JD Vance attacking the Catholic church

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

[Anonymous]

Now Vance is mocking Rory Stewart for saying that the gospels call for universal love for your fellow people, not selective love for people who live closer to you.

https://www.thetimes.com/us/american-politics/article/rory-stewart-jd-vance-podcast-fn2lw6hfj

Vance (weird offpoint) cite to Augustine seems to confirm the convert point above though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Yes and Opus Dei

Today's version of the John Birch Society.

Have you ever met a member of Opus Dei? Attended one of their liturgies or events? Consulted one of their priests? Read any of their publications?

You genuinely don’t know what you’re talking about.

Not PP: But yes I have, and they are cuckoo.

Pejorative epithets may be the safe harbor of the intellectually deficient, but they hardly explain the purported defects in the beliefs and practices of Opus Dei adherents.

Dude, I am a graduate of one of the top SLACs in this country and have two advanced degrees from an Ivy League institution. I am more than intellectually sufficient and I call it like I see it.

Oh. So impressive. But with all that horsepower all you can manage is insults, not substance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

No, it's you who exists in a narrow circle. Stop making up some fake demand for the Latin Mass that doesn't exist broadly in the population.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Yes and Opus Dei

Today's version of the John Birch Society.

Have you ever met a member of Opus Dei? Attended one of their liturgies or events? Consulted one of their priests? Read any of their publications?

You genuinely don’t know what you’re talking about.

Not PP: But yes I have, and they are cuckoo.

Pejorative epithets may be the safe harbor of the intellectually deficient, but they hardly explain the purported defects in the beliefs and practices of Opus Dei adherents.

Dude, I am a graduate of one of the top SLACs in this country and have two advanced degrees from an Ivy League institution. I am more than intellectually sufficient and I call it like I see it.

Oh. So impressive. But with all that horsepower all you can manage is insults, not substance.

Your ad hominem trolling is tired.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

No, it's you who exists in a narrow circle. Stop making up some fake demand for the Latin Mass that doesn't exist broadly in the population.

The assertion was that no, zero, absolutely and unfailingly not a single, person of “Gen X or younger” ever regularly attends a “Latin Mass” (whether Vetus or Novus Ordo was not specified). That assertion is demonstrably false, and even cursory research will reveal many current photos of young people and young families with children happily attending Latin-language liturgies both domestically and throughout the world.

As for what “exists broadly in the population,” lots of things fit that unspecified non-definition. Liturgical rites available across the United States, throughout Europe and found even in Asia and Africa, among other places, would seem to be pretty broadly distributed.

And again, an affection for traditional elements of worship that both predate and are called for in the documents of the Second Vatican Council is hardly a political statement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugees are LEGAL immigrants.

I wonder if the converts are worse that those brought up Catholic.

My extremely republican parents are Catholic converts and yes they are worse than cradle Catholics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Yes and Opus Dei

Today's version of the John Birch Society.

Have you ever met a member of Opus Dei? Attended one of their liturgies or events? Consulted one of their priests? Read any of their publications?

You genuinely don’t know what you’re talking about.

Not PP: But yes I have, and they are cuckoo.

Pejorative epithets may be the safe harbor of the intellectually deficient, but they hardly explain the purported defects in the beliefs and practices of Opus Dei adherents.

Dude, I am a graduate of one of the top SLACs in this country and have two advanced degrees from an Ivy League institution. I am more than intellectually sufficient and I call it like I see it.

Oh. So impressive. But with all that horsepower all you can manage is insults, not substance.

Your ad hominem trolling is tired.

It wasn’t me who equated members of a worldwide, non-political, non-race-centric, religious prelature with those of a notorious xenophobic racist group. What specifically about Opus Dei and especially its diverse members allegedly merits such a comparison?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

The convert has joined the chat!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

No, it's you who exists in a narrow circle. Stop making up some fake demand for the Latin Mass that doesn't exist broadly in the population.

The assertion was that no, zero, absolutely and unfailingly not a single, person of “Gen X or younger” ever regularly attends a “Latin Mass” (whether Vetus or Novus Ordo was not specified). That assertion is demonstrably false, and even cursory research will reveal many current photos of young people and young families with children happily attending Latin-language liturgies both domestically and throughout the world.

As for what “exists broadly in the population,” lots of things fit that unspecified non-definition. Liturgical rites available across the United States, throughout Europe and found even in Asia and Africa, among other places, would seem to be pretty broadly distributed.

And again, an affection for traditional elements of worship that both predate and are called for in the documents of the Second Vatican Council is hardly a political statement.

I know you think you are clever, but you are not. You are not making an argument against my assertion. It's because of self-appointed know-it-alls like you that the Catholic Church in the US is in institutional decline. But please tell me about all the Latin masses going on in the diocese across the US when they are truly few and far between. There are more masses in Spanish in the US than there are Latin masses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

No, it's you who exists in a narrow circle. Stop making up some fake demand for the Latin Mass that doesn't exist broadly in the population.

The assertion was that no, zero, absolutely and unfailingly not a single, person of “Gen X or younger” ever regularly attends a “Latin Mass” (whether Vetus or Novus Ordo was not specified). That assertion is demonstrably false, and even cursory research will reveal many current photos of young people and young families with children happily attending Latin-language liturgies both domestically and throughout the world.

As for what “exists broadly in the population,” lots of things fit that unspecified non-definition. Liturgical rites available across the United States, throughout Europe and found even in Asia and Africa, among other places, would seem to be pretty broadly distributed.

And again, an affection for traditional elements of worship that both predate and are called for in the documents of the Second Vatican Council is hardly a political statement.

I know you think you are clever, but you are not. You are not making an argument against my assertion. It's because of self-appointed know-it-alls like you that the Catholic Church in the US is in institutional decline. But please tell me about all the Latin masses going on in the diocese across the US when they are truly few and far between. There are more masses in Spanish in the US than there are Latin masses.

Name calling is such a puerile excuse for cogent argument. Whether or not there are more Masses in Spanish than in Latin in the US is completely irrelevant to (1) whether any (or indeed many) young people regularly attend Mass in Latin; or (2) whether a preference for the authoritative liturgical language of the Roman Church is in any way a political statement.

And if any portion of the US Catholic community is in growth mode, it is the group that prefers Mass in Latin. They have lots of children, and they take them to Church. In

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

No, it's you who exists in a narrow circle. Stop making up some fake demand for the Latin Mass that doesn't exist broadly in the population.

The assertion was that no, zero, absolutely and unfailingly not a single, person of “Gen X or younger” ever regularly attends a “Latin Mass” (whether Vetus or Novus Ordo was not specified). That assertion is demonstrably false, and even cursory research will reveal many current photos of young people and young families with children happily attending Latin-language liturgies both domestically and throughout the world.

As for what “exists broadly in the population,” lots of things fit that unspecified non-definition. Liturgical rites available across the United States, throughout Europe and found even in Asia and Africa, among other places, would seem to be pretty broadly distributed.

And again, an affection for traditional elements of worship that both predate and are called for in the documents of the Second Vatican Council is hardly a political statement.

I know you think you are clever, but you are not. You are not making an argument against my assertion. It's because of self-appointed know-it-alls like you that the Catholic Church in the US is in institutional decline. But please tell me about all the Latin masses going on in the diocese across the US when they are truly few and far between. There are more masses in Spanish in the US than there are Latin masses.

Name calling is such a puerile excuse for cogent argument. Whether or not there are more Masses in Spanish than in Latin in the US is completely irrelevant to (1) whether any (or indeed many) young people regularly attend Mass in Latin; or (2) whether a preference for the authoritative liturgical language of the Roman Church is in any way a political statement.

And if any portion of the US Catholic community is in growth mode, it is the group that prefers Mass in Latin. They have lots of children, and they take them to Church. In

You are being pedantic and completely off topic.

Why don’t you tell us if you agree with JD Vance that the Catholic Church is trafficking illegal immigrants for financial benefit?

Or since you like Latin so much, tell us whether you agree with him that Ordo Amoris means we are supposed to have a hierarchy where we do not love a stranger as much as our neighbor or a neighbor as much as our family (and I guess we should love no one as much as we love ourselves).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I supposed he thinks he's more Catholic than the Pope. These right wing Catholics are SO arrogant.

Also, Refugess are LEGAL immigrants.

Oof. This gave me a ghost of Henry VIII chill. When do American Catholics break away from Rome and declare Vance head of the Catholic Church in America and ALL churches.

There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.

Latin is the normative liturgical language of the Roman (aka Latin Rite) Catholic Church. Vatican II called for priests to be “very well trained” in Latin and for the use of Latin to be preserved in the liturgy.

But the Latin Mass is really only relevant to the 80yo+ crowd. It's not a part of the tradition for any GenXer or younger.

Simply untrue. First, Latin is the normative/authoritative language not only of the Missal of Paul V (the “Vetus Ordo” or “Old Mass”), but also of the Missal of Paul V (the “Novus Ordo” or “New Mass” of Vatican II). Second, even if one is discussing the Vetus Ordo there are many people far younger than 80 who were raised in that tradition. Third, as noted, Vatican II called for Latin to be preserved, not eradicated, and the Novus Ordo is frequently celebrated in Latin, including by the Popes, when universality of language is desired. Accordingly, whether or not one prefers Latin as a liturgical language is a political irrelevancy.

It is true. No one GenX or younger was raised regularly attending a Latin Mass. NO ONE.

You obviously exist in a very narrow circle. There are churches all over the U.S. and throughout the world, packed with young people, where only the Vetus Ordo is celebrated, by priests in union with the Holy See, not to mention the worldwide presence of the SSPX, which likewise is filled with young families and their children. There also are numerous parishes and oratories that offer celebrations in Latin of the Novus Ordo, which are well and regularly attended by people of all ages.

No, it's you who exists in a narrow circle. Stop making up some fake demand for the Latin Mass that doesn't exist broadly in the population.

The assertion was that no, zero, absolutely and unfailingly not a single, person of “Gen X or younger” ever regularly attends a “Latin Mass” (whether Vetus or Novus Ordo was not specified). That assertion is demonstrably false, and even cursory research will reveal many current photos of young people and young families with children happily attending Latin-language liturgies both domestically and throughout the world.

As for what “exists broadly in the population,” lots of things fit that unspecified non-definition. Liturgical rites available across the United States, throughout Europe and found even in Asia and Africa, among other places, would seem to be pretty broadly distributed.

And again, an affection for traditional elements of worship that both predate and are called for in the documents of the Second Vatican Council is hardly a political statement.

I know you think you are clever, but you are not. You are not making an argument against my assertion. It's because of self-appointed know-it-alls like you that the Catholic Church in the US is in institutional decline. But please tell me about all the Latin masses going on in the diocese across the US when they are truly few and far between. There are more masses in Spanish in the US than there are Latin masses.

Name calling is such a puerile excuse for cogent argument. Whether or not there are more Masses in Spanish than in Latin in the US is completely irrelevant to (1) whether any (or indeed many) young people regularly attend Mass in Latin; or (2) whether a preference for the authoritative liturgical language of the Roman Church is in any way a political statement.

And if any portion of the US Catholic community is in growth mode, it is the group that prefers Mass in Latin. They have lots of children, and they take them to Church. In

You are being pedantic and completely off topic.

Why don’t you tell us if you agree with JD Vance that the Catholic Church is trafficking illegal immigrants for financial benefit?

Or since you like Latin so much, tell us whether you agree with him that Ordo Amoris means we are supposed to have a hierarchy where we do not love a stranger as much as our neighbor or a neighbor as much as our family (and I guess we should love no one as much as we love ourselves).

My post was no less topical than the following, which is what I responded to:

“There are already right wing US sects who consider themselves Catholic. Many of them say Mass in Latin.”

As for the concept of ordo amoris, I’ll defer to Aquinas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Biden is not a cafeteria Catholic. Just one who disagrees with the official Church teaching at times. Are you really saying you agree with the Church on every single issue? All of them?
Even the death penalty?

Biden is the VERY DEFINITION of a cafeteria Catholic.

Yes because he's educated and is able to think for himself and not listen to every controlling lie the church feeds its parishioners. You are the VERY definition of an idiot

You call people names, you suck.

So does your so called president that you voted for....you suck too.