APS Bell schedule review

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our ES used to be an 8am start and moved to 9am this year. Kids got there at 740am for morning recess. From what I heard most teachers really miss the 8am start, so I don't think getting there was tough for them. Granted, I start work at 6am and pre covid we had people work in Loudon or WV that got there at 6am. They get off at 230pm, so it seemed worth it.

Anyway, all that to say. I generally really like early start. My kids were home by 3pm and had time to do HW or rest before sports. Now they pretty much come home and we are back out the door. They also had time to do after school enrichment, which we don't can't do because of sports conflicts.

However, if Congress really passes this bill to make DST standard the sun isn't going to rise until after the kids start school. That means ES age children are going to be walking to the bus in the dark, getting to school in the dark, and having morning recess in the dark. Since the playground is not lighted, I assume this will end morning recess.

I don't know I was really excited about the early start possibility and now I am not sure.

No, they won’t have morning recess in the dark. The earliest lunch time is 10:30. It won’t still be dark at 9:30 or 10 am. Schools with this bell schedule will adjust the whole day so that morning recess isn’t taking place in the dark. Unless you’re talking about how Claremont let’s the kids play before school. That’s unique to that one school and can’t be a reason the whole system doesn’t change. They can adjust.

Also, ES kids rarely walk alone to school, so they’d be safer walking accompanied by an adult than MS who currently have to walk alone to bus stops and school in the dark.

I am assuming this is a Claremont family (HOLA!) because yes we do have morning recess BEFORE school. It used to start at 7:40 and now starts at 8:40. Kids love it, so many want to get to school early to enjoy the frolicking outside with their friends before school.

At Key, it begins at 8:30 am. I would imagine other elementary schools have morning
recess too?

At our early start ES, they have morning recess for the youngest kids only, K-1. They get 2 recesses, but none before school starts. It can be done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It seems like such a wasted effort. No one was asking for a change.

OTOH the community has asked for lots of other changes like reading instruction, something academic that would actually benefit students, and that is the slowest process ever

This is my question. What's so terrible about the current system that warrants this process?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elementary school earlier would eliminate the need for extended day in the morning.

But it could transfer this need to middle school. How many 6th graders can get themselves out of bed, breakfast, to a bus on time? These kids are young. If middle school starts later, they may need morning extended day as an option for working parents who have to be at work before 9am.

There is no extended day, nor is there a need for middle school. They have a check in program after school. That would not make any kind of sense before school.

I realize right now that is the case. But if middle school starts at 9am, how many 11 year olds are doing the morning on their own while their parents go to work? In elementary (which starts at 9am) there is an early drop off option. I think 7th/8th graders might be ok, but that's a big shift for 6th graders with working parents.

I am not arguing a point, just bringing up information. I don't have a middle schooler yet, so I am not sure how I'd feel about leaving for work before they leave for school.

I’d prefer my soon to be middle schooler is alone for half an hour in the morning over 2 hours in the afternoon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our ES used to be an 8am start and moved to 9am this year. Kids got there at 740am for morning recess. From what I heard most teachers really miss the 8am start, so I don't think getting there was tough for them. Granted, I start work at 6am and pre covid we had people work in Loudon or WV that got there at 6am. They get off at 230pm, so it seemed worth it.

Anyway, all that to say. I generally really like early start. My kids were home by 3pm and had time to do HW or rest before sports. Now they pretty much come home and we are back out the door. They also had time to do after school enrichment, which we don't can't do because of sports conflicts.

However, if Congress really passes this bill to make DST standard the sun isn't going to rise until after the kids start school. That means ES age children are going to be walking to the bus in the dark, getting to school in the dark, and having morning recess in the dark. Since the playground is not lighted, I assume this will end morning recess.

I don't know I was really excited about the early start possibility and now I am not sure.

No, they won’t have morning recess in the dark. The earliest lunch time is 10:30. It won’t still be dark at 9:30 or 10 am. Schools with this bell schedule will adjust the whole day so that morning recess isn’t taking place in the dark. Unless you’re talking about how Claremont let’s the kids play before school. That’s unique to that one school and can’t be a reason the whole system doesn’t change. They can adjust.

Also, ES kids rarely walk alone to school, so they’d be safer walking accompanied by an adult than MS who currently have to walk alone to bus stops and school in the dark.

I am assuming this is a Claremont family (HOLA!) because yes we do have morning recess BEFORE school. It used to start at 7:40 and now starts at 8:40. Kids love it, so many want to get to school early to enjoy the frolicking outside with their friends before school.

At Key, it begins at 8:30 am. I would imagine other elementary schools have morning
recess too?

Our school starts at 9 but allows drop off beginning at 8:40. It's not a recess.

If it's a recess or not is up to your principal. They are the ones who have to balance staffing outside for those 20 minutes. Some schools can't do that, so they have kids all sit in the cafeteria, or in the hall if they come early. Ours lets them play on the playground and my kid absolutely loves it, even though it's maybe 15 tops of actual play time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elementary school earlier would eliminate the need for extended day in the morning.

But it could transfer this need to middle school. How many 6th graders can get themselves out of bed, breakfast, to a bus on time? These kids are young. If middle school starts later, they may need morning extended day as an option for working parents who have to be at work before 9am.

This American society has things so backward. WHy is everyone always bending to the current status of the kids rather than setting things up so that kids develop into responsible teens and then responsible adults? How many 6th graders can get themselves up and to school on time depends on how many of them have parents who expect and teach them to do so. If that's what the system is, you find a way....just as people have found ways of working within the current system (which changed many years ago).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elementary school earlier would eliminate the need for extended day in the morning.

But it could transfer this need to middle school. How many 6th graders can get themselves out of bed, breakfast, to a bus on time? These kids are young. If middle school starts later, they may need morning extended day as an option for working parents who have to be at work before 9am.

WELL this goes to my bigger complaint. ES should be K-6 and Middle 7-8. But that change isn't happening sadly

You're right - it isn't going to happen because our facilities aren't constructed with the capacity to make that shift. Another option, however, would be to create 6th grade academies. That would require a lot of shifting around of elementary schools - or construction of new facilities. Parents aren't going to tolerate the former; and the latter isn't practical when we can't even agree to build a 4th high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t like that each option extends the total time for my HS student.

By 13 mins. Gee, what an impact in the grand scheme of things. Just goes to show someone at EPS will always find something to complain about.

Getting out later really messes things up for older kids who have jobs and activities after school. It does impact things for plenty of people, just not you. Just goes to show how someone will always find things to discredit other people's concerns.

13 minutes. Activities will be shifted due to an entire system of schools starting later. Every high school kid will be in the same situation. It's not as if they are shifting the day to an hour later.

One scenario doesn't have them getting out until 3:35. It's ridiculous!

What's so ridiculous about 3:35? It's only a half an hour and it actually puts it closer to the start time of some after-school activities that don't start until 4:00, which means less wasted/awkward time between end of school and start of activity

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elementary school earlier would eliminate the need for extended day in the morning.

But it could transfer this need to middle school. How many 6th graders can get themselves out of bed, breakfast, to a bus on time? These kids are young. If middle school starts later, they may need morning extended day as an option for working parents who have to be at work before 9am.

WELL this goes to my bigger complaint. ES should be K-6 and Middle 7-8. But that change isn't happening sadly

You're right - it isn't going to happen because our facilities aren't constructed with the capacity to make that shift. Another option, however, would be to create 6th grade academies. That would require a lot of shifting around of elementary schools - or construction of new facilities. Parents aren't going to tolerate the former; and the latter isn't practical when we can't even agree to build a 4th high school.

I come from a state where they attempted 6th grade centers and 7th grade centers, and it was a disaster. They reverted back to having middle schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems like such a wasted effort. No one was asking for a change.

OTOH the community has asked for lots of other changes like reading instruction, something academic that would actually benefit students, and that is the slowest process ever

This is my question. What's so terrible about the current system that warrants this process?

It's all about consolidating the bus routes and schedules. It has nothing to do with anything else, no matter what others might say or what types of response options are on the survey. It's about transportation efficiency. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elementary school earlier would eliminate the need for extended day in the morning.

But it could transfer this need to middle school. How many 6th graders can get themselves out of bed, breakfast, to a bus on time? These kids are young. If middle school starts later, they may need morning extended day as an option for working parents who have to be at work before 9am.

WELL this goes to my bigger complaint. ES should be K-6 and Middle 7-8. But that change isn't happening sadly

DP. Why? I grew up with K-6 elementary, and I don’t really see it as meaningfully different than K-5. It’s not like there’s some magic maturity that occurs between 11/12 and 12/13 that means 11/12 yos can’t handle getting themselves to school but 12/13 yos could.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our ES used to be an 8am start and moved to 9am this year. Kids got there at 740am for morning recess. From what I heard most teachers really miss the 8am start, so I don't think getting there was tough for them. Granted, I start work at 6am and pre covid we had people work in Loudon or WV that got there at 6am. They get off at 230pm, so it seemed worth it.

Anyway, all that to say. I generally really like early start. My kids were home by 3pm and had time to do HW or rest before sports. Now they pretty much come home and we are back out the door. They also had time to do after school enrichment, which we don't can't do because of sports conflicts.

However, if Congress really passes this bill to make DST standard the sun isn't going to rise until after the kids start school. That means ES age children are going to be walking to the bus in the dark, getting to school in the dark, and having morning recess in the dark. Since the playground is not lighted, I assume this will end morning recess.

I don't know I was really excited about the early start possibility and now I am not sure.

No, they won’t have morning recess in the dark. The earliest lunch time is 10:30. It won’t still be dark at 9:30 or 10 am. Schools with this bell schedule will adjust the whole day so that morning recess isn’t taking place in the dark. Unless you’re talking about how Claremont let’s the kids play before school. That’s unique to that one school and can’t be a reason the whole system doesn’t change. They can adjust.

Also, ES kids rarely walk alone to school, so they’d be safer walking accompanied by an adult than MS who currently have to walk alone to bus stops and school in the dark.

I am assuming this is a Claremont family (HOLA!) because yes we do have morning recess BEFORE school. It used to start at 7:40 and now starts at 8:40. Kids love it, so many want to get to school early to enjoy the frolicking outside with their friends before school.

At Key, it begins at 8:30 am. I would imagine other elementary schools have morning
recess too?

Our school starts at 9 but allows drop off beginning at 8:40. It's not a recess.

If it's a recess or not is up to your principal. They are the ones who have to balance staffing outside for those 20 minutes. Some schools can't do that, so they have kids all sit in the cafeteria, or in the hall if they come early. Ours lets them play on the playground and my kid absolutely loves it, even though it's maybe 15 tops of actual play time.

Cafeteria, gym, or playground, they are supervised regardless, yes? So why can't the gym or cafeteria supervisor supervise on the playground instead?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elementary school earlier would eliminate the need for extended day in the morning.

But it could transfer this need to middle school. How many 6th graders can get themselves out of bed, breakfast, to a bus on time? These kids are young. If middle school starts later, they may need morning extended day as an option for working parents who have to be at work before 9am.

WELL this goes to my bigger complaint. ES should be K-6 and Middle 7-8. But that change isn't happening sadly

You're right - it isn't going to happen because our facilities aren't constructed with the capacity to make that shift. Another option, however, would be to create 6th grade academies. That would require a lot of shifting around of elementary schools - or construction of new facilities. Parents aren't going to tolerate the former; and the latter isn't practical when we can't even agree to build a 4th high school.

I come from a state where they attempted 6th grade centers and 7th grade centers, and it was a disaster. They reverted back to having middle schools.

Both 6th and 7th grade centers is odd. My old district switched to 6th grade academy (previously ES was K-6; jr hi 7-8). It has worked very well. It's a really nice transition for 6th graders who are too old and too big to be with the majority of elementary schoolers, yet too immature and little to be with the "big guys" in junior high. It's also a great way to meet new peers and make new friends and transitioning to more academic responsibilities before having to deal with the added stress and chaos of a school with 7th and 8th graders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems like such a wasted effort. No one was asking for a change.

OTOH the community has asked for lots of other changes like reading instruction, something academic that would actually benefit students, and that is the slowest process ever

This is my question. What's so terrible about the current system that warrants this process?

It's all about consolidating the bus routes and schedules. It has nothing to do with anything else, no matter what others might say or what types of response options are on the survey. It's about transportation efficiency. Period.

I think it's dual purpose: transportation efficiencies and following the myriad of studies recommending that MS and HS start later than most currently do

[Anonymous]

APS should keep tweaks as minimal as possible while meeting their transportation goals. If they need to make large shifts in time for some schools, limit it to choice schools and programs.

Wholesale flipping around of start times would have far reaching implications beyond the school day, from those that have already been mentioned, to stresses on facility and sports scheduling- pools, fields, gyms, etc. MS and HS should end their school days earlier to give students time to both participate in extracurricular activities and still have time to get homework and studying completed. Not to mention that it allows older siblings to be available to care for younger ones or hold a desperately needed part time job.

Tweaks ok, massive shifts not.

[Anonymous]

When do they anticipate an announcement being made on whatever they decide for next year?