Taking on Debt for Law School

[Anonymous]

Is this rational today? I see the average JD graduates with $145K of debt. Does this make sense outside of the the T14 or even for them? Have an undergraduate sophomore considering law school. We can help pay maybe 1/3 of the COA. Help us out all you attorneys on this board. What do you think?

[Anonymous]

Not a good path

[Anonymous]

If you go to big law and can handle it there for several years it’s not bad but you don’t know that before 1L grades, and you don’t know how you’re going to do in big law before you're actually there.

So generally no I’d advise against it.

[Anonymous]

Well you can get merit aid at some law schools.

[Anonymous]

If you can do it without taking on debt, then great.

They have had to adjust the previous style of reporting to be more accurate as in previous years, law schools would happily allow you to go 6 fixures in the hole and promise that the median income was $160k (2010 law grad here). It wasn't.

What schools are reporting is still not accurate but better than before.

A lot depends on what your kid think s/he will do as a career but finding the balance between highly ranked school and low debt gives the most options. The one outlier to that is a local, lower ranked law school like George Mason in Arlington makes a lot of sense for this area if you aren't looking for big law and want a large network of local alumni.

We are a two JD family and will pay off both our loans 11 years out. Given our years of underemployment post recession, I feel really good about that but it still is a huge amount of interest. The life time earning potential will make up for it for us (commercial software transactions and financial services attorneys).

[Anonymous]

I did it (85k 25 yrs ago), T14, it was fine. Middle-of-the-pack GPA. Starting salary back then was around 75k and increased from there annually, at boutique spinoff from BigLaw. Paid it off in just a few yrs. Naturally, it requires some financial discipline; good to get in that habit early - some lawyers spend too much, in my opinion.

Caveat, I'm not aware the latest trends in the BigLaw job market.

For big borrowing, I'd plan on at least 5 yrs in a BigLaw-type of job, get it paid off before moving to any lesser-paying type of position. Pay down the loans aggressively.

And I would not borrow big outside of the T14, as there would be greater risk in not securing a high-paying job off the bat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I did it (85k 25 yrs ago), T14, it was fine. Middle-of-the-pack GPA. Starting salary back then was around 75k and increased from there annually, at boutique spinoff from BigLaw. Paid it off in just a few yrs. Naturally, it requires some financial discipline; good to get in that habit early - some lawyers spend too much, in my opinion.

Caveat, I'm not aware the latest trends in the BigLaw job market.

For big borrowing, I'd plan on at least 5 yrs in a BigLaw-type of job, get it paid off before moving to any lesser-paying type of position. Pay down the loans aggressively.

And I would not borrow big outside of the T14, as there would be greater risk in not securing a high-paying job off the bat.

Lol this is completely irrelevant. 25 years ago?!?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I did it (85k 25 yrs ago), T14, it was fine. Middle-of-the-pack GPA. Starting salary back then was around 75k and increased from there annually, at boutique spinoff from BigLaw. Paid it off in just a few yrs. Naturally, it requires some financial discipline; good to get in that habit early - some lawyers spend too much, in my opinion.

Caveat, I'm not aware the latest trends in the BigLaw job market.

For big borrowing, I'd plan on at least 5 yrs in a BigLaw-type of job, get it paid off before moving to any lesser-paying type of position. Pay down the loans aggressively.



And I would not borrow big outside of the T14, as there would be greater risk in not securing a high-paying job off the bat.

For god sake’s you graduated law school in one of the best times to graduate law school in history. Are you completely ignorant of the changes in the economy in the industry since then? It’s a completely different ballgame. I graduated from a top 14 and I would not recommend six figured that and less you can get into a top-five. What state do you live in?

[Anonymous]

*six figure debt unless

[Anonymous]

I graduated in 2009 from a non-T14, 50K in debt, couldn’t get a job thanks to the recession (really has I graduated in 2007 I could have gotten a job no problem) and then had a kid so I just stayed home.

DH graduated from a non T14 in 2012, third in his class, went big law, 130 combined debt, we paid it off in 2018. We were very frugal.

So it worked out pay for us but it’s just so hard to know.

[Anonymous]

Also, what are the realistic job prospects for the graduate? How easy is it to get any position in BigLaw?

I would balance the cost of a particular law school, the caliber of student to the realistic possibilities of getting high-paying law firm position.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I did it (85k 25 yrs ago), T14, it was fine. Middle-of-the-pack GPA. Starting salary back then was around 75k and increased from there annually, at boutique spinoff from BigLaw. Paid it off in just a few yrs. Naturally, it requires some financial discipline; good to get in that habit early - some lawyers spend too much, in my opinion.

Caveat, I'm not aware the latest trends in the BigLaw job market.

For big borrowing, I'd plan on at least 5 yrs in a BigLaw-type of job, get it paid off before moving to any lesser-paying type of position. Pay down the loans aggressively.

And I would not borrow big outside of the T14, as there would be greater risk in not securing a high-paying job off the bat.

Lol this is completely irrelevant. 25 years ago?!?

Agree even 10yrs ago is irrelevant, the outlook is so different.

[Anonymous]

Depends on your situation. My parents had saved for college for me, nothing real crazy. I ended up getting a full athletic ride so did not need any of that for college. I moved to the state I was going to law school in early, and got residency by the second semester of first year. I had a loan for that first year only and was able to pay straightaway the second and third years.

No it’s not Princeton, but a well known SEC school, and I have the freedom to pick whatever kind of job I want regardless of pay because my one year of loans has long been paid off.

[Anonymous]

Does your kid have undergraduate debt? That is an important factor.

I took about $55,000 out in loans for law school. I got some scholarships and my parents paid my living expenses. I had no undergraduate loans. I took a job with the federal government and had about half my loans paid by my agency and paid the other half on within 6/7 years.

Overall the loans have not made a big impact on my life. Part of that also is that my DH (who I met in law school and married a few years after I graduated) had an even smaller amount of loans. Given our combined income our total loans were quite manageable. I got lucky in that regard.

I have friends that graduated law school with more than $100,000 in total loans and their life has been harder. It either forced them into higher paying jobs they didn't like or significantly impacted their lifestyle (think not being able to afford a home or being forced to buy is the far out suburbs and having a miserable commute).

I would ask your kid to think about if they really want to be a lawyer or if they're just falling back on it. If its what they really want to do then go in with your eyes open and make smart decision about what school you attend and what jobs you take. People who go to law school because they don't know what else to do suffer the most.

[Anonymous]

Why is there a T14 and not, say, a T15 or T20? Fourteen seems like a weird number.