AP Panic - what's going on with elimination of Ap's at Elite Privates

[Anonymous]

I'm surprised people don't like that some schools have checked out of the AP system. The College Board has so much money. As colleges go test optional, the AP system becomes more important to the College Board's revenue stream. Don't drink the kool-aide their selling. You can have an excellent education and get into a fantastic school without APs on your transcript.

[Anonymous]

PP is giving terrible advice. What is most important at the "fantastic" school is whether an applicant has take the most advanced classes available. So if high school offers them, take them if you want to go to an IVY etc. If your school does not offer them, take honors or whatever and don't worry about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised people don't like that some schools have checked out of the AP system. The College Board has so much money. As colleges go test optional, the AP system becomes more important to the College Board's revenue stream. Don't drink the kool-aide their selling. You can have an excellent education and get into a fantastic school without APs on your transcript.

Very few people don't like ditching College Board.

[Anonymous]

The AP curricula are intended to be similar to an intro class at the average college. That standard is a lot less than I want for my money. I don't believe that the courses at the average college are comparable to the classes my DC will take at an elite college (besides the first semester science and calculus classes which are pretty standard). When I went to college, survey/intro classes at the AP level were considered basically remedial for those who needed an easy class or didn't have strong academic preparation. So I have much higher expectations for my DC's private school than what is in the AP curricula. For my tuition dollars I want a far more sophisticated effort from the teachers. I want my DC to wrestle with primary sources and real scholarship, not some textbook approved by the wackos at the Texas board of education. I want DC to have discussions in class with students who are nearly all headed to similar colleges. And I want DC to have to write extensively at length and depth like in an elite college and never have a multiple choice test in school.

[Anonymous]

Two kids at a top DC private that joined with other privates in eliminating all AP classes, starting next year. I spent a lot of time talking with the head of school, other administrators, and teachers about it. There is universal support for ditching APs. And they are NOT just relabeling classes. Their longstanding view is that AP classes require a lot of work, but not much intellectual engagement. Simply running through a set curriculum does not engage the gifts of the stellar faculty or truly challenge the students.

As a few other posters have said, most of the colleges were the school's grads go do not give credit for APs. Some allow advanced placement in some subjects. Other type privates in three Northeast have also eliminated APs, so colleges know what top expect. And having just finished the college application process for our senior, including visits to more than a dozen top colleges, the fact is that colleges know these schools and want their graduates. Having gone to public school myself, I have some mixed feelings about rhe whole thing. But it's certainly clear to me that top privates getting rid of APs will cause zero harm to their graduates' college prospects. Will likely make their graduates even morr appealing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/2019/10/course-rigor-and-curriculum-strength.html

There's a whole section about APs in this blog.

Plenty of people want to know how many AP courses a student should take to be competitive in our process. We don't approach applications this way. First of all, not everyone goes to a school with APs as an option.

They also know when you're avoiding the perfectly excellent public schools that do have AP options and instead you're choosing a school that doesn't have it. They would also expect that if the coursework is more vigorous than public school AP classes, then the student should have no problem taking the AP exam to prove their knowledge. Paying $$$$ for private school shows you're not so poor that the exam is unaffordable.

We didn't avoid public school, we chose private HS after public elementary & middle schools. The private school we chose had AP classes up until this year, when they basically just renamed them to "Advanced". The kids are still going to take the AP exams in May. My kid is heading to one of the HYP schools in the fall unhooked, so the school obviously didn't have any issues with the lack of "AP" classes on the transcript.

You’ve made my point. Your kid still took the AP exam, which is what colleges will want to see from kids coming out of expensive private schools without AP classes.

The other pp stated UVA doesn’t expect APs from applicants coming from schools without them, but they are talking about schools that may not be high ranking public schools. They would not judge an applicant from a good school district attending an expensive private school without APs the same way. They expect AP exams to be taken because the kids there have the means to do so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/2019/10/course-rigor-and-curriculum-strength.html

There's a whole section about APs in this blog.

Plenty of people want to know how many AP courses a student should take to be competitive in our process. We don't approach applications this way. First of all, not everyone goes to a school with APs as an option.

They also know when you're avoiding the perfectly excellent public schools that do have AP options and instead you're choosing a school that doesn't have it. They would also expect that if the coursework is more vigorous than public school AP classes, then the student should have no problem taking the AP exam to prove their knowledge. Paying $$$$ for private school shows you're not so poor that the exam is unaffordable.

We didn't avoid public school, we chose private HS after public elementary & middle schools. The private school we chose had AP classes up until this year, when they basically just renamed them to "Advanced". The kids are still going to take the AP exams in May. My kid is heading to one of the HYP schools in the fall unhooked, so the school obviously didn't have any issues with the lack of "AP" classes on the transcript.

You’ve made my point. Your kid still took the AP exam, which is what colleges will want to see from kids coming out of expensive private schools without AP classes.

The other pp stated UVA doesn’t expect APs from applicants coming from schools without them, but they are talking about schools that may not be high ranking public schools. They would not judge an applicant from a good school district attending an expensive private school without APs the same way. They expect AP exams to be taken because the kids there have the means to do so.

AP tests aren’t necessary to get into a good school nor does taking 17 AP exams make your kid a “better” candidate than others. My kids at an expensive private school took 3 and 4 AP exams, respectively, and got into three of HYPS each. The AP exam is devalued and not a point of comparison between schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t believe PP. when I was touring colleges they made a big deal about AP and AP credits. Said kids who come in with credits are often top students and can graduate a year early or pick up a double major. If you don’t think those are excellent points whatever- enjoy your fancy private school.

You don't think kids who are taking rigorous courses at the fancy private schools can run circles around your public school AP class kids on the AP exams?

Not at all.

Well I do

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/2019/10/course-rigor-and-curriculum-strength.html

There's a whole section about APs in this blog.

Plenty of people want to know how many AP courses a student should take to be competitive in our process. We don't approach applications this way. First of all, not everyone goes to a school with APs as an option.

They also know when you're avoiding the perfectly excellent public schools that do have AP options and instead you're choosing a school that doesn't have it. They would also expect that if the coursework is more vigorous than public school AP classes, then the student should have no problem taking the AP exam to prove their knowledge. Paying $$$$ for private school shows you're not so poor that the exam is unaffordable.

We didn't avoid public school, we chose private HS after public elementary & middle schools. The private school we chose had AP classes up until this year, when they basically just renamed them to "Advanced". The kids are still going to take the AP exams in May. My kid is heading to one of the HYP schools in the fall unhooked, so the school obviously didn't have any issues with the lack of "AP" classes on the transcript.

You’ve made my point. Your kid still took the AP exam, which is what colleges will want to see from kids coming out of expensive private schools without AP classes.

The other pp stated UVA doesn’t expect APs from applicants coming from schools without them, but they are talking about schools that may not be high ranking public schools. They would not judge an applicant from a good school district attending an expensive private school without APs the same way. They expect AP exams to be taken because the kids there have the means to do so.

AP tests aren’t necessary to get into a good school nor does taking 17 AP exams make your kid a “better” candidate than others. My kids at an expensive private school took 3 and 4 AP exams, respectively, and got into three of HYPS each. The AP exam is devalued and not a point of comparison between schools.

Okay, not to digress too much but can you speak to what made your children such a successful applicant to three of Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford each? I'm genuinely curious, envious, and fascinated. It's hard to convey via an anonymous forum, but there is zero snark in this request. And kudos to your children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/2019/10/course-rigor-and-curriculum-strength.html

There's a whole section about APs in this blog.

Plenty of people want to know how many AP courses a student should take to be competitive in our process. We don't approach applications this way. First of all, not everyone goes to a school with APs as an option.

They also know when you're avoiding the perfectly excellent public schools that do have AP options and instead you're choosing a school that doesn't have it. They would also expect that if the coursework is more vigorous than public school AP classes, then the student should have no problem taking the AP exam to prove their knowledge. Paying $$$$ for private school shows you're not so poor that the exam is unaffordable.

We didn't avoid public school, we chose private HS after public elementary & middle schools. The private school we chose had AP classes up until this year, when they basically just renamed them to "Advanced". The kids are still going to take the AP exams in May. My kid is heading to one of the HYP schools in the fall unhooked, so the school obviously didn't have any issues with the lack of "AP" classes on the transcript.

You’ve made my point. Your kid still took the AP exam, which is what colleges will want to see from kids coming out of expensive private schools without AP classes.

The other pp stated UVA doesn’t expect APs from applicants coming from schools without them, but they are talking about schools that may not be high ranking public schools. They would not judge an applicant from a good school district attending an expensive private school without APs the same way. They expect AP exams to be taken because the kids there have the means to do so.

AP tests aren’t necessary to get into a good school nor does taking 17 AP exams make your kid a “better” candidate than others. My kids at an expensive private school took 3 and 4 AP exams, respectively, and got into three of HYPS each. The AP exam is devalued and not a point of comparison between schools.

I never said it had to be 17 AP’s or any number. And you keep saying kids don’t need to take AP exams then use your kids as examples of getting into great schools even though they did take AP exams.

[Anonymous]

AP tests aren’t necessary to get into a good school nor does taking 17 AP exams make your kid a “better” candidate than others. My kids at an expensive private school took 3 and 4 AP exams, respectively, and got into three of HYPS each. The AP exam is devalued and not a point of comparison between schools.

I never said it had to be 17 AP’s or any number. And you keep saying kids don’t need to take AP exams then use your kids as examples of getting into great schools even though they did take AP exams.

+ 1,000,000. This DC Metro area is so frustrating with this exact example in so many ways....APs are not important for so many reasons.... Don't want to pigeon-hole the teachers...Want them to be able to be creative with the curriculum... Only public school kids need to care about this... I expect my kids to learn so much more....blah, blah, blah.... yeah- my kids took some AP tests too.

[Anonymous]

If my child hadn't gotten into a <10% acceptance school but ended up at her in-state safety, she would have wanted those APs to move her ahead in her classes so that she could double/triple major, graduate early, or otherwise stand out being that she was at a less-selective university.

I don't think it's a good idea for families to say "Oh, Student will be admitted to a top school that doesn't take APs so Student does not need to worry about taking any of those silly tests."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/2019/10/course-rigor-and-curriculum-strength.html

There's a whole section about APs in this blog.

Plenty of people want to know how many AP courses a student should take to be competitive in our process. We don't approach applications this way. First of all, not everyone goes to a school with APs as an option.

They also know when you're avoiding the perfectly excellent public schools that do have AP options and instead you're choosing a school that doesn't have it. They would also expect that if the coursework is more vigorous than public school AP classes, then the student should have no problem taking the AP exam to prove their knowledge. Paying $$$$ for private school shows you're not so poor that the exam is unaffordable.

We didn't avoid public school, we chose private HS after public elementary & middle schools. The private school we chose had AP classes up until this year, when they basically just renamed them to "Advanced". The kids are still going to take the AP exams in May. My kid is heading to one of the HYP schools in the fall unhooked, so the school obviously didn't have any issues with the lack of "AP" classes on the transcript.

No hooks besides full pay and private school.

Bitter much? You might want to read up on what need-blind means. And if private school was such a hook then why don't you do it?

Wow, sensitive. Hit a nerve. Looks like the next generation of douche is on track.

Wow bitter AND prejudiced.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AP tests aren’t necessary to get into a good school nor does taking 17 AP exams make your kid a “better” candidate than others. My kids at an expensive private school took 3 and 4 AP exams, respectively, and got into three of HYPS each. The AP exam is devalued and not a point of comparison between schools.

I never said it had to be 17 AP’s or any number. And you keep saying kids don’t need to take AP exams then use your kids as examples of getting into great schools even though they did take AP exams.

+ 1,000,000. This DC Metro area is so frustrating with this exact example in so many ways....APs are not important for so many reasons.... Don't want to pigeon-hole the teachers...Want them to be able to be creative with the curriculum... Only public school kids need to care about this... I expect my kids to learn so much more....blah, blah, blah.... yeah- my kids took some AP tests too.

hey - if that's the conclusion you want to draw from this, your kids aren't my kids. obviously you and your kids make your own decisions. i don't see why you're so frustrated simply because someone doesn't agree with your world view.

what it said to me was that if they were being measured in same pool as kids with 10+ AP tests and were accepted, then going from 3 or 4 to zero wouldn't matter either.

[Anonymous]

NP. I think there's a difference between AP classes and the AP exams. As I understand it, AP classes are taught according to the curriculum developed by the College Board, with the expectation that the class prepares the students for the exam. I think some schools, privates especially, don't want to be locked in to the AP curriculum. They want to be able to teach more creatively, or focus on particular content, or let the students in the particular class go in a direction that interests them, or whatever other reasons/rationale. They may also want to have classes that are beyond the AP curriculum (as designed by the CB) and concerned about colleges thinking that non-AP classes are not the most challenging.

You don't have to take the AP course to take the AP exam. The private schools I am familiar with say that they will support and help any students who want to take the AP exams, they just don't want to be bound by a course syllabus/curriculum that some corporation that makes money off the process developed (well, the schools don't say it that way, but I think that's what they mean).

in other words, you can have it both way -- you can think that AP courses are not the be all end all and still want your kids to take the exams as a measure of their ability, to get college credit, to pass out of intro classes, etc.