Where do you draw the line between upper middle class and upper class?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/line-between-middle-class-upper-110130857.html

Varies by state.

I love that you provided actual data.

Short version - upper middle class ends around 200k in DC/MD/VA (175 in Virginia as whole, NoVa would probably be closer to 200k)

You think people making over $200K in DC/MD/VA are upper class? Absolutely not.

If you have to use salary to figure out where someone is, they're not upper class.

+1. Our HHI is 415k and we are broke. Broke as in proper savings, living on tight budget, rarely eating out, simple beach vacations, frugal shopping etc.

Broken in common sense too. If you are on a tight budget at your income you've messed up somewhere along the lines.

+1 415K and you are broke? You have a spending probably.

[Anonymous]

UMC is 175k to 600k

Uc is over that.

Idle rich is another catagory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:UMC is 175k to 600k

Uc is over that.

Idle rich is another catagory.

Who made you the arbiter of where the cutoff is?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are absolutely upper class by economic standards (hhi @$1M) but we don’t live an extremely upper class lifestyle. We live in nyc and own our home and a second home and pay for private school but we don’t take super luxury vacations and don’t fly first class with our kids, don’t buy or wear designer clothing etc. We budget and make choices about how we spend our money because it isn’t unlimited.
I think that’s the reality for a lot of UMC and UC families. There’s a big difference between $1M hhi and $10 or $100m.

oh ffs. Your are UC. You live in NYC, own a home, and a second home, and pay for private school (that probably costs like $50k/year), but you think you are only UMC?

I said I was UC - but pointed out corrrctly that even within that “class” there is a very large spread. We don’t actually fly first class period unless work is paying for it (and we both work). We still think a lot about how we spend our money whereas people who are really rich likely don’t… not that we aren’t rich (or upper class) but we aren’t really rich.

[Anonymous]

"The real rich" are just those richer than you.

[Anonymous]

There are no upper middle class or middle class celebrities…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/line-between-middle-class-upper-110130857.html

Varies by state.

I love that you provided actual data.

Short version - upper middle class ends around 200k in DC/MD/VA (175 in Virginia as whole, NoVa would probably be closer to 200k)

You think people making over $200K in DC/MD/VA are upper class? Absolutely not.

If you have to use salary to figure out where someone is, they're not upper class.

+1. Our HHI is 415k and we are broke. Broke as in proper savings, living on tight budget, rarely eating out, simple beach vacations, frugal shopping etc.

Broken in common sense too. If you are on a tight budget at your income you've messed up somewhere along the lines.

20k a month might sound like an awful lot to someone in Ames Iowa but it doesn't go very far in DC when 8Kmortgages are common, you have four kids to put through day care and college, you have car payments for a couple Hondas and insurance all while trying to save aggressively....

$8k mortgages are not common
4 kids is not common

Both are choices

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/line-between-middle-class-upper-110130857.html

Varies by state.

I love that you provided actual data.

Short version - upper middle class ends around 200k in DC/MD/VA (175 in Virginia as whole, NoVa would probably be closer to 200k)

You think people making over $200K in DC/MD/VA are upper class? Absolutely not.

If you have to use salary to figure out where someone is, they're not upper class.

+1. Our HHI is 415k and we are broke. Broke as in proper savings, living on tight budget, rarely eating out, simple beach vacations, frugal shopping etc.

Broken in common sense too. If you are on a tight budget at your income you've messed up somewhere along the lines.

20k a month might sound like an awful lot to someone in Ames Iowa but it doesn't go very far in DC when 8Kmortgages are common, you have four kids to put through day care and college, you have car payments for a couple Hondas and insurance all while trying to save aggressively....

if you have an 8k mortgage that you are able to pay, you are broke by choice if you don't have extra money

Not in DC with 4 kids.

You sound more ignorant every time you post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/line-between-middle-class-upper-110130857.html

Varies by state.

I love that you provided actual data.

Short version - upper middle class ends around 200k in DC/MD/VA (175 in Virginia as whole, NoVa would probably be closer to 200k)

You think people making over $200K in DC/MD/VA are upper class? Absolutely not.

If you have to use salary to figure out where someone is, they're not upper class.

+1. Our HHI is 415k and we are broke. Broke as in proper savings, living on tight budget, rarely eating out, simple beach vacations, frugal shopping etc.

Broken in common sense too. If you are on a tight budget at your income you've messed up somewhere along the lines.

20k a month might sound like an awful lot to someone in Ames Iowa but it doesn't go very far in DC when 8Kmortgages are common, you have four kids to put through day care and college, you have car payments for a couple Hondas and insurance all while trying to save aggressively....

Yeah, you will be practically losing everything when you go to sell your $5 million mansion. /s

8K mortgage in DC is like a 4 bed, 2 bath house in Rockville.

Sorry, $3 million hovel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Upper class doesnt have to work. They can live on dividends and businesses.

Agree with this. And in HCOL areas, that’s not the 1%, but more like a 0.XX%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/line-between-middle-class-upper-110130857.html

Varies by state.

I love that you provided actual data.

Short version - upper middle class ends around 200k in DC/MD/VA (175 in Virginia as whole, NoVa would probably be closer to 200k)

You think people making over $200K in DC/MD/VA are upper class? Absolutely not.

If you have to use salary to figure out where someone is, they're not upper class.

+1. Our HHI is 415k and we are broke. Broke as in proper savings, living on tight budget, rarely eating out, simple beach vacations, frugal shopping etc.

Broken in common sense too. If you are on a tight budget at your income you've messed up somewhere along the lines.

20k a month might sound like an awful lot to someone in Ames Iowa but it doesn't go very far in DC when 8Kmortgages are common, you have four kids to put through day care and college, you have car payments for a couple Hondas and insurance all while trying to save aggressively....

$8k mortgages are not common
4 kids is not common

Both are choices

DP. Eight thousand dollar mortgages in a HCOLA is extremely common. These are high earners and blowing the same on rent is ill advised. Real Estate is a long hold. It's not a flex as much as how do you best manage your income.

[Anonymous]

I once read an article referencing the “working wealthy,” which is basically the next income bracket after upper middle class. I would place the limit of UMC at a HHI of around $350k in this area. Thats the amount made by 2 higher level GS employees. Basically two solid professional incomes, or one high income + a SAH or part time working partner.

After that, you’d get into higher income levels, but a lot of those people still consider themselves upper middle because their livelihoods are still based on income. Whereas the really wealthy may or may not be high earners, but they have inherited wealth that means that they can take lower paying jobs at non-profits and such and live off of trust funds and live in a house that’s been in the family for generations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Upper class doesnt have to work. They can live on dividends and businesses.

Nonsense.

That's a common definition. The dividing line between UC and UMC is the necessity to work to maintain the standard of living and to give your kids the same standard of living.

This, though in the US you will never get agreement on this topic. We like to think of ourselves as a class-less society, so we conflate wealth and class. Class is a social designation, and wealth is a financial one. While on DCUM I would say we are UC given our $1-1.4M HHI, technically I consider us to be UMC and rich. UMC because our lifestyle is primarily supported by W2 income. Rich because we are 1%-ers. Americans don't make this distinction much, though in the UK it's a natural part of society. You can have UC/aristocracy that is not particularly wealthy at all.

Years back on DCUM someone posted an article on class in the US. A big part of it had to do with education. If I can find the article I'll come back and repost. It was really interesting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I once read an article referencing the “working wealthy,” which is basically the next income bracket after upper middle class. I would place the limit of UMC at a HHI of around $350k in this area. Thats the amount made by 2 higher level GS employees. Basically two solid professional incomes, or one high income + a SAH or part time working partner.

After that, you’d get into higher income levels, but a lot of those people still consider themselves upper middle because their livelihoods are still based on income. Whereas the really wealthy may or may not be high earners, but they have inherited wealth that means that they can take lower paying jobs at non-profits and such and live off of trust funds and live in a house that’s been in the family for generations.

Also, It’s actually not that easy to scale back at work. If I down level myself I would just be performing at my current level for less money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I once read an article referencing the “working wealthy,” which is basically the next income bracket after upper middle class. I would place the limit of UMC at a HHI of around $350k in this area. Thats the amount made by 2 higher level GS employees. Basically two solid professional incomes, or one high income + a SAH or part time working partner.

After that, you’d get into higher income levels, but a lot of those people still consider themselves upper middle because their livelihoods are still based on income. Whereas the really wealthy may or may not be high earners, but they have inherited wealth that means that they can take lower paying jobs at non-profits and such and live off of trust funds and live in a house that’s been in the family for generations.

I know two families with incomes of $350+ who ended up buying in PG and Charles because they were priced out of their most desired counties. I feel like you have to not only make an income but have a survivable savings to cross from middle to upper middle to working wealthy to upper class