Extended School Year Approved for 2 MoCo Elementary Schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

OK. What can be done, by whom, to make that happen?

Nothing can be done. It would require people to PERSONALLY make this decision and to change their value system. Schools cannot and SHOULD not be held responsible for making sure that this happens to compensate for what is lacking at home. There is only.so.much. that schools can do. HOw about personal ownership and pride as a parent that you want the best for your child?

So for children who have parents who (according to you) have lacking homes is, what's your answer? Too bad, you should have picked richer, whiter parents?

Why do people always bring race into conversations? Tsk tsk race baiters. What the poster is saying is that personal accountability starts with self, no government agency or schoo district can close a gap that starts with people. People —-Black, White, Brown & Asian must make a personal choice to be married before having children (the way it’s designed to be), saving money and being self-employed or in stable employment. Whiteness does not guarantee financial stability ——> see: West Virginia, Maine and other states. Instead of extending the school year we need to get to the root of the problem. Sex education in communities where people think it’s okay to have multiple children by multiple men and men think it’s okay to have multiple children all over. There should be a tax incentive to help flip childhood poverty, I.e. getting married before children, being financially stable,etc. The tax incentive could work for those who are poor, working and lower middle class. This is where the county should start because it hits the root of the problem. Schools shouldn’t be surrogate parents.

Look at the folks on this board: marriage doesn’t guarantee financial stability or two involved parents. Unless you want to require a licensing procedure to have a biological child and then remove kids immediately if a marriage doesn’t work out, there will always be parents who need extra help.

Amen. This is a pilot that MCPS is doing in schools that are 75% FARMS. They will see what the outcome is and decide whether to scale it up. It seems like people would prefer that nothing is doing to help these kids, and that's sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yes- personal accountability. Don't have kids out of wedlock. Go to college (there's plenty of aid available for poor students). Don't go to jail. Let's start there. I'm aware of the achievement gap. I guarantee you though that the kids on the lower achievement scale are growing up in households where their parents or parent is in one of those 3 predicaments above (had kid out of wedlock, didn't go to college, one parent is in jail).

People Should Behave Like I Think They Should is not a policy, it's a desire. (A desire very commonly expressed on DCUM.) What policies do you support?

Also, what should kids do who were unfortunate enough to be born to unmarried parents who didn't go to college and/or did go to jail?

Do you think that the schools can come up with an overarching solution that will close the achievement gap entirely? The solution starts at HOME. How does that get implemented or fixed is the biggest question but to think that it's the responsibility of the schools to fix it is naive thinking.

Nobody has said on this thread that school policies can fix it all.

The question is, what policies CAN fix it? So far the responses have been:

-people should be personally responsible (a wish, not a policy)
-schools can't (an answer, but to a different question)
-kids of immigrants do better (an observation, not a policy)

[Anonymous]

Have you been a poor kid in college? I have. I had very generous financial aid, but there was a lot it didn’t cover that my family couldn’t. I worked and still often went hungry or cold. Worse, I often knew my family was suffering back home and I couldn’t help them. My brother had really bad asthma and a digestive disorder. He missed a lot of school. My mom (who did have a BS and MS) missed a lot of work. It was painful prioritizing a term paper over your family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Have you been a poor kid in college? I have. I had very generous financial aid, but there was a lot it didn’t cover that my family couldn’t. I worked and still often went hungry or cold. Worse, I often knew my family was suffering back home and I couldn’t help them. My brother had really bad asthma and a digestive disorder. He missed a lot of school. My mom (who did have a BS and MS) missed a lot of work. It was painful prioritizing a term paper over your family.

I don't understand your point. This is a pilot for elementary school kids. They're not going to be working to support their families. Many families will probably appreciate the extra childcare so they can work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yes- personal accountability. Don't have kids out of wedlock. Go to college (there's plenty of aid available for poor students). Don't go to jail. Let's start there. I'm aware of the achievement gap. I guarantee you though that the kids on the lower achievement scale are growing up in households where their parents or parent is in one of those 3 predicaments above (had kid out of wedlock, didn't go to college, one parent is in jail).

People Should Behave Like I Think They Should is not a policy, it's a desire. (A desire very commonly expressed on DCUM.) What policies do you support?

Also, what should kids do who were unfortunate enough to be born to unmarried parents who didn't go to college and/or did go to jail?

Do you think that the schools can come up with an overarching solution that will close the achievement gap entirely? The solution starts at HOME. How does that get implemented or fixed is the biggest question but to think that it's the responsibility of the schools to fix it is naive thinking.

Nobody has said on this thread that school policies can fix it all.

The question is, what policies CAN fix it? So far the responses have been:

-people should be personally responsible (a wish, not a policy)
-schools can't (an answer, but to a different question)
-kids of immigrants do better (an observation, not a policy)

+1. Some people on this thread are convinced that this pilot is a bad idea. Except no one has shown data to support that. And no one articulate what would work better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, it doesn't. It answers a different question

Q: How can schools close the gap?
A: They can't.

So, what can close the gap, and how?

Having all parents understand that education starts at home and doesn't just occur during the school day once a child turns 5. We get kids who arrive in Kindergarten not knowing the names of colors, shapes, how to count to 5, how to recognize their own name in print, how to toilet themselves, or how to hold a pencil or scissors. It also takes them a while to acclimate to how to be in school and that expectations in school are different than at home. No, it doesn't mean preschool is necessary for everyone, but for some kids coming to school is completely brand new on every level.

By the time these kids learn these skills they are already way behind. The curriculum is written assuming children have background knowledge they don't have. Yes, there are interventions but when it takes them two marking periods to learn the skills listed above, they're already way behind. They are spending their time and energy learning those skills, so all of the skills being taught above and beyond those aren't sinking in, so when the same skills are spiraled in later meant as reinforcement these kids are learning them for the first time and aren't building upon them as designed--they're experiencing them for the first time. This cycle builds and builds until there are gaping holes that just can't be filled in the time they're in school.

Some of this is on the preschools and day cares for not teaching as well. It is a parenting issue as many parents, even wealthy don't teach their kids this.

My kid doesn't do summer camps. We do workbooks during the summer but not all kids do summer camps due to cost.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, it doesn't. It answers a different question

Q: How can schools close the gap?
A: They can't.

So, what can close the gap, and how?

Having all parents understand that education starts at home and doesn't just occur during the school day once a child turns 5. We get kids who arrive in Kindergarten not knowing the names of colors, shapes, how to count to 5, how to recognize their own name in print, how to toilet themselves, or how to hold a pencil or scissors. It also takes them a while to acclimate to how to be in school and that expectations in school are different than at home. No, it doesn't mean preschool is necessary for everyone, but for some kids coming to school is completely brand new on every level.

By the time these kids learn these skills they are already way behind. The curriculum is written assuming children have background knowledge they don't have. Yes, there are interventions but when it takes them two marking periods to learn the skills listed above, they're already way behind. They are spending their time and energy learning those skills, so all of the skills being taught above and beyond those aren't sinking in, so when the same skills are spiraled in later meant as reinforcement these kids are learning them for the first time and aren't building upon them as designed--they're experiencing them for the first time. This cycle builds and builds until there are gaping holes that just can't be filled in the time they're in school.

Some of this is on the preschools and day cares for not teaching as well. It is a parenting issue as many parents, even wealthy don't teach their kids this.

My kid doesn't do summer camps. We do workbooks during the summer but not all kids do summer camps due to cost.

These kids for the most part aren't in preschools or day cares. They spend time with extended family or babysitters in the neighborhood. They're not being paid to teach them anything--many end up in front of the TV all day and they're not watching Sesame Street or anything of that sort and they're around lots of adult activities throughout the day because it isn't a child focused arrangement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

OK. What can be done, by whom, to make that happen?

Nothing can be done. It would require people to PERSONALLY make this decision and to change their value system. Schools cannot and SHOULD not be held responsible for making sure that this happens to compensate for what is lacking at home. There is only.so.much. that schools can do. HOw about personal ownership and pride as a parent that you want the best for your child?

So for children who have parents who (according to you) have lacking homes is, what's your answer? Too bad, you should have picked richer, whiter parents?

As I said, there's only so much that the schools can do. I think no one can argue that MCPS is already doing a lot to compensate for the lack of whats happening at home; but to expect that we continue to throw more and more resources on top of what's already being done to completely close the gap is foolish. People need to stop being dillusional, thinking that the solution is solely on the schools to come up with. Your assertion that one can only be rich and white to care about a child's education is effed up by the way. I'm a minority middle class parent who have children in a FOCUS school. Lots of parents; not just white or rich, care about their children's education. The point I'm making is that caring about your child's education is something that personally anyone regardless of your SES or ethnicity CAN do.

MCPS can do a better job in evaluating kids for SN and targeting kids in K with learning and other disabilities and providing specific supports, i.e. reading specialist, OT, Speech in a meaningful way (not just groups of 6 kids for 30 minutes), provide aides in the classroom since everything is now center based so when a teacher is working with a small group, the other kids are working/on task, not goofing off. MCPS can have a real curriculum with textbooks and provide parents with what kids are learning at school (we get no information, no worksheets back, homework is not related to classwork and pathetic). MCPS can involve parents more in the learning process and school. Our school does not allow parent volunteers and discourages any parental involvement, including opinions on their child's IEPs.

And extra 20 days for kids isn't as helpful as making the time they have at school meaningful and child-based. Those millions can help kids early on with more reading specialists, especially those who are trained dyslexia, etc. since many parents aren't aware there is a problem till the key window is missed for getting therapies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have you been a poor kid in college? I have. I had very generous financial aid, but there was a lot it didn’t cover that my family couldn’t. I worked and still often went hungry or cold. Worse, I often knew my family was suffering back home and I couldn’t help them. My brother had really bad asthma and a digestive disorder. He missed a lot of school. My mom (who did have a BS and MS) missed a lot of work. It was painful prioritizing a term paper over your family.

I don't understand your point. This is a pilot for elementary school kids. They're not going to be working to support their families. Many families will probably appreciate the extra childcare so they can work.

I was responding to the person who blamed struggling FARMS students on their parents not going to college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, it doesn't. It answers a different question

Q: How can schools close the gap?
A: They can't.

So, what can close the gap, and how?

Having all parents understand that education starts at home and doesn't just occur during the school day once a child turns 5. We get kids who arrive in Kindergarten not knowing the names of colors, shapes, how to count to 5, how to recognize their own name in print, how to toilet themselves, or how to hold a pencil or scissors. It also takes them a while to acclimate to how to be in school and that expectations in school are different than at home. No, it doesn't mean preschool is necessary for everyone, but for some kids coming to school is completely brand new on every level.

By the time these kids learn these skills they are already way behind. The curriculum is written assuming children have background knowledge they don't have. Yes, there are interventions but when it takes them two marking periods to learn the skills listed above, they're already way behind. They are spending their time and energy learning those skills, so all of the skills being taught above and beyond those aren't sinking in, so when the same skills are spiraled in later meant as reinforcement these kids are learning them for the first time and aren't building upon them as designed--they're experiencing them for the first time. This cycle builds and builds until there are gaping holes that just can't be filled in the time they're in school.

Some of this is on the preschools and day cares for not teaching as well. It is a parenting issue as many parents, even wealthy don't teach their kids this.

My kid doesn't do summer camps. We do workbooks during the summer but not all kids do summer camps due to cost.

These kids for the most part aren't in preschools or day cares. They spend time with extended family or babysitters in the neighborhood. They're not being paid to teach them anything--many end up in front of the TV all day and they're not watching Sesame Street or anything of that sort and they're around lots of adult activities throughout the day because it isn't a child focused arrangement.

None of the preschools or day cares we looked at but 1 really did heavy academics at age 4. We only found one and went. It made a huge difference in preparing my and all the kids for school. I know plenty of wealthy parents who don't teach the foundation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

MCPS can do a better job in evaluating kids for SN and targeting kids in K with learning and other disabilities and providing specific supports, i.e. reading specialist, OT, Speech in a meaningful way (not just groups of 6 kids for 30 minutes), provide aides in the classroom since everything is now center based so when a teacher is working with a small group, the other kids are working/on task, not goofing off. MCPS can have a real curriculum with textbooks and provide parents with what kids are learning at school (we get no information, no worksheets back, homework is not related to classwork and pathetic). MCPS can involve parents more in the learning process and school. Our school does not allow parent volunteers and discourages any parental involvement, including opinions on their child's IEPs.

And extra 20 days for kids isn't as helpful as making the time they have at school meaningful and child-based. Those millions can help kids early on with more reading specialists, especially those who are trained dyslexia, etc. since many parents aren't aware there is a problem till the key window is missed for getting therapies.

This seems like a list for the children of middle-class, college-educated parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

OK. What can be done, by whom, to make that happen?

Nothing can be done. It would require people to PERSONALLY make this decision and to change their value system. Schools cannot and SHOULD not be held responsible for making sure that this happens to compensate for what is lacking at home. There is only.so.much. that schools can do. HOw about personal ownership and pride as a parent that you want the best for your child?

So for children who have parents who (according to you) have lacking homes is, what's your answer? Too bad, you should have picked richer, whiter parents?

As I said, there's only so much that the schools can do. I think no one can argue that MCPS is already doing a lot to compensate for the lack of whats happening at home; but to expect that we continue to throw more and more resources on top of what's already being done to completely close the gap is foolish. People need to stop being dillusional, thinking that the solution is solely on the schools to come up with. Your assertion that one can only be rich and white to care about a child's education is effed up by the way. I'm a minority middle class parent who have children in a FOCUS school. Lots of parents; not just white or rich, care about their children's education. The point I'm making is that caring about your child's education is something that personally anyone regardless of your SES or ethnicity CAN do.

MCPS can do a better job in evaluating kids for SN and targeting kids in K with learning and other disabilities and providing specific supports, i.e. reading specialist, OT, Speech in a meaningful way (not just groups of 6 kids for 30 minutes), provide aides in the classroom since everything is now center based so when a teacher is working with a small group, the other kids are working/on task, not goofing off. MCPS can have a real curriculum with textbooks and provide parents with what kids are learning at school (we get no information, no worksheets back, homework is not related to classwork and pathetic). MCPS can involve parents more in the learning process and school. Our school does not allow parent volunteers and discourages any parental involvement, including opinions on their child's IEPs.

And extra 20 days for kids isn't as helpful as making the time they have at school meaningful and child-based. Those millions can help kids early on with more reading specialists, especially those who are trained dyslexia, etc. since many parents aren't aware there is a problem till the key window is missed for getting therapies.

Your suggestions all make sense to me. I wish MCPS could do all of these. But saying "an extra 20 days isn't helpful" without any data makes it sound more like your opinion than a fact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

OK. What can be done, by whom, to make that happen?

Nothing can be done. It would require people to PERSONALLY make this decision and to change their value system. Schools cannot and SHOULD not be held responsible for making sure that this happens to compensate for what is lacking at home. There is only.so.much. that schools can do. HOw about personal ownership and pride as a parent that you want the best for your child?

So for children who have parents who (according to you) have lacking homes is, what's your answer? Too bad, you should have picked richer, whiter parents?

Why do people always bring race into conversations? Tsk tsk race baiters. What the poster is saying is that personal accountability starts with self, no government agency or schoo district can close a gap that starts with people. People —-Black, White, Brown & Asian must make a personal choice to be married before having children (the way it’s designed to be), saving money and being self-employed or in stable employment. Whiteness does not guarantee financial stability ——> see: West Virginia, Maine and other states. Instead of extending the school year we need to get to the root of the problem. Sex education in communities where people think it’s okay to have multiple children by multiple men and men think it’s okay to have multiple children all over. There should be a tax incentive to help flip childhood poverty, I.e. getting married before children, being financially stable,etc. The tax incentive could work for those who are poor, working and lower middle class. This is where the county should start because it hits the root of the problem. Schools shouldn’t be surrogate parents.

Look at the folks on this board: marriage doesn’t guarantee financial stability or two involved parents. Unless you want to require a licensing procedure to have a biological child and then remove kids immediately if a marriage doesn’t work out, there will always be parents who need extra help.

Amen. This is a pilot that MCPS is doing in schools that are 75% FARMS. They will see what the outcome is and decide whether to scale it up. It seems like people would prefer that nothing is doing to help these kids, and that's sad.

Hopefully it will help. My students are academically devastated by nearly 3 months of no school during the school. Heck, even a week and a half during winter and spring breaks sets them back. I'm very interested in the results of this. I think posters are just frustrated that there is a belief that the achievement gap will be solved at school only. I think we should look at success stories and see what in their lives contributed to the success. I don't necessarily think a kid needs 2 parents to be academically successful. I was raised by a single mother who did the job of 2 parents. Two parents would have been easier on her but it certainly is not a requirement. My mom never graduated from college but did go back to get her AA degree when my dad left. My grandparents came over to our house sometimes to help while my mom was in class at night. My grandparents made us do our "lessons" when we got home from school. On the days they couldn't be there, we would lock ourselves in. My grandfather would remove a part from the TV so we couldn't watch it until he got home. Lol. I do the same thing now with my son's PS4 remote. Neither one of them went to college but we didn't know that they probably didn't understand our homework past a certain grade. They always checked to make sure we did it and if it was messy (my brother), they would make him do it again. We were expected to do well and go to college even though we really couldn't afford it. We worked starting at age 14 in the summer and then after school. We worked PT in college too. We shopped at consignment stores for clothes and ate a lot of canned foods like soup. My grandparents would bring over fruits and vegetables sometimes from their neighbor's backyard. I am rambling but it bothers me that single mothers are given a bad rap. I am a single mother and I envy my child's life. He's got it good! Think of the successful people raised by single moms. All it takes is one good parent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, it doesn't. It answers a different question

Q: How can schools close the gap?
A: They can't.

So, what can close the gap, and how?

Having all parents understand that education starts at home and doesn't just occur during the school day once a child turns 5. We get kids who arrive in Kindergarten not knowing the names of colors, shapes, how to count to 5, how to recognize their own name in print, how to toilet themselves, or how to hold a pencil or scissors. It also takes them a while to acclimate to how to be in school and that expectations in school are different than at home. No, it doesn't mean preschool is necessary for everyone, but for some kids coming to school is completely brand new on every level.

By the time these kids learn these skills they are already way behind. The curriculum is written assuming children have background knowledge they don't have. Yes, there are interventions but when it takes them two marking periods to learn the skills listed above, they're already way behind. They are spending their time and energy learning those skills, so all of the skills being taught above and beyond those aren't sinking in, so when the same skills are spiraled in later meant as reinforcement these kids are learning them for the first time and aren't building upon them as designed--they're experiencing them for the first time. This cycle builds and builds until there are gaping holes that just can't be filled in the time they're in school.

Some of this is on the preschools and day cares for not teaching as well. It is a parenting issue as many parents, even wealthy don't teach their kids this.

My kid doesn't do summer camps. We do workbooks during the summer but not all kids do summer camps due to cost.

These kids for the most part aren't in preschools or day cares. They spend time with extended family or babysitters in the neighborhood. They're not being paid to teach them anything--many end up in front of the TV all day and they're not watching Sesame Street or anything of that sort and they're around lots of adult activities throughout the day because it isn't a child focused arrangement.

None of the preschools or day cares we looked at but 1 really did heavy academics at age 4. We only found one and went. It made a huge difference in preparing my and all the kids for school. I know plenty of wealthy parents who don't teach the foundation.

I'm not talking about heavy academics. I'm talking about doing things like going to the grocery store and pointing out that apples are red and round and cucumbers are long and green. Pointing out environmental print--"look, it's a big M for McDonald's!" etc. All of that is considered rich language from 0-5. Getting kids used to holding a crayon or pencil by having them color on blank paper. The point is that SOMEBODY has to teach the foundation whether it's the parents or it's outsourced. Kids who have not been taught the foundation by the time they start school are at a disadvantage and continue to be. 20 extra days of school per year isn't going to fix that. We already have the data that shows that retaining kids only gives them a fleeting additional boost and then it levels out quickly and that's an entire year of extra schooling. Sure, we can see what happens and what the data shows but until we get to the root of the problem not much will change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

OK. What can be done, by whom, to make that happen?

Nothing can be done. It would require people to PERSONALLY make this decision and to change their value system. Schools cannot and SHOULD not be held responsible for making sure that this happens to compensate for what is lacking at home. There is only.so.much. that schools can do. HOw about personal ownership and pride as a parent that you want the best for your child?

So for children who have parents who (according to you) have lacking homes is, what's your answer? Too bad, you should have picked richer, whiter parents?

Why do people always bring race into conversations? Tsk tsk race baiters. What the poster is saying is that personal accountability starts with self, no government agency or schoo district can close a gap that starts with people. People —-Black, White, Brown & Asian must make a personal choice to be married before having children (the way it’s designed to be), saving money and being self-employed or in stable employment. Whiteness does not guarantee financial stability ——> see: West Virginia, Maine and other states. Instead of extending the school year we need to get to the root of the problem. Sex education in communities where people think it’s okay to have multiple children by multiple men and men think it’s okay to have multiple children all over. There should be a tax incentive to help flip childhood poverty, I.e. getting married before children, being financially stable,etc. The tax incentive could work for those who are poor, working and lower middle class. This is where the county should start because it hits the root of the problem. Schools shouldn’t be surrogate parents.

Look at the folks on this board: marriage doesn’t guarantee financial stability or two involved parents. Unless you want to require a licensing procedure to have a biological child and then remove kids immediately if a marriage doesn’t work out, there will always be parents who need extra help.

Amen. This is a pilot that MCPS is doing in schools that are 75% FARMS. They will see what the outcome is and decide whether to scale it up. It seems like people would prefer that nothing is doing to help these kids, and that's sad.

Hopefully it will help. My students are academically devastated by nearly 3 months of no school during the school. Heck, even a week and a half during winter and spring breaks sets them back. I'm very interested in the results of this. I think posters are just frustrated that there is a belief that the achievement gap will be solved at school only. I think we should look at success stories and see what in their lives contributed to the success. I don't necessarily think a kid needs 2 parents to be academically successful. I was raised by a single mother who did the job of 2 parents. Two parents would have been easier on her but it certainly is not a requirement. My mom never graduated from college but did go back to get her AA degree when my dad left. My grandparents came over to our house sometimes to help while my mom was in class at night. My grandparents made us do our "lessons" when we got home from school. On the days they couldn't be there, we would lock ourselves in. My grandfather would remove a part from the TV so we couldn't watch it until he got home. Lol. I do the same thing now with my son's PS4 remote. Neither one of them went to college but we didn't know that they probably didn't understand our homework past a certain grade. They always checked to make sure we did it and if it was messy (my brother), they would make him do it again. We were expected to do well and go to college even though we really couldn't afford it. We worked starting at age 14 in the summer and then after school. We worked PT in college too. We shopped at consignment stores for clothes and ate a lot of canned foods like soup. My grandparents would bring over fruits and vegetables sometimes from their neighbor's backyard. I am rambling but it bothers me that single mothers are given a bad rap. I am a single mother and I envy my child's life. He's got it good! Think of the successful people raised by single moms. All it takes is one good parent.

Kudos to you. You sound like a great mom.