Are the NESCACs worth the money?
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Anonymous
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An update was done at some point in the past two years. Noted that the Univ. of Chicago moved up "due to marketing".
That is all that I saw on the update. Seems unusual to see Caltech so high on the list--outstanding school, but doesn't seem as though it would have mass appeal. Same for Wellesley College. Otherwise, it appears to be a reasonable list. Maybe we should get two lists--one for LACs and one for National Universities--based on number of apps received focusing just on the schools listed. (That didn't work.) Maybe just list most selective schools by pre-covid (2019) admission rates. And, of course, yield might help the disappointed Williams booster. Yield for Fall, 2019 US News 1/25/2021: LACs & National Universities which had a yield of 50% or higher: I just included elite schools: 1) Harvard--82% 1) Stanford--82% 3) Chicago--81% 4) MIT--77% 5) Princeton--70% 5) Penn--70% 7) Yale--69% 8) Dartmouth--64% 9) Columbia--62% 10) Brown--61% 11) Cornell--60% 12) Notre Dame--58% 13) Northwestern--55% 14) Duke--54% LACs 1) Barnard--62% 2) Bowdoin--59% 3) Pomona--54% 4) Claremont McKenna--52% 5) Bates--50% Not sure why Williams & Amherst did not make the list. Probably fell a point or two below 50% for Fall, 2019 yield. |
Anonymous
Brilliant insight. |
Anonymous
Maybe my opinion of Williams was too generous if it doesn’t instill the value of humility or plain ol’ good taste. The best schools are respected despite random alumni displays of excessive arrogance (like saying closely ranked schools are not even close in reputation), not because of them. It shouldn’t be beyond your education to appreciate how the chest thumping diminishes the very brand you yearn to promote. |
Anonymous
| whenever asked where they went to college, the williams alumns I know don’t say “Williams”, they say “Williams, the Number One Ranked Liberal Arts College” - |
Anonymous
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Although I prefer National Universities, I do understand the attraction to NESCAC schools. If accepted to all to study government/history/foreign affairs, the order of my preference would be based largely on size & location.
1) Tufts--5,500 undergrads--size of student body. 1) Middlebury College--2,600 undergrads. In gorgeous Vermont and fairly close to Burlington,Lake Champlain, and the Univ. of Vermont. About as small as I would be comfortable. 3) Difficult for me to make the next choice as most are too small and Wesleyan (2,900 undergrads) is too liberal even though I would enjoy studying film. 4) Williams College--2,020 undergrads because of its #1 ranking & beautiful location. High ED acceptance rate for a school ranked #1. 5) Amherst College--1,836 undergrads--excellent school & good location near several other colleges. 6) Bowdoin College--1,818 undergrads-quaint town & close to ocean, but I would definitely take a year to study abroad or at another school for a change of scenery. 7) Colby College--1,920--because of new athletic facility & option to live in college owned downtown apts. 8) I don't think that Hamilton (1,900 students), Conn College (1,800 students), Trinity College (2,120 students), or Bates College (1,787 students) would work for me due to size & location. Other LACs: Pomona College (1,690 students) and Claremont McKenna College (1,350) students are attractive due to location, majors offered, and part of a consortium. In addition to elite National Universities, large state university honors colleges appeal to me for many reasons (merit scholarships, separate housing, preferred registration, small intro courses, lots of diversity, lots of attention from faculty & administrators for internships & job placement). Would be interesting to read other posters preferences for themselves or for their students. In my case, because I have a private prep school education, SLACs are less attractive because I feel as though I have been there and done that and do not want to repeat the experience. Plus, I really don't want to be at a small school where everyone knows each other's business. I like to see and meet new people everyday. I like having different friends or friend groups for different activities, and I would like the chance to be anonymous occasionally. Even with my preferences, I think that it would be almost unnatural for a parent to not desire an SLAC educational experience for their sons and daughters. Seems like a more cozy & intimate experience. Also, for 2 sport athletes, D-III schools are usually the best option. |
Anonymous
What are talking about? Williams and Amherst are academically more rigorous and their Econ programs (also PoliEc at Williams) are much stronger. Econ is the most popular major at Williams and the faculty are outstanding. There is also a small Econ grad program. For students who are passionate about Econ or PoliEc there is a lot to offer. And in terms of Wall Street connections, if you look at the first-year IBD analyst classes at GS, MS, JPM, etc. you probably won't see many kids from Colby or Bowdoin. If you knew anything about these schools - and their Econ programs - you would be contributing to the conversation instead of going on about chest thumping. And I'm not trying to "boost" Williams. I don't care if your kid applies to Williams. I'm an alum, not an admissions officer. I'm responding to a statement about the quality of Econ programs at a few NESCACs. |
Anonymous
Econ literally doesn't appear in the title of this thread or the in the original post's question. Your "I went to Williams and Williams and Amherst have better reputations than Bowdoin, Midd, and Colby. It's not even close!" did not qualify the claim only in the context of Econ. Similarly, you are saying now that Williams and Amherst are more rigorous. More rigorous in everything? Just Econ? Say so if that's what you mean. But even in the context of Econ, you are indeed just chest thumping if you don't provide more than anecdotes about how your school is so much better than other elite (top 10 in the case of two!) schools "it's not close!". To think doing is "contributing to the conversation" is misguided, because you are giving people a reason to hold your college in lower esteem, not higher. |
Anonymous
+1 This poster is correct. |
Anonymous
Top feeders to econ PhD graduate programs (size adjusted): #1 Pomona #2 Swarthmore ... #4 Williams ... #8 Colby ... #27 Amherst https://www.collegetransitions.com/dataverse/top-feeders-phd-programs#econ IB target schools: Middlebury is the only LAC in the top 30 https://www.peakframeworks.com/post/ib-target-schools Top feeders to finance: Williams #6 CMC #8 Middlebury #9 Washington and Lee #14 Amherst #16 https://www.collegetransitions.com/dataverse/top-feeders-banking Top econ LACs by research publications: #1 Williams #2 Wellesley #3 Middlebury ... #7 Amherst https://ideas.repec.org/top/top.uslacecon.html You're delusional if you think Williams and Amherst are the only LACs that amount to good outcomes. |
Anonymous
I went to Pomona and at least when I went there, the location wasn't that great. Incredibly smoggy all the time, like you're always sucking on an exhaust pipe. The town of Claremont isn't very interesting, nowhere good to walk to. Very far from the beach, 45 minutes drive to LA, out of the question unless you have a car. Same applies to the other colleges in the consortium. |
Anonymous
This is very helpful information. About 8 or 9 years ago, I raised the issue of air pollution/smog with a former professor in the Claremont consortium. She dismissed any cncerns about smog so I thought that it might just be a problem during the summer months. Thank you for the info. |
Anonymous
By location, I meant in relation to the other colleges in the consortium. I should have been more clear in my other post. |
Anonymous
(That PP) yes the consortium is great, students at any of the five colleges will want to take advantage of the opportunity to take classes at the other colleges. |
Anonymous
pretty outdated info- air quality is fine in claremont these days (we have a child with asthma attending), it's a beautiful leafy east-coast like college town that's completely walkable and constantly makes the list for best college towns in the state (see links below), and there's a train station to los angeles right next to pomona's campus https://www.latimes.com/travel/story/2022-08-16/best-california-college-towns-things-to-do https://www.bestcolleges.com/united-states/california/best-college-towns/ https://www.bestcollegereviews.org/50-best-college-towns-america/ https://www.collegemagazine.com/college-magazines-top-10-colleges-located-in-amazing-towns/ the beach is very far, though. that is true. |
Anonymous
I'm a different poster who happens to have lived in the LA area most of their life. Yes, the air quality is far better than it used to be. However, it would be a mistake to say it's not an issue. Especially when fires are factored in, which can be an issue for a few weeks every few years. Air quality is a function of many things, including distance from the coast, temp, average rain, local and state regulations, etc. The Claremont Colleges are in LA County but closer to San Bernardino County than, say, downtown. In a given year, San Bernardino will have probably 50% more unhealthy days than LA county. For 2019, I think the difference was something like 54 to 28, so almost a factor of 2. The good news is most of the those bad days are in the summer. But the bad air could still be a factor in Aug-Oct. Athletes in fall sports are most likely to be impacted, imo. I raised this as a concern to my child who plays a fall sport when they went through their college application process. For most of the academic year, the CCs have fantastic weather to go along with great academics and a unique best of both worlds community feel (several contiguous small colleges with many of the benefits of a university). But I would not say the air quality (or for that matter temp) is a non-issue, esp for fall athletes. |