TJ Seniors - not allowed to walk at graduation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s silly to spring on these kids that they can’t walk at the last minute.

However, it’s deeply troubling that these kids can’t pass calculus. And shocking that they are taking Calc in 12th grade at TJ. The admissions changes really impacted the school that my kids graduated from just a few years ago.

Mukai is fixing it as best he can by enforcing the GPA requirement and sending a lot of kids back to their schools after freshman year and recruiting large froshmore classes.

That's not likely to go well. I can't imagine a sophomore being flung into the rigor of TJ.

Besides the fact that the actual issue at TJ is rampant cheating. That's the only way to succeed in classes like math where teachers have openly told me they don't teach the class material. Kids are expected to teach themselves and each other.

And yet the Froshmores are doing better on average than the rest of the class. By a noticeable margin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s silly to spring on these kids that they can’t walk at the last minute.

However, it’s deeply troubling that these kids can’t pass calculus. And shocking that they are taking Calc in 12th grade at TJ. The admissions changes really impacted the school that my kids graduated from just a few years ago.

Mukai is fixing it as best he can by enforcing the GPA requirement and sending a lot of kids back to their schools after freshman year and recruiting large froshmore classes.

That's not likely to go well. I can't imagine a sophomore being flung into the rigor of TJ.

Besides the fact that the actual issue at TJ is rampant cheating. That's the only way to succeed in classes like math where teachers have openly told me they don't teach the class material. Kids are expected to teach themselves and each other.

And yet the Froshmores are doing better on average than the rest of the class. By a noticeable margin.

Are these numbers available on a public site?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Adding an important point here.The Math professor Dr J who takes these classes is notorious for her extremely harsh grading not only in TJ but in college campuses as well. many straight A students with excellent GPAs had theirgrades dip to D and Fail due to her. TJ administration has been receving complaints about her since years, and yet have done nothing about the same. Our DD graduated last year and there were so many students who had straight As in other subjects but were sitting at D and Fail grades in her class - the other Math professor Dr Osborne was much better and relatively more lenient in his grading

Dr Osbourne is not an easy grader. But he is a pretty excellent teacher.
I have heard from kids graduating from places like MIT ands CMU say that Dr. Osbourne might be the best math teacher they have had in their life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s silly to spring on these kids that they can’t walk at the last minute.

However, it’s deeply troubling that these kids can’t pass calculus. And shocking that they are taking Calc in 12th grade at TJ. The admissions changes really impacted the school that my kids graduated from just a few years ago.

Mukai is fixing it as best he can by enforcing the GPA requirement and sending a lot of kids back to their schools after freshman year and recruiting large froshmore classes.

That's not likely to go well. I can't imagine a sophomore being flung into the rigor of TJ.

Besides the fact that the actual issue at TJ is rampant cheating. That's the only way to succeed in classes like math where teachers have openly told me they don't teach the class material. Kids are expected to teach themselves and each other.

There are PLENTY of students that are qualified for froshmore. They should indeed shunt the students who can't hack it out of TJ early. Calc in 12th grade is a failure to place appropriately much earlier in elementary/middle - sometimes out of district. TJ should have more summer options to deal with that. My TJ freshman would love to kill off precalc in the summer.

Anyways, hopefully in the future they won't have any students that don't qualify for the TJ diploma. I have one that's a junior at base and will be a national merit finalist but only getting a regular diploma, didn't want to do the Fine Arts or Career and Technical Ed requirement. AP CS Principles, AP CS A, and the 2 dual enrolled CS classes do not count for this. Silly but obviously not the same thing.

[Anonymous]

I don’t understand - what is a failing grade? And do you get ‘credit’ on your transcript for it? The way I heard it described, these kids failed one out of four math courses. They still have the credits for a FCPS diploma not a TJ Diploma.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are different requirements for students to graduate with a "TJ" diploma compared to a regular high school diploma. Mukai initially told students that in order for seniors to walk at graduation, they must have a "TJ" diploma.

What is the point? Letter sent, appeal made, appeal granted? Why not just allow them to walk with no letter since it will be allowed anyway?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Adding an important point here.The Math professor Dr J who takes these classes is notorious for her extremely harsh grading not only in TJ but in college campuses as well. many straight A students with excellent GPAs had theirgrades dip to D and Fail due to her. TJ administration has been receving complaints about her since years, and yet have done nothing about the same. Our DD graduated last year and there were so many students who had straight As in other subjects but were sitting at D and Fail grades in her class - the other Math professor Dr Osborne was much better and relatively more lenient in his grading

Dr Osbourne is not an easy grader. But he is a pretty excellent teacher.
I have heard from kids graduating from places like MIT ands CMU say that Dr. Osbourne might be the best math teacher they have had in their life.

Dr. Osbourne is an excellent and the best math teacher my kid has ever had. But he's not an easy grader. My TJ kid got A- in Dr. O's math classes. But attended a top college (Stanford/Harvard/MIT/Princeton/Caltech) as a math major and credits Dr. Osbourne for their math success in college. I remember them saying that their freshman math class at college was easier than Dr. Osborne's tests.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are different requirements for students to graduate with a "TJ" diploma compared to a regular high school diploma. Mukai initially told students that in order for seniors to walk at graduation, they must have a "TJ" diploma.

What is the point? Letter sent, appeal made, appeal granted? Why not just allow them to walk with no letter since it will be allowed anyway?

Because for all the complaints about the student dumbing down, the admin are dumber.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a TJ parent and super pissed...the math department at TJ is the worst. It's eell known that you can be getting a C or even D in math and a 5 on the AP exam.

This was totally the wrong call.

You can get a 5 on the AP exam at your neighborhood school. You don't need to go to TJ for that

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:My understanding is you still walk with your class, but diploma will be pending until passing required classes even at the University.

Approved to walk is the right call. The young people did not try to fail a class, they will have to deal with it this summer but not walking with the class would be unnecessary torture, what would be the point, to single them out?

They had chances to improve the grade and didn't. So, they kind of did try to fail if they weren't doing what they needed to do to pass.

I think you've replied several times with this ridiculous claim. Just stop. You can't do everything you want either. You too, have tried and failed in your life. It's better for these kids to shoot higher and fail one class, than not try at all.

If they meet FCPS requirements, they should be allowed to walk.

You're as dumb as these kids. “A lot of these students have had opportunities [to improve their grade]. For most of them, the grade isn’t a surprise.

The extra requirement to walk at the ceremony is a surprise and was dropped on the students with little notice. Not surprised since Mukai is a terrible communicator and constantly moves the goalposts on students and staff.

They didn't meet the graduation requirements and thought nothing was going to happen? Welcome to the real world, kiddos.

Are you really this dense? They met the FCPS requirement and did not know about the extra requirement until the last minute.

Maybe just read it again because you didn't understand the first time.

Clearly you didn't actually read the article.

No, that would be you. Because this is much ado about nothing. They got a letter that said they couldn't "automatically" walk unless they appealed which they all did and it was settled. Whoopdy doo.

Yes, they got the letter at the last minute instead of the requirement being communicated at the beginning of the year.

So? What difference does it make? More time to craft an appeal?

You don't think TJ should be transparent about graduation requirements from the beginning? Even the counselors were caught off guard by the letters and requirement.

What requirement are you talking about?

Did you even read the article?

Yes. the requirements haven't changed. So what are you talking about?

This has already been repeatedly discussed. The specific TJ requirement to walk is new and was sent to students with only a few days notice.

All it asked them to do was file an exemption. And they did. They knew they didn't meet the requirements for the TJ degree but assumed they could walk anyway. This isn't about graduation requirements it's just about participating in the ceremony.

High schools can only grant diplomas, not degrees. Colleges and universities grant degrees.

Colleges and universities grant diplomas not degrees. The word degree refers to level of the diploma. When your skin catches fire you can get a third-degree burn not a third degree.

[Anonymous]

https://go.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/files/DL7R2Y6BF266/$file/R3355.pdf

"Exemption from the TJHSST Diploma Requirement
An enrolled student in the senior year may be granted an exemption, under exceptional circumstances, by the director of student services and the principal, from
meeting the requirements for graduation from TJHSST if the student meets local and state requirements for graduation. A student who is granted an exemption from the TJHSST diploma may receive a generic diploma from FCPS and may participate in
the TJHSST graduation ceremony."

The policy is underspecified and the TJ admin decided to be jerks about it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My understanding is you still walk with your class, but diploma will be pending until passing required classes even at the University.

Approved to walk is the right call. The young people did not try to fail a class, they will have to deal with it this summer but not walking with the class would be unnecessary torture, what would be the point, to single them out?

They had chances to improve the grade and didn't. So, they kind of did try to fail if they weren't doing what they needed to do to pass.

I think you've replied several times with this ridiculous claim. Just stop. You can't do everything you want either. You too, have tried and failed in your life. It's better for these kids to shoot higher and fail one class, than not try at all.

If they meet FCPS requirements, they should be allowed to walk.

You're as dumb as these kids. “A lot of these students have had opportunities [to improve their grade]. For most of them, the grade isn’t a surprise.

The extra requirement to walk at the ceremony is a surprise and was dropped on the students with little notice. Not surprised since Mukai is a terrible communicator and constantly moves the goalposts on students and staff.

They didn't meet the graduation requirements and thought nothing was going to happen? Welcome to the real world, kiddos.

Are you really this dense? They met the FCPS requirement and did not know about the extra requirement until the last minute.

Maybe just read it again because you didn't understand the first time.

Clearly you didn't actually read the article.

No, that would be you. Because this is much ado about nothing. They got a letter that said they couldn't "automatically" walk unless they appealed which they all did and it was settled. Whoopdy doo.

Yes, they got the letter at the last minute instead of the requirement being communicated at the beginning of the year.

So? What difference does it make? More time to craft an appeal?

You don't think TJ should be transparent about graduation requirements from the beginning? Even the counselors were caught off guard by the letters and requirement.

What requirement are you talking about?

Did you even read the article?

Yes. the requirements haven't changed. So what are you talking about?

This has already been repeatedly discussed. The specific TJ requirement to walk is new and was sent to students with only a few days notice.

All it asked them to do was file an exemption. And they did. They knew they didn't meet the requirements for the TJ degree but assumed they could walk anyway. This isn't about graduation requirements it's just about participating in the ceremony.

High schools can only grant diplomas, not degrees. Colleges and universities grant degrees.

Colleges and universities grant diplomas not degrees. The word degree refers to level of the diploma. When your skin catches fire you can get a third-degree burn not a third degree.

You earn a diploma from your high school and you earn a degree from your college or university. You can earn a college degree but there is no such thing as a “high school degree.” This is at least high school level knowledge.

Adults who are complaining that TJ kids aren’t smart enough should watch out for the beam in their own eye when their writing shows pretty basic errors.

[Anonymous]

They should just basically let them attend graduation announce that the following students have earned the TJ diploma call them up then say the following students have earned the advanced diploma and called them up

[Anonymous]

I think it's fine to scare future parents/students ... TJ may not let you participate in graduation if you don't fulfill TJ graduation requirements.

I would hope next year and going forward, TJ would actually not allow the student to participate in graduation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are different requirements for students to graduate with a "TJ" diploma compared to a regular high school diploma. Mukai initially told students that in order for seniors to walk at graduation, they must have a "TJ" diploma.

What is the point? Letter sent, appeal made, appeal granted? Why not just allow them to walk with no letter since it will be allowed anyway?

Because for all the complaints about the student dumbing down, the admin are dumber.

Thank you!