McLean to Explore Separating from FC & FCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just noting this...
https://www.vox.com/2019/9/6/20853091/school-secession-racial-segregation-louisiana-alabama

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households. Those differences mean that when a splinter district breaks off it can reinforce, and in some cases worsen, school segregation.

If you think this just happens in the South...looking at Mass (where there is an active, voluntary program (METCO) to try to integrate schools across districts), here are the Boston/Newton numbers...with METCO students included.

Boston:
42.5% Hispanic
33% Black
14% White
9% Asian

Newton: (METCO enrollment about 3% of overall total)
8% Hispanic
5% Black
61% White
19% Asian


Overview of METCO https://theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/04/boston-metco-program-school-desegregation/584224/

that's why this won't happen. McLean can most likely get Town status pretty easily, but moving from Town to City status is a lot harder and much more difficult politically

But the schools impacted would not change the current racial makeup. At least not initially.

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households.

You posting this doesn't not make it any less true that McLean's demographics are what they are. Whether they are included in FCPS statistics or not the kids on the eastern end of the county do not have access to McLean schools. What good is McLean doing them on the opposite end of the county, other than McLean providing tax dollars? The demographics don't change. It would be moving numbers around on paper without any actual impact to students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, they can’t invest the same money in McLean that they are investing in other less overcrowded schools because they might want to change the demographics there so more URMs can enjoy a shitty modular and trailers like the kids at McLean? No wonder FCPS is cratering.

they just invested it in Langley. You're district got a massive renovation, now other districts get massive renovations, McLean will probably be in the next group

What "district"? The only district now is FCPS, and within FCPS Langley and McLean are in different regions (Langley - Region 1; McLean - Region 2), not that it should matter. And FCPS has steadfastly refused to offer McLean any capital investment other than a second-hand modular when less overcrowded schools built after McLean are getting architect-designed, permanent additions that will end up costly about $20M.

It's hard to take the "pipe down" posts seriously when they are based on bad assumptions. We've been trying to get FCPS's attention for years. First they lied to us, then they ignored us, and soon they will try and cram a boundary change with Langley down our throats that will leave McLean with fewer teachers, fewer electives, and an aging infrastructure. They are hurting our community and we are tired of being played. If there is ANY way to exit Fairfax County and FCPS, we will pursue it.

Dranesville- the electoral district that comprises Langley and McLea. Both schools have the same representative, maybe the Langley parents are better at lobbying

Except McLean has a ton of kids from Providence District, funding has never been allocated based on magisterial district, and Langley got renovated because it was due, not because it was "lobbying" harder. I have no idea what point you are trying to make other than it's somehow our fault that we're getting screwed by FCPS, but even if you assume that's the case, then finally pushing back harder would be the right response.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just noting this...
https://www.vox.com/2019/9/6/20853091/school-secession-racial-segregation-louisiana-alabama

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households. Those differences mean that when a splinter district breaks off it can reinforce, and in some cases worsen, school segregation.

If you think this just happens in the South...looking at Mass (where there is an active, voluntary program (METCO) to try to integrate schools across districts), here are the Boston/Newton numbers...with METCO students included.

Boston:
42.5% Hispanic
33% Black
14% White
9% Asian

Newton: (METCO enrollment about 3% of overall total)
8% Hispanic
5% Black
61% White
19% Asian


Overview of METCO https://theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/04/boston-metco-program-school-desegregation/584224/

that's why this won't happen. McLean can most likely get Town status pretty easily, but moving from Town to City status is a lot harder and much more difficult politically

But the schools impacted would not change the current racial makeup. At least not initially.

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households.

You posting this doesn't not make it any less true that McLean's demographics are what they are. Whether they are included in FCPS statistics or not the kids on the eastern end of the county do not have access to McLean schools. What good is McLean doing them on the opposite end of the county, other than McLean providing tax dollars? The demographics don't change. It would be moving numbers around on paper without any actual impact to students.

yes, the rich people fleeing results in a poorer more segregated district, that's the whole point of the article

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, they can’t invest the same money in McLean that they are investing in other less overcrowded schools because they might want to change the demographics there so more URMs can enjoy a shitty modular and trailers like the kids at McLean? No wonder FCPS is cratering.

they just invested it in Langley. You're district got a massive renovation, now other districts get massive renovations, McLean will probably be in the next group

What "district"? The only district now is FCPS, and within FCPS Langley and McLean are in different regions (Langley - Region 1; McLean - Region 2), not that it should matter. And FCPS has steadfastly refused to offer McLean any capital investment other than a second-hand modular when less overcrowded schools built after McLean are getting architect-designed, permanent additions that will end up costly about $20M.

It's hard to take the "pipe down" posts seriously when they are based on bad assumptions. We've been trying to get FCPS's attention for years. First they lied to us, then they ignored us, and soon they will try and cram a boundary change with Langley down our throats that will leave McLean with fewer teachers, fewer electives, and an aging infrastructure. They are hurting our community and we are tired of being played. If there is ANY way to exit Fairfax County and FCPS, we will pursue it.

Dranesville- the electoral district that comprises Langley and McLea. Both schools have the same representative, maybe the Langley parents are better at lobbying

Except McLean has a ton of kids from Providence District, funding has never been allocated based on magisterial district, and Langley got renovated because it was due, not because it was "lobbying" harder. I have no idea what point you are trying to make other than it's somehow our fault that we're getting screwed by FCPS, but even if you assume that's the case, then finally pushing back harder would be the right response.

high school renovations have always been based on pressure from school board reps. You either elect bad politicians, or the Langley parents in your district are more effective

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, they can’t invest the same money in McLean that they are investing in other less overcrowded schools because they might want to change the demographics there so more URMs can enjoy a shitty modular and trailers like the kids at McLean? No wonder FCPS is cratering.

they just invested it in Langley. You're district got a massive renovation, now other districts get massive renovations, McLean will probably be in the next group

What "district"? The only district now is FCPS, and within FCPS Langley and McLean are in different regions (Langley - Region 1; McLean - Region 2), not that it should matter. And FCPS has steadfastly refused to offer McLean any capital investment other than a second-hand modular when less overcrowded schools built after McLean are getting architect-designed, permanent additions that will end up costly about $20M.

It's hard to take the "pipe down" posts seriously when they are based on bad assumptions. We've been trying to get FCPS's attention for years. First they lied to us, then they ignored us, and soon they will try and cram a boundary change with Langley down our throats that will leave McLean with fewer teachers, fewer electives, and an aging infrastructure. They are hurting our community and we are tired of being played. If there is ANY way to exit Fairfax County and FCPS, we will pursue it.

Dranesville- the electoral district that comprises Langley and McLea. Both schools have the same representative, maybe the Langley parents are better at lobbying

Except McLean has a ton of kids from Providence District, funding has never been allocated based on magisterial district, and Langley got renovated because it was due, not because it was "lobbying" harder. I have no idea what point you are trying to make other than it's somehow our fault that we're getting screwed by FCPS, but even if you assume that's the case, then finally pushing back harder would be the right response.

high school renovations have always been based on pressure from school board reps. You either elect bad politicians, or the Langley parents in your district are more effective

Yep, like you said, it's all our fault.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, they can’t invest the same money in McLean that they are investing in other less overcrowded schools because they might want to change the demographics there so more URMs can enjoy a shitty modular and trailers like the kids at McLean? No wonder FCPS is cratering.

they just invested it in Langley. You're district got a massive renovation, now other districts get massive renovations, McLean will probably be in the next group

What "district"? The only district now is FCPS, and within FCPS Langley and McLean are in different regions (Langley - Region 1; McLean - Region 2), not that it should matter. And FCPS has steadfastly refused to offer McLean any capital investment other than a second-hand modular when less overcrowded schools built after McLean are getting architect-designed, permanent additions that will end up costly about $20M.

It's hard to take the "pipe down" posts seriously when they are based on bad assumptions. We've been trying to get FCPS's attention for years. First they lied to us, then they ignored us, and soon they will try and cram a boundary change with Langley down our throats that will leave McLean with fewer teachers, fewer electives, and an aging infrastructure. They are hurting our community and we are tired of being played. If there is ANY way to exit Fairfax County and FCPS, we will pursue it.

Dranesville- the electoral district that comprises Langley and McLea. Both schools have the same representative, maybe the Langley parents are better at lobbying

Except McLean has a ton of kids from Providence District, funding has never been allocated based on magisterial district, and Langley got renovated because it was due, not because it was "lobbying" harder. I have no idea what point you are trying to make other than it's somehow our fault that we're getting screwed by FCPS, but even if you assume that's the case, then finally pushing back harder would be the right response.

high school renovations have always been based on pressure from school board reps. You either elect bad politicians, or the Langley parents in your district are more effective

Yep, like you said, it's all our fault.

try voting for someone with a platform of renovating Mclean and nothing else. Voting for someone with a broad political agenda results in a rep with a broad political agenda. Voting for a rep running on a single issue results in a white elephant renovation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just noting this...
https://www.vox.com/2019/9/6/20853091/school-secession-racial-segregation-louisiana-alabama

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households. Those differences mean that when a splinter district breaks off it can reinforce, and in some cases worsen, school segregation.

If you think this just happens in the South...looking at Mass (where there is an active, voluntary program (METCO) to try to integrate schools across districts), here are the Boston/Newton numbers...with METCO students included.

Boston:
42.5% Hispanic
33% Black
14% White
9% Asian

Newton: (METCO enrollment about 3% of overall total)
8% Hispanic
5% Black
61% White
19% Asian


Overview of METCO https://theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/04/boston-metco-program-school-desegregation/584224/

that's why this won't happen. McLean can most likely get Town status pretty easily, but moving from Town to City status is a lot harder and much more difficult politically

But the schools impacted would not change the current racial makeup. At least not initially.

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households.

You posting this doesn't not make it any less true that McLean's demographics are what they are. Whether they are included in FCPS statistics or not the kids on the eastern end of the county do not have access to McLean schools. What good is McLean doing them on the opposite end of the county, other than McLean providing tax dollars? The demographics don't change. It would be moving numbers around on paper without any actual impact to students.

yes, the rich people fleeing results in a poorer more segregated district, that's the whole point of the article

I can't tell if you're intentionally not seeing the forest for the trees or what.

McLean is already so physically isolated from the more "diverse" areas of the county that it makes no difference except on paper if they separate. Or are you actually saying that you just want to keep McLean taxes solely for the financial security it provides for everyone else? If that is what is being said, just come out with it instead of hiding behind "demographics" as a roadblock.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, they can’t invest the same money in McLean that they are investing in other less overcrowded schools because they might want to change the demographics there so more URMs can enjoy a shitty modular and trailers like the kids at McLean? No wonder FCPS is cratering.

they just invested it in Langley. You're district got a massive renovation, now other districts get massive renovations, McLean will probably be in the next group

What "district"? The only district now is FCPS, and within FCPS Langley and McLean are in different regions (Langley - Region 1; McLean - Region 2), not that it should matter. And FCPS has steadfastly refused to offer McLean any capital investment other than a second-hand modular when less overcrowded schools built after McLean are getting architect-designed, permanent additions that will end up costly about $20M.

It's hard to take the "pipe down" posts seriously when they are based on bad assumptions. We've been trying to get FCPS's attention for years. First they lied to us, then they ignored us, and soon they will try and cram a boundary change with Langley down our throats that will leave McLean with fewer teachers, fewer electives, and an aging infrastructure. They are hurting our community and we are tired of being played. If there is ANY way to exit Fairfax County and FCPS, we will pursue it.

Dranesville- the electoral district that comprises Langley and McLea. Both schools have the same representative, maybe the Langley parents are better at lobbying

Except McLean has a ton of kids from Providence District, funding has never been allocated based on magisterial district, and Langley got renovated because it was due, not because it was "lobbying" harder. I have no idea what point you are trying to make other than it's somehow our fault that we're getting screwed by FCPS, but even if you assume that's the case, then finally pushing back harder would be the right response.

high school renovations have always been based on pressure from school board reps. You either elect bad politicians, or the Langley parents in your district are more effective

Yep, like you said, it's all our fault.

try voting for someone with a platform of renovating Mclean and nothing else. Voting for someone with a broad political agenda results in a rep with a broad political agenda. Voting for a rep running on a single issue results in a white elephant renovation

Hard to see how it would be a "white elephant" addition when McLean's enrollment has been increasing (pre-Covid) and the boundaries include areas in Tysons, West Falls Church and the central McLean business district that have all seen or are slated for development.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just noting this...
https://www.vox.com/2019/9/6/20853091/school-secession-racial-segregation-louisiana-alabama

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households. Those differences mean that when a splinter district breaks off it can reinforce, and in some cases worsen, school segregation.

If you think this just happens in the South...looking at Mass (where there is an active, voluntary program (METCO) to try to integrate schools across districts), here are the Boston/Newton numbers...with METCO students included.

Boston:
42.5% Hispanic
33% Black
14% White
9% Asian

Newton: (METCO enrollment about 3% of overall total)
8% Hispanic
5% Black
61% White
19% Asian


Overview of METCO https://theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/04/boston-metco-program-school-desegregation/584224/

that's why this won't happen. McLean can most likely get Town status pretty easily, but moving from Town to City status is a lot harder and much more difficult politically

But the schools impacted would not change the current racial makeup. At least not initially.

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households.

You posting this doesn't not make it any less true that McLean's demographics are what they are. Whether they are included in FCPS statistics or not the kids on the eastern end of the county do not have access to McLean schools. What good is McLean doing them on the opposite end of the county, other than McLean providing tax dollars? The demographics don't change. It would be moving numbers around on paper without any actual impact to students.

yes, the rich people fleeing results in a poorer more segregated district, that's the whole point of the article

I can't tell if you're intentionally not seeing the forest for the trees or what.

McLean is already so physically isolated from the more "diverse" areas of the county that it makes no difference except on paper if they separate. Or are you actually saying that you just want to keep McLean taxes solely for the financial security it provides for everyone else? If that is what is being said, just come out with it instead of hiding behind "demographics" as a roadblock.

that's the whole point of the article. I guess reading isn't a strong point? Schools like hybla valley depends on tax payers from other parts of the county. When those tax payers leave, the poor schools get poorer. It's not a difficult concept. McLean may have a good argument, but McLean can't make the decision unilaterally, and the state commission is going to care about the schools like Woodlawn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just noting this...
https://www.vox.com/2019/9/6/20853091/school-secession-racial-segregation-louisiana-alabama

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households. Those differences mean that when a splinter district breaks off it can reinforce, and in some cases worsen, school segregation.

If you think this just happens in the South...looking at Mass (where there is an active, voluntary program (METCO) to try to integrate schools across districts), here are the Boston/Newton numbers...with METCO students included.

Boston:
42.5% Hispanic
33% Black
14% White
9% Asian

Newton: (METCO enrollment about 3% of overall total)
8% Hispanic
5% Black
61% White
19% Asian


Overview of METCO https://theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/04/boston-metco-program-school-desegregation/584224/

that's why this won't happen. McLean can most likely get Town status pretty easily, but moving from Town to City status is a lot harder and much more difficult politically

But the schools impacted would not change the current racial makeup. At least not initially.

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households.

You posting this doesn't not make it any less true that McLean's demographics are what they are. Whether they are included in FCPS statistics or not the kids on the eastern end of the county do not have access to McLean schools. What good is McLean doing them on the opposite end of the county, other than McLean providing tax dollars? The demographics don't change. It would be moving numbers around on paper without any actual impact to students.

yes, the rich people fleeing results in a poorer more segregated district, that's the whole point of the article

I can't tell if you're intentionally not seeing the forest for the trees or what.

McLean is already so physically isolated from the more "diverse" areas of the county that it makes no difference except on paper if they separate. Or are you actually saying that you just want to keep McLean taxes solely for the financial security it provides for everyone else? If that is what is being said, just come out with it instead of hiding behind "demographics" as a roadblock.

that's the whole point of the article. I guess reading isn't a strong point? Schools like hybla valley depends on tax payers from other parts of the county. When those tax payers leave, the poor schools get poorer. It's not a difficult concept. McLean may have a good argument, but McLean can't make the decision unilaterally, and the state commission is going to care about the schools like Woodlawn

No, I understand the article perfectly. What you have yet to explain is why funding schools in Hybla Valley is the responsibility of McLean. To be clear, you don't actually care about the demographics of McLean leaving (because removing those demographics would actually boost the diversity as a percentage of the remaining FCPS). You just want McLean tax dollars. Which is what I said previously. Perhaps reading isn't your strong point?

[Anonymous]

If this is true, it's a good illustration of how at least 1/2 the School Board thinks (they were following this rabid account), and why they won't give McLean the time of day.

https://twitter.com/AsraNomani/status/1336026069191827463

[Anonymous]

That's going to be my line when they ask for feedback during tonight's community meeting: "You think I give a [expletive] about Scotty B."

Good enough for teachers, good enough for parents. LOL.

[Anonymous]

I can't believe FCPS is associated with these clowns.

How embarrassing. We've fallen pretty far.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just noting this...
https://www.vox.com/2019/9/6/20853091/school-secession-racial-segregation-louisiana-alabama

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households. Those differences mean that when a splinter district breaks off it can reinforce, and in some cases worsen, school segregation.

If you think this just happens in the South...looking at Mass (where there is an active, voluntary program (METCO) to try to integrate schools across districts), here are the Boston/Newton numbers...with METCO students included.

Boston:
42.5% Hispanic
33% Black
14% White
9% Asian

Newton: (METCO enrollment about 3% of overall total)
8% Hispanic
5% Black
61% White
19% Asian


Overview of METCO https://theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/04/boston-metco-program-school-desegregation/584224/

that's why this won't happen. McLean can most likely get Town status pretty easily, but moving from Town to City status is a lot harder and much more difficult politically

But the schools impacted would not change the current racial makeup. At least not initially.

But the study finds that these moves largely have a racial and economic impact: the smaller districts created through the secession process are usually whiter and have more affluent residents than the districts they leave behind, which are larger, have more nonwhite students, and more students in low-income or impoverished households.

You posting this doesn't not make it any less true that McLean's demographics are what they are. Whether they are included in FCPS statistics or not the kids on the eastern end of the county do not have access to McLean schools. What good is McLean doing them on the opposite end of the county, other than McLean providing tax dollars? The demographics don't change. It would be moving numbers around on paper without any actual impact to students.

yes, the rich people fleeing results in a poorer more segregated district, that's the whole point of the article

I can't tell if you're intentionally not seeing the forest for the trees or what.

McLean is already so physically isolated from the more "diverse" areas of the county that it makes no difference except on paper if they separate. Or are you actually saying that you just want to keep McLean taxes solely for the financial security it provides for everyone else? If that is what is being said, just come out with it instead of hiding behind "demographics" as a roadblock.

Both points are true. Other parts of the country have already experienced these changes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:More info than you may want but here is CIP published in DEC 2019 (2020 CIP must be coming soon)

https://www.fcps.edu/sites/default/files/media/pdf/Proposed-CIP-FY-2021-25_1.pdf

Table on page 60 of HS capacity with and without modulars

Thanks for this, but I'm a bit confused by the McLean numbers... it shows the same utilization levels in both 19-20 and 24-25 with and without modulars? How is that possible unless McLean had no modulars (both now and planned for the future)? But it already HAS modulars.

Holding that issue with the numbers aside, order-of-magnitude-wise if they can shift ~20% of McLean students to Langley then both schools settle in around 100% utilization, and presumably McLean would be able to remove most of its current modulars. And it sounds like the main sticking point here is the feeder MS not wanting to be split, which means they needed to wait to get the MS capacities aligned to support the new HS capacities (in particular, adding capacity at Cooper... which is funded). So isn't that the "plan" for addressing the McLean overcrowding issue? 69k new sf of space at Cooper, currently starting the construction process, not sure when the classroom space comes online but entire project to be completed in 2.5 years... then they make the boundary swap? And in the meantime McLean has to make due to with additional modulars and loss of certain facilities (tennis courts), which sucks, but it's not as if there's "no plan", right? It's just that people (in particular, parents of current MS/HS-aged students zoned for McLean HS) don't like the plan because it doesn't move fast enough for them (which I am sympathetic to, as this was easily foreseeable should have been addressed sooner, but FCPS planning is poor), right?