Starting to think about college for our gifted kid

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Check out hoagiesgifted.org for great resources in gifted children, including why grade acceleration is absolutely the best approach in many instances — dcum will nearly never support grade acceleration.

Also I second the Davidson Institute if your child meets their criteria.

I do not think you should be thinking of college at all yet. As many have mentioned, your child’s path will not be straight. Gifted kids often have greater social and emotional needs (you are already seeing anxiety and perfectionism which can be devastating) or learning disabilities (twice exceptional). These things can prove very difficult and you should not jump to the idea that your daughter will get merit aid for college.

My highly gifted kid is currently falling apart in 8th grade because he cannot stay organized and turn in his assignments on time. All tests are 100% but so many 0s on homework because they were late or not turned in. I’m definitely not thinking of merit aid!

My advice is avoid hoagies like the plague and don’t ask upper middle class people questions like this. Both have really (albeit differently) screwed-up attitudes re giftedness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's important for you to realize there is nothing unique or remarkable about what you're describing and when she applies to college she will be competing against similarly gifted students for slots.

You are wrong. A kid who figures out how to read by age 3 is exceptional. Assuming (a) kid basically taught herself and (b) parent is accurate about kid being able to read (vs recite text from memory and recognize a few words). This is consistent with a subsequent identification as PG.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's important for you to realize there is nothing unique or remarkable about what you're describing and when she applies to college she will be competing against similarly gifted students for slots.

You are wrong. A kid who figures out how to read by age 3 is exceptional. Assuming (a) kid basically taught herself and (b) parent is accurate about kid being able to read (vs recite text from memory and recognize a few words). This is consistent with a subsequent identification as PG.

No, they are just smart and have a knack for that. My kid could read by 3, but couldn't talk. He's a smart kid, good IQ but not a genius. You save for all kids and treat them equally. If they have a lower IQ because of your genetics its your fault and you should take that money and get them what they need in terms of tutors, etc. vs. punishing them and doing less for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, moving to a state with an excellent public university system is a great idea if your work lives allow for it. As a pg kid, I really benefited from living in CA, with cheap and easy access to community college and UC classes and libraries from an early age.

Personally, I grew up with what others might call a strong work ethic but it wasn't really school-focused. School was a relatively low bar which I cleared easily and then got on with doing things that interested me. So I’d say I was responsible wrt schoolwork but the Energizer Bunny wrt my own interests/projects.

And what provided that energy was not a work ethic so much as curiosity and a delight in figuring things out. Basically, for a pg kid like me, school was not where most learning happened. Libraries mattered more. In some cases, extra curricular mattered more (speech and debate and math team, for me). Museums mattered. Films mattered. The newspaper mattered. The woods mattered. Even the kitchen mattered.

School is not that interesting, but the world is fascinating. And school can be a useful way of discovering (vs pursuing) interests and playmates/partners in crime (another advantage of living in a college town during MS and HS — it was easy to find kids who loved to read and think and talk and explore).

Ironic thing for me is when I had a kid of my own, I set out to find DC a more challenging school than the ones I attended. Big mistake. DC lost the free time I had and got used to a regime in which obligation, competition, triage, and stress dominated the school environment, and school became mostly where DC learned.

DC excelled in HS, got into a great Uni, and continues to do well in college, but DC’s work/play distinction is much sharper than mine and, as a result, there’s less drive and less joy. If I had to do it all over again, I’d send DC to public school for HS and provide more space and time for a choose your own adventure approach to intellectual life.

Unless you are exceptionally rich, California is one of the worst states to move to if you have a smart kid.

Except for a tiny handful of tye very wealthy areas, California schools are abismal now.

Neither my parents nor my brother are exceptionally rich (or even rich) and both live in SoCal districts with excellent public schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many - but certainly not all - gifted children also have a learning disability or ADHD. They might struggle with executive function skills or maintaining sustained focus in non-preferred subjects, so their grades don’t match their standardized test scores.

Well, the Washington area is also filled with successful non LD kids, so it’s not that high a percentage I don’t think.
Several of my friends’ sent their ‘profoundly gifted’ kids to top private schools here and by the end they decided their kid was ‘pretty darned normal’.

Kids who are "profoundly gifted" are in the 99.9th percentile for IQ. It is unlikely that several of your friends had kids in this category.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many - but certainly not all - gifted children also have a learning disability or ADHD. They might struggle with executive function skills or maintaining sustained focus in non-preferred subjects, so their grades don’t match their standardized test scores.

Well, the Washington area is also filled with successful non LD kids, so it’s not that high a percentage I don’t think.
Several of my friends’ sent their ‘profoundly gifted’ kids to top private schools here and by the end they decided their kid was ‘pretty darned normal’.

Kids who are "profoundly gifted" are in the 99.9th percentile for IQ. It is unlikely that several of your friends had kids in this category.

In Fairfax county, the largest municipality in the area, there are probably 200 kids per grade that are profoundly gifted. I have adjusted it for the socioeconomic aspects. I know one kid (not my kid) who fits that. He is at TJ and is not finding it hard. I know another dozen kids from TJ that work their rear off.

In my life experience (including myself), I have known about 20 people I would call profoundly gifted. Most of these are professional colleagues. Interestingly, they are not the people I know who are the most successful (financially), as they do not measure life in dollars but rather ideas. I do not know them that well, but one of them won a Nobel Prize.

[Anonymous]

No there aren’t 200 kids per grade in FCPS that have IQs > 175.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's important for you to realize there is nothing unique or remarkable about what you're describing and when she applies to college she will be competing against similarly gifted students for slots.

You are wrong. A kid who figures out how to read by age 3 is exceptional. Assuming (a) kid basically taught herself and (b) parent is accurate about kid being able to read (vs recite text from memory and recognize a few words). This is consistent with a subsequent identification as PG.

I taught myself to read at 3. I am not PG. I'm smart and a quick processor but not even close to PG.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's important for you to realize there is nothing unique or remarkable about what you're describing and when she applies to college she will be competing against similarly gifted students for slots.

You are wrong. A kid who figures out how to read by age 3 is exceptional. Assuming (a) kid basically taught herself and (b) parent is accurate about kid being able to read (vs recite text from memory and recognize a few words). This is consistent with a subsequent identification as PG.

I think the person you're quoting here is right. I have a 130s IQ and went to Ivy League college. I guess the PG kids had to slum it with the rest of us there but there were not really people there who seemed like they were so much smarter than the rest of us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No there aren’t 200 kids per grade in FCPS that have IQs > 175.

Wow that would be the highest recorded IQ

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's important for you to realize there is nothing unique or remarkable about what you're describing and when she applies to college she will be competing against similarly gifted students for slots.

You are wrong. A kid who figures out how to read by age 3 is exceptional. Assuming (a) kid basically taught herself and (b) parent is accurate about kid being able to read (vs recite text from memory and recognize a few words). This is consistent with a subsequent identification as PG.

I think the person you're quoting here is right. I have a 130s IQ and went to Ivy League college. I guess the PG kids had to slum it with the rest of us there but there were not really people there who seemed like they were so much smarter than the rest of us.

For a variety of reasons, you wouldn’t know. And, yes, of course PG kids go to college with kids who aren’t PG. No reason to consider that “slumming.” It’s never a situation where you can only learn with or from people who have an IQ that is as high or higher than your own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No there aren’t 200 kids per grade in FCPS that have IQs > 175.

Made a mistake -- moved the decimal point. Probably 20 not 200.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No there aren’t 200 kids per grade in FCPS that have IQs > 175.

Wow that would be the highest recorded IQ

No, by definition, someone who has been tested to be "profoundly gifted" has an IQ of 175+.

I think a lot of people who are commenting here think using that term is just hyperbole but it has a very specific meaning. PG people are in the top 99.9th percentiles of those tested. It is indeed unique and very rare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No there aren’t 200 kids per grade in FCPS that have IQs > 175.

Wow that would be the highest recorded IQ

The thing is many tests saturate at the highest scores. #s are probably meaningless above about 150. if you use 99.9 as the basis, and use a scale with a 15 point standard deviation, by definition, you are just over three standard deviations above the mean. Or, just over 145.

175 is 5 standard deviations, or 330,000,000/ 1744278= 190 people in the US. But, you can't measure it as the tests can't scale that high.

Instead, you can look at lifetime results and the problems they can solve.

Really, anything about 140 is hard to measure. One question can mean 10 points; one extra second in a section can impact it.

The difference between scoring 160 and 140 can a distracting itch. (the key thing is scoring/measuring).

Years ago (around 1990), I was part of a study that looked at intelligence compared with different actions. My baseline is about 155. No sleep and it dropped to 130. Drunk and it dropped to 110...etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's important for you to realize there is nothing unique or remarkable about what you're describing and when she applies to college she will be competing against similarly gifted students for slots.

You are wrong. A kid who figures out how to read by age 3 is exceptional. Assuming (a) kid basically taught herself and (b) parent is accurate about kid being able to read (vs recite text from memory and recognize a few words). This is consistent with a subsequent identification as PG.

I taught myself to read at 3. I am not PG. I'm smart and a quick processor but not even close to PG.

.

Yes, that happens. (Although, FWIW, “at 3” isn’t the same as “by 3”). Early reading isn’t determinative of extreme giftedness, but it’s a marker of one variety of it. So the PG classification later (based on other means of evaluation) is plausible. That’s why I said “is consistent with” and (part of the reason) why I’m willing to take seriously OP’s claim that she’s raising a PG kid and give advice based on that assumption. YMMV.

The “your DC ain’t all that” kind of response just strikes me as pointless and nasty. I do agree with advice about treating all DCs with equal love and concern and as whole people with different strengths and challenges, about not counting on merit aid for college, and about the importance of persistence/resilience. But that’s good advice that doesn’t depend on a kid’s IQ.