want to make this decision and we didn’t make it easily.

You actually don’t have to “make this decision.” There is a published cut off. If you and everyone else were to just abide by the cut off, there would be no decision and no issue. You decided it was something you needed to choose when there wasn’t actually a process you needed to engage in. As a previous poster mentioned, NYC does not allow redshirting. They have a cut off and that is it. I personally agree with the OP that there is no need for most of these students to be held back.

I don’t care why NY does, starting kids in full day school at 4 years old is ridiculous. You know I’m right but don’t want to admit it.

Plenty of babies and toddlers go to daycare for many more hours than a kindergarten “full day” of school. I also hardly think a child who is two weeks away from turning 5 is developmentally able to enter kindergarten in all but the most extreme cases. Kindergarten isn’t exactly Calculus!

Sorry typo. I *do* think a nearly 5 is developmentally ready for K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You would probably have judged us this way, OP. We held our Sept boy back. He was fine academically and behaviorally in school. But what you wouldn’t have seen is that at home he was an emotional mess. I suspected he inherited my ADHD yet we weren’t able to get an evaluation until he was in 2nd grade and yes it was confirmed. Not everything is as it seems to you. If we didn’t hold him back it would’ve been a disaster.

I am unclear why his being an emotional mess at home would indicate that he should be redshirted at school, particularly if he had no academic or behavioral issues while he was at school? Why would it have been a disaster? It sounds like he had home issues regardless of whether you held him or not. Makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Agree, but because everyone does it, my August son is behind his peers and we're holding him back. We'd send him on time if the majority of kids weren't already over a year older than him. I've also seen the absolute drudgery and hell that is Kindergarten. Little to no movement, zero field trips, nonstop focused learning by yourself vs classroom learning. Kindergarteners aren't even allowed on the playground, so they have to just play in a courtyard with no toys (they do have chalk and balls). If your kid isn't way behind the curve, they get no attention and no help from teachers. I'm so excited to give him another year of fabulous Pre-K.

We sent our two summer girls on time.

Your school is bad. That's not what kindergarten is like at our (Title 1!) school.

How many redshirted kindergarteners are at your Title 1 school?

None. I've never encountered a redshirted kid at our school.

The fact that your school is full of redshirted kids AND apparently don't allow kindergarteners to go on the playground indicates YOUR SCHOOL IS BAD.

You care deeply about an issue that has no effect on you?

+1

Apparently that PP cares extremely deeply about an issue that is statistically fairly rare (there are studies on this) and does not impact her personally at all, to the point where she is raging bizarrely on DCUM. So odd.

What's bizarre is that pro-redshirters in this thread are simultaneously arguing that they "had" to redshirt because everyone else does, and also that it's incredibly rare and doesn't impact anyone else.

Which is it?

Oh, to be clear, I didn’t redshirt. I’m fascinated by the continually crazy anti-redshirters though, which is why I read these threads.

Anyone who claims “everyone does it” is simply bad at math and statistics. People bad at math and stats aren’t unusual, unfortunately, on both sides. Of course, there may be private schools that redshirt more than the population average, but that’s an admission policy of private schools who can admit whomever they want. I sometimes think a lot of these threads are started by tantruming private school K parents who apparently just learned that private schools can set their own admissions criteria. In any event, across the population redshirting is statistically quite rare. Go look at the studies of you don’t believe me.

Weird thing for you to be fascinated and obsessed about.

Oh come on. The anti-redshirt posters on DCUM are pretty entertaining for DCUM.

You are “entertained” in an obsessive, unhealthy, and unbalanced way. Entertain yourself with a therapist.

I see you don’t like the fact that people have observed how crazy DCUMs anti-redshirt posters are. I suppose it can be tough to see the truth about your group.

You would redshirt as you feel the need to “one-up” and bully your way through with you lack of emotional intelligence.

I could have redshirted and didn’t.

In any event, it is kind of obvious how detached from reality the anti-redshirters are. It doesn’t take a lot of observation. In this thread alone there is a poster who is apparently genuinely puzzled as to why anti-redshirting is not on the platform of the national Democratic Party. You cannot seriously argue that someone who is genuinely asking that question is grounded in any sort of reality.

No one cares that you “could have redshirted and didn’t.”
Get a life.

That poster isn’t wrong, though. Trying to shame parents for making a choice they are completely allowed to make under the guidelines is only a shade less crazy than lobbying for it to be a national political issue.

I do wonder if that’s the same poster who believes that redshirted kids should be barred from running for class office….

I bet you are right. I remember that poster. Total nutcase.

Obsessive, emotionally unbalanced sock puppet strikes again. And answers her own post for good measure.

Okay crazy. Go back to lobbying a national political party to add anti-redshirting to their platform and report back. Would love to hear how you progress on that particular adventure. Let us know when you hear back from Pelosi.

NP. If others are crazy, you are insane into the ether. Desperation and really bizarre things that go through that scattered “brain” of yours.

[Anonymous]

I didn't redshirt my Sept birthday and I really don't care what others do. It didn't affect him. He was smart and capable all the way through HS and is thriving in college.

I can't believe someone thinks it's "aggressive behavior." It might be misguided, or unwarranted, or done out of fear, but I hardly think it's aggressive. Most people redshirt because their kid has academic and/or social issues. If they didn't, I'm sure they would be happy to have the go on time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A parent's job is to give their child as many advantages as they can afford. Otherwise, they're not doing their job as a parent.

Twisted way to think that with regards to this matter. Keep them from entering school till their teens since you want to give them as many advantages as possible.