How not to get a divorce because of dishes

[Anonymous]

New NYT article about a guy who thinks being lazy at home contributed to his divorce and now is counseling men to “step up”


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/18/parenting/marriage-invisible-labor-coach.html

I think it is a bit surprising but not surprising that this guy may be more effective at reaching husbands than many trained therapists (this guy is not one).

[Anonymous]

It isn't about dishes. It's about resentment, and that usually goes both ways.

[Anonymous]

Speaking of doing the dishes...

This article is all too true.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/the-dishes-will-never-be-done/2020/05/19/e558ef5a-965e-11ea-9f5e-56d8239bf9ad_story.html

[Anonymous]

Wow. So much of that really resonates in our marriage. I am positive that the whole narrative beginning with "eat shit, wife..." has gone through my husband's head when I have asked him to do something very simple for me.

[Anonymous]

I found his blog years ago and it explained how I felt in my marriage perfectly. Showed it to my then-DH, who did the whole “dispute the facts” thing. We ended up divorced.

[Anonymous]

This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

NP here. Your comment shows your absolute ignorance to what this poster has described. It's about feeling respected, valued and loved. She posts that she was doing most of the work and he would complain about her efforts. Do you think that fosters feelings of being respected and valued? I'd say she and her child(ren) are better off alone because they didn't have a husband/father in any sense of the word.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

NP here. Your comment shows your absolute ignorance to what this poster has described. It's about feeling respected, valued and loved. She posts that she was doing most of the work and he would complain about her efforts. Do you think that fosters feelings of being respected and valued? I'd say she and her child(ren) are better off alone because they didn't have a husband/father in any sense of the word.

While I'm sure pp is 100% perfect as a mother and a partner and this is ALL the ex-husband's fault, I was reacting to the flippancy with which she says she tells others why she initiated divorce. "He didn't put his dishes in the dishwasher." I mean, really?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

NP here. Your comment shows your absolute ignorance to what this poster has described. It's about feeling respected, valued and loved. She posts that she was doing most of the work and he would complain about her efforts. Do you think that fosters feelings of being respected and valued? I'd say she and her child(ren) are better off alone because they didn't have a husband/father in any sense of the word.

While I'm sure pp is 100% perfect as a mother and a partner and this is ALL the ex-husband's fault, I was reacting to the flippancy with which she says she tells others why she initiated divorce. "He didn't put his dishes in the dishwasher." I mean, really?

Those who are obtuse can never understand nuanced sarcasm.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

NP here. Your comment shows your absolute ignorance to what this poster has described. It's about feeling respected, valued and loved. She posts that she was doing most of the work and he would complain about her efforts. Do you think that fosters feelings of being respected and valued? I'd say she and her child(ren) are better off alone because they didn't have a husband/father in any sense of the word.

At one point in my life I was home with 3 kids under the age of 4 and my husband would frequently come home at the end of the day, having stopped at the grocery store to pick up a snack for himself. He would come home with a bag of potato chips that he planned on eating that evening as he watched TV on the couch. What bothered me wasn't the potato chips but the fact that he could stop at the store and think "Gee, what would I like for a snack this evening" without even thinking that there were four additional members of his family at home who might also want or need something from the grocery store. IT was the quintessential example of someone having the privilege of continuing to behave like a single person while I had been physically attached to each of my three toddlers for most of the last four years. Were we out of milk at home? WHo knew? Who cared? If we needed milk, I could damn well put three kids in snowsuits and carsuits and haul them all into the grocery store. His grocery store trips were for himself and his potato chips. The blogger man's column resonated with me because there are a lot of guys out there who just don't get it. If my life isn't completely my own anymore, that ought to be equally true for the dads. Funny enough, I mentioned to my husband that if he was going to stop at the store every day after week, I'd really apprecaiate him calling me and asking if we were out of milk or if there was anything else we needed. We've now been married over 20 years and he still calls every day to ask if we need milk. It's the little things, because they kind of are the big things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

NP here. Your comment shows your absolute ignorance to what this poster has described. It's about feeling respected, valued and loved. She posts that she was doing most of the work and he would complain about her efforts. Do you think that fosters feelings of being respected and valued? I'd say she and her child(ren) are better off alone because they didn't have a husband/father in any sense of the word.

While I'm sure pp is 100% perfect as a mother and a partner and this is ALL the ex-husband's fault, I was reacting to the flippancy with which she says she tells others why she initiated divorce. "He didn't put his dishes in the dishwasher." I mean, really?

Keeps it simple for even the stupidest to understand. Well, maybe not the stupidest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

Response from the article, that you did not read, and do not understand:

Of course, it wasn’t about the glass. “It felt to her like I just said, ‘[b]Not taking four seconds to put my glass in the dishwasher is more important to me than you are,’” he recalled.[/b]

I don't think PP gives a damn if you judge her. That says more about you than it does about her or the ending of the marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

Response from the article, that you did not read, and do not understand:

Of course, it wasn’t about the glass. “It felt to her like I just said, ‘[b]Not taking four seconds to put my glass in the dishwasher is more important to me than you are,’” he recalled.[/b]

I don't think PP gives a damn if you judge her. That says more about you than it does about her or the ending of the marriage.

Of course I judge her. She sounds like a henpecker of a wife who was unable to choose hills to die on, so she internalized laziness. She blew up her kids' life because of that. Projecting her own failings on her husband in such a flippant way demonstrates lack of internal perspective and the notion that such a sarcastic response is somehow apropos is further evidence of that. Typical shrew behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true! I’ve always told people my divorce was due to my XH never putting his dishes in the dishwasher. It was the last straw. We both worked full time out of the house and all kid and house duties were left to me. It didn’t start that way, he was a great partner and put forth an effort early in our marriage. Once the kids came I just became the default everything. He would sit on the couch on his computer while I’d be cleaning or mowing the lawn (no kidding). He complained about how I did his laundry. It finally dawned on me that he didn’t value me or my time, and the extra fee seconds it would have taken him to load the dishes were more important to him than my time. I slowly lost respect for him and started to resent him. Of course I didn’t realize any of this until after we split and I had some time to reflect. Honestly it got to the point where he didn’t add any value to the relationship. And my workload with the house actually became less when he moved out because I had one less person to take care of.

You really trivialize your broken family this way? By telling people you put your children through that trauma because he wouldn't put the dishes in the dishwasher?


Do you think this is funny or something? Do you understand how people judge you when you put it that way?

Response from the article, that you did not read, and do not understand:

Of course, it wasn’t about the glass. “It felt to her like I just said, ‘[b]Not taking four seconds to put my glass in the dishwasher is more important to me than you are,’” he recalled.[/b]

I don't think PP gives a damn if you judge her. That says more about you than it does about her or the ending of the marriage.

Of course I judge her. She sounds like a henpecker of a wife who was unable to choose hills to die on, so she internalized laziness. She blew up her kids' life because of that. Projecting her own failings on her husband in such a flippant way demonstrates lack of internal perspective and the notion that such a sarcastic response is somehow apropos is further evidence of that. Typical shrew behavior.

Pot meet kettle.