Are the NESCACs worth the money?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My wife and I both graduated nescacs and our two children graduated ivies and my impression is that nescacs deliver a far superior undergrad experience. Abundant opportunities to work with professors on research and loads of mentorship. Go visit and decide for yourself. I wouldn’t bankrupt myself for the opportunity but attending a NESCAC is a special experienc.

LOL, ok.

PP, are you still using a rotary or a flip phone and thinking your rotary or flip works just as well as a smartphone in calling or receiving phone calls? The original PP is trying to explain to you the benefits of a smartphone. If you never owned one, everything goes over your head.

If you think yours is a clever retort I got news for you . . .

But I'll elaborate. First, NESCAC is an athletic conference. For this poster to group them all together and say attending any single one of them is a "special experience" is ridiculous. Some are better than others, and several are not "special" at all.

In any event, my real reason for the "LOL, ok" is that this poster isn't going to school with her kids or sitting in on their classes so she has no idea whether every NESCAC delivers a "far superior undergrad experience" than their Ivy League schools. And if she responds to this post with "well, we talk about their classes all the time as a family," or words to that effect, my response is both "well, that's really weird" and "so what, it's not the same thing."

NP -- And my response to that is, sorry that you show no interest in your kid's intellectual life and growth and they seem to respond in kind. But, LOL, you do you.

The personal jibes and overinflated sense of self importence and omniscience in this exchange are a perfect summation the drawbacks of spending time on dcum . Though, there might be a tiny bit of info here, so I guess better than some.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm so surprised to hear this. I would have to believe that law school admissions officers would be influenced by the undergrad, but maybe not...

They don’t. It’s all about the GPA and the LSAT. Sorry to disappoint, but throwing $80k a year at a NESCAC doesn’t give you an edge over a kid from state U with a high GPA and the same LSAT score.

After many years in BigLaw, I can say with confidence that as a general matter, and with the caveat that individual results may vary, the NESCAC grad will be a much stronger writer than the state U grad. It is also correct that law school admissions are driven by GPA and LSATs because US News rankings are apparently the be all end all. Sad to say, our profession is all the worse for it because we have to deal with the many bright, hard-working, high GPA 25 year olds who cannot string together 3 coherent paragraphs if their lives depended on it.

After many years in Biglaw, I can say with equal confidence that I've seen no correlation whatsoever between undergraduate institution and writing ability. By the way, your own writing is verbose and not particularly impressive. "With the caveat that individual results may vary?" Why the need to include that mouthful of a phrase when you have already said "as a general matter?" Your writing needs serious editing.

-- Retired Biglaw partner

NP. Battle of two pretentious lawyers. How about focusing on the question rather than crafting insults?

I am not one of the attorneys you reference, but I do think that both are helpful responses to the question posed by this thread. One attorney finds the writing of NESCAC graduates to be superior to that of public university graduates, while the other says which school one attended doesn't matter with respect to writing skills as those are largely derived from innate talent and abilities.

My view differs somewhat in that I find effective writing to be a product of focused hard-work, intelligence and practice.

Apply these points of view to one's educational experience to determine whether or not a particular school or group of schools is worth the money with respect to legal writing skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My wife and I both graduated nescacs and our two children graduated ivies and my impression is that nescacs deliver a far superior undergrad experience. Abundant opportunities to work with professors on research and loads of mentorship. Go visit and decide for yourself. I wouldn’t bankrupt myself for the opportunity but attending a NESCAC is a special experienc.

LOL, ok.

PP, are you still using a rotary or a flip phone and thinking your rotary or flip works just as well as a smartphone in calling or receiving phone calls? The original PP is trying to explain to you the benefits of a smartphone. If you never owned one, everything goes over your head.

If you think yours is a clever retort I got news for you . . .

But I'll elaborate. First, NESCAC is an athletic conference. For this poster to group them all together and say attending any single one of them is a "special experience" is ridiculous. Some are better than others, and several are not "special" at all.

In any event, my real reason for the "LOL, ok" is that this poster isn't going to school with her kids or sitting in on their classes so she has no idea whether every NESCAC delivers a "far superior undergrad experience" than their Ivy League schools. And if she responds to this post with "well, we talk about their classes all the time as a family," or words to that effect, my response is both "well, that's really weird" and "so what, it's not the same thing."

NP -- And my response to that is, sorry that you show no interest in your kid's intellectual life and growth and they seem to respond in kind. But, LOL, you do you.

“Nerd Alert”

- Austin Powers

Totally copping to the Nerd Alert, baby!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm so surprised to hear this. I would have to believe that law school admissions officers would be influenced by the undergrad, but maybe not...

They don’t. It’s all about the GPA and the LSAT. Sorry to disappoint, but throwing $80k a year at a NESCAC doesn’t give you an edge over a kid from state U with a high GPA and the same LSAT score.

After many years in BigLaw, I can say with confidence that as a general matter, and with the caveat that individual results may vary, the NESCAC grad will be a much stronger writer than the state U grad. It is also correct that law school admissions are driven by GPA and LSATs because US News rankings are apparently the be all end all. Sad to say, our profession is all the worse for it because we have to deal with the many bright, hard-working, high GPA 25 year olds who cannot string together 3 coherent paragraphs if their lives depended on it.

After many years in Biglaw, I can say with equal confidence that I've seen no correlation whatsoever between undergraduate institution and writing ability. By the way, your own writing is verbose and not particularly impressive. "With the caveat that individual results may vary?" Why the need to include that mouthful of a phrase when you have already said "as a general matter?" Your writing needs serious editing.

-- Retired Biglaw partner

NP. Battle of two pretentious lawyers. How about focusing on the question rather than crafting insults?

One is pretentious. The other is simply responding.

[Anonymous]

When I was in law school, the dean told me that he thought many of the best writers were students who had attended top SLACs. FWIW, he went to Yale, both for undergrad and law, so he wasn't just pumping up his alma mater (as I, most unabashedly, am ).

[Anonymous]

OP asked: "Are the NESCACs worth the money ?"

The answer will vary from person to person depending upon what one hopes to achieve by attending an elite SLAC. Also will vary person to person depending upon the individual's other options.

OP: Can you refine your question ? Worth the money regarding what ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: “If, however, you are of the ilk who think Williams is superior to Emory, so much so that even comparing the two is silly (let alone ranking Williams lower), then the NESCAC’s, even the lower NESCAC’s, are indeed for you. This isn’t really a discussion issue: these are two different types of people. You know who you are, and that won’t change”

I ❤️ You

-SLAC grad

Although I prefer National Universities, I do understand the attraction to SLACs.

I do not want to be impolite, but the writing above is unfair and suggests that the writer probably does not have an experienced understanding of an elite National University undergraduate education.

To many, LACs and SLACs are an advanced continuation of high school / prep school. Nothing wrong with this. Rural, isolated LACs delay entry into the real world while providing a somewhat insulated learning experience. Understandable why many parents would want this for their children / students. However, the LAC experience is romanticized easily because it is simple to understand a small campus, daily contact with professors and--sometimes--administrators, easy, convenient administrative matters, familiar faces all around. Gets old after a year or so. Especially so regarding the social scene.

While Williams College is arguably the greatest LAC in the country--and deservedly so-- Emory University is a well respected elite National University. Two different arenas. Their is no comparison as to which educational institution contributes more to the world through research and scholarly publications.

There is no doubt that the students at each school are outstanding. Different stages, however. Different leagues.

Emory is a much larger institution than Williams so not an apples to apples comparison and most of their publications come from the graduate division

Emorys research is number 17 in the country. That's more than almost all public schools which are much larger. Also if you compare alumni Emory also wins. How many past or present ceos does Williams have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: “If, however, you are of the ilk who think Williams is superior to Emory, so much so that even comparing the two is silly (let alone ranking Williams lower), then the NESCAC’s, even the lower NESCAC’s, are indeed for you. This isn’t really a discussion issue: these are two different types of people. You know who you are, and that won’t change”

I ❤️ You

-SLAC grad

Although I prefer National Universities, I do understand the attraction to SLACs.

I do not want to be impolite, but the writing above is unfair and suggests that the writer probably does not have an experienced understanding of an elite National University undergraduate education.

To many, LACs and SLACs are an advanced continuation of high school / prep school. Nothing wrong with this. Rural, isolated LACs delay entry into the real world while providing a somewhat insulated learning experience. Understandable why many parents would want this for their children / students. However, the LAC experience is romanticized easily because it is simple to understand a small campus, daily contact with professors and--sometimes--administrators, easy, convenient administrative matters, familiar faces all around. Gets old after a year or so. Especially so regarding the social scene.

While Williams College is arguably the greatest LAC in the country--and deservedly so-- Emory University is a well respected elite National University. Two different arenas. Their is no comparison as to which educational institution contributes more to the world through research and scholarly publications.

There is no doubt that the students at each school are outstanding. Different stages, however. Different leagues.

Emory is a much larger institution than Williams so not an apples to apples comparison and most of their publications come from the graduate division

Emorys research is number 17 in the country. That's more than almost all public schools which are much larger. Also if you compare alumni Emory also wins. How many past or present ceos does Williams have.

What a sad metric for alumni quality. Speaks volumes.

[Anonymous]

So sad how pathetic many of you are

Is this concise and pointed enough for you retired partner?

[Anonymous]

Is Emory anyone's first choice?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is Emory anyone's first choice?

https://college.emory.edu/scholars/

[Anonymous]

Apparently, the above is not a secure website.

Emory Scholars is a full tuition scholarship--if I recall correctly--plus additional benefits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Emory anyone's first choice?

https://college.emory.edu/scholars/

Ahh...so if they pay people to go there, Emory is a first choice. Got it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: “If, however, you are of the ilk who think Williams is superior to Emory, so much so that even comparing the two is silly (let alone ranking Williams lower), then the NESCAC’s, even the lower NESCAC’s, are indeed for you. This isn’t really a discussion issue: these are two different types of people. You know who you are, and that won’t change”

I ❤️ You

-SLAC grad

Although I prefer National Universities, I do understand the attraction to SLACs.

I do not want to be impolite, but the writing above is unfair and suggests that the writer probably does not have an experienced understanding of an elite National University undergraduate education.

To many, LACs and SLACs are an advanced continuation of high school / prep school. Nothing wrong with this. Rural, isolated LACs delay entry into the real world while providing a somewhat insulated learning experience. Understandable why many parents would want this for their children / students. However, the LAC experience is romanticized easily because it is simple to understand a small campus, daily contact with professors and--sometimes--administrators, easy, convenient administrative matters, familiar faces all around. Gets old after a year or so. Especially so regarding the social scene.

While Williams College is arguably the greatest LAC in the country--and deservedly so-- Emory University is a well respected elite National University. Two different arenas. Their is no comparison as to which educational institution contributes more to the world through research and scholarly publications.

There is no doubt that the students at each school are outstanding. Different stages, however. Different leagues.

Emory is a much larger institution than Williams so not an apples to apples comparison and most of their publications come from the graduate division

Emorys research is number 17 in the country. That's more than almost all public schools which are much larger. Also if you compare alumni Emory also wins. How many past or present ceos does Williams have.

You’re kidding, right?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Williams_College_people

God I hope you were trying to be funny. If not read the link and come back to mea culpa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Emory anyone's first choice?

https://college.emory.edu/scholars/

Ahh...so if they pay people to go there, Emory is a first choice. Got it.

In some cases. But, many students target schools which offer significant merit scholarship money as a first choice school.