Peer Masking as a Reasonable Accommodation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't this only apply to the students that are plaintiffs in the lawsuit?

Nope.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

My child is deaf. Your child will not wear a mask so my child can read her lips. Cancer student should stay home.

How about your deaf child stays home since she can't hear? See how this works?

Is the deaf kid asking other students to do something as part of her own accommodations?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Tell me you hate kids with disabilities without saying you hate kids with disabilities.

Please. There comes a point where you have to look and say that accommodating one kid is leading to too much disruption for the other kids and the one kid needs to move to a different environment. I think the kids who are violent and disruptive on a regular basis are a clear case of crossing that line because their behavior is hurting other kids physically or at the very least it endangers other kids. Not to mention the disruption that comes from having to evacuate classrooms.

Masking other kids to protect one kid is a different line. There are kids who need to read lips and who struggle to understand what people are saying with masks on. Hell, I have good hearing and I barely understand people wearing masks. Everything is muffled. Now kids are expected to have to learn sounds or listen to a lecture when it is harder to hear and understand? I have a kid who has been in speech for 6 years and you think that it is good for him to have to wear a mask or trying and learn how to pronounce sounds properly while listening to people wearing a mask?

I don’t know what we would do in that situation. It is nice to think that we would be all “cool, wear a mask” but the reality is my kid didn’t like wearing it and it hurt his speech. Do I need to get his IEP changed to read that he doesn’t have to mask because it hurts his speech? Or that he can’t be in a classroom with a Teacher wearing a mask because it is harder for him to hear properly pronounced sounds?

Bending over backwards to accommodate everyone is not possible. We have gone far beyond the idea of being reasonable. Where does the right of one kid infringe on another kids rights? Reasonable accommodations should not infringe on the entire classes ability to learn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

My child is deaf. Your child will not wear a mask so my child can read her lips. Cancer student should stay home.

How about your deaf child stays home since she can't hear? See how this works?

A sigh language interpreter in the classroom doesn’t interfere with other kids ability to learn. Special software that helps communicate doesn’t interfere with the other kids ability to learn A mask that makes it harder for a Teacher and classmates to be understood interferes with their ability to learn. One kids accommodations don’t interfere with the rest of the classes ability to learn while the other one does. See how that works?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

Asking a classroom of other students to do something they and their parents don't want them to is not a reasonable accommodation for the one student.

Actually it is and its good to teach your kids a sense of community and empathy.

And to give them speech issues, challenges connecting/recognizing emotions, and failure to develop normal immunity

]

Oh boy you sure hit all the right wing talking points.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

My child is deaf. Your child will not wear a mask so my child can read her lips. Cancer student should stay home.

How about your deaf child stays home since she can't hear? See how this works?

A sigh language interpreter in the classroom doesn’t interfere with other kids ability to learn. Special software that helps communicate doesn’t interfere with the other kids ability to learn A mask that makes it harder for a Teacher and classmates to be understood interferes with their ability to learn. One kids accommodations don’t interfere with the rest of the classes ability to learn while the other one does. See how that works?

A sign language interpreter is distracting to the kids with ADHD. Your kid should stay home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

My child is deaf. Your child will not wear a mask so my child can read her lips. Cancer student should stay home.

How about your deaf child stays home since she can't hear? See how this works?

A sigh language interpreter in the classroom doesn’t interfere with other kids ability to learn. Special software that helps communicate doesn’t interfere with the other kids ability to learn A mask that makes it harder for a Teacher and classmates to be understood interferes with their ability to learn. One kids accommodations don’t interfere with the rest of the classes ability to learn while the other one does. See how that works?

Ever heard of a peanut free class? See how this works?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Tell me you hate kids with disabilities without saying you hate kids with disabilities.

Please. There comes a point where you have to look and say that accommodating one kid is leading to too much disruption for the other kids and the one kid needs to move to a different environment. I think the kids who are violent and disruptive on a regular basis are a clear case of crossing that line because their behavior is hurting other kids physically or at the very least it endangers other kids. Not to mention the disruption that comes from having to evacuate classrooms.

Masking other kids to protect one kid is a different line. There are kids who need to read lips and who struggle to understand what people are saying with masks on. Hell, I have good hearing and I barely understand people wearing masks. Everything is muffled. Now kids are expected to have to learn sounds or listen to a lecture when it is harder to hear and understand? I have a kid who has been in speech for 6 years and you think that it is good for him to have to wear a mask or trying and learn how to pronounce sounds properly while listening to people wearing a mask?

I don’t know what we would do in that situation. It is nice to think that we would be all “cool, wear a mask” but the reality is my kid didn’t like wearing it and it hurt his speech. Do I need to get his IEP changed to read that he doesn’t have to mask because it hurts his speech? Or that he can’t be in a classroom with a Teacher wearing a mask because it is harder for him to hear properly pronounced sounds?

Bending over backwards to accommodate everyone is not possible. We have gone far beyond the idea of being reasonable. Where does the right of one kid infringe on another kids rights? Reasonable accommodations should not infringe on the entire classes ability to learn.

your kid has been in speech for 6 years - something else is going on there. you may want to look beyond blaming masks for all your kids' troubles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Tell me you hate kids with disabilities without saying you hate kids with disabilities.

I have a kid with a disability. Who didn’t get services he’s entitled to per his IEP during school closures. But nice try.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Speech delays have nothing to do with masking. ASD might. It's kinda sad you cannot be considerate to the child who may have health issues who otherwise may not be able to go to school. Being vaccinated and boosted helps your child not others as its not stopping transmission fully. Maybe you should homeschool.

You asset this rather confidently but we really don’t know that speech delays have nothing to do with masking. Masks may not cause delays, but they certainly don’t help them. And kids with autism/sensory issues may not like masking. But no one was worried about those kids during school closures/mask mandates. Even now, COVID is still the cause du jour for a certain segment of society who act as if it’s the only heath issue that matters.

I love when people assert so confidently that masks don't work but that they have been proven to cause speech delays.

Uh, I think you have your science wrong. Lots of studies showing masks work and lots of uninformed opinions on their harms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

My child is deaf. Your child will not wear a mask so my child can read her lips. Cancer student should stay home.

How about your deaf child stays home since she can't hear? See how this works?

A sigh language interpreter in the classroom doesn’t interfere with other kids ability to learn. Special software that helps communicate doesn’t interfere with the other kids ability to learn A mask that makes it harder for a Teacher and classmates to be understood interferes with their ability to learn. One kids accommodations don’t interfere with the rest of the classes ability to learn while the other one does. See how that works?

Ever heard of a peanut free class? See how this works?

Removing nuts from classrooms is a scientifically proven way to avoid nut-related anaphylaxis. A classroom full of kids with a piece of fabric off Amazon or from Etsy is not scientifically proven to do so much as stop the spread of the common cold.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Speech delays have nothing to do with masking. ASD might. It's kinda sad you cannot be considerate to the child who may have health issues who otherwise may not be able to go to school. Being vaccinated and boosted helps your child not others as its not stopping transmission fully. Maybe you should homeschool.

You asset this rather confidently but we really don’t know that speech delays have nothing to do with masking. Masks may not cause delays, but they certainly don’t help them. And kids with autism/sensory issues may not like masking. But no one was worried about those kids during school closures/mask mandates. Even now, COVID is still the cause du jour for a certain segment of society who act as if it’s the only heath issue that matters.

I love when people assert so confidently that masks don't work but that they have been proven to cause speech delays.

Uh, I think you have your science wrong. Lots of studies showing masks work and lots of uninformed opinions on their harms.

Please go re-read. Where did I say masks *cause* speech delays? I’m waiting … Maybe read before you respond and call others uninformed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

My child is deaf. Your child will not wear a mask so my child can read her lips. Cancer student should stay home.

How about your deaf child stays home since she can't hear? See how this works?

A sigh language interpreter in the classroom doesn’t interfere with other kids ability to learn. Special software that helps communicate doesn’t interfere with the other kids ability to learn A mask that makes it harder for a Teacher and classmates to be understood interferes with their ability to learn. One kids accommodations don’t interfere with the rest of the classes ability to learn while the other one does. See how that works?

Ever heard of a peanut free class? See how this works?

Yup. Reasonable. Telling kids no nuts in a classroom. It doesn’t interfere with a kids ability to learn. Reasonable.

Also reasonable, swivel chairs, resource teachers pushing into a class to work with kids, pull outs for kids, fidget toys, 1 on 1 aides. There are a whole list of things people are fine with. Why? Because it helps the kid(s) who needs it and doesn’t hurt or inconvenience all the other kids. Keeping the kid in the room who throws things and hits and hurts people, not reasonable. Telling every other kid that they have to wear a mask? not reasonable.

It is called balance. Most people are not arguing about reasonable accommodations but there are more and more signs that we have moved beyond reasonable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Tell me you hate kids with disabilities without saying you hate kids with disabilities.

I have a kid with a disability. Who didn’t get services he’s entitled to per his IEP during school closures. But nice try.

Oh so you just hate THOSE kids with disabilities, you know the ones who don't have health immune systems. You're still being ableist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

Asking a classroom of other students to do something they and their parents don't want them to is not a reasonable accommodation for the one student.

Actually it is and its good to teach your kids a sense of community and empathy.

And to give them speech issues, challenges connecting/recognizing emotions, and failure to develop normal immunity

]

Oh boy you sure hit all the right wing talking points.

+ 1
DCUM never disappoints. Masks are very triggering to the MAGA crowd.