A Solution to the TJ Lottery Madness

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The ignorance in these threads is appalling.

You can be living in poverty and *still* have privilege due to your race/ethnicity. A poor white child is not looked with the same negative stereotypes as a poor Black child, for example. Racial profiling is not based on income. And Asians are not racially profiled the way Black people are. The fact is that Asians do not receive the level of discrimination from systemic racism that Black and Hispanic people do. To ignore the data that exists on this matter is foolish and irresponsible.

Are you kidding me? White privilege, just like wealth, is head and shoulders above that of the any of other groups in this society. The lottery shoots down Asians and helps Whites, the most privileged group in this country. Practically no Asian has not been teased by the color of their skin, slanted eyes, funny pronunciation, meek attitudes, weak physique, etc. Many have jumped across oceans and continents to flee their own kinds of discrimination at home and frankly speaking a lot more poverty than exists here. Asians go to good schools, but society ignores them for promotion to management positions or positions of political power even compared to Blacks and Hispanics. Don’t try to make this as something to help Blacks and Hispanics. Whites, the group that has the most privileges, not only in this country, but across the entire globe are being helped in a nontrivial manner at the expense of Asians in this case. That is the data. This is exactly how minorities in different countries have been suppressed in world history.

Can we all agree that the heterogeneous makeup of the United States isn’t ideal? There is a such a thing as too much diversity, there are too many cooks in the kitchen. Everyone wants to outdo everyone else here in this wonderful land.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The ignorance in these threads is appalling.

You can be living in poverty and *still* have privilege due to your race/ethnicity. A poor white child is not looked with the same negative stereotypes as a poor Black child, for example. Racial profiling is not based on income. And Asians are not racially profiled the way Black people are. The fact is that Asians do not receive the level of discrimination from systemic racism that Black and Hispanic people do. To ignore the data that exists on this matter is foolish and irresponsible.

Are you kidding me? White privilege, just like wealth, is head and shoulders above that of the any of other groups in this society. The lottery shoots down Asians and helps Whites, the most privileged group in this country. Practically no Asian has not been teased by the color of their skin, slanted eyes, funny pronunciation, meek attitudes, weak physique, etc. Many have jumped across oceans and continents to flee their own kinds of discrimination at home and frankly speaking a lot more poverty than exists here. Asians go to good schools, but society ignores them for promotion to management positions or positions of political power even compared to Blacks and Hispanics. Don’t try to make this as something to help Blacks and Hispanics. Whites, the group that has the most privileges, not only in this country, but across the entire globe are being helped in a nontrivial manner at the expense of Asians in this case. That is the data. This is exactly how minorities in different countries have been suppressed in world history.

Can we all agree that the heterogeneous makeup of the United States isn’t ideal? There is a such a thing as too much diversity, there are too many cooks in the kitchen. Everyone wants to outdo everyone else here in this wonderful land.

Is it racist to say that the US was founded by white people based on Christian values? You don’t have to agree, but this is a fact. The US isn’t perfect, but we have been more accepting and open than any other country or society in history. Sorry, but if you come to any country as a minority, you may experience some backlash. Maybe the US isn’t the utopia that many believe it to be. Diversity comes with inevitable issues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

Fairfax Democrats are bunch of spineless, pandering hypocrites. Vote republicans in November.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

If asians would think strategically they would be trump supporters

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The ignorance in these threads is appalling.

You can be living in poverty and *still* have privilege due to your race/ethnicity. A poor white child is not looked with the same negative stereotypes as a poor Black child, for example. Racial profiling is not based on income. And Asians are not racially profiled the way Black people are. The fact is that Asians do not receive the level of discrimination from systemic racism that Black and Hispanic people do. To ignore the data that exists on this matter is foolish and irresponsible.

Are you kidding me? White privilege, just like wealth, is head and shoulders above that of the any of other groups in this society. The lottery shoots down Asians and helps Whites, the most privileged group in this country. Practically no Asian has not been teased by the color of their skin, slanted eyes, funny pronunciation, meek attitudes, weak physique, etc. Many have jumped across oceans and continents to flee their own kinds of discrimination at home and frankly speaking a lot more poverty than exists here. Asians go to good schools, but society ignores them for promotion to management positions or positions of political power even compared to Blacks and Hispanics. Don’t try to make this as something to help Blacks and Hispanics. Whites, the group that has the most privileges, not only in this country, but across the entire globe are being helped in a nontrivial manner at the expense of Asians in this case. That is the data. This is exactly how minorities in different countries have been suppressed in world history.

Can we all agree that the heterogeneous makeup of the United States isn’t ideal? There is a such a thing as too much diversity, there are too many cooks in the kitchen. Everyone wants to outdo everyone else here in this wonderful land.

Is it racist to say that the US was founded by white people based on Christian values? You don’t have to agree, but this is a fact. The US isn’t perfect, but we have been more accepting and open than any other country or society in history. Sorry, but if you come to any country as a minority, you may experience some backlash. Maybe the US isn’t the utopia that many believe it to be. Diversity comes with inevitable issues.

Fairfax democrats, pay attention to this. Asians by and large are democrats because the attitude like PP's. But your own racist policy against Asians counters it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

If asians would think strategically they would be trump supporters

A Lot of them will be voting that way come November, which is very unfortunately as they are caught b/t a rock (Trump's anti-China and anti-immigrant) rhetoric and and a hard place (Democrat's sacrificing and marginalizing the Asians for the sake of leveling the playing field). Weighing the two options, they will opt to go Red as US is their home base not China. This is where they pledge their allegiance and fight for their right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

If asians would think strategically they would be trump supporters

A Lot of them will be voting that way come November, which is very unfortunately as they are caught b/t a rock (Trump's anti-China and anti-immigrant) rhetoric and and a hard place (Democrat's sacrificing and marginalizing the Asians for the sake of leveling the playing field). Weighing the two options, they will opt to go Red as US is their home base not China. This is where they pledge their allegiance and fight for their right.

Got that right. This blatant racism against Asians will force many Asians in northern Virginia to vote Republicans for all elective offices. Asians will turn Virginia into a purple state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

If asians would think strategically they would be trump supporters

A Lot of them will be voting that way come November, which is very unfortunately as they are caught b/t a rock (Trump's anti-China and anti-immigrant) rhetoric and and a hard place (Democrat's sacrificing and marginalizing the Asians for the sake of leveling the playing field). Weighing the two options, they will opt to go Red as US is their home base not China. This is where they pledge their allegiance and fight for their right.

Got that right. This blatant racism against Asians will force many Asians in northern Virginia to vote Republicans for all elective offices. Asians will turn Virginia into a purple state.

+1

All politics are local. If there is a sizable shift in November, maybe they will rethink this racist policy.

[Anonymous]

And remember this TJ issue effects not only Fairfax county but also Arlington, Loudoun county, Prince William county and falls church as well.

This issue is forcing Asians in all those jurisdictions to vote against racist Democrats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole discussion does point out how awful our schools are. Not awful as in "failing to educate" perhaps, but definitely awful as "only the top high school is considered competitive internationally".

I grew up in Western Europe and benefited from a free and excellent education. It is a strange realization that this is not an option for most Americans.

In Western Europe do they offer prep courses for every single standardized test? These courses have aided in broadening the preexisting chasm amongst students. It may be legal, but it isn’t fair. Ruthless helicopter parents and obsessive prepping don’t always yield successful gifted students.

We have lot of tests in this country and enormous unfairness including singling out this particular TJ test out of dozens of tests and singling out Asians to discriminate.

It has nothing to do with Asians, but everything to do with people of all races working the system to one’s advantage. If we are to truly weed out the unqualified students, and discover raw talent/genius, we need to completely level the playing field. Anything else is skewed.

Ok then. Let’s institute a lottery system for all similar situations but you will only want to agree with a policy that discriminate against Asians.

No, let’s create and implement exams that can only be prepped for by studying on one’s own. No extra help, no prep courses. If these are gifted children, this shouldn’t be an issue.

But that is not what fcps is doing. They are ramming through the new proposal acting like Trump. My way or the highway. No difference.

If asians would think strategically they would be trump supporters

A Lot of them will be voting that way come November, which is very unfortunately as they are caught b/t a rock (Trump's anti-China and anti-immigrant) rhetoric and and a hard place (Democrat's sacrificing and marginalizing the Asians for the sake of leveling the playing field). Weighing the two options, they will opt to go Red as US is their home base not China. This is where they pledge their allegiance and fight for their right.

Lol, ok

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In reading about the FCPS' frenzied, half-assed approach to revamping TJ admissions, it seems to me that the proposed merit-based lottery system is an inane solution to addressing diversity. More alarmingly, it is detrimental to the quality of a high school that refreshingly has a rigorous curriculum and a high standard. For a change, we have a school that is competitive with what would be routine in other countries.

If only our Middle Schools and Elementary Schools had such high standards, we would be building a strong foundation in the children from early on for all demographics, and not be in this situation. On the contrary, look at the number elementary school teachers who teach Math and Science who actually have a STEM background – they may be counted on the one hand. In other countries, elementary school Math is taught by someone with math expertise and the Science teacher has a science background. The data in this survey -- https://www.sreb.org/blog-post/giving-elementary-teachers-tools-teach-math-well -- is quite telling: only 3% of elementary school teachers have a degree in Math or Math Education. It is appalling that anyone in this country can become an elementary school teacher with only a teacher certification. Most of them are liberal arts majors, with no clear understanding of Math or Science concepts themselves and, sadly, with an expressed dislike for Math and Science. What kind of passion can you expect them to instill in our children? As a result, most of our elementary school education is focused on social studies and the soft subjects, with only lip service to Science and Math. Much of the math and science education, therefore, is left to the parents’ initiatives to provide the training and exposure. So, the result is not surprising. We routinely turn a blind eye toward this science and math apathy in the foundational years of school. Our public school education system is failing at the foundation and here we are trying to paint the roof with a desired proportion of colors. To paraphrase Thomas L. Friedman, we are rapidly racing ourselves to the bottom.

The crap shoot approach being proposed for TJ admissions would amount to nothing but diluting the quality of an exemplary school and, in fact, would lead to reverse-discrimination of excluding the top students with a genuine STEM passion by subjecting them to a game of chance. Of course, there is no NAACP or politician championing for the top STEM students, because it is not politically sexy and doesn’t get votes. The argument that the FCPS Superintendent offered in favor of this lottery system is that certain families spend about $15,000 in test prep. This argument is ludicrous, at best. Why is preparing for a test a dirty word? How is this different from preparing for any standardized test? How is this different from training for a sport or a music competition, where parents do spend a lot of money? In a similar vein to the lottery-based admission to a STEM school, would the school and college athletics programs also adopt a lottery system? After all, parents spend a lot of money on sports camps and training athletes to be competitive. Professional NBA is made of 74% Blacks, 23% White, 1.8% Latino and 0.2% Asian players (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_NBA). Similarly, NFL has 70% Blacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_players_in_professional_American_football). Are these numbers representative of our demographic? Why aren’t we addressing that?

Returning to the issue of our hometown, there is a sensible and meaningful solution to the TJ situation: If the goal is to have a certain percentage/number of preferred inclusion of the underrepresented groups, why not carve out the desired fraction of admissions in each class exclusively for the underrepresented groups? Let's say a class has 500 students, and a 20% representation (or pick whatever distribution that fancies the bean counters) of the underrepresented groups is desired. This means that 100 of the spots would be dedicated to the underrepresented population. Among the 100, the target may be 40 Black, 30 Hispanic, 30 other underrepresented groups. Then, admit the top scorers in the admissions test, teacher recommendations, SIS essays within the respective groups – in our example, the top 40 among all Black applicants, the top 30 among all Hispanic applicants and the top 30 among the other underrepresented groups. The remaining 400 is open to all other groups – Asians, Whites and anyone else. This will ensure that each class will have exactly the same demographic proportion desired and the politicians can win elections touting their dedication to diversity. This is still merit based and will be rewarding the top STEM students than leaving their fate to a game of chance. It is a win-all solution.

Is anyone listening?

This lottery sounds too good to be true. Sign me up already!