Are MCPS racist? Study out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This thread. SMH

+1000 Seriously.

In a probably futile attempt to add something sensible to this thread ...

I think a major problem with only looking at race is that you don't control for Socio-Economic Status or other impacts such as Special education students, including those coded with emotional disabilities. In my experience as a teacher, there is a correlation between poorer students having more disrupted home lives, which leads to more challenging classroom behaviors. I do not deny that there are studies that show that teachers will tolerate certain behavior more from white students than black/brown students. But there is also likely to be more disrupted behavior from poor students, who are more likely to be black or brown. Whittle this data to show only students from families with HHI >$100k, and the disparity will likely be much less.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread. SMH

+1000 Seriously.

In a probably futile attempt to add something sensible to this thread ...

I think a major problem with only looking at race is that you don't control for Socio-Economic Status or other impacts such as Special education students, including those coded with emotional disabilities. In my experience as a teacher, there is a correlation between poorer students having more disrupted home lives, which leads to more challenging classroom behaviors. I do not deny that there are studies that show that teachers will tolerate certain behavior more from white students than black/brown students. But there is also likely to be more disrupted behavior from poor students, who are more likely to be black or brown. Whittle this data to show only students from families with HHI >$100k, and the disparity will likely be much less.

This is the belief that so many people point to as an explanation for what is going on. Unfortunately, in studies done throughout the U.S., the discrepancy between discipline rates for the same behaviors holds true when the black students in question are from high-SES families. At that point, I think you need to concede that racism is the explanation.

[Anonymous]

Boys are disciplined far more than girls. There must be a bias too.

[Anonymous]

You keep on mentioning racism must be the cause. Against whom if whites her disciplined more than Asians by teachers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Boys are disciplined far more than girls. There must be a bias too.

boys aren’t a protected class

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Boys are disciplined far more than girls. There must be a bias too.

boys aren’t a protected class

Boys absolutely are a protected class. Sex discrimination is illegal whether it is discrimination against males or against females. Many of the leading sex discrimination cases of the 1970s and 1980s were discrimination against males. Boys are a protected class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That was such a stupid study. They should have been looking into why the students are getting disciplined rather than what race they are. What is the MCPS supposed to do now, condone bad actions because they are black or hispanic?

That is what's happening now in elementary schools.

[Anonymous]

As far as I can tell, elementary schools aren't disciplining anyone: white, black, Hispanic, Asian. I hear about some abhorrent behavior from my kids' school but never see anything done about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You keep on mentioning racism must be the cause. Against whom if whites her disciplined more than Asians by teachers?

So, if teachers don't discipline Asian students because they believe them to be naturally reserved and lacking in personality, is that cause for concern?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Almost every study shows it's 2 things

1. For the Rs People of color actually do act out more, and objectively perform at a lower level in school

2. For the Ds Most people are still racist and treat people of color differently

I have democrat friend who admit there is a parental and work ethic disparity and black and Hispanic patents need to be more involved

I’ve taught in both high poverty majority minority schools and Ws in this county. A clear disparity in ability, motivation, and parenting doesn’t exist. Sure, you can find enough examples to satisfy your confirmation bias, but there’s just as many non-examples. A white kid goes to California for two weeks, it’s an educational trip and an excused absence. A Latino kid goes to El Salvador for the same amount of time and it’s an unexcused family vacation. I’ve taught plenty of white middle schools whose parents were disengaged and plenty of AA and Latino ones where the parents were a great support.

And I can absolutely tell you that there are racist teachers and admins. When you point out the discrepancy in how they talk about and act towards white vs. minority children, they get angry. MCPS needs to focus on identifying and removing racist staff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Almost every study shows it's 2 things

1. For the Rs People of color actually do act out more, and objectively perform at a lower level in school

2. For the Ds Most people are still racist and treat people of color differently

I have democrat friend who admit there is a parental and work ethic disparity and black and Hispanic patents need to be more involved

I’ve taught in both high poverty majority minority schools and Ws in this county. A clear disparity in ability, motivation, and parenting doesn’t exist. Sure, you can find enough examples to satisfy your confirmation bias, but there’s just as many non-examples. A white kid goes to California for two weeks, it’s an educational trip and an excused absence. A Latino kid goes to El Salvador for the same amount of time and it’s an unexcused family vacation. I’ve taught plenty of white middle schools whose parents were disengaged and plenty of AA and Latino ones where the parents were a great support.

And I can absolutely tell you that there are racist teachers and admins. When you point out the discrepancy in how they talk about and act towards white vs. minority children, they get angry. MCPS needs to focus on identifying and removing racist staff.

Do black students in a school led by a black principal have less reported suspension? There are a lot of principals are black, most of them were wonderful teachers in classroom before they left classroom. It will be interesting to breakdown data into each HS or MS to see if the race of the principals plays any role in student suspension.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As far as I can tell, elementary schools aren't disciplining anyone: white, black, Hispanic, Asian. I hear about some abhorrent behavior from my kids' school but never see anything done about it.

THIS!!

OMG. So much focus on PBIS and positive reinforcement, while the kids are completely disrespectful and acting out in school and on the bus.

We have incidents of kids fighting IN class at our ES. Kids running out of the classroom. Kids constantly rolling around on the floor in class and during PE. Zero consequences. The kids who are fighting do get sent to the office, but come back to class later in the day. Issues on the bus, where the kid is still allowed to ride on the bus, even despite violent outbursts.

Kids know they can behave horribly and get away with it. And I see this with kids of all races.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Almost every study shows it's 2 things

1. For the Rs People of color actually do act out more, and objectively perform at a lower level in school

2. For the Ds Most people are still racist and treat people of color differently

I have democrat friend who admit there is a parental and work ethic disparity and black and Hispanic patents need to be more involved

I’ve taught in both high poverty majority minority schools and Ws in this county. A clear disparity in ability, motivation, and parenting doesn’t exist. Sure, you can find enough examples to satisfy your confirmation bias, but there’s just as many non-examples. A white kid goes to California for two weeks, it’s an educational trip and an excused absence. A Latino kid goes to El Salvador for the same amount of time and it’s an unexcused family vacation. I’ve taught plenty of white middle schools whose parents were disengaged and plenty of AA and Latino ones where the parents were a great support.

And I can absolutely tell you that there are racist teachers and admins. When you point out the discrepancy in how they talk about and act towards white vs. minority children, they get angry. MCPS needs to focus on identifying and removing racist staff.

Do black students in a school led by a black principal have less reported suspension? There are a lot of principals are black, most of them were wonderful teachers in classroom before they left classroom. It will be interesting to breakdown data into each HS or MS to see if the race of the principals plays any role in student suspension.

Anecdotally, my experience has been the opposite. Our ES used to have a Black principal before he was promoted out of the school. Our new principal is white and the new principal seems bound and determined to just stop disciplining kids. Now every incident gets a "justice circle" where everyone, including kids clearly being bullied and/or assaulted, has to talk about their actions. So even if a kid did nothing and got beat up on the playground, they have to talk about how they could have handled the incident differently. Then apparently everyone just walks away - no punishment for the perpetrators, no discussion of the impact of their actions on the class. Just an endless round of self-criticism followed by....nothing.

[Anonymous]

The chronically disruptive, misbehaved kids are disciplined more frequently than the polite, attentive kids.

What should MCPS do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Almost every study shows it's 2 things

1. For the Rs People of color actually do act out more, and objectively perform at a lower level in school

2. For the Ds Most people are still racist and treat people of color differently

I have democrat friend who admit there is a parental and work ethic disparity and black and Hispanic patents need to be more involved

I’ve taught in both high poverty majority minority schools and Ws in this county. A clear disparity in ability, motivation, and parenting doesn’t exist. Sure, you can find enough examples to satisfy your confirmation bias, but there’s just as many non-examples. A white kid goes to California for two weeks, it’s an educational trip and an excused absence. A Latino kid goes to El Salvador for the same amount of time and it’s an unexcused family vacation. I’ve taught plenty of white middle schools whose parents were disengaged and plenty of AA and Latino ones where the parents were a great support.

And I can absolutely tell you that there are racist teachers and admins. When you point out the discrepancy in how they talk about and act towards white vs. minority children, they get angry. MCPS needs to focus on identifying and removing racist staff.

Do black students in a school led by a black principal have less reported suspension? There are a lot of principals are black, most of them were wonderful teachers in classroom before they left classroom. It will be interesting to breakdown data into each HS or MS to see if the race of the principals plays any role in student suspension.

Anecdotally, my experience has been the opposite. Our ES used to have a Black principal before he was promoted out of the school. Our new principal is white and the new principal seems bound and determined to just stop disciplining kids. Now every incident gets a "justice circle" where everyone, including kids clearly being bullied and/or assaulted, has to talk about their actions. So even if a kid did nothing and got beat up on the playground, they have to talk about how they could have handled the incident differently. Then apparently everyone just walks away - no punishment for the perpetrators, no discussion of the impact of their actions on the class. Just an endless round of self-criticism followed by....nothing.

That’s better than the past . My gun teachers cheered on the people bullying me and if I ever defended myself I’d be the one sent to the office