Poverty level is $140,000 for a family. Really.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

I lived in "secret poverty" growing up. My dad was in an out of work and my mom did part time stuff. They didnt own a home so we moved a few times so they could find better rent. We weren't starving by any means but we had a strict budget and by the end of the week there was usually only bread and peanut butter left. Me and my siblings never got money for yearbooks or book fair or extras. We didnt go to the movies or the mall or anywhere that had an entrance fee. We did sometimes play sports so i guess they budgeted that in or got a deal or something. We spent a lot of time at parks and playgrounds. We wore hand me downs. I never had a car. We went camping or to visit grandparents for vacation. We did not go to the doctor or dentist.

I was fed and cared for and life was mostly fine. I was smart and had friends. I played outside and went to the library on weekends.

But in retrospect we were really poor and i missed out on a lot. I dont know their actual income but it wasn't enough to happily raise a family. Im thinking this $140K number is kind of similar to that for today. I am so glad I can raise my kids differently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

I lived in "secret poverty" growing up. My dad was in an out of work and my mom did part time stuff. They didnt own a home so we moved a few times so they could find better rent. We weren't starving by any means but we had a strict budget and by the end of the week there was usually only bread and peanut butter left. Me and my siblings never got money for yearbooks or book fair or extras. We didnt go to the movies or the mall or anywhere that had an entrance fee. We did sometimes play sports so i guess they budgeted that in or got a deal or something. We spent a lot of time at parks and playgrounds. We wore hand me downs. I never had a car. We went camping or to visit grandparents for vacation. We did not go to the doctor or dentist.

I was fed and cared for and life was mostly fine. I was smart and had friends. I played outside and went to the library on weekends.

But in retrospect we were really poor and i missed out on a lot. I dont know their actual income but it wasn't enough to happily raise a family. Im thinking this $140K number is kind of similar to that for today. I am so glad I can raise my kids differently.

Very sweet post. Thank you for sharing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

I lived in "secret poverty" growing up. My dad was in an out of work and my mom did part time stuff. They didnt own a home so we moved a few times so they could find better rent. We weren't starving by any means but we had a strict budget and by the end of the week there was usually only bread and peanut butter left. Me and my siblings never got money for yearbooks or book fair or extras. We didnt go to the movies or the mall or anywhere that had an entrance fee. We did sometimes play sports so i guess they budgeted that in or got a deal or something. We spent a lot of time at parks and playgrounds. We wore hand me downs. I never had a car. We went camping or to visit grandparents for vacation. We did not go to the doctor or dentist.

I was fed and cared for and life was mostly fine. I was smart and had friends. I played outside and went to the library on weekends.

But in retrospect we were really poor and i missed out on a lot. I dont know their actual income but it wasn't enough to happily raise a family. Im thinking this $140K number is kind of similar to that for today. I am so glad I can raise my kids differently.

I think the point of redefining the poverty line from the 1965 measurement (3x cost of food) is to make sure families like yours pay less in taxes, qualify for free or reduced school lunches, get subsidized health care, and can get food stamps so their kids can eat real food with nutrients instead of peanut butter and bread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

I lived in "secret poverty" growing up. My dad was in an out of work and my mom did part time stuff. They didnt own a home so we moved a few times so they could find better rent. We weren't starving by any means but we had a strict budget and by the end of the week there was usually only bread and peanut butter left. Me and my siblings never got money for yearbooks or book fair or extras. We didnt go to the movies or the mall or anywhere that had an entrance fee. We did sometimes play sports so i guess they budgeted that in or got a deal or something. We spent a lot of time at parks and playgrounds. We wore hand me downs. I never had a car. We went camping or to visit grandparents for vacation. We did not go to the doctor or dentist.

I was fed and cared for and life was mostly fine. I was smart and had friends. I played outside and went to the library on weekends.

But in retrospect we were really poor and i missed out on a lot. I dont know their actual income but it wasn't enough to happily raise a family. Im thinking this $140K number is kind of similar to that for today. I am so glad I can raise my kids differently.

I think the point of redefining the poverty line from the 1965 measurement (3x cost of food) is to make sure families like yours pay less in taxes, qualify for free or reduced school lunches, get subsidized health care, and can get food stamps so their kids can eat real food with nutrients instead of peanut butter and bread.

This is PP and that would have been a huge benefit for my family. I don't think there were services available because from the outside we weren't noticeably harmed by lack of money, like we weren't dirty or malnourished and we did mosty normal things and our public school was great at providing enrichments and what not. I do remember having to ask the school to pay for some stuff, like field trips, which they did and didnt make it a big deal. But I wish my parents could have had more to give the family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

I lived in "secret poverty" growing up. My dad was in an out of work and my mom did part time stuff. They didnt own a home so we moved a few times so they could find better rent. We weren't starving by any means but we had a strict budget and by the end of the week there was usually only bread and peanut butter left. Me and my siblings never got money for yearbooks or book fair or extras. We didnt go to the movies or the mall or anywhere that had an entrance fee. We did sometimes play sports so i guess they budgeted that in or got a deal or something. We spent a lot of time at parks and playgrounds. We wore hand me downs. I never had a car. We went camping or to visit grandparents for vacation. We did not go to the doctor or dentist.

I was fed and cared for and life was mostly fine. I was smart and had friends. I played outside and went to the library on weekends.

But in retrospect we were really poor and i missed out on a lot. I dont know their actual income but it wasn't enough to happily raise a family. Im thinking this $140K number is kind of similar to that for today. I am so glad I can raise my kids differently.

Very sweet post. Thank you for sharing.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you read the article, he's gotten criticism for starting with a poverty measure and modifying it into the minimum income to be middle class. That makes more sense as an HHI below $140k is going to seriously impact budgeting expenses in the DC area, but it's pretty ludicrous to imply that you'll struggle to meet basic needs like food or clothing at this level. It does make sense as a threshold for getting some type of housing assistance as becoming a homeowner at this income in DC is going to be close to impossible.

This is why no one reads WaPo anymore. What a shame. It was once a great, reliable paper

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

I don't know, but during an initial meeting with a child therapist recently the therapist asked me why I wasn't putting my child in summer camp, as if that was the completely normal thing to do. She then went on to say that maybe I was getting in the way of my child's social development by not sending them to camp. I'm a SAHP. I plan activities with other kids and my kids during the summer. We'll obviously be finding someone else to work with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

Child care in the summer is always expensive. Even child care in the school year is expensive. A basic program in MoCo is $5k per child for the school year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

Child care in the summer is always expensive. Even child care in the school year is expensive. A basic program in MoCo is $5k per child for the school year.

the proposed budget includes 32k for childcare. that leaves 22k for the summer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

Child care in the summer is always expensive. Even child care in the school year is expensive. A basic program in MoCo is $5k per child for the school year.

the proposed budget includes 32k for childcare. that leaves 22k for the summer.

My youngest is 10 but we paid $2500 per month for infant care. It went down closer to $1000 for preschool age. But if you've got 2 kids in the baby stages its more than $32K annual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

Summer camp is 100% a necessity when both parents work outside the house. What else would you do with the kids during the summer if you are at the office?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:140K can be rich in DC depending on your situation.

For example my kid lives in a rent controlled apt in Adam Morgan.

The women who is on site manager has two kids and is married. She does the apt showings, makes sure work is done by porter and staff. But the building is old and runs like clockwork so not really a full time job. Just has to be around for stuff like when an apt is is free to be shown and check work is actually done.

She does it for free and in return she gets a free two bedroom apartment, utilities and parking included. Kids school is up the block she walks them to and from school.

If her husband made 140K she be in my opinion rich.

A dual income couple both in the office with childcare and a mortgage at 140K would be poor.

That is exactly his point. In his article, he says the poverty line for a dual-income couple with 2 kids who need childcare and a mortgage. This is pasted from his article:

"Using conservative, national-average data:

Childcare: $32,773
Housing: $23,267
Food: $14,717
Transportation: $14,828
Healthcare: $10,567
Other essentials: $21,857
Required net income: $118,009

Add federal, state, and FICA taxes of roughly $18,500, and you arrive at a required gross income of $136,500."

That’s not poverty. That’s living an honest life with two cars and an apartment with healthcare and food. Trips to Va wine country and Major cities are cheap ways to have ‘vacations’ like camping. Amazing that poverty is now considered having all those things.

100%. This thread was shocking to read. Since when is summer camp or expensive kid activities an essential? People look at how the UMC lives and assumes that means the MC gets those things too and if not, that means they’re poverty level.

Summer camp is 100% a necessity when both parents work outside the house. What else would you do with the kids during the summer if you are at the office?

That’s a great question, have you ever looked into it yourself? Or did you assume because everyone else does it, it’s a necessity? There’s options that aren’t summer camp and aren’t prohibitively expensive.

The problem with this area is we’ve got a lot of $$ floating around which skews what the working class and middle class view as normal. Summer camp for the entire summer has ALWAYS been an UMC and wealthy luxury.

The normal MC kids get maybe a week here or there and that’s it. The rest of the summer is a patchwork of time with grandparents (if they’re around / involved), spending time on their own if old enough, daycare, or paying a local family with a SAHP to watch your kids too.

[Anonymous]

Summer camp and daycare are the same thing. They’re both expensive. Lots of people don’t have family to help out. So the choices are- camp, daycare, babysitter/nanny, home alone (if they are old enough), parents alternative weeks off (for a small part of the summer).

[Anonymous]

Trump's economy $140,000 will be bread lines.....

[Anonymous]

I don’t get the backlash to this article. Supporting a family of four on $140k is nearly impossible