Anyone get telework approved at SEC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just go to Indigo - it’s actually good and really popular.

What’s the walk over there like? Is it easy enough to get in and out of I won’t attract the wrath of the Lunch Stasi?

you can definitely walk over and grab something you ordered ahead and get back within 30. might be tight if you don't order until you get there.

People are seriously worrying about this? Am I the only one who is like 30 min, 43 min, whatever?!

See all the comments about SEC being scaredy cars.

Seriously for a bunch of trained and barred attorneys, this is the scariest bunch of feds I’ve seen post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

I don't think anyone's saying that. I think PP is referring to the agency heads who violated the CBA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

I don't think anyone's saying that. I think PP is referring to the agency heads who violated the CBA.

There clear implication from that post and many earlier ones was that employees don’t need to follow CBA rules because they believe the agency didn’t follow the CBA re telework.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

This is not a violation of the CBA. It is a violation of the Agency’s time and attendance requirements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

This is not a violation of the CBA. It is a violation of the Agency’s time and attendance requirements.

It is part of the CBA. Article 7, Section 14.

https://www.secunion.org/article-7-work-schedules

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

This is not a violation of the CBA. It is a violation of the Agency’s time and attendance requirements.

It is part of the CBA. Article 7, Section 14.

https://www.secunion.org/article-7-work-schedules

You are correct, thanks for the citation. Both things can be true. The CBA mirrors Agency policy. If an employee were reprimanded the agency would not cite a violation of the CBA. They would cite non compliance with schedule and attendance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

Ah, I see — the CBA for me but not for thee. Got it. Thanks for clarifying.

If I violate the CBA, does the agency have to go through a multi-year grievance and arbitration and appeals process?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

Ah, I see — the CBA for me but not for thee. Got it. Thanks for clarifying.

If I violate the CBA, does the agency have to go through a multi-year grievance and arbitration and appeals process?

You didn’t answer my question, and I wasn’t saying whether it was fair or not. I was just asking if you thought it would actually be an effective defense to say that I am allowed to violate the CBA because of what the agency did on telework.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

Ah, I see — the CBA for me but not for thee. Got it. Thanks for clarifying.

If I violate the CBA, does the agency have to go through a multi-year grievance and arbitration and appeals process?

You didn’t answer my question, and I wasn’t saying whether it was fair or not. I was just asking if you thought it would actually be an effective defense to say that I am allowed to violate the CBA because of what the agency did on telework.

DP, but this is contract law question isn't it? If one party to a contract breached, can the other party now breach? I seem to remember perhaps yes, esp if the second breach is related/as a result of the first breach. But of course not sure if we as members are actually considered parties.

[Anonymous]

the rto does get some getting used to. like everyone else i have to take vacation to leave early to pick up kids. am less productive than before because of all the commute time and don’t answer any emails once i leave the office.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Power is not only what you have but what your opponent thinks you have.” -Sun Tzu

Applies to the ridiculous notion that they’re (accurately) tracking 4300 daily badge swipes, bouncing the data off of work schedules, or they can do anything about any discrepancies.

They’re obviously not. We’re 6 weeks in. If they were wouldn’t we start hearing stories like so and so got fired for being 10 min late? And plenty of people are a few min short here or there and they aren’t using vacation time or staying extra to make it up. Not saying it’s brazen but plenty of people I know will roll in 20 min late because traffic got tied up someplace or metro was single tracking or whatever.

if i come in late, then i stay late or take 15 minutes leave or whatever. (note: quicktime only understands taking 15 minutes on the quarter hour. no taking 15 minutes of leave at 5:20, it will completely error out)

Congrats on being a govt rule follower. I def am not doing that.

If you're employed at the agency, your job is government rule follower.

I've been in govt a long time, mostly not at SEC. I work my hours and log my time honestly. Most people I know do the same and talk about doing it. You're either the rare outlier that gives everyone a bad name or, more likely, non-govt and just stirring the pot.

I wish All government employees were like you and obeyed the rules, complied with lawful agreements (like the CBA), and honored their commitments and promises. How quaint.

Ok, so let’s say you get flagged for violating the CBA rules on hours, for example by only being there 8 hours because you take your lunch at the very end of the day.

Do you really think that you arguing that, because the SEC ended telework, you no longer have to obey any other provisions of the CBA would work?

Ah, I see — the CBA for me but not for thee. Got it. Thanks for clarifying.

If I violate the CBA, does the agency have to go through a multi-year grievance and arbitration and appeals process?

You didn’t answer my question, and I wasn’t saying whether it was fair or not. I was just asking if you thought it would actually be an effective defense to say that I am allowed to violate the CBA because of what the agency did on telework.

DP, but this is contract law question isn't it? If one party to a contract breached, can the other party now breach? I seem to remember perhaps yes, esp if the second breach is related/as a result of the first breach. But of course not sure if we as members are actually considered parties.

Correct me if I’m wrong here, but I think there is language in the CBA that specifies the usual contract type language that if one section/article/etc. is null/void/breached the rest remains in place.

I get the question. I just don’t think this is a viable path. The union’s position is that the SEC repudiated the contract illegally. We will see what happens in arbitration on that point.

[Anonymous]

Does anyone know when the final steps of the arbitrary will happen? When we will get a decision? I feel like it would be helpful if the union told us that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone know when the final steps of the arbitrary will happen? When we will get a decision? I feel like it would be helpful if the union told us that.

Ask your steward, they know.

[Anonymous]

Not a single question to PA about breaking the CBA by committee members to whom he’s testified. Pathetic.