Does Racism Exist for Middle-Upper/Upper Class Americans?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I are both Indian. Both times we were looking for housing here in DC (one rental, one purchase) we had weird interactions with landlords/real estate agents.

1. We went to an apartment building in a predominantly white part of north Arlington. No one greeted us at the rental office; a woman sat at her desk for five minutes. Finally, we approached her, even though we thought she was busy and would get to us after finishing paperwork, or something - benefit of the doubt. She curtly invited us to sit down and asked us how many bedrooms we wanted. We saw a model we liked on paper and asked if we could see the apartment. She told us we could not. I asked if we could come back another day to see it and she said that she would not show us the apartment at all, and we would have to put down a deposit if we wanted to rent it, sight unseen. We have friends who lived in the building - when we mentioned this to them, they told us that a clause in their lease required that their apartment be available for showings to potential renters, and they did have people check out the apartment in the months before they vacated. I had no idea why we wouldn't be suitable residents - perhaps the Indian accent?

2. We met a real estate agent at a showing in Alexandria. He showed us one house later that month, and then refused to show us any more houses until we provided to him a prequalification letter. "You say you want to spend $X on a house, but I need to be sure you can afford these houses before I show them to you." We were looking at houses in the $350k-500k range; my husband and I are both professionals with graduate degrees. We qualified for significantly more than we were looking to spend. Not a single white person I know has had a real estate agent refuse to show them homes for fear that they were lying about their ability to afford the houses.

I can't even imagine how much worse it is for black people - at least some people have an (ill-informed) opinion that all Indians are financially successful; I imagine it's much worse for black and hispanic people.

That's terrible. Could you have reported both places to a government housing authority to investigate? I hope they get what's coming to them!

Well, in situation #1, we found an apartment we loved in the same neighborhood in a "luxury" building where we were treated much better. We ended up with a beautiful apartment.

Situation #2 - the house the agent refused to show us went off the market while we looked for another realtor. The house came back on the market a two months later and we bought it through our new agent. That nice commission went to the new realtor. I kind of wanted to call the first realtor and tell him that his piggishness cost him a $20k commission, but decided to be the bigger person and keep my mouth shut!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I are both Indian. Both times we were looking for housing here in DC (one rental, one purchase) we had weird interactions with landlords/real estate agents.

1. We went to an apartment building in a predominantly white part of north Arlington. No one greeted us at the rental office; a woman sat at her desk for five minutes. Finally, we approached her, even though we thought she was busy and would get to us after finishing paperwork, or something - benefit of the doubt. She curtly invited us to sit down and asked us how many bedrooms we wanted. We saw a model we liked on paper and asked if we could see the apartment. She told us we could not. I asked if we could come back another day to see it and she said that she would not show us the apartment at all, and we would have to put down a deposit if we wanted to rent it, sight unseen. We have friends who lived in the building - when we mentioned this to them, they told us that a clause in their lease required that their apartment be available for showings to potential renters, and they did have people check out the apartment in the months before they vacated. I had no idea why we wouldn't be suitable residents - perhaps the Indian accent?

2. We met a real estate agent at a showing in Alexandria. He showed us one house later that month, and then refused to show us any more houses until we provided to him a prequalification letter. "You say you want to spend $X on a house, but I need to be sure you can afford these houses before I show them to you." We were looking at houses in the $350k-500k range; my husband and I are both professionals with graduate degrees. We qualified for significantly more than we were looking to spend. Not a single white person I know has had a real estate agent refuse to show them homes for fear that they were lying about their ability to afford the houses.

I can't even imagine how much worse it is for black people - at least some people have an (ill-informed) opinion that all Indians are financially successful; I imagine it's much worse for black and hispanic people.

That's terrible. Could you have reported both places to a government housing authority to investigate? I hope they get what's coming to them!

Well, in situation #1, we found an apartment we loved in the same neighborhood in a "luxury" building where we were treated much better. We ended up with a beautiful apartment.

Situation #2 - the house the agent refused to show us went off the market while we looked for another realtor. The house came back on the market a two months later and we bought it through our new agent. That nice commission went to the new realtor. I kind of wanted to call the first realtor and tell him that his piggishness cost him a $20k commission, but decided to be the bigger person and keep my mouth shut!

Perhaps karma at work? But I still say you should have reported both of them. They will probably continue doing this kind of crap to others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I are both Indian. Both times we were looking for housing here in DC (one rental, one purchase) we had weird interactions with landlords/real estate agents.

1. We went to an apartment building in a predominantly white part of north Arlington. No one greeted us at the rental office; a woman sat at her desk for five minutes. Finally, we approached her, even though we thought she was busy and would get to us after finishing paperwork, or something - benefit of the doubt. She curtly invited us to sit down and asked us how many bedrooms we wanted. We saw a model we liked on paper and asked if we could see the apartment. She told us we could not. I asked if we could come back another day to see it and she said that she would not show us the apartment at all, and we would have to put down a deposit if we wanted to rent it, sight unseen. We have friends who lived in the building - when we mentioned this to them, they told us that a clause in their lease required that their apartment be available for showings to potential renters, and they did have people check out the apartment in the months before they vacated. I had no idea why we wouldn't be suitable residents - perhaps the Indian accent?

2. We met a real estate agent at a showing in Alexandria. He showed us one house later that month, and then refused to show us any more houses until we provided to him a prequalification letter. "You say you want to spend $X on a house, but I need to be sure you can afford these houses before I show them to you." We were looking at houses in the $350k-500k range; my husband and I are both professionals with graduate degrees. We qualified for significantly more than we were looking to spend. Not a single white person I know has had a real estate agent refuse to show them homes for fear that they were lying about their ability to afford the houses.

I can't even imagine how much worse it is for black people - at least some people have an (ill-informed) opinion that all Indians are financially successful; I imagine it's much worse for black and hispanic people.

That's terrible. Could you have reported both places to a government housing authority to investigate? I hope they get what's coming to them!

Well, in situation #1, we found an apartment we loved in the same neighborhood in a "luxury" building where we were treated much better. We ended up with a beautiful apartment.

Situation #2 - the house the agent refused to show us went off the market while we looked for another realtor. The house came back on the market a two months later and we bought it through our new agent. That nice commission went to the new realtor. I kind of wanted to call the first realtor and tell him that his piggishness cost him a $20k commission, but decided to be the bigger person and keep my mouth shut!

Perhaps karma at work? But I still say you should have reported both of them. They will probably continue doing this kind of crap to others.

Honestly, it didn't occur to me at the time that it could be racism/discrimination against immigrants. Only when I looked at both experiences in context of this conversation. I think you're right that I should report it.

[Anonymous]

OP, have you read any of this thread to your husband?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, this is 12:42, I thought you were doing the 'ZOMG McCain IS A FURRINER' thing. My apologies.

And yeah, the "Tryg birthers" are the equivalent of the "Obama birthers" in terms of being able to deny the facts -- thing is you don't see Pelosi coming out and giving carefully worded statements about Tryg's birth circumstances the way you've seen McConnell.

There is no Movement to unearth Trig's true birth mother. Do you not see the difference between a week's worth of idle gossip and a concerted, funded campaign to find something about Obama that will allow them to get him removed from office?

This is the wikipedia entry over Obama's birthplace: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories (holy crap!)

This is the "controversy" over Trig's birthe mother: (uh, there isn't one)


If you think that these two situations remotely similar, you are off your rocker.

[Anonymous]

Sorry that was accidentally attached to the wrong pp.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A staggering number of Americans think Barack Obama is not a real American citizen and that he's a Muslim! Would those idiocies persist if he were a white guy? Hell, no.

There were those who said McCain couldn't run since he was born in Pananma. It doesn't matter that when an active duty service member, or the wife of one, has a baby in another country that the baby is automatically a US citizen. They aren't issued birth certificates but Certificates of foriegn birth instead.

Obama: Black. Born to American mother on US soil. Legitimate birth certificate. Questioned mercilessly despite legal documentation and proof.

McCain: White. Born to American parents in a foreign country. No further questions asked.

How can you compare the two?

Let me guess, you think Tryg really isn't Sarah Palin's kid.

Holy moly - I think Trig is Sarah Palin's kid, yet I do think the birthers are absolutely crazy and that these questions are only being asked of the president because he has a father who was born outside of the United States.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your DH is an idiot.

DITTO.

Your husband is such a f*&%ing idiot. Why are you trying to gather evidence? SERIOUSLY, racism in America? What next? Does DH believe that gravity only wears on the poor?

Such. A. F*&^king. IDIOT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AA mom here. Do DH and I have multiple Ivy league degrees, a lovely house in a majority white neighborhood, and great credit? Sure. Do I sometimes walk into meetings and have white men think I am there to take the meeting minutes? You bet. It is teh subtle assumptions that don't go away, no matter how successful you are.

I agree.

[Anonymous]

Education, assimilation, speaking a common language, and wealth are the only things that matter anymore. If you are not actively attempting to improve each of these conditions in your lives, you are only making excuses.

You can only play the race card so many times. Eventually, no one is going to care what happened centuries or even just decades ago.

Pull up your pants and get a job.

[Anonymous]

I will be kind and refrain from calling your husband ignorant, but the title of this thread is truly a question that could be asked in this nation by a white person who has the privilege of saying racism doesn't exist because HE never encounters it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I will be kind and refrain from calling your husband ignorant, but the title of this thread is truly a question that could be asked in this nation by a white person who has the privilege of saying racism doesn't exist because HE never encounters it.

This. If you don't experience it, it doesn't exist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Education, assimilation, speaking a common language, and wealth are the only things that matter anymore. If you are not actively attempting to improve each of these conditions in your lives, you are only making excuses.

You can only play the race card so many times. Eventually, no one is going to care what happened centuries or even just decades ago.

Pull up your pants and get a job.

What the hell are you talking about? For someone spouting off about education your reading comprehension is severely lacking. Did you even read the OP?! You and my FIL would be great friends. You could ask him about the weather and he would find a way to work hating Obama into his reply. Talk about having an axe to grind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH and I were discussing this--he thinks not, I do. But, in trying to convince him, I had few examples on which to draw. Am I wrong? He says that the fact that we have an Af Am president shows that the vast majority of Americans are not racist anymore. What do you think? Can you link any recent studies about this one way or the other?

Thank you.

The better question would be "do racism and sexism exist in any class in America"? Not only yes, but Hell yes, and they always will. We are not a color- or gender-blind country and probably will never be so. Well, maybe when there are no more pure-bred WASPs and that will take hundreds of years. Is your husband a comedian?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH and I were discussing this--he thinks not, I do. But, in trying to convince him, I had few examples on which to draw. Am I wrong? He says that the fact that we have an Af Am president shows that the vast majority of Americans are not racist anymore. What do you think? Can you link any recent studies about this one way or the other?

Thank you.

The better question would be "do racism and sexism exist in any class in America"? Not only yes, but Hell yes, and they always will. We are not a color- or gender-blind country and probably will never be so. Well, maybe when there are no more pure-bred WASPs and that will take hundreds of years. Is your husband a comedian?

Maybe sooner than that. Perhaps when Hispanics become the majority in the US and the Chinese the majority in the world.