Is this problem too hard for a second grader?

[Anonymous]

Fortunately only your children will have to suffer for it, not mine.

I'm not the poster who used vulgar language, but I am the poster who said I would not accept that behavior from my child. He seems well adjusted and happy and is doing well at school. So I don't think he's suffering. Our style of parenting is authoritative, not authoritarian, and it works very well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is the stupid new way they teach math now.

They should be memorizing the facts first the way math has always been taught.

I am sorry. Where's the proof in American education and worldwide standings, and our overall success in math, that shows that the old way actually worked?

I could do math in my head by 2nd grade, which is preferable to drawing 100 pieces of candy, etc. So,I think the old math was pretty damn good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Fortunately only your children will have to suffer for it, not mine.

I'm not the poster who used vulgar language, but I am the poster who said I would not accept that behavior from my child. He seems well adjusted and happy and is doing well at school. So I don't think he's suffering. Our style of parenting is authoritative, not authoritarian, and it works very well.

If you can conclude from what I described of my approach that my style is not authoritative, you don't understand what authoritative parenting is because there is nothing in my description that conflicts with authoritative parenting.

[Anonymous]

Fortunately only your children will have to suffer for it, not mine.

I'm not the poster who used vulgar language, but I am the poster who said I would not accept that behavior from my child. He seems well adjusted and happy and is doing well at school. So I don't think he's suffering. Our style of parenting is authoritative, not authoritarian, and it works very well.

If you can conclude from what I described of my approach that my style is not authoritative, you don't understand what authoritative parenting is because there is nothing in my description that conflicts with authoritative parenting.

You're looking to create an argument, and I'm not going to waste my time having it with you, so you'll need to search for it elsewhere. Best of luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, and I still have no answer. I thought the problem type itself was OK, but not with such a high number. Are other parents seeing their kids working with this type of problem with such a high number?

Yes, teach your daughter to use o or xs or a line instead of tediously drawing the exact thing. It does not take that long that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It works for some kids, and is an abysmal failure for many others, who need the concrete before the abstract.

That is the entire point. They now utilize TONS of manipulatives in most of the math curricula, all the way through 6th grade. Hopefully this child had some discs or unit/tens blocks on hand to work out this problem concretely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, and I still have no answer. I thought the problem type itself was OK, but not with such a high number. Are other parents seeing their kids working with this type of problem with such a high number?

Yes, this seems perfectly appropriate for a 2nd grader. In my child's school, the students would be able to use tens blocks or just draw a big rectangle to represent tens. Then it wouldn't be so labor intensive.

[Anonymous]

I have a daughter in first grade and they had problems like that in a workbook she was doing this past summer.

[Anonymous]

Are most second graders really not doing division or multiplication? Mine does long division, long multiplication and fractions (equivalent and addition). Is this unusual?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait until she has to write a paragraph about how she solved the problem. That started sometime in 2nd grade. That killed math for my DS. He hates writing so now he hates math. Thanks CC!

Yep, thanks for that too, fcps. If the tedious word problem weren't enough, the paragraph about it after was the nail in my son's coffin. Now hates ALL subjects. That's apparently what a world class school system looks like. I guess we're' just not world class people.

+2
Oh boy, add me to this list. He solved it in his head. Now he gets I for incomplete on his math work and was crying over this last night. F common core!

I would even be okay with the paragraph if it was included in his WRITING grade. But he would get 100% of the math questions right and still gets Cs on math tests due to the writing.

No, they need to be able to explain it verbally when they get to the real world and it is better to start young so it becomes second nature. My DH is a aerospace engineer and his biggest complaint with staff is that they can't explain how they are solving the problem. When they meet with customers and the gov't they have to have an understandable answer when they are asked "why are you recommending this approach." Stating "I just know" will get you laughed out of the room.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's good that the kids are given thoughtful word problems.

Except I happen to know that they're not being explained adequately in class... there is a wide chasm between the dumbed down worksheets and these word problems, and somehow the kids are expected to go from one to the other effortlessly.

Another example of poor math teaching.

Yes!!!

Elementary school teachers usually make the WORST math teachers. It is so sad the way it works in this country. Think about your average elementary school teacher: white suburban chick who avoided math in college and went into teaching because she "loves" kids. Most of them majored in a soft social science like psychology. And now we're entrusting her to foster the basic building blocks of math education which you need to be successful in so many fields from finance to engineering? It's really terrible.

I hope you enjoy homeschooling your child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. Standard second grade curriculum.

It's early in the year. They're working on the concepts. It's about understanding what "division" means in real life. So it's more than just a mechanical function. The goal is for kids to experience division -- not just learn the rote rules.

More generally, it's ok that homework is hard sometimes. As a parent, our job is to teach our kids that it's ok to struggle with learning. It's ok to be confused. It's ok to have to think about things in different ways and keep coming back to it until we figure out how to do it. It doesn't mean we're dumb or that the work is too hard. Sometimes learning comes easily and sometimes it take more time. Both are ok. It's how we grow.

I'd worry less about whether she got the "right" answer and focus on encouraging her CURIOUSITY, her PERSISTENCE (not give up when things get hard) and her RESILIENCE (not letting it upset or get to her when things are difficult.) That's learning. Sometimes it's easy and sometimes it's hard. Either way, her brain is GROWING and getting STRONGER, and that's awesome.

Maybe think of an example in your own life when it took you awhile to learn something. Where you had to put in a lot of time and effort before something clicked for you. For me, it was weekly spelling words (never came easy) and later in law school (certain classes took months to click before they came together for me). But you're proud that you STUCK WITH IT and DIDN'T GIVE UP. That effort and mindset made you even smarter!!!

Wonderful response! Thanks, PP.

Concepts are harder than methods. They take longer to sink in, but once you've gotten it, the method flows. Offering her other word problems with smaller numbers would be good practice. Locking in the concept right now is key. She can memorize tables later, if you think that would make it easier for her down the road.

I agree with almost everything in the PP's response. Yet, division is not a second grade math standard and is not standard second grade curriculum if the district is using the Common Core Standards. What math standards has your district adopted?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It works for some kids, and is an abysmal failure for many others, who need the concrete before the abstract.

So you would claim that 25 x 5 = 100, or 5 + 5 = 10 is more "concrete" than distributing 100 pieces of candy to 25 people (or drawing a picture of doing so)?

The whole point of 5 + 5 = 10 is that it is a symbolic (abstract) language that is shorthand for the concrete (10 actual things).

I think your issue is that you're scared of word problems. Children don't see them as word problems. They see them like stories, and the pictures help them to understand the math involved.

Hmm. It may not be too hard for 2nd graders but it's too hard for some DCUMers.

Seriously! Did no one else get that the PP wrote 25X5 = 100? I am not scared of my kid doing word problems, I am scared of my kid being given poorly written math word problems. The first example of 100 candies, everyone wants 5, and there are 25 people is a poorly written question. You have to establish that the candy has to be shared equally or it isn't a division problem. The poorly written math curriculum that comes home is a joke. I have to buy Singapore math books (from Marshall Cavendish publishers) so my kids will really learn math as well as kids in other parts of the world.

If everyone wants 5, and there are 25 kids but only 100 pieces of candy, nobody's getting any candy, because I'm not listening to 25 kids bitching that they only got 4 pieces.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. Standard second grade curriculum.

It's early in the year. They're working on the concepts. It's about understanding what "division" means in real life. So it's more than just a mechanical function. The goal is for kids to experience division -- not just learn the rote rules.

More generally, it's ok that homework is hard sometimes. As a parent, our job is to teach our kids that it's ok to struggle with learning. It's ok to be confused. It's ok to have to think about things in different ways and keep coming back to it until we figure out how to do it. It doesn't mean we're dumb or that the work is too hard. Sometimes learning comes easily and sometimes it take more time. Both are ok. It's how we grow.

I'd worry less about whether she got the "right" answer and focus on encouraging her CURIOUSITY, her PERSISTENCE (not give up when things get hard) and her RESILIENCE (not letting it upset or get to her when things are difficult.) That's learning. Sometimes it's easy and sometimes it's hard. Either way, her brain is GROWING and getting STRONGER, and that's awesome.

Maybe think of an example in your own life when it took you awhile to learn something. Where you had to put in a lot of time and effort before something clicked for you. For me, it was weekly spelling words (never came easy) and later in law school (certain classes took months to click before they came together for me). But you're proud that you STUCK WITH IT and DIDN'T GIVE UP. That effort and mindset made you even smarter!!!

I love this answer. I hope you are a teacher.

Dear sweet merciful gods, you sound like a Tupperware cheerleader at at sales meeting. Enough with the caps, already.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are most second graders really not doing division or multiplication? Mine does long division, long multiplication and fractions (equivalent and addition). Is this unusual?

Which county?