W&M vs. uVA for someone who wants to go for a humanities PhD after undergrad?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Why would your child get a masters and DPhil and THEN go to law school? Why didn’t they go right after or shortly after undergrad? You’re not making sense.

Not that parent, but if you’re gunning for H or Y, you’d better have something special in addition to your perfect lsat score.

Work experience, a unique life story and/or an outstanding EC (read: Olympian) is prized in addition to grades & LSAT for HYPS.

Unless the Oxford PP’s child is a Rhodes scholar, I’m not sure how or why they think a bunch of random degrees is going to help them in law school admissions. Gives rich kid perpetual student vibes.

The MPhil and DPhil tie into the law. DC hopes to get published by a law review by application time which would be a great "oomph" factor for any law school. The issue is unexplored so there's a good shot. Yes, I was on law review so can comment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:anecdotally, w&m grads went to more prestigious grad schools. uva grads got better poli sci jobs in the DC area.

(again, this is anecdotal, folks! don't come at me with your "only two years after graduating w&m with a 1.7 gpa, my kid was promoted to jonah ryan's chief speechwriter. while the neighbor kid down the street who did political philosophy, policy, and law major* at uva is slinging burgers at five guys.")

Upside of W&M: the profs there focus on undergrads and you don't have to fight with grad students to work on research with a prof, since that's basically what gets you into a grad school if you don't have family money.

however, UVa has some real go-getters who get internationally prestigious post-grad fellowships etc. So, if your kid is a total shark, UVa. If they are an intense nerd, W&M.

*if that major appeals to your kid, then UVa.

+1. It was the well-known profs in their fields that really helped write amazing letters of recommendation for grad work. I read the letters: they were stunning and so much better than my letters of recommendation from a SLAC long ago

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Uh, you spelled it wrong. You're on here most constantly, trolling.

I never troll, ask Jeff the moerator. and I' not here "most cosnstantly"

[Anonymous]

Didn't read all of the responses, but replying to the title. PLEASE don't get a PhD in the humanities. Get an MPA, an MSW, a JD, an MBA. Pretty much any professional degree will be more useful, more lucrative, and more beneficial from a cost benefit lens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Why would your child get a masters and DPhil and THEN go to law school? Why didn’t they go right after or shortly after undergrad? You’re not making sense.

Not that parent, but if you’re gunning for H or Y, you’d better have something special in addition to your perfect lsat score.

Work experience, a unique life story and/or an outstanding EC (read: Olympian) is prized in addition to grades & LSAT for HYPS.

Unless the Oxford PP’s child is a Rhodes scholar, I’m not sure how or why they think a bunch of random degrees is going to help them in law school admissions. Gives rich kid perpetual student vibes.

The MPhil and DPhil tie into the law. DC hopes to get published by a law review by application time which would be a great "oomph" factor for any law school. The issue is unexplored so there's a good shot. Yes, I was on law review so can comment.

Gotta get a job at some point around age 30, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Why would your child get a masters and DPhil and THEN go to law school? Why didn’t they go right after or shortly after undergrad? You’re not making sense.

Not that parent, but if you’re gunning for H or Y, you’d better have something special in addition to your perfect lsat score.

Work experience, a unique life story and/or an outstanding EC (read: Olympian) is prized in addition to grades & LSAT for HYPS.

Unless the Oxford PP’s child is a Rhodes scholar, I’m not sure how or why they think a bunch of random degrees is going to help them in law school admissions. Gives rich kid perpetual student vibes.

The MPhil and DPhil tie into the law. DC hopes to get published by a law review by application time which would be a great "oomph" factor for any law school. The issue is unexplored so there's a good shot. Yes, I was on law review so can comment.

Gotta get a job at some point around age 30, right?

If all goes well, clerking, as mom and dad did

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Why would your child get a masters and DPhil and THEN go to law school? Why didn’t they go right after or shortly after undergrad? You’re not making sense.

Not that parent, but if you’re gunning for H or Y, you’d better have something special in addition to your perfect lsat score.

Work experience, a unique life story and/or an outstanding EC (read: Olympian) is prized in addition to grades & LSAT for HYPS.

Unless the Oxford PP’s child is a Rhodes scholar, I’m not sure how or why they think a bunch of random degrees is going to help them in law school admissions. Gives rich kid perpetual student vibes.

The MPhil and DPhil tie into the law. DC hopes to get published by a law review by application time which would be a great "oomph" factor for any law school. The issue is unexplored so there's a good shot. Yes, I was on law review so can comment.

Gotta get a job at some point around age 30, right?

If all goes well, clerking, as mom and dad did

and before you say something further nasty, you should know that Scotus clerks are paid $200K a year and $400K for signing bonuses by law firms.

[Anonymous]

UVA students protested individuals such as Charles Murray and VP Mike Pence, so it is becoming somewhat of a liberal echo chamber. If that is the cultural you are looking for then UVA is higher ranked and will provide a launching pad to your end goal.

If you want a school where different view points are tolerated then W&M can launch one just as well. There is grade deflation at W&M but grad schools are aware and take that into account when making admission decisions.

Visit both talk to current students. See what fits you best. As far as preparing you for future success. Both can and will.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Why would your child get a masters and DPhil and THEN go to law school? Why didn’t they go right after or shortly after undergrad? You’re not making sense.

Not that parent, but if you’re gunning for H or Y, you’d better have something special in addition to your perfect lsat score.

Work experience, a unique life story and/or an outstanding EC (read: Olympian) is prized in addition to grades & LSAT for HYPS.

Unless the Oxford PP’s child is a Rhodes scholar, I’m not sure how or why they think a bunch of random degrees is going to help them in law school admissions. Gives rich kid perpetual student vibes.

The MPhil and DPhil tie into the law. DC hopes to get published by a law review by application time which would be a great "oomph" factor for any law school. The issue is unexplored so there's a good shot. Yes, I was on law review so can comment.

Gotta get a job at some point around age 30, right?

If all goes well, clerking, as mom and dad did

and before you say something further nasty, you should know that Scotus clerks are paid $200K a year and $400K for signing bonuses by law firms.

Don’t forget the $300k law school debt or the big law hours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here...agree both are great options and the student should look at specific faculty profiles and/or evaluate where they'll be happiest.

Botb are great. My UVA grad is doing a doctorate (DPhil) at Oxford right now.

When I was looking at graduate programs, I was warned that although a certain Oxbridge college had the best stash of materials for my chosen topic, no U.S. institution was going to hire me to teach with a DPhil. I was shocked, but it was my department chair, so he clearly knew about hiring.

Has that changed, or is your kid planning to do something else with their degree?

Definitely correct. There are over a hundred libraries at Oxford, the Bodlein being the most famous and one of the oldest in Europe. Most if the libraries have foreign language collections that no one else does. DC currently is prepping for the lsat. Yes the masters work ties in with law

Why would your child get a masters and DPhil and THEN go to law school? Why didn’t they go right after or shortly after undergrad? You’re not making sense.

Not that parent, but if you’re gunning for H or Y, you’d better have something special in addition to your perfect lsat score.

Work experience, a unique life story and/or an outstanding EC (read: Olympian) is prized in addition to grades & LSAT for HYPS.

Unless the Oxford PP’s child is a Rhodes scholar, I’m not sure how or why they think a bunch of random degrees is going to help them in law school admissions. Gives rich kid perpetual student vibes.

The MPhil and DPhil tie into the law. DC hopes to get published by a law review by application time which would be a great "oomph" factor for any law school. The issue is unexplored so there's a good shot. Yes, I was on law review so can comment.

Gotta get a job at some point around age 30, right?

If all goes well, clerking, as mom and dad did

and before you say something further nasty, you should know that Scotus clerks are paid $200K a year and $400K for signing bonuses by law firms.

Don’t forget the $300k law school debt or the big law hours.

Not if you get a scholarship, which schools will do to get oomph factors. Two of my kids' friends got full tuition or 70% tuition off. But, yes, you are correct about the grind and the associate hours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The cheapest option, because a PhD in the Humanities isn't going to generate a lot of income. And if money is not an issue, then visit both and choose based on vibe.

Also, stop dumping on the happy parent with the Oxford kid - it takes a lot to get in, and they are understandably proud. It's an anonymous forum, it's all right to boast.

+1 thought I'd argue that Oxford mom is absolutely right to post since the OP is asking about a path to PhD specifically so she's 100% on topic.

No doubt Oxford mom (or dad) started this thread for exactly that reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The cheapest option, because a PhD in the Humanities isn't going to generate a lot of income. And if money is not an issue, then visit both and choose based on vibe.

Also, stop dumping on the happy parent with the Oxford kid - it takes a lot to get in, and they are understandably proud. It's an anonymous forum, it's all right to boast.

+1 thought I'd argue that Oxford mom is absolutely right to post since the OP is asking about a path to PhD specifically so she's 100% on topic.

No doubt Oxford mom (or dad) started this thread for exactly that reason.

Go read the top of the thread. That suggestion makes no sense. Ask Jeff, he will confirm

[Anonymous]

Do not get a phd in the humanities. There are no jobs. It’s a terrible idea.

[Anonymous]

I would not worry too much right now about the job market. A lot can change over the next four years. Don’t pick too narrowly based upon that major.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UVA is hardly “woke”. My DD is finishing up a class this semester with a famous conservative sociology professor. She has enjoyed hearing all sorts of perspectives, which is what college should be about. Learning to think and make your own judgements not just follow what others tell you.

Oooo! Ian Mullins? Tell her to also take Ken Elzinga in Econ. He was a wonderful mentor to my kid. Also James Ceasar and Gerard Alexander.

Brad Wilcox, she has taken Elzinga too