FCPS HS Boundary

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The best nugget of info out of this meeting (because boundary adjustments are a foregone conclusion) is from Dr. Reid's response to Mateo Dunne's question about boundary changes: she stated that HS boundaries will not change much at all, and most of the boundary changes will be at the ES level.

That’s interesting, I wonder why they decided to do that. Most kids attend the closest ES unless they’re at a split feeder or in an attendance island. The kids who have a long ES bus ride would have one regardless because they live in a far-flung area like Clifton or Great Falls. Or they’re getting bussed to the AAP center …

This is false. Anyone with eyes can look at a map of the school boundaries to see lots of elementary schools completely disconnected from their communities.

Such as??

Westbriar, Keene Mill, Flint Hill, Sangster, etc.

The one no-brainer move coming from a savant who spends too much time on Zillow and has no dog in the fight, the Groveland/Green Garland drive area zoned for Sangster will move to Newington Forest and will become part of the South County pyramid.

I can see that happening, although that’s a really small neighborhood that probably won’t make too much of a difference either way.

As a Lorton resident I wonder if the infamous Hagel Circle will continue to get bussed past 95 to Halley or if they will get sent to the much closer Gunston. That’s a hot potato.

I was shocked to learn that Hagel Ct students didn’t go to Lorton Station ES. It’s only a mile away!

That’s one of the equity bussing situations. Sending those kids to the comparatively rich Halley makes Halley and Gunston both around 40% FARMS, and Lorton Station around 55%. Otherwise Halley would have demographics similar to Silverbrook which has single digit FARMS, and Gunston or Lorton Station would be much higher needs.

I imagine if they changed it it would be to send those kids to Gunston so they can stay at South County, as opposed to Lorton Station/Hayfield. But also, without that big neighborhood Halley’s population would drop quite a bit and there’s really nowhere for them to pick up kids from since that is not a growth area of the county.

This may have been their intention when they assigned these attendance islands, but they’re seeing the negative impacts. If kids miss the bus, they’re likely missing school that day, when in some cases, there’s another elementary school within walking distance.

Very true and I’m sure there is a lot of absenteeism coming from that area. A lot of families don’t have cars. If the kid misses the school bus there’s no way to get them to school.

+ 1 never thought of this but I’m positive this is happening.

These are the types of nuances that people who support “keeping things the same” don’t think about. I’m glad that the school board is taking a look at this in a holistic way. Issues like chronic absenteeism only put kids in that community further and further behind, which leads to more stress on the educators and other school resources.

You don’t know what nuance I think about. You’re just throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I don’t have to throw anything, the motion passed so it’s “up and it’s stuck” already! That reference will likely over your head, it just means your whining is pointless at this point. You should focus that energy on opening up your mind to the possibilities now, since this is no longer a question of IF but WHEN and HOW.

Gloat as much as you want. They’re well on their way to destroying the county schools. Those of us with money will leave, those of us like you will just be stuck with lower SES schools and will never stop your pathetic whining.

That’s the nuance that YOU and your SJW friends don’t think about. Oops.

Oh we did and…WE DO NOT CARE. You think you’re the only one in the county with money? ALL of the houses in FFX cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It’s just empty threats until/unless it happens and even then, things will be fine. Your house will be snapped up quickly and life will go on.

I have to agree. Houses will still be bought for location, etc. Some of the new buyers will simply expect to go private from the get go unlike whose who had the rug pulled out from under them.

Others will embrace the chance to let their child see how the other half lives so they don’t have to hear them whining about having Izumi for dinner AGAIN.

What I would implore any SJW, economically challenged ideologues on this board to do, is looking at property sales over the next few years in the jurisdictions that are at high risk of getting redistricted. You’ll of course try to spin the ensuing drop as something else, but we all know that the number one reason that people buy their houses is for the schools.

I know you don’t care, but each drop represents a loss for the county, both directly and indirectly.

Ok, hypothetically:
Boundary changes happen and now more poor and diverse kids go to your pyramid. GreatSchools score takes a hit on Zillow. The ultra-wealthy from California and Seattle now refuse to pay 300k over the assessment for homes in your neighborhood. This leaves room for younger mid-grade federal employees and other public servants, from teachers to custodians, to buy and live and work in Fairfax County, just like they used to in the 90s.

How has your own child's education specifically been negatively impacted?

How my own child's education is impacted: now my kid is moving between 10th and 11th grade, completely loses continuity with her school clubs and sports and social groups/friends. Academically, everything is unfamiliar from the courses and path to graduation to the teachers who teach them. She is now exposed to more disciplinary problems, drugs, gang members (yes, not an exaggeration, they are a reality at Lewis). There is no explanation that paints a silver lining for her. But I will make sure she understands there are SJWs who believe she and her cohort are educational martyrs who are fixing the system for FARMS kids and no one else will have to go through what she is going through.

In terms of academics, it’s not just that it is unfamiliar it’s that many advanced courses may not even be available. At least one school board member made this point last night. Not committing to grandfather rising juniors tells me moving them is on the table. Junior year is critical for college admissions and the fact that the school board as whole will not commit to supporting at least that one cohort is disappointing to say the least.

They ended up carrying over the language in the existing Policy 8130 on phasing and grandfathering verbatim.

Of course, part of the rationale for revising the policy was they claimed it was too open-ended and that they wanted to provide clearer direction as to which factors were important.

Having done that, it was a punt not to provide a more specific commitment with respect to phasing or grandfathering. Their refusal to do so does, in fact, mean they wanted to leave Reid with the flexibility to come back with a proposal that would actually move HS students from their existing schools to new schools. There is no other way to interpret it.

However, if Reid actually were to come back and propose this, it’s not clear she could get seven votes. It appears at least five members would oppose it (R. Anderson, Lady, McElveen, Meren, and Moon) and least one other member who signed on this in theory last night might balk at signing off on it in practice, when the stakes are higher.

I hope that’s true. I said previously on this thread, and I really mean it, I’m willing to send my younger child to Lewis as a 9th grader where he can start knowing what’s there, making friends, creating and joining clubs and sports, and hopefully his and others’ academic needs will be met as they come. But I will look into other options if they move my older child his junior year. That’s just not right.

Exactly. This is the situation we are in as well. There is no way I can "advocate for change" and have it possibly make a difference for my rising junior. Meren even expressed this concern and favored limited grandfathering for this reason. There will most likely be a lag in Lewis' ability to offer AP and DE classes. Not all teachers can teach those courses. For AP, you need to be AP certified for that specific course and for DE you need to have the required graduate credits in that content area to teach it, typically 18 credits. When my youngest is in 9th grade, there is a good chance that the course offerings would have improved, and they will likely not experience the loss of opportunities in terms of sports and leadership positions my junior would. Heck, I'm not even arguing against boundary changes. I'm just advocating to do them in way that makes sense geographically and at a bare minimum to try mitigate the harm to kids in the "move zone" at critical times in their academic career. There is a whole lot of space between digging in your heals against any boundary changes and saying "whatever, move 'em all, they'll be fine." I see the need for some changes but just want to see it done in a way that minimizes harm. Rising juniors are the ones who arguably would be harmed the most in a forced move.

Also, no this is not the same as a family choosing to move. Families in the demographic that is going to likely get moved would research the area and prioritize schools in terms of certain measures of quality, to include advanced course offerings, and if possible time those moves in a way that is least disruptive to their kids. Don't bring up military kids. I've worked in DODEA schools, and while many thrive and excel, and most are okay, there is a subset that ARE NOT okay and suffer mental health challenges unlike any I've seen in other schools. Luckily, those schools have much more robust mental health services available. Ask any military family, and they will say the moves get harder the older the kids get. Many time their retirements to avoid moving during high school. A forced move like this is nothing like "oh kids moved all the time, they'll be fine."

While I do not disagree with the need to change boundaries, I do disagree with doing it in a way that does not take into consideration the needs of the kids being moved. That it was what I will advocate for in addition to IMMEDIATE expansions of course offerings in the currently under enrolled schools. I can get behind improving schools and using resources more wisely. I can't get behind a numbers game intended to mask problems without regard for the impact on the higher achieving kids you hope will improve the school.

For the poster who keeps saying "what will you do to improve your new school," what have YOU done to improve your school beyond possibly advocating to move other kids to your school in hopes that it improves the situation?

Fantastic post.

[Anonymous]

I don’t see AP options for juniors as being the worst thing. Most college counselors say colleges judge you based on the offerings at your school so you aren’t penalized for classes it does not offer.

The HUGE HUGE problem with not grandfathering juniors is that it will be super hard for them to achieve leadership roles for their college applications when they will only be there for 1 year before the typical leadership year of Senior year. And it’s not uncommon for kids involved in something since 9th to have leadership roles by 11th too. It’s the extracurricular portion of their applications that will be absolutely decimated.

[Anonymous]

^ adding on…skip the 8th grade grandfathering if needed. It’s 11 and 12 where it’s absolutely essential.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP not really following this but have they actually said they would move kids in the middle of their schooling (ie in 8th or after 9th) or is this just conjecture?

I thought boundary changes are typically applied to new incoming classes while students already in the school are able to complete their time at that particular school

They openly stated and adopted a policy that only offers grandfathering to rising seniors, rising 8th graders, and rising 6th graders.

Rising sophomores and juniors will move mid-high school with zero grandfathering.

Families will have their senior at West Springfield High School and the junior, sophomore or freshman sibling at Lewis.

2 kids, same family, same house, same neighborhood, and vastly different education quality, peer group , programs and opportunities.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The best nugget of info out of this meeting (because boundary adjustments are a foregone conclusion) is from Dr. Reid's response to Mateo Dunne's question about boundary changes: she stated that HS boundaries will not change much at all, and most of the boundary changes will be at the ES level.

That’s interesting, I wonder why they decided to do that. Most kids attend the closest ES unless they’re at a split feeder or in an attendance island. The kids who have a long ES bus ride would have one regardless because they live in a far-flung area like Clifton or Great Falls. Or they’re getting bussed to the AAP center …

This is false. Anyone with eyes can look at a map of the school boundaries to see lots of elementary schools completely disconnected from their communities.

Such as??

Westbriar, Keene Mill, Flint Hill, Sangster, etc.

The one no-brainer move coming from a savant who spends too much time on Zillow and has no dog in the fight, the Groveland/Green Garland drive area zoned for Sangster will move to Newington Forest and will become part of the South County pyramid.

I can see that happening, although that’s a really small neighborhood that probably won’t make too much of a difference either way.

As a Lorton resident I wonder if the infamous Hagel Circle will continue to get bussed past 95 to Halley or if they will get sent to the much closer Gunston. That’s a hot potato.

I was shocked to learn that Hagel Ct students didn’t go to Lorton Station ES. It’s only a mile away!

That’s one of the equity bussing situations. Sending those kids to the comparatively rich Halley makes Halley and Gunston both around 40% FARMS, and Lorton Station around 55%. Otherwise Halley would have demographics similar to Silverbrook which has single digit FARMS, and Gunston or Lorton Station would be much higher needs.

I imagine if they changed it it would be to send those kids to Gunston so they can stay at South County, as opposed to Lorton Station/Hayfield. But also, without that big neighborhood Halley’s population would drop quite a bit and there’s really nowhere for them to pick up kids from since that is not a growth area of the county.

This may have been their intention when they assigned these attendance islands, but they’re seeing the negative impacts. If kids miss the bus, they’re likely missing school that day, when in some cases, there’s another elementary school within walking distance.

Very true and I’m sure there is a lot of absenteeism coming from that area. A lot of families don’t have cars. If the kid misses the school bus there’s no way to get them to school.

+ 1 never thought of this but I’m positive this is happening.

These are the types of nuances that people who support “keeping things the same” don’t think about. I’m glad that the school board is taking a look at this in a holistic way. Issues like chronic absenteeism only put kids in that community further and further behind, which leads to more stress on the educators and other school resources.

You don’t know what nuance I think about. You’re just throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I don’t have to throw anything, the motion passed so it’s “up and it’s stuck” already! That reference will likely over your head, it just means your whining is pointless at this point. You should focus that energy on opening up your mind to the possibilities now, since this is no longer a question of IF but WHEN and HOW.

Gloat as much as you want. They’re well on their way to destroying the county schools. Those of us with money will leave, those of us like you will just be stuck with lower SES schools and will never stop your pathetic whining.

That’s the nuance that YOU and your SJW friends don’t think about. Oops.

Oh we did and…WE DO NOT CARE. You think you’re the only one in the county with money? ALL of the houses in FFX cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It’s just empty threats until/unless it happens and even then, things will be fine. Your house will be snapped up quickly and life will go on.

I have to agree. Houses will still be bought for location, etc. Some of the new buyers will simply expect to go private from the get go unlike whose who had the rug pulled out from under them.

Others will embrace the chance to let their child see how the other half lives so they don’t have to hear them whining about having Izumi for dinner AGAIN.

What I would implore any SJW, economically challenged ideologues on this board to do, is looking at property sales over the next few years in the jurisdictions that are at high risk of getting redistricted. You’ll of course try to spin the ensuing drop as something else, but we all know that the number one reason that people buy their houses is for the schools.

I know you don’t care, but each drop represents a loss for the county, both directly and indirectly.

Ok, hypothetically:
Boundary changes happen and now more poor and diverse kids go to your pyramid. GreatSchools score takes a hit on Zillow. The ultra-wealthy from California and Seattle now refuse to pay 300k over the assessment for homes in your neighborhood. This leaves room for younger mid-grade federal employees and other public servants, from teachers to custodians, to buy and live and work in Fairfax County, just like they used to in the 90s.

How has your own child's education specifically been negatively impacted?

How my own child's education is impacted: now my kid is moving between 10th and 11th grade, completely loses continuity with her school clubs and sports and social groups/friends. Academically, everything is unfamiliar from the courses and path to graduation to the teachers who teach them. She is now exposed to more disciplinary problems, drugs, gang members (yes, not an exaggeration, they are a reality at Lewis). There is no explanation that paints a silver lining for her. But I will make sure she understands there are SJWs who believe she and her cohort are educational martyrs who are fixing the system for FARMS kids and no one else will have to go through what she is going through.

In terms of academics, it’s not just that it is unfamiliar it’s that many advanced courses may not even be available. At least one school board member made this point last night. Not committing to grandfather rising juniors tells me moving them is on the table. Junior year is critical for college admissions and the fact that the school board as whole will not commit to supporting at least that one cohort is disappointing to say the least.

Advocate for more AP in your new school. Contribute to the community.

It is not our community.

Our community is the school zone we originally purchased int, set roots in, and out kids grew up in.

Agree, the school will be two schools within a school. Especially if the kids at the schools are like their smug petty SJW parents. My kids would want nothing to do with them, and I’d fully support that.

Anyone who actually complies with the school board plan and sends their kids would be best served to go in with a good attitude and do all the things they would have done had they stayed at their chosen school.

Why make life less pleasant for your kid and for you? Buy the school logo gear, join the athletic boosters/choral guild/pta and make it a good time.

If you won’t send your kid, good for you and your kid. But if you are going to enroll them, embrace the experience.

+1 The kids are probably handling this better than parents on here.

Yeah because 1) it’s not their property values or ability to sell that’s potentially being affected and 2) kids don’t necessarily have a full grasp on how bad it would be, academically and in terms of their college apps, to move high schools DURING HIGH SCHOOL. If the SB doesn’t figure out the whole AP vs. IB thing, potentially moving from a school with AP classes to one that doesn’t have them. If a kid was on the most advanced math track, moving to a school that could potentially not accommodate that if there has been no demand in the past for the highest AP math classes. No it’s not the same to take those classes at NVCC - as everyone knows, the quality of teaching is generally better in high school when you’re taught by qualified teachers vs. professors whose specialty is research.

And, those same kids also got screwed at some point in elementary school by a year and a half’s worth of closures due to COVID.

I think allowing grandfathering for both juniors and seniors would mitigate a lot of parental stress about this, and I would like to see 6th graders grandfathered as well so they can finish out ES with their class. If a 9th or 10th grader had to move HS, they would have more than half of HS at the new school and that’s not as bad.

What college said they prefer one high school over another? Show us where colleges say they don’t admit kids that move. Post your source.

It's common sense to anyone who knows anything about college admissions. Strength of schedule matters. We're not talking about just getting into college period, we're taking about the potential options of more advance students being limited due to lack of access to AP and DE courses.

Most of us here are not advocating against the boundary changes. We are arguing to grandfather juniors because that is a critical year in terms of college admissions. You are arguing for the other extreme end of the spectrum from those who say "no boundary changes, period." What is best for the county is a moderate position that takes into account the needs of all students, including those being moved.

Show us your source. Show us a college that says they won’t admit a top kid from a school with less AP.

Oh, and here you go.
https://www.nacacnet.org/factors-in-the-admission-decision/

Where does says kids from a school with less AP don’t get in? Even a lower FCPS school has more AP than most districts in VA. You think kids outside FCPS don’t go to college?

The colleges do not compare your child's rigor of coursework against kids in rural southwestern Virginia.

Colleges compare your child's academic rigor against other students in your geographic area attending high school in Fairfax County.

Colleges also expect your child to have 3 to 4 years of sequential coursework in a single foreign language, particularly the more competitive universities like UVA, VT and W&M.

A WSHS student taking one if the languages not offered at Lewis who is forced to transfer between sophomore and junior year will be significantly dinged in the college application process for only having level 2 as their highest foreign language class completed, particularly if that student is a high achieving student who is trying for acceptance to in state schools of UVA, VT, W&M, a competitive private university, or a competitive out of state university like Michigan.

Not allowing generous grandfathering of enrolled high school students is unacceptable.

In addition, due to the disparity of quality between some of the schools getting rezoned, younger siblingsin a famly should be allowed grandfathering, if the parent provides transportation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ adding on…skip the 8th grade grandfathering if needed. It’s 11 and 12 where it’s absolutely essential.

I don’t know, seems like a selfish post. “As long as my kids aren’t impacted, they can do as they please.”

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The best nugget of info out of this meeting (because boundary adjustments are a foregone conclusion) is from Dr. Reid's response to Mateo Dunne's question about boundary changes: she stated that HS boundaries will not change much at all, and most of the boundary changes will be at the ES level.

That’s interesting, I wonder why they decided to do that. Most kids attend the closest ES unless they’re at a split feeder or in an attendance island. The kids who have a long ES bus ride would have one regardless because they live in a far-flung area like Clifton or Great Falls. Or they’re getting bussed to the AAP center …

This is false. Anyone with eyes can look at a map of the school boundaries to see lots of elementary schools completely disconnected from their communities.

Such as??

Westbriar, Keene Mill, Flint Hill, Sangster, etc.

The one no-brainer move coming from a savant who spends too much time on Zillow and has no dog in the fight, the Groveland/Green Garland drive area zoned for Sangster will move to Newington Forest and will become part of the South County pyramid.

I can see that happening, although that’s a really small neighborhood that probably won’t make too much of a difference either way.

As a Lorton resident I wonder if the infamous Hagel Circle will continue to get bussed past 95 to Halley or if they will get sent to the much closer Gunston. That’s a hot potato.

I was shocked to learn that Hagel Ct students didn’t go to Lorton Station ES. It’s only a mile away!

That’s one of the equity bussing situations. Sending those kids to the comparatively rich Halley makes Halley and Gunston both around 40% FARMS, and Lorton Station around 55%. Otherwise Halley would have demographics similar to Silverbrook which has single digit FARMS, and Gunston or Lorton Station would be much higher needs.

I imagine if they changed it it would be to send those kids to Gunston so they can stay at South County, as opposed to Lorton Station/Hayfield. But also, without that big neighborhood Halley’s population would drop quite a bit and there’s really nowhere for them to pick up kids from since that is not a growth area of the county.

This may have been their intention when they assigned these attendance islands, but they’re seeing the negative impacts. If kids miss the bus, they’re likely missing school that day, when in some cases, there’s another elementary school within walking distance.

Very true and I’m sure there is a lot of absenteeism coming from that area. A lot of families don’t have cars. If the kid misses the school bus there’s no way to get them to school.

+ 1 never thought of this but I’m positive this is happening.

These are the types of nuances that people who support “keeping things the same” don’t think about. I’m glad that the school board is taking a look at this in a holistic way. Issues like chronic absenteeism only put kids in that community further and further behind, which leads to more stress on the educators and other school resources.

You don’t know what nuance I think about. You’re just throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I don’t have to throw anything, the motion passed so it’s “up and it’s stuck” already! That reference will likely over your head, it just means your whining is pointless at this point. You should focus that energy on opening up your mind to the possibilities now, since this is no longer a question of IF but WHEN and HOW.

Gloat as much as you want. They’re well on their way to destroying the county schools. Those of us with money will leave, those of us like you will just be stuck with lower SES schools and will never stop your pathetic whining.

That’s the nuance that YOU and your SJW friends don’t think about. Oops.

Oh we did and…WE DO NOT CARE. You think you’re the only one in the county with money? ALL of the houses in FFX cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It’s just empty threats until/unless it happens and even then, things will be fine. Your house will be snapped up quickly and life will go on.

I have to agree. Houses will still be bought for location, etc. Some of the new buyers will simply expect to go private from the get go unlike whose who had the rug pulled out from under them.

Others will embrace the chance to let their child see how the other half lives so they don’t have to hear them whining about having Izumi for dinner AGAIN.

What I would implore any SJW, economically challenged ideologues on this board to do, is looking at property sales over the next few years in the jurisdictions that are at high risk of getting redistricted. You’ll of course try to spin the ensuing drop as something else, but we all know that the number one reason that people buy their houses is for the schools.

I know you don’t care, but each drop represents a loss for the county, both directly and indirectly.

Ok, hypothetically:
Boundary changes happen and now more poor and diverse kids go to your pyramid. GreatSchools score takes a hit on Zillow. The ultra-wealthy from California and Seattle now refuse to pay 300k over the assessment for homes in your neighborhood. This leaves room for younger mid-grade federal employees and other public servants, from teachers to custodians, to buy and live and work in Fairfax County, just like they used to in the 90s.

How has your own child's education specifically been negatively impacted?

How my own child's education is impacted: now my kid is moving between 10th and 11th grade, completely loses continuity with her school clubs and sports and social groups/friends. Academically, everything is unfamiliar from the courses and path to graduation to the teachers who teach them. She is now exposed to more disciplinary problems, drugs, gang members (yes, not an exaggeration, they are a reality at Lewis). There is no explanation that paints a silver lining for her. But I will make sure she understands there are SJWs who believe she and her cohort are educational martyrs who are fixing the system for FARMS kids and no one else will have to go through what she is going through.

In terms of academics, it’s not just that it is unfamiliar it’s that many advanced courses may not even be available. At least one school board member made this point last night. Not committing to grandfather rising juniors tells me moving them is on the table. Junior year is critical for college admissions and the fact that the school board as whole will not commit to supporting at least that one cohort is disappointing to say the least.

Advocate for more AP in your new school. Contribute to the community.

It is not our community.

Our community is the school zone we originally purchased int, set roots in, and out kids grew up in.

Agree, the school will be two schools within a school. Especially if the kids at the schools are like their smug petty SJW parents. My kids would want nothing to do with them, and I’d fully support that.

Anyone who actually complies with the school board plan and sends their kids would be best served to go in with a good attitude and do all the things they would have done had they stayed at their chosen school.

Why make life less pleasant for your kid and for you? Buy the school logo gear, join the athletic boosters/choral guild/pta and make it a good time.

If you won’t send your kid, good for you and your kid. But if you are going to enroll them, embrace the experience.

+1 The kids are probably handling this better than parents on here.

Yeah because 1) it’s not their property values or ability to sell that’s potentially being affected and 2) kids don’t necessarily have a full grasp on how bad it would be, academically and in terms of their college apps, to move high schools DURING HIGH SCHOOL. If the SB doesn’t figure out the whole AP vs. IB thing, potentially moving from a school with AP classes to one that doesn’t have them. If a kid was on the most advanced math track, moving to a school that could potentially not accommodate that if there has been no demand in the past for the highest AP math classes. No it’s not the same to take those classes at NVCC - as everyone knows, the quality of teaching is generally better in high school when you’re taught by qualified teachers vs. professors whose specialty is research.

And, those same kids also got screwed at some point in elementary school by a year and a half’s worth of closures due to COVID.

I think allowing grandfathering for both juniors and seniors would mitigate a lot of parental stress about this, and I would like to see 6th graders grandfathered as well so they can finish out ES with their class. If a 9th or 10th grader had to move HS, they would have more than half of HS at the new school and that’s not as bad.

What college said they prefer one high school over another? Show us where colleges say they don’t admit kids that move. Post your source.

It's common sense to anyone who knows anything about college admissions. Strength of schedule matters. We're not talking about just getting into college period, we're taking about the potential options of more advance students being limited due to lack of access to AP and DE courses.

Most of us here are not advocating against the boundary changes. We are arguing to grandfather juniors because that is a critical year in terms of college admissions. You are arguing for the other extreme end of the spectrum from those who say "no boundary changes, period." What is best for the county is a moderate position that takes into account the needs of all students, including those being moved.

Show us your source. Show us a college that says they won’t admit a top kid from a school with less AP.

Oh, and here you go.
https://www.nacacnet.org/factors-in-the-admission-decision/

Where does says kids from a school with less AP don’t get in? Even a lower FCPS school has more AP than most districts in VA. You think kids outside FCPS don’t go to college?

If you can't read that chart and make logical inferences, I can't help you. Strength of schedule, which includes advanced courses is number 3 in the chart.

All FCPS schools have advanced courses. You’re creating an issue that isn’t there. Again, how do kids from districts without AP get in college?

Oh my word! People arguing for students to move to schools like Lewis say that there is a dearth of AP/DE courses do to lack of demand, and lack of access to these courses limits their college options. They want higher performing students moved there to increase demand and access to those courses. However, there will likely be a lag in access to at least the first group that is transferred, so they would also have a lack of access and their options limited. On the marco level, it would seem like a necessary sacrifice for the long term greater good, but on the individual level, parents, myself included, are not going to want to see the options limited for their own kids and will find ways to alleviate that situation. Sorry.

Again, this is not about not changing boundaries. It's about doing it in a way that is thoughtful and considers the needs of all students.

I think many here don’t understand what equity is about.

Those UMC kids will be fine. The kids in Lewis who are poor and can’t move away and have low opportunities aren’t fine. If moving UMC kids helps impoverished kids and their school, that’s great.

UMC/MC kids will be fine. UMC/MC kids that can’t get into TJ now because of bonus points for URM status and quotas will be fine. Those URMs didn’t have great opportunities but your UMC kid will be fine.

MC kid wants to go on the field trip with Young Scholars? That’s for URMs who don’t have the same opportunities as your MC kid who…. Will be fine.

Does your MC kid want to join a college partnership program. Sorry URMs only. Your kid will be fine.

There’s limited resources, so the county needs to focus on kids who will not be fine. Kids involved in boundary changes will be fine.

On the contrary people are very aware of how equity works. You will see a backlash on this in Fairfax County. People are not going to accept that their UMC kid needs to make sacrifices for foreign nations in our schools. It's actually insane that the school board thinks this will fly.

Maybe I read irony where it wasn't intended but I read the post to which you responded as implying that MC/UMC kids get the shaft in FCPS. When the poster kept repeating that these kids "wilk be fine," it appeared they were saying that's how FCPS conveys that it doesn't care about these kids and takes them for granted. PP appears to believe the focus now is very much on kids deemed less fortunate and therefore more deserving.

We could debate whether that's really the case. Certainly there are signs - for example, FCPS spending tens of millions on an addition to Justice HS, which primarily serves a low-income Hispanic population, while refusing to invest similarly in older, more overcrowded McLean HS, which primarily serves an UMC white/Asian population. But I really didn't read the post to suggest the poster actually believes UMC/MC kids will "be fine" if FCPS remains on its current path.

Oh gosh, this is repeated ad infinitum and is completely a false accusation. Look at Oakton, Madison, Langley, West Springfield, Cooper, Rocky Run, Frost with beautiful new facilities. FCPS is not leaving the high-SES out to dry at all. Look at Lewis and Annandale, two of the poorest with very outdated facilities.

You simply don’t understand the facts. Most of the renovations you mention were scheduled renovations, pursuant to the 2008 renovation queue.

Justice was not otherwise scheduled for a renovation but still got a multi-million permanent addition outside the renovation queue. McLean was more overcrowded than Justice and got a cheap modular instead. West Potomac was also expanded to a whopping 3000 seats, again outside the renovation queue, while McLean is left with under 2000 permanent seats.

So there are signs that FCPS has systematically discriminated against McLean compared to other less affluent schools. Lewis and Annandale are not similarly overcrowded.

And it’s unlikely to change under the current School Board, because Robyn Lady and her cronies appear to want to move more McLean kids to Langley so they can bump a large chunk of Great Falls to Herndon. But, as PP said, these are mostly MC/UMC kids so it’s assumed they’ll “be fine.”

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Anonymous wrote:The best nugget of info out of this meeting (because boundary adjustments are a foregone conclusion) is from Dr. Reid's response to Mateo Dunne's question about boundary changes: she stated that HS boundaries will not change much at all, and most of the boundary changes will be at the ES level.

That’s interesting, I wonder why they decided to do that. Most kids attend the closest ES unless they’re at a split feeder or in an attendance island. The kids who have a long ES bus ride would have one regardless because they live in a far-flung area like Clifton or Great Falls. Or they’re getting bussed to the AAP center …

This is false. Anyone with eyes can look at a map of the school boundaries to see lots of elementary schools completely disconnected from their communities.

Such as??

Westbriar, Keene Mill, Flint Hill, Sangster, etc.

The one no-brainer move coming from a savant who spends too much time on Zillow and has no dog in the fight, the Groveland/Green Garland drive area zoned for Sangster will move to Newington Forest and will become part of the South County pyramid.

I can see that happening, although that’s a really small neighborhood that probably won’t make too much of a difference either way.

As a Lorton resident I wonder if the infamous Hagel Circle will continue to get bussed past 95 to Halley or if they will get sent to the much closer Gunston. That’s a hot potato.

I was shocked to learn that Hagel Ct students didn’t go to Lorton Station ES. It’s only a mile away!

That’s one of the equity bussing situations. Sending those kids to the comparatively rich Halley makes Halley and Gunston both around 40% FARMS, and Lorton Station around 55%. Otherwise Halley would have demographics similar to Silverbrook which has single digit FARMS, and Gunston or Lorton Station would be much higher needs.

I imagine if they changed it it would be to send those kids to Gunston so they can stay at South County, as opposed to Lorton Station/Hayfield. But also, without that big neighborhood Halley’s population would drop quite a bit and there’s really nowhere for them to pick up kids from since that is not a growth area of the county.

This may have been their intention when they assigned these attendance islands, but they’re seeing the negative impacts. If kids miss the bus, they’re likely missing school that day, when in some cases, there’s another elementary school within walking distance.

Very true and I’m sure there is a lot of absenteeism coming from that area. A lot of families don’t have cars. If the kid misses the school bus there’s no way to get them to school.

+ 1 never thought of this but I’m positive this is happening.

These are the types of nuances that people who support “keeping things the same” don’t think about. I’m glad that the school board is taking a look at this in a holistic way. Issues like chronic absenteeism only put kids in that community further and further behind, which leads to more stress on the educators and other school resources.

You don’t know what nuance I think about. You’re just throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I don’t have to throw anything, the motion passed so it’s “up and it’s stuck” already! That reference will likely over your head, it just means your whining is pointless at this point. You should focus that energy on opening up your mind to the possibilities now, since this is no longer a question of IF but WHEN and HOW.

Gloat as much as you want. They’re well on their way to destroying the county schools. Those of us with money will leave, those of us like you will just be stuck with lower SES schools and will never stop your pathetic whining.

That’s the nuance that YOU and your SJW friends don’t think about. Oops.

Oh we did and…WE DO NOT CARE. You think you’re the only one in the county with money? ALL of the houses in FFX cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It’s just empty threats until/unless it happens and even then, things will be fine. Your house will be snapped up quickly and life will go on.

I have to agree. Houses will still be bought for location, etc. Some of the new buyers will simply expect to go private from the get go unlike whose who had the rug pulled out from under them.

Others will embrace the chance to let their child see how the other half lives so they don’t have to hear them whining about having Izumi for dinner AGAIN.

What I would implore any SJW, economically challenged ideologues on this board to do, is looking at property sales over the next few years in the jurisdictions that are at high risk of getting redistricted. You’ll of course try to spin the ensuing drop as something else, but we all know that the number one reason that people buy their houses is for the schools.

I know you don’t care, but each drop represents a loss for the county, both directly and indirectly.

Ok, hypothetically:
Boundary changes happen and now more poor and diverse kids go to your pyramid. GreatSchools score takes a hit on Zillow. The ultra-wealthy from California and Seattle now refuse to pay 300k over the assessment for homes in your neighborhood. This leaves room for younger mid-grade federal employees and other public servants, from teachers to custodians, to buy and live and work in Fairfax County, just like they used to in the 90s.

How has your own child's education specifically been negatively impacted?

How my own child's education is impacted: now my kid is moving between 10th and 11th grade, completely loses continuity with her school clubs and sports and social groups/friends. Academically, everything is unfamiliar from the courses and path to graduation to the teachers who teach them. She is now exposed to more disciplinary problems, drugs, gang members (yes, not an exaggeration, they are a reality at Lewis). There is no explanation that paints a silver lining for her. But I will make sure she understands there are SJWs who believe she and her cohort are educational martyrs who are fixing the system for FARMS kids and no one else will have to go through what she is going through.

In terms of academics, it’s not just that it is unfamiliar it’s that many advanced courses may not even be available. At least one school board member made this point last night. Not committing to grandfather rising juniors tells me moving them is on the table. Junior year is critical for college admissions and the fact that the school board as whole will not commit to supporting at least that one cohort is disappointing to say the least.

Advocate for more AP in your new school. Contribute to the community.

It is not our community.

Our community is the school zone we originally purchased int, set roots in, and out kids grew up in.

Agree, the school will be two schools within a school. Especially if the kids at the schools are like their smug petty SJW parents. My kids would want nothing to do with them, and I’d fully support that.

Anyone who actually complies with the school board plan and sends their kids would be best served to go in with a good attitude and do all the things they would have done had they stayed at their chosen school.

Why make life less pleasant for your kid and for you? Buy the school logo gear, join the athletic boosters/choral guild/pta and make it a good time.

If you won’t send your kid, good for you and your kid. But if you are going to enroll them, embrace the experience.

+1 The kids are probably handling this better than parents on here.

Yeah because 1) it’s not their property values or ability to sell that’s potentially being affected and 2) kids don’t necessarily have a full grasp on how bad it would be, academically and in terms of their college apps, to move high schools DURING HIGH SCHOOL. If the SB doesn’t figure out the whole AP vs. IB thing, potentially moving from a school with AP classes to one that doesn’t have them. If a kid was on the most advanced math track, moving to a school that could potentially not accommodate that if there has been no demand in the past for the highest AP math classes. No it’s not the same to take those classes at NVCC - as everyone knows, the quality of teaching is generally better in high school when you’re taught by qualified teachers vs. professors whose specialty is research.

And, those same kids also got screwed at some point in elementary school by a year and a half’s worth of closures due to COVID.

I think allowing grandfathering for both juniors and seniors would mitigate a lot of parental stress about this, and I would like to see 6th graders grandfathered as well so they can finish out ES with their class. If a 9th or 10th grader had to move HS, they would have more than half of HS at the new school and that’s not as bad.

What college said they prefer one high school over another? Show us where colleges say they don’t admit kids that move. Post your source.

It's common sense to anyone who knows anything about college admissions. Strength of schedule matters. We're not talking about just getting into college period, we're taking about the potential options of more advance students being limited due to lack of access to AP and DE courses.

Most of us here are not advocating against the boundary changes. We are arguing to grandfather juniors because that is a critical year in terms of college admissions. You are arguing for the other extreme end of the spectrum from those who say "no boundary changes, period." What is best for the county is a moderate position that takes into account the needs of all students, including those being moved.

Show us your source. Show us a college that says they won’t admit a top kid from a school with less AP.

Oh, and here you go.
https://www.nacacnet.org/factors-in-the-admission-decision/

Where does says kids from a school with less AP don’t get in? Even a lower FCPS school has more AP than most districts in VA. You think kids outside FCPS don’t go to college?

The colleges do not compare your child's rigor of coursework against kids in rural southwestern Virginia.

Colleges compare your child's academic rigor against other students in your geographic area attending high school in Fairfax County.

Colleges also expect your child to have 3 to 4 years of sequential coursework in a single foreign language, particularly the more competitive universities like UVA, VT and W&M.

A WSHS student taking one if the languages not offered at Lewis who is forced to transfer between sophomore and junior year will be significantly dinged in the college application process for only having level 2 as their highest foreign language class completed, particularly if that student is a high achieving student who is trying for acceptance to in state schools of UVA, VT, W&M, a competitive private university, or a competitive out of state university like Michigan.

Not allowing generous grandfathering of enrolled high school students is unacceptable.

In addition, due to the disparity of quality between some of the schools getting rezoned, younger siblingsin a famly should be allowed grandfathering, if the parent provides transportation.

False. Colleges compare kids only against kids within the same high school. Every HS has a "strength of courses available" metric which is used to normalize the course rigor at that individual HS. Colleges are very careful not to penalize the kids who have less options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can we back to the basics? What is the timeline for these boundary changes?

Fall 2025 is the school board's stated goal.

They have mentioned this timeline at multiple work sessions.

If you have a high school student in the class of 2027 or 2028 (current rising sophomores and freshmen) you need to be VERY concerned, especially if you are not within the walk zone to your high school.

The school board has mentioned this timeline, and minimal grandfathering of high school students many times.

When someone gives you insight to their plans, believe them.

When a politician lies by omission, hiding their true plans during their campaigns so they can get elected, expect nothing less from them than a complete disregard for constituents when they are in power.

If they prioritized student's well being, they would allow grandfathering for all enrolled high school students.

If they prioritized educational quality for the kids in failing schools like Lewis, they would have removed IB a long time ago and looked for real solutions, that do not require disrupting a bunch of kids to hopefully hide the failures without actually fixing the problems.

If they valued constituents, they would not have voted for a plan that concentrates power affecting student well being, communities, and housing values, with a single, unelected, overpaid bureaucrat, to try to remove the responsibility of elected officials to their voters in their district.

If the Springfield district representative was actually representing the will of her actual voters, she would have either come out strongly against the rezoning plan, OR very strongly in support of extensive grandfathering of high school students.

She did neither, so she is clearly not performing her duties to represent her constituents.

Please vote better in 2027. Ultimately, this is the outcome of voting choices made by the voters in our county, not just for school board but also for the board of supervisors that gerrymandered 22152 and the Springfield district to try to get rid of the last moderate politician in all of Northern Virginia. If you get rezoned, and voted blue no matter who, this is the policies you support being put into action.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It does really suck if juniors aren’t grandfathered, but I suspect that some seniors will be affected too. I’m doubtful FCPS will be able to offer bus service for grandfathered students. So if a student doesn’t have a way to transport themselves to their original school, they may be out of luck. FCPS does not have a large fleet of busses nor pool of drivers.

Most of the WSHS juniors and seniors drive themselves, ride with friends or walk.

Only sophomores and freshmen ride the bus.

The only senior I ever knew who took the bus during the past 6 years that we have had kids there was one who lost their car for a month for busting curfew. That senior rode the bus as a punishment, not as a necessity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It does really suck if juniors aren’t grandfathered, but I suspect that some seniors will be affected too. I’m doubtful FCPS will be able to offer bus service for grandfathered students. So if a student doesn’t have a way to transport themselves to their original school, they may be out of luck. FCPS does not have a large fleet of busses nor pool of drivers.

West Springfield kids at least would probably be able to take a Fairfax Connector bus, maybe with a walk on either end, or carpool. I don’t know how much public bus service there is out in Great Falls though.

Probably most WSHS kids could bike to school in under 15 minutes. We have tight boundaries.

It is a 15 to 20 minute walk from one of the neighborhoods being discussed here, the farthest elementary zone from Lewis.

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Anonymous wrote:The best nugget of info out of this meeting (because boundary adjustments are a foregone conclusion) is from Dr. Reid's response to Mateo Dunne's question about boundary changes: she stated that HS boundaries will not change much at all, and most of the boundary changes will be at the ES level.

That’s interesting, I wonder why they decided to do that. Most kids attend the closest ES unless they’re at a split feeder or in an attendance island. The kids who have a long ES bus ride would have one regardless because they live in a far-flung area like Clifton or Great Falls. Or they’re getting bussed to the AAP center …

This is false. Anyone with eyes can look at a map of the school boundaries to see lots of elementary schools completely disconnected from their communities.

Such as??

Westbriar, Keene Mill, Flint Hill, Sangster, etc.

The one no-brainer move coming from a savant who spends too much time on Zillow and has no dog in the fight, the Groveland/Green Garland drive area zoned for Sangster will move to Newington Forest and will become part of the South County pyramid.

I can see that happening, although that’s a really small neighborhood that probably won’t make too much of a difference either way.

As a Lorton resident I wonder if the infamous Hagel Circle will continue to get bussed past 95 to Halley or if they will get sent to the much closer Gunston. That’s a hot potato.

I was shocked to learn that Hagel Ct students didn’t go to Lorton Station ES. It’s only a mile away!

That’s one of the equity bussing situations. Sending those kids to the comparatively rich Halley makes Halley and Gunston both around 40% FARMS, and Lorton Station around 55%. Otherwise Halley would have demographics similar to Silverbrook which has single digit FARMS, and Gunston or Lorton Station would be much higher needs.

I imagine if they changed it it would be to send those kids to Gunston so they can stay at South County, as opposed to Lorton Station/Hayfield. But also, without that big neighborhood Halley’s population would drop quite a bit and there’s really nowhere for them to pick up kids from since that is not a growth area of the county.

This may have been their intention when they assigned these attendance islands, but they’re seeing the negative impacts. If kids miss the bus, they’re likely missing school that day, when in some cases, there’s another elementary school within walking distance.

Very true and I’m sure there is a lot of absenteeism coming from that area. A lot of families don’t have cars. If the kid misses the school bus there’s no way to get them to school.

+ 1 never thought of this but I’m positive this is happening.

These are the types of nuances that people who support “keeping things the same” don’t think about. I’m glad that the school board is taking a look at this in a holistic way. Issues like chronic absenteeism only put kids in that community further and further behind, which leads to more stress on the educators and other school resources.

You don’t know what nuance I think about. You’re just throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I don’t have to throw anything, the motion passed so it’s “up and it’s stuck” already! That reference will likely over your head, it just means your whining is pointless at this point. You should focus that energy on opening up your mind to the possibilities now, since this is no longer a question of IF but WHEN and HOW.

Gloat as much as you want. They’re well on their way to destroying the county schools. Those of us with money will leave, those of us like you will just be stuck with lower SES schools and will never stop your pathetic whining.

That’s the nuance that YOU and your SJW friends don’t think about. Oops.

Oh we did and…WE DO NOT CARE. You think you’re the only one in the county with money? ALL of the houses in FFX cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It’s just empty threats until/unless it happens and even then, things will be fine. Your house will be snapped up quickly and life will go on.

I have to agree. Houses will still be bought for location, etc. Some of the new buyers will simply expect to go private from the get go unlike whose who had the rug pulled out from under them.

Others will embrace the chance to let their child see how the other half lives so they don’t have to hear them whining about having Izumi for dinner AGAIN.

What I would implore any SJW, economically challenged ideologues on this board to do, is looking at property sales over the next few years in the jurisdictions that are at high risk of getting redistricted. You’ll of course try to spin the ensuing drop as something else, but we all know that the number one reason that people buy their houses is for the schools.

I know you don’t care, but each drop represents a loss for the county, both directly and indirectly.

Ok, hypothetically:
Boundary changes happen and now more poor and diverse kids go to your pyramid. GreatSchools score takes a hit on Zillow. The ultra-wealthy from California and Seattle now refuse to pay 300k over the assessment for homes in your neighborhood. This leaves room for younger mid-grade federal employees and other public servants, from teachers to custodians, to buy and live and work in Fairfax County, just like they used to in the 90s.

How has your own child's education specifically been negatively impacted?

How my own child's education is impacted: now my kid is moving between 10th and 11th grade, completely loses continuity with her school clubs and sports and social groups/friends. Academically, everything is unfamiliar from the courses and path to graduation to the teachers who teach them. She is now exposed to more disciplinary problems, drugs, gang members (yes, not an exaggeration, they are a reality at Lewis). There is no explanation that paints a silver lining for her. But I will make sure she understands there are SJWs who believe she and her cohort are educational martyrs who are fixing the system for FARMS kids and no one else will have to go through what she is going through.

In terms of academics, it’s not just that it is unfamiliar it’s that many advanced courses may not even be available. At least one school board member made this point last night. Not committing to grandfather rising juniors tells me moving them is on the table. Junior year is critical for college admissions and the fact that the school board as whole will not commit to supporting at least that one cohort is disappointing to say the least.

Advocate for more AP in your new school. Contribute to the community.

It is not our community.

Our community is the school zone we originally purchased int, set roots in, and out kids grew up in.

Agree, the school will be two schools within a school. Especially if the kids at the schools are like their smug petty SJW parents. My kids would want nothing to do with them, and I’d fully support that.

Anyone who actually complies with the school board plan and sends their kids would be best served to go in with a good attitude and do all the things they would have done had they stayed at their chosen school.

Why make life less pleasant for your kid and for you? Buy the school logo gear, join the athletic boosters/choral guild/pta and make it a good time.

If you won’t send your kid, good for you and your kid. But if you are going to enroll them, embrace the experience.

+1 The kids are probably handling this better than parents on here.

Yeah because 1) it’s not their property values or ability to sell that’s potentially being affected and 2) kids don’t necessarily have a full grasp on how bad it would be, academically and in terms of their college apps, to move high schools DURING HIGH SCHOOL. If the SB doesn’t figure out the whole AP vs. IB thing, potentially moving from a school with AP classes to one that doesn’t have them. If a kid was on the most advanced math track, moving to a school that could potentially not accommodate that if there has been no demand in the past for the highest AP math classes. No it’s not the same to take those classes at NVCC - as everyone knows, the quality of teaching is generally better in high school when you’re taught by qualified teachers vs. professors whose specialty is research.

And, those same kids also got screwed at some point in elementary school by a year and a half’s worth of closures due to COVID.

I think allowing grandfathering for both juniors and seniors would mitigate a lot of parental stress about this, and I would like to see 6th graders grandfathered as well so they can finish out ES with their class. If a 9th or 10th grader had to move HS, they would have more than half of HS at the new school and that’s not as bad.

What college said they prefer one high school over another? Show us where colleges say they don’t admit kids that move. Post your source.

It's common sense to anyone who knows anything about college admissions. Strength of schedule matters. We're not talking about just getting into college period, we're taking about the potential options of more advance students being limited due to lack of access to AP and DE courses.

Most of us here are not advocating against the boundary changes. We are arguing to grandfather juniors because that is a critical year in terms of college admissions. You are arguing for the other extreme end of the spectrum from those who say "no boundary changes, period." What is best for the county is a moderate position that takes into account the needs of all students, including those being moved.

Show us your source. Show us a college that says they won’t admit a top kid from a school with less AP.

Oh, and here you go.
https://www.nacacnet.org/factors-in-the-admission-decision/

Where does says kids from a school with less AP don’t get in? Even a lower FCPS school has more AP than most districts in VA. You think kids outside FCPS don’t go to college?

The colleges do not compare your child's rigor of coursework against kids in rural southwestern Virginia.

Colleges compare your child's academic rigor against other students in your geographic area attending high school in Fairfax County.

Colleges also expect your child to have 3 to 4 years of sequential coursework in a single foreign language, particularly the more competitive universities like UVA, VT and W&M.

A WSHS student taking one if the languages not offered at Lewis who is forced to transfer between sophomore and junior year will be significantly dinged in the college application process for only having level 2 as their highest foreign language class completed, particularly if that student is a high achieving student who is trying for acceptance to in state schools of UVA, VT, W&M, a competitive private university, or a competitive out of state university like Michigan.

Not allowing generous grandfathering of enrolled high school students is unacceptable.

In addition, due to the disparity of quality between some of the schools getting rezoned, younger siblingsin a famly should be allowed grandfathering, if the parent provides transportation.

Where is your cite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we back to the basics? What is the timeline for these boundary changes?

Fall 2025 is the school board's stated goal.

They have mentioned this timeline at multiple work sessions.

If you have a high school student in the class of 2027 or 2028 (current rising sophomores and freshmen) you need to be VERY concerned, especially if you are not within the walk zone to your high school.

The school board has mentioned this timeline, and minimal grandfathering of high school students many times.

When someone gives you insight to their plans, believe them.

When a politician lies by omission, hiding their true plans during their campaigns so they can get elected, expect nothing less from them than a complete disregard for constituents when they are in power.

If they prioritized student's well being, they would allow grandfathering for all enrolled high school students.

If they prioritized educational quality for the kids in failing schools like Lewis, they would have removed IB a long time ago and looked for real solutions, that do not require disrupting a bunch of kids to hopefully hide the failures without actually fixing the problems.

If they valued constituents, they would not have voted for a plan that concentrates power affecting student well being, communities, and housing values, with a single, unelected, overpaid bureaucrat, to try to remove the responsibility of elected officials to their voters in their district.

If the Springfield district representative was actually representing the will of her actual voters, she would have either come out strongly against the rezoning plan, OR very strongly in support of extensive grandfathering of high school students.

She did neither, so she is clearly not performing her duties to represent her constituents.

Please vote better in 2027. Ultimately, this is the outcome of voting choices made by the voters in our county, not just for school board but also for the board of supervisors that gerrymandered 22152 and the Springfield district to try to get rid of the last moderate politician in all of Northern Virginia. If you get rezoned, and voted blue no matter who, this is the policies you support being put into action.

Reid is the one will be driving this bus. She had said a company will study it and they will take 18 months. So that would be fall 2026.

Do we think that in 1 year they will have boundaries redrawn?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t see AP options for juniors as being the worst thing. Most college counselors say colleges judge you based on the offerings at your school so you aren’t penalized for classes it does not offer.

The HUGE HUGE problem with not grandfathering juniors is that it will be super hard for them to achieve leadership roles for their college applications when they will only be there for 1 year before the typical leadership year of Senior year. And it’s not uncommon for kids involved in something since 9th to have leadership roles by 11th too. It’s the extracurricular portion of their applications that will be absolutely decimated.

As one of the board members pointed out, in a boundary change some kids will be moved out and others moved in.

Kids will just have to cross their fingers and hope that the new school’s probable president of model UN or editor of the yearbook got moved out.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The best nugget of info out of this meeting (because boundary adjustments are a foregone conclusion) is from Dr. Reid's response to Mateo Dunne's question about boundary changes: she stated that HS boundaries will not change much at all, and most of the boundary changes will be at the ES level.

That’s interesting, I wonder why they decided to do that. Most kids attend the closest ES unless they’re at a split feeder or in an attendance island. The kids who have a long ES bus ride would have one regardless because they live in a far-flung area like Clifton or Great Falls. Or they’re getting bussed to the AAP center …

This is false. Anyone with eyes can look at a map of the school boundaries to see lots of elementary schools completely disconnected from their communities.

Such as??

Westbriar, Keene Mill, Flint Hill, Sangster, etc.

The one no-brainer move coming from a savant who spends too much time on Zillow and has no dog in the fight, the Groveland/Green Garland drive area zoned for Sangster will move to Newington Forest and will become part of the South County pyramid.

I can see that happening, although that’s a really small neighborhood that probably won’t make too much of a difference either way.

As a Lorton resident I wonder if the infamous Hagel Circle will continue to get bussed past 95 to Halley or if they will get sent to the much closer Gunston. That’s a hot potato.

I was shocked to learn that Hagel Ct students didn’t go to Lorton Station ES. It’s only a mile away!

That’s one of the equity bussing situations. Sending those kids to the comparatively rich Halley makes Halley and Gunston both around 40% FARMS, and Lorton Station around 55%. Otherwise Halley would have demographics similar to Silverbrook which has single digit FARMS, and Gunston or Lorton Station would be much higher needs.

I imagine if they changed it it would be to send those kids to Gunston so they can stay at South County, as opposed to Lorton Station/Hayfield. But also, without that big neighborhood Halley’s population would drop quite a bit and there’s really nowhere for them to pick up kids from since that is not a growth area of the county.

This may have been their intention when they assigned these attendance islands, but they’re seeing the negative impacts. If kids miss the bus, they’re likely missing school that day, when in some cases, there’s another elementary school within walking distance.

Very true and I’m sure there is a lot of absenteeism coming from that area. A lot of families don’t have cars. If the kid misses the school bus there’s no way to get them to school.

+ 1 never thought of this but I’m positive this is happening.

These are the types of nuances that people who support “keeping things the same” don’t think about. I’m glad that the school board is taking a look at this in a holistic way. Issues like chronic absenteeism only put kids in that community further and further behind, which leads to more stress on the educators and other school resources.

You don’t know what nuance I think about. You’re just throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I don’t have to throw anything, the motion passed so it’s “up and it’s stuck” already! That reference will likely over your head, it just means your whining is pointless at this point. You should focus that energy on opening up your mind to the possibilities now, since this is no longer a question of IF but WHEN and HOW.

Gloat as much as you want. They’re well on their way to destroying the county schools. Those of us with money will leave, those of us like you will just be stuck with lower SES schools and will never stop your pathetic whining.

That’s the nuance that YOU and your SJW friends don’t think about. Oops.

Oh we did and…WE DO NOT CARE. You think you’re the only one in the county with money? ALL of the houses in FFX cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It’s just empty threats until/unless it happens and even then, things will be fine. Your house will be snapped up quickly and life will go on.

I have to agree. Houses will still be bought for location, etc. Some of the new buyers will simply expect to go private from the get go unlike whose who had the rug pulled out from under them.

Others will embrace the chance to let their child see how the other half lives so they don’t have to hear them whining about having Izumi for dinner AGAIN.

What I would implore any SJW, economically challenged ideologues on this board to do, is looking at property sales over the next few years in the jurisdictions that are at high risk of getting redistricted. You’ll of course try to spin the ensuing drop as something else, but we all know that the number one reason that people buy their houses is for the schools.

I know you don’t care, but each drop represents a loss for the county, both directly and indirectly.

Ok, hypothetically:
Boundary changes happen and now more poor and diverse kids go to your pyramid. GreatSchools score takes a hit on Zillow. The ultra-wealthy from California and Seattle now refuse to pay 300k over the assessment for homes in your neighborhood. This leaves room for younger mid-grade federal employees and other public servants, from teachers to custodians, to buy and live and work in Fairfax County, just like they used to in the 90s.

How has your own child's education specifically been negatively impacted?

How my own child's education is impacted: now my kid is moving between 10th and 11th grade, completely loses continuity with her school clubs and sports and social groups/friends. Academically, everything is unfamiliar from the courses and path to graduation to the teachers who teach them. She is now exposed to more disciplinary problems, drugs, gang members (yes, not an exaggeration, they are a reality at Lewis). There is no explanation that paints a silver lining for her. But I will make sure she understands there are SJWs who believe she and her cohort are educational martyrs who are fixing the system for FARMS kids and no one else will have to go through what she is going through.

In terms of academics, it’s not just that it is unfamiliar it’s that many advanced courses may not even be available. At least one school board member made this point last night. Not committing to grandfather rising juniors tells me moving them is on the table. Junior year is critical for college admissions and the fact that the school board as whole will not commit to supporting at least that one cohort is disappointing to say the least.

Advocate for more AP in your new school. Contribute to the community.

It is not our community.

Our community is the school zone we originally purchased int, set roots in, and out kids grew up in.

Agree, the school will be two schools within a school. Especially if the kids at the schools are like their smug petty SJW parents. My kids would want nothing to do with them, and I’d fully support that.

Anyone who actually complies with the school board plan and sends their kids would be best served to go in with a good attitude and do all the things they would have done had they stayed at their chosen school.

Why make life less pleasant for your kid and for you? Buy the school logo gear, join the athletic boosters/choral guild/pta and make it a good time.

If you won’t send your kid, good for you and your kid. But if you are going to enroll them, embrace the experience.

+1 The kids are probably handling this better than parents on here.

Yeah because 1) it’s not their property values or ability to sell that’s potentially being affected and 2) kids don’t necessarily have a full grasp on how bad it would be, academically and in terms of their college apps, to move high schools DURING HIGH SCHOOL. If the SB doesn’t figure out the whole AP vs. IB thing, potentially moving from a school with AP classes to one that doesn’t have them. If a kid was on the most advanced math track, moving to a school that could potentially not accommodate that if there has been no demand in the past for the highest AP math classes. No it’s not the same to take those classes at NVCC - as everyone knows, the quality of teaching is generally better in high school when you’re taught by qualified teachers vs. professors whose specialty is research.

And, those same kids also got screwed at some point in elementary school by a year and a half’s worth of closures due to COVID.

I think allowing grandfathering for both juniors and seniors would mitigate a lot of parental stress about this, and I would like to see 6th graders grandfathered as well so they can finish out ES with their class. If a 9th or 10th grader had to move HS, they would have more than half of HS at the new school and that’s not as bad.

What college said they prefer one high school over another? Show us where colleges say they don’t admit kids that move. Post your source.

It's common sense to anyone who knows anything about college admissions. Strength of schedule matters. We're not talking about just getting into college period, we're taking about the potential options of more advance students being limited due to lack of access to AP and DE courses.

Most of us here are not advocating against the boundary changes. We are arguing to grandfather juniors because that is a critical year in terms of college admissions. You are arguing for the other extreme end of the spectrum from those who say "no boundary changes, period." What is best for the county is a moderate position that takes into account the needs of all students, including those being moved.

Show us your source. Show us a college that says they won’t admit a top kid from a school with less AP.

Oh, and here you go.
https://www.nacacnet.org/factors-in-the-admission-decision/

Where does says kids from a school with less AP don’t get in? Even a lower FCPS school has more AP than most districts in VA. You think kids outside FCPS don’t go to college?

If you can't read that chart and make logical inferences, I can't help you. Strength of schedule, which includes advanced courses is number 3 in the chart.

All FCPS schools have advanced courses. You’re creating an issue that isn’t there. Again, how do kids from districts without AP get in college?

Oh my word! People arguing for students to move to schools like Lewis say that there is a dearth of AP/DE courses do to lack of demand, and lack of access to these courses limits their college options. They want higher performing students moved there to increase demand and access to those courses. However, there will likely be a lag in access to at least the first group that is transferred, so they would also have a lack of access and their options limited. On the marco level, it would seem like a necessary sacrifice for the long term greater good, but on the individual level, parents, myself included, are not going to want to see the options limited for their own kids and will find ways to alleviate that situation. Sorry.

Again, this is not about not changing boundaries. It's about doing it in a way that is thoughtful and considers the needs of all students.

I think many here don’t understand what equity is about.

Those UMC kids will be fine. The kids in Lewis who are poor and can’t move away and have low opportunities aren’t fine. If moving UMC kids helps impoverished kids and their school, that’s great.

UMC/MC kids will be fine. UMC/MC kids that can’t get into TJ now because of bonus points for URM status and quotas will be fine. Those URMs didn’t have great opportunities but your UMC kid will be fine.

MC kid wants to go on the field trip with Young Scholars? That’s for URMs who don’t have the same opportunities as your MC kid who…. Will be fine.

Does your MC kid want to join a college partnership program. Sorry URMs only. Your kid will be fine.

There’s limited resources, so the county needs to focus on kids who will not be fine. Kids involved in boundary changes will be fine.

On the contrary people are very aware of how equity works. You will see a backlash on this in Fairfax County. People are not going to accept that their UMC kid needs to make sacrifices for foreign nations in our schools. It's actually insane that the school board thinks this will fly.

Maybe I read irony where it wasn't intended but I read the post to which you responded as implying that MC/UMC kids get the shaft in FCPS. When the poster kept repeating that these kids "wilk be fine," it appeared they were saying that's how FCPS conveys that it doesn't care about these kids and takes them for granted. PP appears to believe the focus now is very much on kids deemed less fortunate and therefore more deserving.

We could debate whether that's really the case. Certainly there are signs - for example, FCPS spending tens of millions on an addition to Justice HS, which primarily serves a low-income Hispanic population, while refusing to invest similarly in older, more overcrowded McLean HS, which primarily serves an UMC white/Asian population. But I really didn't read the post to suggest the poster actually believes UMC/MC kids will "be fine" if FCPS remains on its current path.

Oh gosh, this is repeated ad infinitum and is completely a false accusation. Look at Oakton, Madison, Langley, West Springfield, Cooper, Rocky Run, Frost with beautiful new facilities. FCPS is not leaving the high-SES out to dry at all. Look at Lewis and Annandale, two of the poorest with very outdated facilities.

You simply don’t understand the facts. Most of the renovations you mention were scheduled renovations, pursuant to the 2008 renovation queue.

Justice was not otherwise scheduled for a renovation but still got a multi-million permanent addition outside the renovation queue. McLean was more overcrowded than Justice and got a cheap modular instead. West Potomac was also expanded to a whopping 3000 seats, again outside the renovation queue, while McLean is left with under 2000 permanent seats.

So there are signs that FCPS has systematically discriminated against McLean compared to other less affluent schools. Lewis and Annandale are not similarly overcrowded.

And it’s unlikely to change under the current School Board, because Robyn Lady and her cronies appear to want to move more McLean kids to Langley so they can bump a large chunk of Great Falls to Herndon. But, as PP said, these are mostly MC/UMC kids so it’s assumed they’ll “be fine.”

McLean had a whole committee dedicated to this issue and their citizens association was in regular contact with the school board, including visits by board members. Their pta as well.

They voted for the people who ignored them twice in a row.

There are more important issues than overcrowding, so I think they’ll get over this little boundary issue.