Travel Soccer teams around NOVA let's discuss

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok. Making a little more sense now. Do most high school players play club/travel as well as high school

Some solely do Academy(no Travel; No HS).

Some choose to only play for their HS team.

Some do HS and Travel.

Oh and some at that age have given up soccer completely for a different sport,

[Anonymous]

Based on my experience with U9-U12 travel, here are a few misconceptions related to tryouts:

-When a club holds tryouts, there are spaces available.

Actually, most spots are already "taken." The tryout is a show, a ritual that invests the travel experience with importance but is otherwise empty.

-At U9 tryouts the coaches and trainers don't know that many of the players.

Actually, they've known most of the players for about two years (at least at large clubs with crossover).

-Coaches and trainers use tryouts to find new talent.

Actually, new talent would disrupt things and could threaten the established "A" team. Three phenoms could ruin everything.

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

Actually, the need for clubs to keep parents happy and for parents to be able to use travel as a status symbol is greater than the need for clubs to win games. A true commitment to winning would require rocking the boat with brutal cuts and reorganizations of teams established at U9 or before -- and that would interrupt the streams of revenue.

In all of this, what really bothers me about the cattle-call tryouts at large clubs is that families who have just moved to NoVa are often shut out, and that often these are military families. It's like a special little insult from our bloated NoVa travel clubs to the "outsiders."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Based on my experience with U9-U12 travel, here are a few misconceptions related to tryouts:

-When a club holds tryouts, there are spaces available.

Actually, most spots are already "taken." The tryout is a show, a ritual that invests the travel experience with importance but is otherwise empty.

-At U9 tryouts the coaches and trainers don't know that many of the players.

Actually, they've known most of the players for about two years (at least at large clubs with crossover).

-Coaches and trainers use tryouts to find new talent.

Actually, new talent would disrupt things and could threaten the established "A" team. Three phenoms could ruin everything.

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

Actually, the need for clubs to keep parents happy and for parents to be able to use travel as a status symbol is greater than the need for clubs to win games. A true commitment to winning would require rocking the boat with brutal cuts and reorganizations of teams established at U9 or before -- and that would interrupt the streams of revenue.

In all of this, what really bothers me about the cattle-call tryouts at large clubs is that families who have just moved to NoVa are often shut out, and that often these are military families. It's like a special little insult from our bloated NoVa travel clubs to the "outsiders."

At some places, much of this is true.

At other places, it's not.

In fact, it's changing at some places. Vienna was often accused of having "show" tryouts in the past. This year, with a new technical staff in place, they've gone wildly in the other direction. People are dropping from a "C" or even a "B" team all the way out of travel. "Crossover" stalwarts are getting left out.

Now, is that *better*? Yes and no. Do you really want to base everything on tryouts? What if one kid just has a really good night and is actually uncoachable? What if one kid all the previous coaches loved just doesn't have things go his way at tryouts?

On the other hand -- sure, you want the door to be open, especially in this area with so many people moving in and out all the time.

Even under the old Vienna regime, though, some people moved here in the summer and found spots on travel teams. And that's surely true elsewhere.

I do want to address one other thing:

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

I hope not. At least not at young ages. You should be finding kids who love soccer and can develop into good players. NO ONE is a good player at U9. They just don't exist.

The "winning/development" pendulum has swung very far toward "development." At least in theory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can a kid with above average speed have success beyond rec? He's U12. Tks.

The short answer is absolutely. Being a great soccer player is much more than merely being fast. Technical skills--the ability to receive the ball under pressure, the ability to shield the ball, the ability take a touch or two to relieve pressure and open up space for teammates, the ability to strike the ball well etc.--are more important than pure speed. Also, quickness to the ball and anticipation are equally if not more important than speed.

thanks. i guess i'll encourage him to try out again. it's sort of chicken and egg problem though. at the rec level/team he's been playing in, he's not developing the skills you mentioned, but he's also not fast enough to get selected at these tryouts, at least to my untrained eyes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can a kid with above average speed have success beyond rec? He's U12. Tks.

The short answer is absolutely. Being a great soccer player is much more than merely being fast. Technical skills--the ability to receive the ball under pressure, the ability to shield the ball, the ability take a touch or two to relieve pressure and open up space for teammates, the ability to strike the ball well etc.--are more important than pure speed. Also, quickness to the ball and anticipation are equally if not more important than speed.

thanks. i guess i'll encourage him to try out again. it's sort of chicken and egg problem though. at the rec level/team he's been playing in, he's not developing the skills you mentioned, but he's also not fast enough to get selected at these tryouts, at least to my untrained eyes.

Does he play soccer at lunchtime at school? Does he play after school with the neighborhood kids? Is he willing/able to kick a ball off a wall or rebounder and practice his juggling at home. If he really likes soccer and continues to practice and play it regularly in rec league, school, neighborhood, at home, then he will develop the necessary soccer skills through practice and effort and my guess is that he will find a place on a travel team next year as the teams add 3-4 kids to each roster at U13 to play 11 v. 11.

There are so many kids playing soccer around here that the kids with "average" physical skills (speed/size, etc.) simply have to work very hard on their own (and want to do so) to stand out from the crowd at tryouts.

[Anonymous]

Similar question, but what about tall kids? DS currently isn't as quick as most of his soccer peers at age 11 (did not make travel) but is, and probably will continue to be, much, much taller and is very coordinated. Does there come a time when coaches select tall players for defending? He really likes goalkeeping as well. He prefers soccer to basketball.

[Anonymous]

At 11, he should easily be a goalie or defender. Neither requires quickness, but they both need to anticipate well, be aggressive, etc. As you stated, he is very coordinated. Good clubs will see that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Similar question, but what about tall kids? DS currently isn't as quick as most of his soccer peers at age 11 (did not make travel) but is, and probably will continue to be, much, much taller and is very coordinated. Does there come a time when coaches select tall players for defending? He really likes goalkeeping as well. He prefers soccer to basketball.

No, travel team coaches do not select tall players for defending unless the tall player is the better defender. Speed, ball skills, aggressiveness, toughness, are all more important attributes than height in a junior travel team defender.

But for goalie -- it absolutely helps to be taller. Particularly at U13 when the teams move to a full-size 8'x24' goal. It also helps as a goalie to be a good basketball player because goalie and basketball both require good reflexes and good TWO-HANDED ball catching coordination.

The other advantage to being a goalie is that it really is a specialized position. So most of the fundamental training for goalie can be done alone with a goalie trainer without a team. So the fact that your son is not on a travel team should not be an obstacle to him learning how to be a good goalie. If I had a son who was in your shoes and if he really wanted to play goalie on a travel team I would find a local HS aged goalie who wanted to earn some pocket money and pay the teenager to teach my son fundamental goalie skills for a couple hours each week. If a tall kid shows up at U11 or U12 tryouts and looks like he/she knows the fundamentals of the position, the coaches will take notice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
In fact, it's changing at some places. Vienna was often accused of having "show" tryouts in the past. This year, with a new technical staff in place, they've gone wildly in the other direction. People are dropping from a "C" or even a "B" team all the way out of travel. "Crossover" stalwarts are getting left out.

Now, is that *better*? Yes and no. Do you really want to base everything on tryouts? What if one kid just has a really good night and is actually uncoachable? What if one kid all the previous coaches loved just doesn't have things go his way at tryouts?

A large part of the turnover at Vienna is that they've scraped the VYS preference so a lot more outside players are getting offers. The second piece is that all of the kids are being judged objectively, and your relationship with the prior technical staff no longer gets your child an undeserved spot.

In my experience, VYS has always tried to accommodate military families moving to the area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:At 11, he should easily be a goalie or defender. Neither requires quickness, but they both need to anticipate well, be aggressive, etc. As you stated, he is very coordinated. Good clubs will see that.

I totally disagree!!! A defender needs great speed to chase down those fast wings and strikers!! A slow defender is death to the team.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At 11, he should easily be a goalie or defender. Neither requires quickness, but they both need to anticipate well, be aggressive, etc. As you stated, he is very coordinated. Good clubs will see that.

I totally disagree!!! A defender needs great speed to chase down those fast wings and strikers!! A slow defender is death to the team.

Soccer is a speed sport--esp. At the higher levels.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Based on my experience with U9-U12 travel, here are a few misconceptions related to tryouts:

-When a club holds tryouts, there are spaces available.

Actually, most spots are already "taken." The tryout is a show, a ritual that invests the travel experience with importance but is otherwise empty.

-At U9 tryouts the coaches and trainers don't know that many of the players.

Actually, they've known most of the players for about two years (at least at large clubs with crossover).

-Coaches and trainers use tryouts to find new talent.

Actually, new talent would disrupt things and could threaten the established "A" team. Three phenoms could ruin everything.

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

Actually, the need for clubs to keep parents happy and for parents to be able to use travel as a status symbol is greater than the need for clubs to win games. A true commitment to winning would require rocking the boat with brutal cuts and reorganizations of teams established at U9 or before -- and that would interrupt the streams of revenue.

In all of this, what really bothers me about the cattle-call tryouts at large clubs is that families who have just moved to NoVa are often shut out, and that often these are military families. It's like a special little insult from our bloated NoVa travel clubs to the "outsiders."

Really well stated - thanks for the straight talk

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Based on my experience with U9-U12 travel, here are a few misconceptions related to tryouts:

-When a club holds tryouts, there are spaces available.

Actually, most spots are already "taken." The tryout is a show, a ritual that invests the travel experience with importance but is otherwise empty.

-At U9 tryouts the coaches and trainers don't know that many of the players.

Actually, they've known most of the players for about two years (at least at large clubs with crossover).

-Coaches and trainers use tryouts to find new talent.

Actually, new talent would disrupt things and could threaten the established "A" team. Three phenoms could ruin everything.

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

Actually, the need for clubs to keep parents happy and for parents to be able to use travel as a status symbol is greater than the need for clubs to win games. A true commitment to winning would require rocking the boat with brutal cuts and reorganizations of teams established at U9 or before -- and that would interrupt the streams of revenue.

In all of this, what really bothers me about the cattle-call tryouts at large clubs is that families who have just moved to NoVa are often shut out, and that often these are military families. It's like a special little insult from our bloated NoVa travel clubs to the "outsiders."

Really well stated - thanks for the straight talk

If my kid's travel club or coach at U9-U12 was all about a "true commitment to winning" I would run as fast as I could with my youngster to a club that was focused at U9-U12 not on winning but on individual development of the player.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Based on my experience with U9-U12 travel, here are a few misconceptions related to tryouts:

-When a club holds tryouts, there are spaces available.

Actually, most spots are already "taken." The tryout is a show, a ritual that invests the travel experience with importance but is otherwise empty.

-At U9 tryouts the coaches and trainers don't know that many of the players.

Actually, they've known most of the players for about two years (at least at large clubs with crossover).

-Coaches and trainers use tryouts to find new talent.

Actually, new talent would disrupt things and could threaten the established "A" team. Three phenoms could ruin everything.

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

Actually, the need for clubs to keep parents happy and for parents to be able to use travel as a status symbol is greater than the need for clubs to win games. A true commitment to winning would require rocking the boat with brutal cuts and reorganizations of teams established at U9 or before -- and that would interrupt the streams of revenue.

In all of this, what really bothers me about the cattle-call tryouts at large clubs is that families who have just moved to NoVa are often shut out, and that often these are military families. It's like a special little insult from our bloated NoVa travel clubs to the "outsiders."

Really well stated - thanks for the straight talk

If my kid's travel club or coach at U9-U12 was all about a "true commitment to winning" I would run as fast as I could with my youngster to a club that was focused at U9-U12 not on winning but on individual development of the player.

I think they can go a little extreme with the 'we don't care about winning' . Yes- it is possible to have player development and win games.

Lord knows the kids on our team are passionate about winning at age 9-10. It's teaching them to lose gracefully that's the challenge.

With very competitive kids (a trait VERY important in high level sports) it's hard to get them not to care about winning. I'm not so sure I want to go overboard with how great losing is--but I agree at the young ages that everyone should get equal playing time, etc.

The 'we don't care about goals' also makes me chuckle. I know what they are trying to say with that, but the point of the game is to put the ball in the other team's net --isn't it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Based on my experience with U9-U12 travel, here are a few misconceptions related to tryouts:

-When a club holds tryouts, there are spaces available.

Actually, most spots are already "taken." The tryout is a show, a ritual that invests the travel experience with importance but is otherwise empty.

-At U9 tryouts the coaches and trainers don't know that many of the players.

Actually, they've known most of the players for about two years (at least at large clubs with crossover).

-Coaches and trainers use tryouts to find new talent.

Actually, new talent would disrupt things and could threaten the established "A" team. Three phenoms could ruin everything.

-The purpose of tryouts is to assemble winning teams.

Actually, the need for clubs to keep parents happy and for parents to be able to use travel as a status symbol is greater than the need for clubs to win games. A true commitment to winning would require rocking the boat with brutal cuts and reorganizations of teams established at U9 or before -- and that would interrupt the streams of revenue.

In all of this, what really bothers me about the cattle-call tryouts at large clubs is that families who have just moved to NoVa are often shut out, and that often these are military families. It's like a special little insult from our bloated NoVa travel clubs to the "outsiders."

Really well stated - thanks for the straight talk

If my kid's travel club or coach at U9-U12 was all about a "true commitment to winning" I would run as fast as I could with my youngster to a club that was focused at U9-U12 not on winning but on individual development of the player.

I think they can go a little extreme with the 'we don't care about winning' . Yes- it is possible to have player development and win games.

Lord knows the kids on our team are passionate about winning at age 9-10. It's teaching them to lose gracefully that's the challenge.

With very competitive kids (a trait VERY important in high level sports) it's hard to get them not to care about winning. I'm not so sure I want to go overboard with how great losing is--but I agree at the young ages that everyone should get equal playing time, etc.

The 'we don't care about goals' also makes me chuckle. I know what they are trying to say with that, but the point of the game is to put the ball in the other team's net --isn't it?

Let me be more specific. Of course the kids care about winning. But a club focused on individual player development at the younger ages will teach the kids to play soccer the correct way regardless of whether it results in winning records or tournament trophies at U9, U10 and U11.

The kids will learn how to shield the ball rather than kick it upfield. They will learn how to switch the ball from one side to another rather than always going North/South. They will learn how to shoot with both feet rather than always their right foot. They will learn how to maintain possession by passing backwards (including back to the goalie). They will learn how to play a flat four defense and offside trap rather than putting their fastest player at sweeper. They will learn How to play the ball out from the back. They will learn how to pass the ball across the field between central defenders.

Learning and implementing those techniques and skills at U9-U12 will absolutely result in mistakes leading to opposing goals and team losses that could have been avoided in a club only focused on winning games. However, as the kids age and improve, they will make fewer and fewer of those costly mistakes and, having focused on their skill development and learning how to play soccer correctly, both the individual players and the team as a whole will be much better at U13-U16 for having sacrificed some "wins" at U9-U12. Teams that win all their games at U9-U12 by relying on a fast sweeper and a fast striker often fall woefully behind other teams by U12-U14 that have improved steadily though correct technical and tactical training.