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Ivy League Aspirations Unleashed (NYT Q&A with Harvard's DofA)
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Anonymous
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http://thechoice.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/09/08/harvarddean/?hp
The comments are fascinating, a window into many a parent's obsession over getting into an Ivy League school. |
Anonymous
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I find the obsession re getting into Harvard - or any other Ivy school - to be most disconcerting. And I went to Harvard.
I can't help but think that parents and kids who focus on this goal as the "be all and end all" are often going to result in overly-stressed, depressed and confidence-lacking children down the road. How did it become this way? When my husband and I were in high school, we were not laser-focused on these schools. It was an organic process, really, that took us to 4 different Ivies for degrees. We have no intention of pushing these schools on our child who is doing very well academically. It will be up to him to find the right fit. I find it crazy that so many people think that Ivies have a monopoly on turning out successful grads. If that were so, then many colleges around the world would be hurting for money and students. Times are once again changing and showing that there is a glut of lawyers and that an MBA is now essentially obsolete (see study of Wall Streeters who are skipping grad school and working immediately after college). The hottest careers are in high tech, international and entrepreneurship - not exactly The Ivies' forte with the exception of Harvard (and MIT). I believe the most important vision for kids and families alike is to find a school that matches the child's strengths and will challenge them to blossom and grow. Doesn't really matter where the degree is from if your child is able to thrive in a career that makes him or her happy. Some of the most unhappy people I know are Ivy grads. |
Anonymous
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I think people who didn't go are much more obsessed with Harvard than people who did. It's like the brass ring that hung just out of reach and if only you could have grabbed it, life would be different and better. So it's something people want to give their kids, especially in an era where upward mobility doesn't seem like a sure thing anymore.
I think Harvard's a great school for nerdy future-academic type kids (though hardly the only great school for these kids), but that's probably not the outcome most parents are hoping for, LOL! |
Anonymous
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10:42 here. I think you've got something there, 10:51.
I will say that the grass always looks greener on the other side. I'm here to say Harvard was nice but I did happen to like other schools better. I also found it to be stifling at times. College is also just 4 years. No one really cares where you went to school when you are looking for your second job. They care about your track record and whether you can get the job done. The one bad thing about Harvard is the perceived "snob level" you bring to any group. You learn not to talk about your school or to really downplay it if you are asked. There are lots of people out there with misconceptions and baggage about anyone who attends an Ivy school. It's not especially conducive to making friends in certain social situations even though you are just like everyone else. |
Anonymous
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Hmm! ? "It was an organic process that took us to 4 different Ivies..."
The obsession in your day (my day too ... 1960/1970s !) still exists today. Your "organic process" was certainly non random but carefully orchestrated and executed just like kids today. Attending 4 Ivies out of the possible tens of thousands of universities around the country is by no means an "organic" (whatever that means) or random process. It's always easy to tell others without an Ivy league degree that it's really not that important or necessary .... but I'm glad I have mine! |
Anonymous
| Now, I bet you and your husband would gladly trade in your 4 Ivy League diplomas for 4 State U diplomas! |
Anonymous
| I am not sure where the obsession is stronger, non=Ivies or Ivies.. My Princeton friend married a Princeton man, her father had also gone to Princeton, and I think they will have a cow if none of their children get into Princeton. So I think many Ivy League alum are obsessing over whether their children can get in. There are questions along these lines from a number of legacy parents on the NYT. |
Anonymous
| Similar legacy phenomenon at Amherst, USC, Notre Dame, West Point etc. etc. |
Anonymous
and for law school, was accepted at Harvard, but chose State U. because I didn't want to deal with the student loans that Harvard would have meant. I knew that I didn't want the kind of high-stress career that Harvard Law would give me entree to, so it made no sense to go down that path. There are people who make these choices. |
Anonymous
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I agree that the focus is overly obsessive and unnecessary.
I went to Brown undergrad and Harvard Law and my husband went to Stanford. We liked our undergrads (Harvard Law kind of sucks, but that's law school for you) and if our child were interested in them, we'd be supportive. But honestly, if she's more interested in something else and could realistically succeed somewhere else, that'd be just fine by us. My goal is for her to be intellectually curious, responsible about her studies, and equipped with the necessary study skills, writing skills, and foundations in math and science to succeed in and enjoy the college of her choice. That just makes sense to me. But then, neither my husband nor I came from families that pressured us academically. We both just worked hard and studied hard on our own and ended up where we did. We really don't know anything about pressure-cooker home life. |
Anonymous
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"Organic Girl" here to clarify my thoughts. I am actually a child of the 80's and I really did simply focus on doing my best in HS and getting into a good college. I did not go through the machinations that many now do.
I took the SATs once and did not study for them in advance. I was an excellent student who had a number of real interests but didn't go out of my way to come up with a strategy. Maybe I was naive but the thought was that with good credentials, I would get into good places. (Ignorance is bliss.) Not carefully orchestrated at all. I did however have familiarity with New England and that is where I knew I wanted to be. Maybe coming from the Midwest keeps us sane and practical about college apps. 
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Anonymous
| I know there are people who make these choices. And I commend and respect your choice and decision. This does not imply that those who decide to attend Harvard Law School are less commendable or respectable. |
Anonymous
13:41 here. I completely relate to what you wrote. It can be an organic process. |
Anonymous
Same here, but I think the college admissions world has changed. I assumed that I would get into Harvard, and I did. Today, with my record, I very well might not. I feel for students and parents going through the process these days. |
Anonymous
| No intent at all to disparage people who make other choices. I just lament the fact that so many people are forced to go through this exacting process which I'm sure takes a toll. If it truly is their intent, that's great! I make no judgements. |