Regular decision at UVA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's what I'm wrestling with. I think UVA has gone overboard this year with the first-generation segment of applicants. We know UVA received almost 50,000 applications, a 17 percent increase this year. Out of the ED applications (38% increase), 968 were accepted. A few were rejected. The rest were deferred. Then 28,897 students applied for EA. 21,048 of those applications came from OOS. 18% OOS students were offered a slot.

But a whopping 692 first-generationers (remember the entire class is 3,750) were offered and ED or EA slot. I could be wrong but I don't think admissions has been transparent about how many of the first-generation students were EA or ED.

So with a class of 3,750, you first have to subtract those that took a gap year due to covid. Let's just say 200. the ED (minus or take a few that bowed out due to finances). Now, take 3,550 and subtract the EDs of 968 and you are down to 2,582. You have now a 6000 accepted EA (no one knows in this year how many of them will show up - family finances will play a huge party). So you are now in negative territory (2,582 - 6,000). Also you have those students who were deferred, not rejected from ED. If one-half of those 6,000 showed up, UVA is still over subscribed. If a third show up, then there are 582 slots left for ED deferred, EA deferred and RD. Now toss in the athletes (may already be in), URM, more low-income, Blue Ridge Scholars, the Jefferson Scholars, rich daddys who have made calls and it increasingly becomes an imposible situation for those like OP's kid.

What I'm pondering and haven't settled on a decision yet is why are so many slots going to in-state and OOS first-generation students? 692 slots for a class of 3,750 seems extreme. I'm a first-generation student (and white) and back then it didn't count for squat. No one even thought of it. Yes, I understand USN&WR now uses this category as a "social mobility" factor, but why are we rewarding students simply because their parents didn't finish college? Mine didn't. My grandfather didn't even finish middle school because his father died and he had to take care of the farm. VT is also doing the same.

I think -all things being equal - there are other more important subcategories in Admissions such as URM, Blue Ridge Scholars (disadvantaged and poor), etc. etc. Why is first-generation now so hot. Even as of 2015, 54% of all students were first-generationers (although most of us didn't know it). And only 14-16% of those were minorities.
https://firstgen.naspa.org/research-and-policy/national-data-fact-sheets-on-first-generation-college-students/national-data-fact-sheets. That may have changed. So I don't think you can say this is pushing race issues. Is this all just because USN&WR added the social mobility criteria and schools must now report the number to USN&WR.

But where does that leave the superstars at Virginia's top public and private schools. Or the TJ superstars? It's happening at TJ too. The Commonwealth's top kids aren't getting into the flagship or the state's best tech school. Is this right? I'm very proud of the fact that I am self-made with no help from anyone along the way. I should not have been rewarded that my parents did not graduate from college. And I was low-income too.

What do you think (and don't make this a DCUM yelling match). I'm genuinely curious.

Another step I think needs to be taken is to increase the number of seats at Virginian schools as other states have. Texas is top 6% of public high school class (a fairer one than Virginia's - and easier on the students and the parents); California has virtually pushed out all the OOS when the voters got fed up paying for a very good system (UC, Cal State, Community college) but their own chldren couldn't get in. UVA is still at 35%OOS and I bet that a lot of them are the first-generation students that Jim Ryan is so keen on admitting.

https://news.virginia.edu/content/historic-application-year-uva-offers-early-action-admission-more-6000

The current president, Jim Ryan, made First Gen acceptance a priority when he came on board. The legislature sets the in state/out of state numbers and how public colleges/universities are designed; this is not a a high priority for them. Charlottesville is small compared to California markets, Texas markets etc. Virginia does not have a large state system like UCs, UTs, UNCs, etc.

But the same is taking place with the relatively new Preisdent of VT. It's "First-generation" or bust for him. WHY? Is it just the USN&WR ratings pushing this? Go read the VT EA results, and the UVA EA results pages on this forum and see the kinds of statistics that are being deferred from TJ. Also there's a TJ acceptance thread with a similar point of view. (BTW I have no affiliation with VT). But these kids who are rejected or deferred have outstanding statistics and they are being favored over the first-generation applicants. Many VA families really NEED Virginia Tech this year because of financial reasons due to covid. The OOS and private tech schools are too expensive = lots of frustration.

Also UVA gets only a small percentage of its budget from the Commonwealth. It can do what it wants for the most part. And the Commonwealth WILL have to pay attention when enough parents in Virginia rise up and say "enough OSS - my own kid can't get into any of the UC schools and I've paid taxes for 30 years". Public institutions do have a different mission than privates. The other states have already starting curtailing the OSS programs.

The Commonwealth has 41 institutions of higher learning, which includes the community colleges. Per student population that's pretty amazing.

[Anonymous]

Go read College Confidential on VT and UVA. And also the subreddits and you will see the same. Students and famlies upset that they counted VT as a reach, match or safety and got zero and are desperately hoping to get off the deferral/waitlists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's what I'm wrestling with. I think UVA has gone overboard this year with the first-generation segment of applicants. We know UVA received almost 50,000 applications, a 17 percent increase this year. Out of the ED applications (38% increase), 968 were accepted. A few were rejected. The rest were deferred. Then 28,897 students applied for EA. 21,048 of those applications came from OOS. 18% OOS students were offered a slot.

But a whopping 692 first-generationers (remember the entire class is 3,750) were offered and ED or EA slot. I could be wrong but I don't think admissions has been transparent about how many of the first-generation students were EA or ED.

So with a class of 3,750, you first have to subtract those that took a gap year due to covid. Let's just say 200. the ED (minus or take a few that bowed out due to finances). Now, take 3,550 and subtract the EDs of 968 and you are down to 2,582. You have now a 6000 accepted EA (no one knows in this year how many of them will show up - family finances will play a huge party). So you are now in negative territory (2,582 - 6,000). Also you have those students who were deferred, not rejected from ED. If one-half of those 6,000 showed up, UVA is still over subscribed. If a third show up, then there are 582 slots left for ED deferred, EA deferred and RD. Now toss in the athletes (may already be in), URM, more low-income, Blue Ridge Scholars, the Jefferson Scholars, rich daddys who have made calls and it increasingly becomes an imposible situation for those like OP's kid.

What I'm pondering and haven't settled on a decision yet is why are so many slots going to in-state and OOS first-generation students? 692 slots for a class of 3,750 seems extreme. I'm a first-generation student (and white) and back then it didn't count for squat. No one even thought of it. Yes, I understand USN&WR now uses this category as a "social mobility" factor, but why are we rewarding students simply because their parents didn't finish college? Mine didn't. My grandfather didn't even finish middle school because his father died and he had to take care of the farm. VT is also doing the same.

I think -all things being equal - there are other more important subcategories in Admissions such as URM, Blue Ridge Scholars (disadvantaged and poor), etc. etc. Why is first-generation now so hot. Even as of 2015, 54% of all students were first-generationers (although most of us didn't know it). And only 14-16% of those were minorities.
https://firstgen.naspa.org/research-and-policy/national-data-fact-sheets-on-first-generation-college-students/national-data-fact-sheets. That may have changed. So I don't think you can say this is pushing race issues. Is this all just because USN&WR added the social mobility criteria and schools must now report the number to USN&WR.

But where does that leave the superstars at Virginia's top public and private schools. Or the TJ superstars? It's happening at TJ too. The Commonwealth's top kids aren't getting into the flagship or the state's best tech school. Is this right? I'm very proud of the fact that I am self-made with no help from anyone along the way. I should not have been rewarded that my parents did not graduate from college. And I was low-income too.

What do you think (and don't make this a DCUM yelling match). I'm genuinely curious.

Another step I think needs to be taken is to increase the number of seats at Virginian schools as other states have. Texas is top 6% of public high school class (a fairer one than Virginia's - and easier on the students and the parents); California has virtually pushed out all the OOS when the voters got fed up paying for a very good system (UC, Cal State, Community college) but their own chldren couldn't get in. UVA is still at 35%OOS and I bet that a lot of them are the first-generation students that Jim Ryan is so keen on admitting.

https://news.virginia.edu/content/historic-application-year-uva-offers-early-action-admission-more-6000

The current president, Jim Ryan, made First Gen acceptance a priority when he came on board. The legislature sets the in state/out of state numbers and how public colleges/universities are designed; this is not a a high priority for them. Charlottesville is small compared to California markets, Texas markets etc. Virginia does not have a large state system like UCs, UTs, UNCs, etc.

But the same is taking place with the relatively new Preisdent of VT. It's "First-generation" or bust for him. WHY? Is it just the USN&WR ratings pushing this? Go read the VT EA results, and the UVA EA results pages on this forum and see the kinds of statistics that are being deferred from TJ. Also there's a TJ acceptance thread with a similar point of view. (BTW I have no affiliation with VT). But these kids who are rejected or deferred have outstanding statistics and they are being favored over the first-generation applicants. Many VA families really NEED Virginia Tech this year because of financial reasons due to covid. The OOS and private tech schools are too expensive = lots of frustration.

Also UVA gets only a small percentage of its budget from the Commonwealth. It can do what it wants for the most part. And the Commonwealth WILL have to pay attention when enough parents in Virginia rise up and say "enough OSS - my own kid can't get into any of the UC schools and I've paid taxes for 30 years". Public institutions do have a different mission than privates. The other states have already starting curtailing the OSS programs.

The Commonwealth has 41 institutions of higher learning, which includes the community colleges. Per student population that's pretty amazing.

For UVa president it’s because he himself was a First Gen

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:25% admit rate is still higher than NOVA!

WRONG. Fairfax: 36 percent admit rate; Arlington 35; Loudoun 30. 1843 students from these counties admitted in 2019. ONE from Allegheny County.

Don't give facts to these people, they need a crutch to rationalize the deferral/waitlist/reject. The my kid didn't get into UVA parents here are a self licking ice cream cone, the world outside of NOVA is filled with inferior students that can only achieve admission by a handout, gross.

+1

*100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ECs don’t matter much for UVA. This year will be really tough for your son.

Yes they do, especially if they show grit and ability to finish a lengthy, complicated project on time. Like Eagle Scouts or Gold Award.

Do you really think being an Eagle Scout shows “grit”? LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ECs don’t matter much for UVA. This year will be really tough for your son.

Yes they do, especially if they show grit and ability to finish a lengthy, complicated project on time. Like Eagle Scouts or Gold Award.

Do you really think being an Eagle Scout shows “grit”? LOL

I think Eagle Scout has a lot of tasks but every ES I know built a bench or a wooden path for some entity they were already members (church, previous PS, neighborhood) and is GoFundMe for supplies. Yes, the very definition of grit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ECs don’t matter much for UVA. This year will be really tough for your son.

Yes they do, especially if they show grit and ability to finish a lengthy, complicated project on time. Like Eagle Scouts or Gold Award.

Do you really think being an Eagle Scout shows “grit”? LOL

I think Eagle Scout has a lot of tasks but every ES I know built a bench or a wooden path for some entity they were already members (church, previous PS, neighborhood) and is GoFundMe for supplies. Yes, the very definition of grit

😂

[Anonymous]

Regarding first generation admits, there tends to be a lot of overlap between this group, minorities, and Pell grant recipients. So, if the university says 20% of the admitted or attending class is first gen, 25% is minority, and 10% received Pell grants, the percent of unique students between these groups might be 28% (some white kids might have received Pell grants). However, just because these kids have these designations, doesn’t mean they aren’t qualified.

The point is that elite schools are not really admitting more minorities. Instead, they are shifting the “descriptors” of the minorities they accept based on shifting ranking criteria and social pressures. For example, elite colleges used to admit more Blacks from wealthy backgrounds. These students essentially had much the same background as the white admits. However, when first gen and Pell grants became a thing, they started admitting more minorities with those attributes and fewer wealthy minorities. Now, there are lots of articles about poor minorities admitted to prestigious colleges that don’t feel like they “fit” with the culture. Anyway, be careful about your assumptions and how you read the data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ECs don’t matter much for UVA. This year will be really tough for your son.

Yes they do, especially if they show grit and ability to finish a lengthy, complicated project on time. Like Eagle Scouts or Gold Award.

Do you really think being an Eagle Scout shows “grit”? LOL

I think Eagle Scout has a lot of tasks but every ES I know built a bench or a wooden path for some entity they were already members (church, previous PS, neighborhood) and is GoFundMe for supplies. Yes, the very definition of grit

The Eagle project is only one small part of a multi-year process. I’m sorry your kid couldn’t stick with it, but colleges do, in fact, value Eagle Scouts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Go read College Confidential on VT and UVA. And also the subreddits and you will see the same. Students and famlies upset that they counted VT as a reach, match or safety and got zero and are desperately hoping to get off the deferral/waitlists.

There is a thread about VT - VT is taking more URM this year, and the stats are lower than usual, so lots of higher stats kids denied.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's what I'm wrestling with. I think UVA has gone overboard this year with the first-generation segment of applicants. We know UVA received almost 50,000 applications, a 17 percent increase this year. Out of the ED applications (38% increase), 968 were accepted. A few were rejected. The rest were deferred. Then 28,897 students applied for EA. 21,048 of those applications came from OOS. 18% OOS students were offered a slot.

But a whopping 692 first-generationers (remember the entire class is 3,750) were offered and ED or EA slot. I could be wrong but I don't think admissions has been transparent about how many of the first-generation students were EA or ED.

So with a class of 3,750, you first have to subtract those that took a gap year due to covid. Let's just say 200. the ED (minus or take a few that bowed out due to finances). Now, take 3,550 and subtract the EDs of 968 and you are down to 2,582. You have now a 6000 accepted EA (no one knows in this year how many of them will show up - family finances will play a huge party). So you are now in negative territory (2,582 - 6,000). Also you have those students who were deferred, not rejected from ED. If one-half of those 6,000 showed up, UVA is still over subscribed. If a third show up, then there are 582 slots left for ED deferred, EA deferred and RD. Now toss in the athletes (may already be in), URM, more low-income, Blue Ridge Scholars, the Jefferson Scholars, rich daddys who have made calls and it increasingly becomes an imposible situation for those like OP's kid.

What I'm pondering and haven't settled on a decision yet is why are so many slots going to in-state and OOS first-generation students? 692 slots for a class of 3,750 seems extreme. I'm a first-generation student (and white) and back then it didn't count for squat. No one even thought of it. Yes, I understand USN&WR now uses this category as a "social mobility" factor, but why are we rewarding students simply because their parents didn't finish college? Mine didn't. My grandfather didn't even finish middle school because his father died and he had to take care of the farm. VT is also doing the same.

I think -all things being equal - there are other more important subcategories in Admissions such as URM, Blue Ridge Scholars (disadvantaged and poor), etc. etc. Why is first-generation now so hot. Even as of 2015, 54% of all students were first-generationers (although most of us didn't know it). And only 14-16% of those were minorities.
https://firstgen.naspa.org/research-and-policy/national-data-fact-sheets-on-first-generation-college-students/national-data-fact-sheets. That may have changed. So I don't think you can say this is pushing race issues. Is this all just because USN&WR added the social mobility criteria and schools must now report the number to USN&WR.

But where does that leave the superstars at Virginia's top public and private schools. Or the TJ superstars? It's happening at TJ too. The Commonwealth's top kids aren't getting into the flagship or the state's best tech school. Is this right? I'm very proud of the fact that I am self-made with no help from anyone along the way. I should not have been rewarded that my parents did not graduate from college. And I was low-income too.

What do you think (and don't make this a DCUM yelling match). I'm genuinely curious.

Another step I think needs to be taken is to increase the number of seats at Virginian schools as other states have. Texas is top 6% of public high school class (a fairer one than Virginia's - and easier on the students and the parents); California has virtually pushed out all the OOS when the voters got fed up paying for a very good system (UC, Cal State, Community college) but their own chldren couldn't get in. UVA is still at 35%OOS and I bet that a lot of them are the first-generation students that Jim Ryan is so keen on admitting.

https://news.virginia.edu/content/historic-application-year-uva-offers-early-action-admission-more-6000

The current president, Jim Ryan, made First Gen acceptance a priority when he came on board. The legislature sets the in state/out of state numbers and how public colleges/universities are designed; this is not a a high priority for them. Charlottesville is small compared to California markets, Texas markets etc. Virginia does not have a large state system like UCs, UTs, UNCs, etc.

But the same is taking place with the relatively new Preisdent of VT. It's "First-generation" or bust for him. WHY? Is it just the USN&WR ratings pushing this? Go read the VT EA results, and the UVA EA results pages on this forum and see the kinds of statistics that are being deferred from TJ. Also there's a TJ acceptance thread with a similar point of view. (BTW I have no affiliation with VT). But these kids who are rejected or deferred have outstanding statistics and they are being favored over the first-generation applicants. Many VA families really NEED Virginia Tech this year because of financial reasons due to covid. The OOS and private tech schools are too expensive = lots of frustration.

Also UVA gets only a small percentage of its budget from the Commonwealth. It can do what it wants for the most part. And the Commonwealth WILL have to pay attention when enough parents in Virginia rise up and say "enough OSS - my own kid can't get into any of the UC schools and I've paid taxes for 30 years". Public institutions do have a different mission than privates. The other states have already starting curtailing the OSS programs.

The Commonwealth has 41 institutions of higher learning, which includes the community colleges. Per student population that's pretty amazing.

For UVa president it’s because he himself was a First Gen

Huh? From Where??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ECs don’t matter much for UVA. This year will be really tough for your son.

Yes they do, especially if they show grit and ability to finish a lengthy, complicated project on time. Like Eagle Scouts or Gold Award.

Do you really think being an Eagle Scout shows “grit”? LOL

I think Eagle Scout has a lot of tasks but every ES I know built a bench or a wooden path for some entity they were already members (church, previous PS, neighborhood) and is GoFundMe for supplies. Yes, the very definition of grit

😂

+2

I'm sorry, the Eagle Scout crap has GOT to go. They are in high school!

[Anonymous]

According to both a HS counselor and two college admission officers that we know, being an Eagle Scout doesn’t count for anything anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's what I'm wrestling with. I think UVA has gone overboard this year with the first-generation segment of applicants. We know UVA received almost 50,000 applications, a 17 percent increase this year. Out of the ED applications (38% increase), 968 were accepted. A few were rejected. The rest were deferred. Then 28,897 students applied for EA. 21,048 of those applications came from OOS. 18% OOS students were offered a slot.

But a whopping 692 first-generationers (remember the entire class is 3,750) were offered and ED or EA slot. I could be wrong but I don't think admissions has been transparent about how many of the first-generation students were EA or ED.

So with a class of 3,750, you first have to subtract those that took a gap year due to covid. Let's just say 200. the ED (minus or take a few that bowed out due to finances). Now, take 3,550 and subtract the EDs of 968 and you are down to 2,582. You have now a 6000 accepted EA (no one knows in this year how many of them will show up - family finances will play a huge party). So you are now in negative territory (2,582 - 6,000). Also you have those students who were deferred, not rejected from ED. If one-half of those 6,000 showed up, UVA is still over subscribed. If a third show up, then there are 582 slots left for ED deferred, EA deferred and RD. Now toss in the athletes (may already be in), URM, more low-income, Blue Ridge Scholars, the Jefferson Scholars, rich daddys who have made calls and it increasingly becomes an imposible situation for those like OP's kid.

What I'm pondering and haven't settled on a decision yet is why are so many slots going to in-state and OOS first-generation students? 692 slots for a class of 3,750 seems extreme. I'm a first-generation student (and white) and back then it didn't count for squat. No one even thought of it. Yes, I understand USN&WR now uses this category as a "social mobility" factor, but why are we rewarding students simply because their parents didn't finish college? Mine didn't. My grandfather didn't even finish middle school because his father died and he had to take care of the farm. VT is also doing the same.

I think -all things being equal - there are other more important subcategories in Admissions such as URM, Blue Ridge Scholars (disadvantaged and poor), etc. etc. Why is first-generation now so hot. Even as of 2015, 54% of all students were first-generationers (although most of us didn't know it). And only 14-16% of those were minorities.
https://firstgen.naspa.org/research-and-policy/national-data-fact-sheets-on-first-generation-college-students/national-data-fact-sheets. That may have changed. So I don't think you can say this is pushing race issues. Is this all just because USN&WR added the social mobility criteria and schools must now report the number to USN&WR.

But where does that leave the superstars at Virginia's top public and private schools. Or the TJ superstars? It's happening at TJ too. The Commonwealth's top kids aren't getting into the flagship or the state's best tech school. Is this right? I'm very proud of the fact that I am self-made with no help from anyone along the way. I should not have been rewarded that my parents did not graduate from college. And I was low-income too.

What do you think (and don't make this a DCUM yelling match). I'm genuinely curious.

Another step I think needs to be taken is to increase the number of seats at Virginian schools as other states have. Texas is top 6% of public high school class (a fairer one than Virginia's - and easier on the students and the parents); California has virtually pushed out all the OOS when the voters got fed up paying for a very good system (UC, Cal State, Community college) but their own chldren couldn't get in. UVA is still at 35%OOS and I bet that a lot of them are the first-generation students that Jim Ryan is so keen on admitting.

https://news.virginia.edu/content/historic-application-year-uva-offers-early-action-admission-more-6000

The current president, Jim Ryan, made First Gen acceptance a priority when he came on board. The legislature sets the in state/out of state numbers and how public colleges/universities are designed; this is not a a high priority for them. Charlottesville is small compared to California markets, Texas markets etc. Virginia does not have a large state system like UCs, UTs, UNCs, etc.

But the same is taking place with the relatively new Preisdent of VT. It's "First-generation" or bust for him. WHY? Is it just the USN&WR ratings pushing this? Go read the VT EA results, and the UVA EA results pages on this forum and see the kinds of statistics that are being deferred from TJ. Also there's a TJ acceptance thread with a similar point of view. (BTW I have no affiliation with VT). But these kids who are rejected or deferred have outstanding statistics and they are being favored over the first-generation applicants. Many VA families really NEED Virginia Tech this year because of financial reasons due to covid. The OOS and private tech schools are too expensive = lots of frustration.

Also UVA gets only a small percentage of its budget from the Commonwealth. It can do what it wants for the most part. And the Commonwealth WILL have to pay attention when enough parents in Virginia rise up and say "enough OSS - my own kid can't get into any of the UC schools and I've paid taxes for 30 years". Public institutions do have a different mission than privates. The other states have already starting curtailing the OSS programs.

The Commonwealth has 41 institutions of higher learning, which includes the community colleges. Per student population that's pretty amazing.

For UVa president it’s because he himself was a First Gen

But so am I. And I made it to Harvard Law on my own, just like he made it to Harvard on his own. Again, why this push amongst most f the Presidents to push “first-generation” applicants this year. 56 percent of US students are already first-generation (and white and low-income like me). Why niw? I think it is all USN&WR driven. Why should be. Students ( all stats being equal) get a slot at any public institution simply because his parents didn’t finish college, as my didn’t?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ECs don’t matter much for UVA. This year will be really tough for your son.

Yes they do, especially if they show grit and ability to finish a lengthy, complicated project on time. Like Eagle Scouts or Gold Award.

Do you really think being an Eagle Scout shows “grit”? LOL

I think Eagle Scout has a lot of tasks but every ES I know built a bench or a wooden path for some entity they were already members (church, previous PS, neighborhood) and is GoFundMe for supplies. Yes, the very definition of grit

😂

You clearly don’t know what it takes to make Eagle.