Active Duty Army Officer wins title for the first time in history

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I posted earlier on this thread and no one seems to want to acknowledge that there is an ethics problem here - she is using her official position, and taxpayer money, for her own benefit. And the fact that DOD policy for decades was that they would NOT support beauty pageants because they were considered demeaning.

So who, or what, at DOD or Air Force changed decades of policy (which had been vetted with the Joint Ethics Regulations) to not support beauty pageants as it was demeaning and was endorsement of a non-federal entity?

This is the big question.

Yup.

Or, a question could be at what point did she read DOD into her extracurriculars? Was the train already moving down the tracks when they found out?

Maybe. She's cute and some boys in blue with a star or two probably wanted to give her a pass, despite breaking laws. If a regular troop did this they'd get hammered and maybe discharged. I'd love to read all the background e-mails on this ...FOIA, anyone?

A. Personnel shall not use Government property for other than authorized purposes.
(5 C.F.R. 2635.101(b)(9))

B. Personnel shall not use public office for private gain. (5 C.F.R. § 2635.101(b)(7))

C. Personnel shall not give preferential treatment to any private organization or
individual. (5 C.F.R. § 2635.101(b)(8))

D. Personnel shall not participate in official matters that conflict with personal interests.
(5 C.F.R. §§ 2635.402 and 2635.502)

See, the 14 Principles of Ethical Conduct issued by Executive Order 12647 (4/12/1989) and
both the Standards of Ethical Conduct for Employees of the Executive Branch and the Joint
Ethics Regulation.

This is what she would have been told had she asked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The intense hate so many of you have and are willing to express for a 22 year old whose mother died 5 years ago, got a physics degree making the deans list every quarter, won NASA scholarships, and wants to improve cancer treatment is really deplorable. This is why the internet is hell.

I don’t like pageants but I’m a mother and some of you are sick. Seriously disturbed.

The ethics questions are legit but there’s no way this wasn’t approved. Football players go pro and delay their clock too. Do you lose your minds over that and call them names? Or do you just save that for attractive young women?

Very very very few service academy athletes go pro. And if they do, they can decline their commission and pay back the government with their NFL salaries. Or they accept their commission and go into a recruiting role. They don’t take a coveted aviation position from a classmate, call themselves a fighter pilot to get drafted by the NFL and then tell the DOD what they are doing. That’s the more appropriate comparison.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Very very very few service academy athletes go pro. And if they do, they can decline their commission and pay back the government with their NFL salaries. Or they accept their commission and go into a recruiting role. They don’t take a coveted aviation position from a classmate, call themselves a fighter pilot to get drafted by the NFL and then tell the DOD what they are doing. That’s the more appropriate comparison.

This.

As a taxpayer, I would like to know why this military servicemember has been allowed to violate Federal ethics laws and get special treatment. But that might mean blowing the involvement of high-ranking officers. Pardon the pun.

Time to look at records and e-mails, IMO. As PP noted, the old go ahead and do it and then "beg for forgiveness later" is no excuse for doing what you KNOW is wrong in the first place.

I'd personally like to see the legal review of how this woman is supposed to be an official representative of the Miss America Organization and still maintain her official capacity as a military member. If there wasn't a legal review done, that's even more damning.

[Anonymous]

Four active duty women competed in 2021.

[Anonymous]

And now the barracks lawyers have arrived. Servicemembers are permitted to participate in activities, including in uniform, if approved by their command. We watch football games with serviemembers present, in uniform. They are even acknowledged and thanked for their service. Think of all the military athletes that compete in the Olympics.

Her participation is good for the military, where participation is at critically low levels. The services are missing every recruiting goal. They need to modernize and establish a place where people want to servce. Many young, beautiful women have no interest in serving. This young woman’s position is an example of how these woman can participate and thrive in the military. We need more examples like her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And now the barracks lawyers have arrived. Servicemembers are permitted to participate in activities, including in uniform, if approved by their command. We watch football games with serviemembers present, in uniform. They are even acknowledged and thanked for their service. Think of all the military athletes that compete in the Olympics.

Her participation is good for the military, where participation is at critically low levels. The services are missing every recruiting goal. They need to modernize and establish a place where people want to servce. Many young, beautiful women have no interest in serving. This young woman’s position is an example of how these woman can participate and thrive in the military. We need more examples like her.

Yes. Spending a Sunday afternoon at FedEx Field is exactly the same thing as spending a year fulfilling the Miss America contract that requires 24/7 availability to attend all appearances they schedule for you (that are not outlined in advance).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And now the barracks lawyers have arrived. Servicemembers are permitted to participate in activities, including in uniform, if approved by their command. We watch football games with serviemembers present, in uniform. They are even acknowledged and thanked for their service. Think of all the military athletes that compete in the Olympics.

Her participation is good for the military, where participation is at critically low levels. The services are missing every recruiting goal. They need to modernize and establish a place where people want to servce. Many young, beautiful women have no interest in serving. This young woman’s position is an example of how these woman can participate and thrive in the military. We need more examples like her.

Yes. Spending a Sunday afternoon at FedEx Field is exactly the same thing as spending a year fulfilling the Miss America contract that requires 24/7 availability to attend all appearances they schedule for you (that are not outlined in advance).

No, maybe it's not the barracks lawyers who have arrived, it's those who are well-versed on the standards of conduct for military/Feds and who know what the laws are.

Violating ethics laws is criminal - period.

And using the same old "it's good for recruiting" or "it's good PR" trope isn't going to work anymore.

Unless US taxpayers are willing to pick up the tab for EVERY servicemember who wants to pursue whatever their private pursuits are on government time/dime, then this woman shouldn't be allowed to either. That would leave absolutely no one in our barracks, including lawyers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Very very very few service academy athletes go pro. And if they do, they can decline their commission and pay back the government with their NFL salaries. Or they accept their commission and go into a recruiting role. They don’t take a coveted aviation position from a classmate, call themselves a fighter pilot to get drafted by the NFL and then tell the DOD what they are doing. That’s the more appropriate comparison.

This.

As a taxpayer, I would like to know why this military servicemember has been allowed to violate Federal ethics laws and get special treatment. But that might mean blowing the involvement of high-ranking officers. Pardon the pun.

Time to look at records and e-mails, IMO. As PP noted, the old go ahead and do it and then "beg for forgiveness later" is no excuse for doing what you KNOW is wrong in the first place.

I'd personally like to see the legal review of how this woman is supposed to be an official representative of the Miss America Organization and still maintain her official capacity as a military member. If there wasn't a legal review done, that's even more damning.

Yes, no more fake names!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Very very very few service academy athletes go pro. And if they do, they can decline their commission and pay back the government with their NFL salaries. Or they accept their commission and go into a recruiting role. They don’t take a coveted aviation position from a classmate, call themselves a fighter pilot to get drafted by the NFL and then tell the DOD what they are doing. That’s the more appropriate comparison.

This.

As a taxpayer, I would like to know why this military servicemember has been allowed to violate Federal ethics laws and get special treatment. But that might mean blowing the involvement of high-ranking officers. Pardon the pun.

Time to look at records and e-mails, IMO. As PP noted, the old go ahead and do it and then "beg for forgiveness later" is no excuse for doing what you KNOW is wrong in the first place.

I'd personally like to see the legal review of how this woman is supposed to be an official representative of the Miss America Organization and still maintain her official capacity as a military member. If there wasn't a legal review done, that's even more damning.

Yes, no more fake names!

You obviously are not a lawyer, because her participation does not, per se, violate federal ethics rules. A legal review could find that her participation was in the interest of the Air Force, the government was receiving value, and her duties could be changed. This is the same for servicemember Olympic athletes.

Are you a Russian troll? Why all the hate?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Very very very few service academy athletes go pro. And if they do, they can decline their commission and pay back the government with their NFL salaries. Or they accept their commission and go into a recruiting role. They don’t take a coveted aviation position from a classmate, call themselves a fighter pilot to get drafted by the NFL and then tell the DOD what they are doing. That’s the more appropriate comparison.

This.

As a taxpayer, I would like to know why this military servicemember has been allowed to violate Federal ethics laws and get special treatment. But that might mean blowing the involvement of high-ranking officers. Pardon the pun.

Time to look at records and e-mails, IMO. As PP noted, the old go ahead and do it and then "beg for forgiveness later" is no excuse for doing what you KNOW is wrong in the first place.

I'd personally like to see the legal review of how this woman is supposed to be an official representative of the Miss America Organization and still maintain her official capacity as a military member. If there wasn't a legal review done, that's even more damning.

Yes, no more fake names!

You obviously are not a lawyer, because her participation does not, per se, violate federal ethics rules. A legal review could find that her participation was in the interest of the Air Force, the government was receiving value, and her duties could be changed. This is the same for servicemember Olympic athletes.

Are you a Russian troll? Why all the hate?

You are obviously not well-versed in government ethics law or have learned a twisted version of it.

It's not hate. It's shining a light on violations so the American people can continue to have trust and confidence in their military.

Maybe someone should remind Miss America that she took an oath to defend her country, which should be paramount to her personal desires.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And now the barracks lawyers have arrived. Servicemembers are permitted to participate in activities, including in uniform, if approved by their command. We watch football games with serviemembers present, in uniform. They are even acknowledged and thanked for their service. Think of all the military athletes that compete in the Olympics.

Her participation is good for the military, where participation is at critically low levels. The services are missing every recruiting goal. They need to modernize and establish a place where people want to servce. Many young, beautiful women have no interest in serving. This young woman’s position is an example of how these woman can participate and thrive in the military. We need more examples like her.

There's a 16% admission rate at the Air Force Academy. I'd say there were plenty of qualified young women willing to take her place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And now the barracks lawyers have arrived. Servicemembers are permitted to participate in activities, including in uniform, if approved by their command. We watch football games with serviemembers present, in uniform. They are even acknowledged and thanked for their service. Think of all the military athletes that compete in the Olympics.

Her participation is good for the military, where participation is at critically low levels. The services are missing every recruiting goal. They need to modernize and establish a place where people want to servce. Many young, beautiful women have no interest in serving. This young woman’s position is an example of how these woman can participate and thrive in the military. We need more examples like her.

There's a 16% admission rate at the Air Force Academy. I'd say there were plenty of qualified young women willing to take her place.

Agree, and this incident will make it MORE difficult for intelligent, brave and dedicated young women who want to serve. Because now there may be an unconscious bias/standard that females at the Academy need to be "Miss America" pretty, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So she's finding a way to pay for all of her education. I'm in the "hate the game, not the player" camp on this one.

The Miss America program is the world's largest scholarship program for women.https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/miss-america-organization-and-pageant-icons/#:~:text=Since%20establishing%20the%20scholarship%20program,largest%20scholarship%20program%20for%20women.

And why can't she be both a pilot and a public health expert?

Nope, it's the most fraudulent "scholarship"
program.

The Air Force already paid her undergrad degree and is paying for her graduate school now if she is on active duty and a student. I don’t really get why should would be in a pageant at all

[Anonymous]

She is from a small town. She said she wants to show how you participate in the pageants and pursue your dreams of being a pilot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She’s a pilot, a Harvard graduate student, and Miss America. I hate pageants but you have to be in awe of her well-rounded talents and time management skills.

I don’t think she’s a pilot. Just some publicity shots of her getting in a jet.

The do-it-all person who SHOULD be a household name is that Navy Seal who graduated from Harvard Med school & then became an astronaut.