What should Israel do with Gaza?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Do you honestly believe that Hamas would stop aggression against Israel - rockets and tunnels - if Israel dropped the blockade? On what basis other than hope?

This sentence presupposes that Hamas cannot abide by an agreement, or that they are some sort of irrational actor. What is *your* basis for that?

1. Having a charter that lists the destruction of Israel and the murder of Jews as their primary goal.
2. Starting a war that they cannot win and knowingly puts their own civilians in danger
3. The fact that Hamas continued to shoot rockets and dig tunnels after the last 2 ceasefires.

How is this NOT obvious to others?!?! I sincerely don't understand how there are people out there who think Hamas will stop their aggression!!!

Yeah, they just started a war out of nowhere. Just because, they just started firing missiles.

In Haaretz: http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.606791

The short answer is that I’d treat the rockets as military symptoms of a political problem. That doesn’t mean Israel shouldn’t return fire. If Hamas and Islamic Jihad can attack Israel with impunity, they may never stop. But returning fire—or even invading Gaza—will never make Israel safe. Israel can destroy Hamas’ rockets, but Hamas will eventually rebuild them bigger and better, as it did after the last war, and the one before that

So what is this political problem?

Since 2010, Israel has made it easier for goods to enter Gaza. But it still makes it extremely difficult for goods to leave. According to the Israeli human rights group Gisha, only two percent as many truckloads leave the Strip as did in 2007. If Israel wants to check those trucks to ensure they’re not carrying weapons, fine. (Last December, the Netherlands tried to donate a high-tech scanner for exactly that purpose).

But essentially barring Gazan exports to Israel and the West Bank — historically Gaza’s biggest markets — is both inhumane and stupid. It’s helped destroy the independent business class that could have been a check on Hamas’ power, and left many in Gaza with the choice of working for Hamas or receiving food aid.

In addition to goods, Israel should make it easier for people to leave Gaza, too. A quarter of Gazans have family in the West Bank. Yet even before this war, Israel allowed Gazans to travel to the West Bank only in “exceptional humanitarian cases.” Yes, Israel can restrict the travel of terrorists. But preventing young Gazans from studying in the West Bank - like preventing Gazan businessmen from exporting there - is self-defeating and inhumane. It feeds the isolation and despair that Hamas exploits.

What about recognition?

Israel wants Hamas barred from any Palestinian unity government, and any Palestinian election, until it accepts the two-state solution and past peace agreements. But as I’ve suggested before, the current Israeli government probably couldn’t meet those conditions....What’s crucial is not that Hamas as a party endorse the two-state solution. After all, Likud as a party has not endorsed the two state-solution, either. What’s crucial is that Hamas promise to respect a two-state agreement if endorsed by the Palestinian people in a referendum. In the past, Hamas leaders have told the media they would.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Israel should go back to the 68 border or a one state solution. Time is running out for Israel.

Sorry bud... Israel is here to stay. Time is running out for Hamas, though. They are going DOWN! The Palestinians will be much better off for it, too.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel should respond to every rocket attack with a devastating artillery barrage. Keep killing the Palestinians until they quit or are all dead.

That is the current strategy. How's it working?

Israel is targeting terrorists, not the general Palestinian population.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel should go back to the 68 border or a one state solution. Time is running out for Israel.

Sorry bud... Israel is here to stay. Time is running out for Hamas, though. They are going DOWN! The Palestinians will be much better off for it, too.

Please .......... this has been the goal for years and Israel has not succeeded. What makes you think that it will make any difference this go around?

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel should respond to every rocket attack with a devastating artillery barrage. Keep killing the Palestinians until they quit or are all dead.

That is the current strategy. How's it working?

Israel is targeting terrorists, not the general Palestinian population.

In that case, Israel has really bad aim. Israel has killed more Palestinian children than fighters.

[Anonymous]

The UN plans to investigate Israel for war crimes. The US was the only country to vote against such an inquiry, so we get tarred again by association with Israel's misconduct, but the global BDS movement against Israel will only gain further momentum. The posts suggesting that Israel is succeeding at anything here other than killing people is quite misguided.

[Anonymous]

Hamas just refused a ceasefire uses Israel disarms. As this is clearly an unrealistic demand, what choice does Israel have now?

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel should respond to every rocket attack with a devastating artillery barrage. Keep killing the Palestinians until they quit or are all dead.

That is the current strategy. How's it working?

Israel is targeting terrorists, not the general Palestinian population.

In that case, Israel has really bad aim. Israel has killed more Palestinian children than fighters.

That is not true. According to al Jazeera, 82% of those killed were men with 66% being between 18-38 and a large portion bring older than 38.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel should respond to every rocket attack with a devastating artillery barrage. Keep killing the Palestinians until they quit or are all dead.

That is the current strategy. How's it working?

Israel is targeting terrorists, not the general Palestinian population.

In that case, Israel has really bad aim. Israel has killed more Palestinian children than fighters.

That is not true. According to al Jazeera, 82% of those killed were men with 66% being between 18-38 and a large portion bring older than 38.

I don't know where al-Jazeera is getting it's numbers or if you quoted al-Jazeera correctly, but the Washington Post has an interactive graphic here using UN figures:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/world/gaza-counter/

It shows 87 armed Palestinians killed and 144 children killed (out of 443 Palestinian civilians).

Edit: Here is a second report, but I think based on the same UN report, that shows similar figures:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/palestinianauthority/10984259/Revealed-the-Palestinian-children-killed-by-Israeli-forces.html

This one has the name and age of each child killed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Israel should go back to the 68 border or a one state solution. Time is running out for Israel.


Sorry bud... Israel is here to stay. Time is running out for Hamas, though. They are going DOWN! The Palestinians will be much better off for it, too.

LOL You all say that every time and each time your military is surprised by the sophistication of the resistance. Hamas rockets reach all of Israel and shut down the airport. They have drones now. Just a matter of time before the tech gets the best of Israel. Next time the drones and rockets will be able to independently acquire targets. One really has to question the competency of the leadership in Israel.

[Anonymous]

[jsteele]

Kids being killed is hilarious. I can't think of anything more funny than that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Saw it on my facebook

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Saw it on my facebook

Nothing funny about it. It's sad and tragic how Hamas uses the children of Gaza as its victims.

[Anonymous]

I can't keep up with all of these threads, but one of the main themes, has been Hamas really isn't that sophisticated. Just a few tunnels....If only Israel allowed gaza the building materials they need. I actually remember arguing with Jeff about this last time. He didn't understand why Israel would not want concrete to come through. Well look what happens.

http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/#!/content/1.2716251