My Fellow Catholics Please Help Me To Understand

[Anonymous]

First, I'm not a troll or an angry atheist. I'm a life long Catholic trying to understand why do I remain in the Catholic church. All the recent articles and documentaries about the rampant sexual abuse within the church really upsets me. I'm saddened and hurt whenever I come across an article about clergy abusing a child. I spent years working as a child advocate and a crisis counselor dealing with abused children. However, I feel like a hypocrite because I support an institution which covers up the abuse of children. If you're Catholic, then help me understand why do you continually support the church? Why isn't there pressure put on the church to punished clergy who abuse children? Why isn't there pressure to reconcile with victims who have been abused by clergy? It seems like this topic is often times push under the rug when I'm in the company of other Catholics. Us Catholics come together for numerous issues (abortion, poverty, immigration, etc.) However, when it comes to clergy abuse its like silence. No one wants to touch this issue. The Vatican is so powerful that even our government, The Supreme Court, and folks in Congress are afraid to touch this issue. We can hunt down Bin Laden, but we can't prosecute or find pedophile priests? Our government can go head to toe with some of the most vile criminals or terrorists around the world, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? We can nuke places off the face of the earth, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? Even when I try to discuss this issue with some of the priests that I know they become extremely uncomfortable and try to change the subject. I was looking at the crowd during the Walk For Life March this year. I was wondering, "It will be great to see a crowd like this to stand up against clergy abuse here at home around the world. A March Against Clergy Abuse, raising money for victim's legal fees and therapy would be great!" I'm at a lost for words and my heart is truly broke. I even told my husband today that, "I'm not sure if I want to remain Catholic because the Vatican creates a safety bubble for clergy who abuse children." Many of the monsters who have abused children are hiding out with the comforts of retirement. While their victims have yet to get justice and families of deceased love ones are still waiting for justice. Does this upset you as a Catholic? Does it make you angry with God or the church? Help me understand how can many of us (myself included) support the Catholic Church?

I'm at a crossroads here. To leave the Catholic faith equates to rejecting my family, my friends, my culture, my customs, and everything that makes me who I am as a person. I love being a Catholic. It has shaped me into the person that I am today. However, the child abuse issue is not something that I can tolerate or remain silent about. I'm not sure if anyone else has felt this way or not. If you have felt this way, did you leave the church or did you choose to stay?

[Anonymous]

But what would justice be? What would reconciliation with victims be? I feel like that's true of any child predator. Nothing is going to make it right. So the victim gets money. The offender goes to jail. Current and future clergy get copious amounts of screening and instruction. Victims get copious amounts of counseling. I have some connection to this as I'm familiar with the developments in Boston years ago. Does the victim heal better if the offender is sent to jail and stomped to death by another inmate vs. not imprisoned but sent away forever? I wish I knew answers. I do see the Church taking huge strides to address it. There are a million non-clergy abusers out there too and their victims have no support system to rally for them. Their legal fees and mental health needs are just as important but there's no rallying cry for them. I know many, many good priests and I will not turn my back on them because someone who shares their occupation is horrible. We have talked about it at length and in my experience they do not become uncomfortable the way you say yours have. They've shared their experiences openly (some were in seminary before this was exposed and some after so it certainly has been addressed differently) and discussed how it affected their formation as priests. I've yet to find any priest who is not affected deeply by this or is complacent about it. I too harbor resentment that some who are retired probably do harbor blame, but I also read an article once about a pastor or bishop or someone who signed off to move an abusive priest based on reports from independent psychologists who deemed him rehabilitated. Who shoulders the blame? The person in charge or the professional who "fixed" him? If you act based on information you have at the time, are you responsible for what comes later? It's the crux of our whole prison rehabilitation system. It's a lot to wrap your head around.

As for my continued life as a Catholic, I stayed and I do that for me. I go to Mass and receive sacraments because I have faith. I didn't stop believing just because of this. I can separate my faith from the "system" and I continue to practice because God is in my heart and in the end it's between Him and me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But what would justice be? What would reconciliation with victims be? I feel like that's true of any child predator. Nothing is going to make it right. So the victim gets money. The offender goes to jail. Current and future clergy get copious amounts of screening and instruction. Victims get copious amounts of counseling. I have some connection to this as I'm familiar with the developments in Boston years ago. Does the victim heal better if the offender is sent to jail and stomped to death by another inmate vs. not imprisoned but sent away forever? I wish I knew answers. I do see the Church taking huge strides to address it. There are a million non-clergy abusers out there too and their victims have no support system to rally for them. Their legal fees and mental health needs are just as important but there's no rallying cry for them. I know many, many good priests and I will not turn my back on them because someone who shares their occupation is horrible. We have talked about it at length and in my experience they do not become uncomfortable the way you say yours have. They've shared their experiences openly (some were in seminary before this was exposed and some after so it certainly has been addressed differently) and discussed how it affected their formation as priests. I've yet to find any priest who is not affected deeply by this or is complacent about it. I too harbor resentment that some who are retired probably do harbor blame, but I also read an article once about a pastor or bishop or someone who signed off to move an abusive priest based on reports from independent psychologists who deemed him rehabilitated. Who shoulders the blame? The person in charge or the professional who "fixed" him? If you act based on information you have at the time, are you responsible for what comes later? It's the crux of our whole prison rehabilitation system. It's a lot to wrap your head around.

As for my continued life as a Catholic, I stayed and I do that for me. I go to Mass and receive sacraments because I have faith. I didn't stop believing just because of this. I can separate my faith from the "system" and I continue to practice because God is in my heart and in the end it's between Him and me.

If your faith is between you and him, what do you need the Catholic Church for?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But what would justice be? What would reconciliation with victims be? I feel like that's true of any child predator. Nothing is going to make it right. So the victim gets money. The offender goes to jail. Current and future clergy get copious amounts of screening and instruction. Victims get copious amounts of counseling. I have some connection to this as I'm familiar with the developments in Boston years ago. Does the victim heal better if the offender is sent to jail and stomped to death by another inmate vs. not imprisoned but sent away forever? I wish I knew answers. I do see the Church taking huge strides to address it. There are a million non-clergy abusers out there too and their victims have no support system to rally for them. Their legal fees and mental health needs are just as important but there's no rallying cry for them. I know many, many good priests and I will not turn my back on them because someone who shares their occupation is horrible. We have talked about it at length and in my experience they do not become uncomfortable the way you say yours have. They've shared their experiences openly (some were in seminary before this was exposed and some after so it certainly has been addressed differently) and discussed how it affected their formation as priests. I've yet to find any priest who is not affected deeply by this or is complacent about it. I too harbor resentment that some who are retired probably do harbor blame, but I also read an article once about a pastor or bishop or someone who signed off to move an abusive priest based on reports from independent psychologists who deemed him rehabilitated. Who shoulders the blame? The person in charge or the professional who "fixed" him? If you act based on information you have at the time, are you responsible for what comes later? It's the crux of our whole prison rehabilitation system. It's a lot to wrap your head around.

As for my continued life as a Catholic, I stayed and I do that for me. I go to Mass and receive sacraments because I have faith. I didn't stop believing just because of this. I can separate my faith from the "system" and I continue to practice because God is in my heart and in the end it's between Him and me.

NP. But the church is a huge system that actually supported this behavior by shuffling priests who were repeatedly accused from parish to parish, hiding them away and turning a blind eye, therefore enabling and excusing the abuse. If the priest was treated as the criminal he is and sent to jail, yes, that would be preferable than "sending them away forever." What does that even mean? Where do they go? In my experience, they were "rehabbed" and then put back into parishes with full access to children. Please. But where are you saying they go for the rest of their lives?

[Anonymous]

OP, I was raised Catholic. I've come to believe that the Church in large part rests on a powerful sexual complex that arises from celibacy and control of women's fertility. That gave rise to scandals like child sex abuse and the Magdalnene laundries and 1000s of dead children buried in septic tanks in Ireland.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First, I'm not a troll or an angry atheist. I'm a life long Catholic trying to understand why do I remain in the Catholic church. All the recent articles and documentaries about the rampant sexual abuse within the church really upsets me. I'm saddened and hurt whenever I come across an article about clergy abusing a child. I spent years working as a child advocate and a crisis counselor dealing with abused children. However, I feel like a hypocrite because I support an institution which covers up the abuse of children. If you're Catholic, then help me understand why do you continually support the church? Why isn't there pressure put on the church to punished clergy who abuse children? Why isn't there pressure to reconcile with victims who have been abused by clergy? It seems like this topic is often times push under the rug when I'm in the company of other Catholics. Us Catholics come together for numerous issues (abortion, poverty, immigration, etc.) However, when it comes to clergy abuse its like silence. No one wants to touch this issue. The Vatican is so powerful that even our government, The Supreme Court, and folks in Congress are afraid to touch this issue. We can hunt down Bin Laden, but we can't prosecute or find pedophile priests? Our government can go head to toe with some of the most vile criminals or terrorists around the world, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? We can nuke places off the face of the earth, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? Even when I try to discuss this issue with some of the priests that I know they become extremely uncomfortable and try to change the subject. I was looking at the crowd during the Walk For Life March this year. I was wondering, "It will be great to see a crowd like this to stand up against clergy abuse here at home around the world. A March Against Clergy Abuse, raising money for victim's legal fees and therapy would be great!" I'm at a lost for words and my heart is truly broke. I even told my husband today that, "I'm not sure if I want to remain Catholic because the Vatican creates a safety bubble for clergy who abuse children." Many of the monsters who have abused children are hiding out with the comforts of retirement. While their victims have yet to get justice and families of deceased love ones are still waiting for justice. Does this upset you as a Catholic? Does it make you angry with God or the church? Help me understand how can many of us (myself included) support the Catholic Church?

I'm at a crossroads here. To leave the Catholic faith equates to rejecting my family, my friends, my culture, my customs, and everything that makes me who I am as a person. I love being a Catholic. It has shaped me into the person that I am today. However, the child abuse issue is not something that I can tolerate or remain silent about. I'm not sure if anyone else has felt this way or not. If you have felt this way, did you leave the church or did you choose to stay?

You are more than catholic. Many have left and kept their friends and family and even maintained many customs and practices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First, I'm not a troll or an angry atheist. I'm a life long Catholic trying to understand why do I remain in the Catholic church. All the recent articles and documentaries about the rampant sexual abuse within the church really upsets me. I'm saddened and hurt whenever I come across an article about clergy abusing a child. I spent years working as a child advocate and a crisis counselor dealing with abused children. However, I feel like a hypocrite because I support an institution which covers up the abuse of children. If you're Catholic, then help me understand why do you continually support the church? Why isn't there pressure put on the church to punished clergy who abuse children? Why isn't there pressure to reconcile with victims who have been abused by clergy? It seems like this topic is often times push under the rug when I'm in the company of other Catholics. Us Catholics come together for numerous issues (abortion, poverty, immigration, etc.) However, when it comes to clergy abuse its like silence. No one wants to touch this issue. The Vatican is so powerful that even our government, The Supreme Court, and folks in Congress are afraid to touch this issue. We can hunt down Bin Laden, but we can't prosecute or find pedophile priests? Our government can go head to toe with some of the most vile criminals or terrorists around the world, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? We can nuke places off the face of the earth, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? Even when I try to discuss this issue with some of the priests that I know they become extremely uncomfortable and try to change the subject. I was looking at the crowd during the Walk For Life March this year. I was wondering, "It will be great to see a crowd like this to stand up against clergy abuse here at home around the world. A March Against Clergy Abuse, raising money for victim's legal fees and therapy would be great!" I'm at a lost for words and my heart is truly broke. I even told my husband today that, "I'm not sure if I want to remain Catholic because the Vatican creates a safety bubble for clergy who abuse children." Many of the monsters who have abused children are hiding out with the comforts of retirement. While their victims have yet to get justice and families of deceased love ones are still waiting for justice. Does this upset you as a Catholic? Does it make you angry with God or the church? Help me understand how can many of us (myself included) support the Catholic Church?

I'm at a crossroads here. To leave the Catholic faith equates to rejecting my family, my friends, my culture, my customs, and everything that makes me who I am as a person. I love being a Catholic. It has shaped me into the person that I am today. However, the child abuse issue is not something that I can tolerate or remain silent about. I'm not sure if anyone else has felt this way or not. If you have felt this way, did you leave the church or did you choose to stay?

I'm not Catholic but I have great admiration for Catholics. First off, all Xtians were Catholics until the Reformation. It is the original egalitarian religion. Catholics brought us Western Civilization, music, art, architecture, medicine, universities: none would have had a prayer without the church. To this day the Catholics do more to build communities and help the poor and needy than any organization on earth. None of this excuses the many sins of the church, but humans are deeply flawed by their nature, thus any organization run by humans will be deeply flawed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First, I'm not a troll or an angry atheist. I'm a life long Catholic trying to understand why do I remain in the Catholic church. All the recent articles and documentaries about the rampant sexual abuse within the church really upsets me. I'm saddened and hurt whenever I come across an article about clergy abusing a child. I spent years working as a child advocate and a crisis counselor dealing with abused children. However, I feel like a hypocrite because I support an institution which covers up the abuse of children. If you're Catholic, then help me understand why do you continually support the church? Why isn't there pressure put on the church to punished clergy who abuse children? Why isn't there pressure to reconcile with victims who have been abused by clergy? It seems like this topic is often times push under the rug when I'm in the company of other Catholics. Us Catholics come together for numerous issues (abortion, poverty, immigration, etc.) However, when it comes to clergy abuse its like silence. No one wants to touch this issue. The Vatican is so powerful that even our government, The Supreme Court, and folks in Congress are afraid to touch this issue. We can hunt down Bin Laden, but we can't prosecute or find pedophile priests? Our government can go head to toe with some of the most vile criminals or terrorists around the world, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? We can nuke places off the face of the earth, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? Even when I try to discuss this issue with some of the priests that I know they become extremely uncomfortable and try to change the subject. I was looking at the crowd during the Walk For Life March this year. I was wondering, "It will be great to see a crowd like this to stand up against clergy abuse here at home around the world. A March Against Clergy Abuse, raising money for victim's legal fees and therapy would be great!" I'm at a lost for words and my heart is truly broke. I even told my husband today that, "I'm not sure if I want to remain Catholic because the Vatican creates a safety bubble for clergy who abuse children." Many of the monsters who have abused children are hiding out with the comforts of retirement. While their victims have yet to get justice and families of deceased love ones are still waiting for justice. Does this upset you as a Catholic? Does it make you angry with God or the church? Help me understand how can many of us (myself included) support the Catholic Church?

I'm at a crossroads here. To leave the Catholic faith equates to rejecting my family, my friends, my culture, my customs, and everything that makes me who I am as a person. I love being a Catholic. It has shaped me into the person that I am today. However, the child abuse issue is not something that I can tolerate or remain silent about. I'm not sure if anyone else has felt this way or not. If you have felt this way, did you leave the church or did you choose to stay?

I'm not Catholic but I have great admiration for Catholics. First off, all Xtians were Catholics until the Reformation. It is the original egalitarian religion. Catholics brought us Western Civilization, music, art, architecture, medicine, universities: none would have had a prayer without the church. To this day the Catholics do more to build communities and help the poor and needy than any organization on earth. None of this excuses the many sins of the church, but humans are deeply flawed by their nature, thus any organization run by humans will be deeply flawed.

This sounds like whitewashing child rape by saying "everybody does it."

[Anonymous]

OP, there are two entities to be concerned with, first, the worldwide Catholic Church/Rome and all the stuff that comes with that, but second, the local, day-to-day parish and people and priests you are involved with.

I have issues with the worldwide church, which has a lot of dysfunctionality. However; my local parish has awesome priests, great families, and is not dysfunctional at all--it's a high functioning entity. My kids have a healthy, caring nurturing environment with great teachers and parents who are living the 'it takes a village' mentality. My kids are building good character and getting a moral compass. I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater. And the bathwater is Rome, not my little parish. I've talked about this to my local priest and he gets it.

That being said, obviously the two are connected, and there are some serious issues that have to be dealt with, and I'm not excusing it. If you cannot reconcile it, try Episcopalian. My DH is Episcopalian and we started in an E. school because my kids were starting school when the priest scandals were breaking. It was good in a variety of ways for our values--and I liked having married priests and women priests. However; that particular parish had some issues (not relevant to this story) that drove me bonkers, and we ended up at the Catholic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First, I'm not a troll or an angry atheist. I'm a life long Catholic trying to understand why do I remain in the Catholic church. All the recent articles and documentaries about the rampant sexual abuse within the church really upsets me. I'm saddened and hurt whenever I come across an article about clergy abusing a child. I spent years working as a child advocate and a crisis counselor dealing with abused children. However, I feel like a hypocrite because I support an institution which covers up the abuse of children. If you're Catholic, then help me understand why do you continually support the church? Why isn't there pressure put on the church to punished clergy who abuse children? Why isn't there pressure to reconcile with victims who have been abused by clergy? It seems like this topic is often times push under the rug when I'm in the company of other Catholics. Us Catholics come together for numerous issues (abortion, poverty, immigration, etc.) However, when it comes to clergy abuse its like silence. No one wants to touch this issue. The Vatican is so powerful that even our government, The Supreme Court, and folks in Congress are afraid to touch this issue. We can hunt down Bin Laden, but we can't prosecute or find pedophile priests? Our government can go head to toe with some of the most vile criminals or terrorists around the world, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? We can nuke places off the face of the earth, but we can't prosecute pedophile priests? Even when I try to discuss this issue with some of the priests that I know they become extremely uncomfortable and try to change the subject. I was looking at the crowd during the Walk For Life March this year. I was wondering, "It will be great to see a crowd like this to stand up against clergy abuse here at home around the world. A March Against Clergy Abuse, raising money for victim's legal fees and therapy would be great!" I'm at a lost for words and my heart is truly broke. I even told my husband today that, "I'm not sure if I want to remain Catholic because the Vatican creates a safety bubble for clergy who abuse children." Many of the monsters who have abused children are hiding out with the comforts of retirement. While their victims have yet to get justice and families of deceased love ones are still waiting for justice. Does this upset you as a Catholic? Does it make you angry with God or the church? Help me understand how can many of us (myself included) support the Catholic Church?

I'm at a crossroads here. To leave the Catholic faith equates to rejecting my family, my friends, my culture, my customs, and everything that makes me who I am as a person. I love being a Catholic. It has shaped me into the person that I am today. However, the child abuse issue is not something that I can tolerate or remain silent about. I'm not sure if anyone else has felt this way or not. If you have felt this way, did you leave the church or did you choose to stay?

You are more than catholic. Many have left and kept their friends and family and even maintained many customs and practices.

The easy solitaire is to join the episcopal church. Very similar religious traditions as the Catholic Church without the child abuse scandals.

[Anonymous]

Here's a perfect example from a few days ago:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/religion/vatican-diplomat-recalled-amid-child-porn-investigation/2017/09/15/9d6ea646-9a0b-11e7-af6a-6555caaeb8dc_story.html?utm_term=.107a2f1b40b9

A Vatican embassy priest in DC faced charges of child porn, so what does the Vatican do? They recall him back to Rome instead of allowing him to face charges in the US.

He is a diplomat with immunity, but his country can choose to have his immunity waived... instead they send him back.

Now this wasn't abuse directly of a child in this case, but how does that look?

I'm Catholic and I thought the era of cover-ups was over after the scandals a few years ago, but apparently not.

[Anonymous]

Good will triumph over evil, and the scandal will be wiped from our church. It end no other way.

In the meantime, keep praying and working his vineyard in your parish!

You are the living embodiment of the baptismal promise made by your parents, and you'll never be true at home breaking that promise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Good will triumph over evil, and the scandal will be wiped from our church. It end no other way.

In the meantime, keep praying and working his vineyard in your parish!

You are the living embodiment of the baptismal promise made by your parents, and you'll never be true at home breaking that promise.

What about the promise the church made to its children? Typical catholic guilt trip.

[Anonymous]

I am culturally Catholic, but do not practice or donate regularly.

All organized religions have the potential for abuse, OP. You need to understand this.

For the specific issue you are talking about, it will take many years to root out the old generation of priests who have been trained to protect their ilk from the law. They're an old men's club completely removed from reality. It's a good sign that our current Pope is willing to make some modest changes, but real progress won't happen until the boys who entered the Church after the scandals, are at the helm.

And if they could welcome women and married priests, I might even toddle over with my checkbook every Sunday
Probably not in my lifetime, though.

[Anonymous]

There are several ways to stay in the church despite the child sex scandal-- denying it, rationalizing it or not caring about it.

If none of those work for you, then you can choose to leave the church.