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[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Yes, they are artificially throttling the number of As and Fs. I don’t care about the number of a Fs, I’m annoyed at the lower number of As when most FCPS schools don’t have this policy. It is especially egregious when they are doing away with it next year, so this policy won’t be as visible to colleges for the current juniors. They should have just eliminated it this year.

My rising junior's grades at Madison are just fine, thanks.

He is becoming an independent person who has to make decisions about when he needs to do the practice work and when he doesn't need to do it. And certain teachers are better than others about impressing on their students that the non-graded practice work still must be done. The kids get it. This is especially true in sciences and math, of course. But, history teacher was quite clear that the non-graded work wasn't "optional" --- and my kid did most of it. We aren't boo-hoo-ing over his A- grades. He got the grades he was supposed to get. A 16- or 17-yr old should be learning how to learn, how much one has to do, and when one doesn't need to do more practice.

I am curious what the plan is exactly for this year. I'm betting they will show a video to everyone at BTSN.

I don't get too worked up about it. My kid just needs to listen to whatever policy the teachers explain... and then my kid needs to follow that. I expect that he is capable of adapting to the plan.

A lot of kids just aren’t capable or as intrinsically motivated to do this. They also have had years of no grades counting for 9 years of school so high school is often the first time they even get grades they start to care about. Many of them don’t transition into caring about each assignment when they haven’t had practice years before.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Yes, they are artificially throttling the number of As and Fs. I don’t care about the number of a Fs, I’m annoyed at the lower number of As when most FCPS schools don’t have this policy. It is especially egregious when they are doing away with it next year, so this policy won’t be as visible to colleges for the current juniors. They should have just eliminated it this year.

My rising junior's grades at Madison are just fine, thanks.

He is becoming an independent person who has to make decisions about when he needs to do the practice work and when he doesn't need to do it. And certain teachers are better than others about impressing on their students that the non-graded practice work still must be done. The kids get it. This is especially true in sciences and math, of course. But, history teacher was quite clear that the non-graded work wasn't "optional" --- and my kid did most of it. We aren't boo-hoo-ing over his A- grades. He got the grades he was supposed to get. A 16- or 17-yr old should be learning how to learn, how much one has to do, and when one doesn't need to do more practice.

I am curious what the plan is exactly for this year. I'm betting they will show a video to everyone at BTSN.

I don't get too worked up about it. My kid just needs to listen to whatever policy the teachers explain... and then my kid needs to follow that. I expect that he is capable of adapting to the plan.

Same. And the truth is, which parents here don't want to admit, is that this system stops grade inflation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Yes, they are artificially throttling the number of As and Fs. I don’t care about the number of a Fs, I’m annoyed at the lower number of As when most FCPS schools don’t have this policy. It is especially egregious when they are doing away with it next year, so this policy won’t be as visible to colleges for the current juniors. They should have just eliminated it this year.

My rising junior's grades at Madison are just fine, thanks.

He is becoming an independent person who has to make decisions about when he needs to do the practice work and when he doesn't need to do it. And certain teachers are better than others about impressing on their students that the non-graded practice work still must be done. The kids get it. This is especially true in sciences and math, of course. But, history teacher was quite clear that the non-graded work wasn't "optional" --- and my kid did most of it. We aren't boo-hoo-ing over his A- grades. He got the grades he was supposed to get. A 16- or 17-yr old should be learning how to learn, how much one has to do, and when one doesn't need to do more practice.

I am curious what the plan is exactly for this year. I'm betting they will show a video to everyone at BTSN.

I don't get too worked up about it. My kid just needs to listen to whatever policy the teachers explain... and then my kid needs to follow that. I expect that he is capable of adapting to the plan.

A lot of kids just aren’t capable or as intrinsically motivated to do this. They also have had years of no grades counting for 9 years of school so high school is often the first time they even get grades they start to care about. Many of them don’t transition into caring about each assignment when they haven’t had practice years before.

Well, they'll figure it out pretty quickly. Your kids will earn the grade they deserve. All this foot stomping from parents is about how homework isn't propping up the grade anymore. Kids actually have to show masti of the material, not rely on busy work for that A.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Yes, they are artificially throttling the number of As and Fs. I don’t care about the number of a Fs, I’m annoyed at the lower number of As when most FCPS schools don’t have this policy. It is especially egregious when they are doing away with it next year, so this policy won’t be as visible to colleges for the current juniors. They should have just eliminated it this year.

My rising junior's grades at Madison are just fine, thanks.

He is becoming an independent person who has to make decisions about when he needs to do the practice work and when he doesn't need to do it. And certain teachers are better than others about impressing on their students that the non-graded practice work still must be done. The kids get it. This is especially true in sciences and math, of course. But, history teacher was quite clear that the non-graded work wasn't "optional" --- and my kid did most of it. We aren't boo-hoo-ing over his A- grades. He got the grades he was supposed to get. A 16- or 17-yr old should be learning how to learn, how much one has to do, and when one doesn't need to do more practice.

I am curious what the plan is exactly for this year. I'm betting they will show a video to everyone at BTSN.

I don't get too worked up about it. My kid just needs to listen to whatever policy the teachers explain... and then my kid needs to follow that. I expect that he is capable of adapting to the plan.

A lot of kids just aren’t capable or as intrinsically motivated to do this. They also have had years of no grades counting for 9 years of school so high school is often the first time they even get grades they start to care about. Many of them don’t transition into caring about each assignment when they haven’t had practice years before.

Well, they'll figure it out pretty quickly. Your kids will earn the grade they deserve. All this foot stomping from parents is about how homework isn't propping up the grade anymore. Kids actually have to show masti of the material, not rely on busy work for that A.

Foot stomping? Madison HS is foot stomping by not dropping this new fad grading now. One more year of 4.0 grading until they go back to normal? SMH

[Anonymous]

Sorry your kid will have one more year of actually having to demonstrate mastery of their skills instead of inflating their unearned grade.

[Anonymous]

Actually Joe Feldman’s (author of Grading for Equity) research shows it’s an approach that results in less As for white students and less Ds and Fs for non-white students.

Also, there is an ongoing debate about the move away from content learning to skills-based learning. I don’t think it’s a good idea and think kids learn less. It does let kids slack off and still do ok in the end.

[Anonymous]

Can someone explain the difference Madison will have with grading this coming school year and thereafter? Thanks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Thank God my kids don’t go to Madison.

West Potomac uses the 4.0 scale, too. Most teachers hate it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Actually Joe Feldman’s (author of Grading for Equity) research shows it’s an approach that results in less As for white students and less Ds and Fs for non-white students.

Also, there is an ongoing debate about the move away from content learning to skills-based learning. I don’t think it’s a good idea and think kids learn less. It does let kids slack off and still do ok in the end.

Speeches he’s given always note as the first reason equity grading is important is because traditional grading methods hurt kids who can’t do homework because they are watching younger siblings or working. At jmhs, what is the percentage of the student population this specific concern impacts? I’m guessing it is less than 1-2%. It would have to be only kids who either work or watch siblings AND but for the babysitting/work they would be doing their hw.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually Joe Feldman’s (author of Grading for Equity) research shows it’s an approach that results in less As for white students and less Ds and Fs for non-white students.

Also, there is an ongoing debate about the move away from content learning to skills-based learning. I don’t think it’s a good idea and think kids learn less. It does let kids slack off and still do ok in the end.

Speeches he’s given always note as the first reason equity grading is important is because traditional grading methods hurt kids who can’t do homework because they are watching younger siblings or working. At jmhs, what is the percentage of the student population this specific concern impacts? I’m guessing it is less than 1-2%. It would have to be only kids who either work or watch siblings AND but for the babysitting/work they would be doing their hw.

So if equity is everything for the school board, isn't doing away with the 4.0 grading scale and standards based grading moving away from equity grading and back to a more traditional method?

I have an 8th grader as my oldest and I'm still trying to figure this out. His 7th grade teachers did a mix of what I know as traditional scoring on a 100 point scale with a rolling gradebook vs. skills/standards based grading with rolling gradebook (this was the long column of "I can" statements). My 7th grader really hated the 4.0 scale. I never got a handle on how it worked.

I remember him being annoyed once when he got an 80% on a science test which brought his grade down to a B+. He wasn't allowed to retake it because he didn't "fail enough". He wished he'd missed one more question and then he could have retaken it and gotten a perfect. He was starting to realize he should just fail all his tests to see what's on them and then get a perfect the second time around! Seems like a strange system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually Joe Feldman’s (author of Grading for Equity) research shows it’s an approach that results in less As for white students and less Ds and Fs for non-white students.

Also, there is an ongoing debate about the move away from content learning to skills-based learning. I don’t think it’s a good idea and think kids learn less. It does let kids slack off and still do ok in the end.

Speeches he’s given always note as the first reason equity grading is important is because traditional grading methods hurt kids who can’t do homework because they are watching younger siblings or working. At jmhs, what is the percentage of the student population this specific concern impacts? I’m guessing it is less than 1-2%. It would have to be only kids who either work or watch siblings AND but for the babysitting/work they would be doing their hw.

So if equity is everything for the school board, isn't doing away with the 4.0 grading scale and standards based grading moving away from equity grading and back to a more traditional method?

I have an 8th grader as my oldest and I'm still trying to figure this out. His 7th grade teachers did a mix of what I know as traditional scoring on a 100 point scale with a rolling gradebook vs. skills/standards based grading with rolling gradebook (this was the long column of "I can" statements). My 7th grader really hated the 4.0 scale. I never got a handle on how it worked.

I remember him being annoyed once when he got an 80% on a science test which brought his grade down to a B+. He wasn't allowed to retake it because he didn't "fail enough". He wished he'd missed one more question and then he could have retaken it and gotten a perfect. He was starting to realize he should just fail all his tests to see what's on them and then get a perfect the second time around! Seems like a strange system.

I don’t think FCPS plans to move away from equity grading. They trained teachers on equity grading and shutting down parent complaints. Madison admin are masters of trying to minimize forums for parents to ask questions publicly. They don’t have the answers.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/fairness-justice/fairfax-trained-teachers-disregard-objections-equity-grading

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Yes, they are artificially throttling the number of As and Fs. I don’t care about the number of a Fs, I’m annoyed at the lower number of As when most FCPS schools don’t have this policy. It is especially egregious when they are doing away with it next year, so this policy won’t be as visible to colleges for the current juniors. They should have just eliminated it this year.

My rising junior's grades at Madison are just fine, thanks.

He is becoming an independent person who has to make decisions about when he needs to do the practice work and when he doesn't need to do it. And certain teachers are better than others about impressing on their students that the non-graded practice work still must be done. The kids get it. This is especially true in sciences and math, of course. But, history teacher was quite clear that the non-graded work wasn't "optional" --- and my kid did most of it. We aren't boo-hoo-ing over his A- grades. He got the grades he was supposed to get. A 16- or 17-yr old should be learning how to learn, how much one has to do, and when one doesn't need to do more practice.

I am curious what the plan is exactly for this year. I'm betting they will show a video to everyone at BTSN.

I don't get too worked up about it. My kid just needs to listen to whatever policy the teachers explain... and then my kid needs to follow that. I expect that he is capable of adapting to the plan.

A lot of kids just aren’t capable or as intrinsically motivated to do this. They also have had years of no grades counting for 9 years of school so high school is often the first time they even get grades they start to care about. Many of them don’t transition into caring about each assignment when they haven’t had practice years before.

Well, they'll figure it out pretty quickly. Your kids will earn the grade they deserve. All this foot stomping from parents is about how homework isn't propping up the grade anymore. Kids actually have to show masti of the material, not rely on busy work for that A.

Except they aren’t getting the grade the deserve or would get in any other school in the county. They are getting artificially lower grades to make the school look better for equity. True equity would be helping the struggling students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Madison is using 4.0, adding zeros, and using standards based grading and whole letter grading to drop grades as low as they can do they don’t have to do anything to help failing students learn material? Is that the gist?

Yes, they are artificially throttling the number of As and Fs. I don’t care about the number of a Fs, I’m annoyed at the lower number of As when most FCPS schools don’t have this policy. It is especially egregious when they are doing away with it next year, so this policy won’t be as visible to colleges for the current juniors. They should have just eliminated it this year.

My rising junior's grades at Madison are just fine, thanks.

He is becoming an independent person who has to make decisions about when he needs to do the practice work and when he doesn't need to do it. And certain teachers are better than others about impressing on their students that the non-graded practice work still must be done. The kids get it. This is especially true in sciences and math, of course. But, history teacher was quite clear that the non-graded work wasn't "optional" --- and my kid did most of it. We aren't boo-hoo-ing over his A- grades. He got the grades he was supposed to get. A 16- or 17-yr old should be learning how to learn, how much one has to do, and when one doesn't need to do more practice.

I am curious what the plan is exactly for this year. I'm betting they will show a video to everyone at BTSN.

I don't get too worked up about it. My kid just needs to listen to whatever policy the teachers explain... and then my kid needs to follow that. I expect that he is capable of adapting to the plan.

A lot of kids just aren’t capable or as intrinsically motivated to do this. They also have had years of no grades counting for 9 years of school so high school is often the first time they even get grades they start to care about. Many of them don’t transition into caring about each assignment when they haven’t had practice years before.

Well, they'll figure it out pretty quickly. Your kids will earn the grade they deserve. All this foot stomping from parents is about how homework isn't propping up the grade anymore. Kids actually have to show masti of the material, not rely on busy work for that A.

Except they aren’t getting the grade the deserve or would get in any other school in the county. They are getting artificially lower grades to make the school look better for equity. True equity would be helping the struggling students.

This. If it’s applied unevenly throughout FCPS - or more specifically - applied almost universally in a different way that produces more As - this is unfair. It’s the same as having most of FCPS have an A be a 90-100 and an F be a 50 and below and Madison has an A be a 97-100 and an F be a 40 and below. You could argue that you shouldn’t whine about it - either your kid knows the material or he doesn’t - but when it results in fewer As even if the Madison kids know the material better than other FCPS students - it’s unfair. Add to that that the idea behind equity grading is to help babysitters and workers who absolutely cannot get their HW done, which applies to close to 0% of jmhs’ population.

[Anonymous]

I hate that term busy work. This is high school. What high school teacher is giving out busy work? There isn’t a morning meeting or work given out when the class is finished to keep someone busy. That is what busy work is. Any homework that is assigned is probably pretty important to achieving mastery. Whether the child is babysitting or not they need to actually do the important PRACTICE AND FORMATIVE work before taking tests. What happened to people hating that tests didn’t measure all a student could do and hating all the pressure of tests? Now we have a new system where summative tests are ALL that matter? No one makes any sense in education. They all just spout off names of things without even understanding what they are saying and react without thinking.

[Anonymous]

And remember the protests about Teaching to the Test? So now it's back, but all year long, not just SOLs? Does anyone in FCPS have any sense anymore?

And retakes were supposed to be for that unit. Summatives were supposed to be per FCPS's policy the only things allowed for retakes and they were for kids who got below an 80. The summatives were supposed to teach the same skills, not the same year long skill sets. These year long skill sets don't even work for most of these courses. I don't know how they work for a semester course with few summatives. For the year long courses you only do a poetry unit once. Only an electricity unit once. The point of the summatives was to graduate students who actually learned more of the material. Not create more holes for next year's teacher.