Marriage at 17, solely for emancipation purposes. Crazy idea?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have honestly never heard of a police officer dragging an unwilling teenager to a parental visitation. Is the dad telling her this will happen?

An attorney and police officer told her this.

No, they didn’t. Either she’s lying to you, or you’re lying to us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When can't she refuse to go with her father? Call the judge herself to day she is being abused by him, call police if he comes near her, ask for a restraining order?

The father can send the police to pick her up if she doesn’t show up for visitation. She can’t call anyone when it’s happening. He won’t allow her access to a phone. The police said she can request a restraining order only after provable threats or additional injuries.

OP, what state is this in?

[Anonymous]

OP here. The teen ran away rather than deal with her father showing up with the police. He claims he may be open to changing the arrangement, but not in any way that is legally binding.

I get the sense that most of you have no experience with custody cases for older kids. In that state, kids are generally discouraged from testifying. The legal assumption in that state is that the act of testifying is traumatic for a child, and it is used sparingly. Instead, experts are hired to speak for them. No one can afford this. Even if one of us could afford it, it would take a few months to get before a judge. She will be 18 in a few more months. The money and effort would all be for nothing.

I don’t think a protective order would be granted. The law requires an imminent threat, and he has not met the outlined requirements. If he threatens her or prevents her from calling the police, she can move forward with one.

Again, the marriage question was if it was a crazy idea. No one has a set plan for this, or a potential spouse picked out. It was an idea, as the title of this thread clearly indicated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. The teen ran away rather than deal with her father showing up with the police. He claims he may be open to changing the arrangement, but not in any way that is legally binding.

I get the sense that most of you have no experience with custody cases for older kids. In that state, kids are generally discouraged from testifying. The legal assumption in that state is that the act of testifying is traumatic for a child, and it is used sparingly. Instead, experts are hired to speak for them. No one can afford this. Even if one of us could afford it, it would take a few months to get before a judge. She will be 18 in a few more months. The money and effort would all be for nothing.

I don’t think a protective order would be granted. The law requires an imminent threat, and he has not met the outlined requirements. If he threatens her or prevents her from calling the police, she can move forward with one.

Again, the marriage question was if it was a crazy idea. No one has a set plan for this, or a potential spouse picked out. It was an idea, as the title of this thread clearly indicated.

Which state?

I’m very experience with an older child testifying. It’s usually the younger kids they discourage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. The teen ran away rather than deal with her father showing up with the police. He claims he may be open to changing the arrangement, but not in any way that is legally binding.

I get the sense that most of you have no experience with custody cases for older kids. In that state, kids are generally discouraged from testifying. The legal assumption in that state is that the act of testifying is traumatic for a child, and it is used sparingly. Instead, experts are hired to speak for them. No one can afford this. Even if one of us could afford it, it would take a few months to get before a judge. She will be 18 in a few more months. The money and effort would all be for nothing.

I don’t think a protective order would be granted. The law requires an imminent threat, and he has not met the outlined requirements. If he threatens her or prevents her from calling the police, she can move forward with one.

Again, the marriage question was if it was a crazy idea. No one has a set plan for this, or a potential spouse picked out. It was an idea, as the title of this thread clearly indicated.

Which state?

I’m very experience with an older child testifying. It’s usually the younger kids they discourage.

Florida.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. The teen ran away rather than deal with her father showing up with the police. He claims he may be open to changing the arrangement, but not in any way that is legally binding.

I get the sense that most of you have no experience with custody cases for older kids. In that state, kids are generally discouraged from testifying. The legal assumption in that state is that the act of testifying is traumatic for a child, and it is used sparingly. Instead, experts are hired to speak for them. No one can afford this. Even if one of us could afford it, it would take a few months to get before a judge. She will be 18 in a few more months. The money and effort would all be for nothing.

I don’t think a protective order would be granted. The law requires an imminent threat, and he has not met the outlined requirements. If he threatens her or prevents her from calling the police, she can move forward with one.

Again, the marriage question was if it was a crazy idea. No one has a set plan for this, or a potential spouse picked out. It was an idea, as the title of this thread clearly indicated.

Which state?

I’m very experience with an older child testifying. It’s usually the younger kids they discourage.

Florida.

I know two separate families in FL that had older kids testify in custody proceedings. The kids were 15 and 17. Does your teen relative have her own atty or a GAL?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. The teen ran away rather than deal with her father showing up with the police. He claims he may be open to changing the arrangement, but not in any way that is legally binding.

I get the sense that most of you have no experience with custody cases for older kids. In that state, kids are generally discouraged from testifying. The legal assumption in that state is that the act of testifying is traumatic for a child, and it is used sparingly. Instead, experts are hired to speak for them. No one can afford this. Even if one of us could afford it, it would take a few months to get before a judge. She will be 18 in a few more months. The money and effort would all be for nothing.

I don’t think a protective order would be granted. The law requires an imminent threat, and he has not met the outlined requirements. If he threatens her or prevents her from calling the police, she can move forward with one.

Again, the marriage question was if it was a crazy idea. No one has a set plan for this, or a potential spouse picked out. It was an idea, as the title of this thread clearly indicated.

Which state?

I’m very experience with an older child testifying. It’s usually the younger kids they discourage.

Florida.

I know two separate families in FL that had older kids testify in custody proceedings. The kids were 15 and 17. Does your teen relative have her own atty or a GAL?

She doesn’t, and I’m not sure there’s any point to it if she can’t get an emergency hearing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. The teen ran away rather than deal with her father showing up with the police. He claims he may be open to changing the arrangement, but not in any way that is legally binding.

I get the sense that most of you have no experience with custody cases for older kids. In that state, kids are generally discouraged from testifying. The legal assumption in that state is that the act of testifying is traumatic for a child, and it is used sparingly. Instead, experts are hired to speak for them. No one can afford this. Even if one of us could afford it, it would take a few months to get before a judge. She will be 18 in a few more months. The money and effort would all be for nothing.

I don’t think a protective order would be granted. The law requires an imminent threat, and he has not met the outlined requirements. If he threatens her or prevents her from calling the police, she can move forward with one.

Again, the marriage question was if it was a crazy idea. No one has a set plan for this, or a potential spouse picked out. It was an idea, as the title of this thread clearly indicated.

Which state?

I’m very experience with an older child testifying. It’s usually the younger kids they discourage.

Florida.

I know two separate families in FL that had older kids testify in custody proceedings. The kids were 15 and 17. Does your teen relative have her own atty or a GAL?

She doesn’t, and I’m not sure there’s any point to it if she can’t get an emergency hearing.

Her lawyer or GAL can get her the hearing. They usually can pull favors because they know someone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When can't she refuse to go with her father? Call the judge herself to day she is being abused by him, call police if he comes near her, ask for a restraining order?

The father can send the police to pick her up if she doesn’t show up for visitation. She can’t call anyone when it’s happening. He won’t allow her access to a phone. The police said she can request a restraining order only after provable threats or additional injuries.

The police will NOT enforce custody orders without an emergency order from a judge, which are very rarely given. Custody orders are civil, and the police will NOT enforce them. Her dad would have to take mom to court for a violation of the order, and the daughter could testify as to why she refuses to go. She could also probably go to family court with her mother and file for a restraining order.

[Anonymous]

OP, why are you so reluctant to seek actual legal help for this girl? Stop making assumptions and ask actual legal professionals. Seek out a lawyer and a GAL if you really want to help her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:


OP, why are you so reluctant to seek actual legal help for this girl? Stop making assumptions and ask actual legal professionals. Seek out a lawyer and a GAL if you really want to help her.

Well, it doesn’t make as exciting a story as “Did you know my little cousin had to get married at 17 just to get away from her crazy daddy. That mean old judge was going to send her back, but I fixed her up with my friend from HS and they looked soooo cute at the courthouse. He sent her home to live with her momma because he was in it just to help the poor girl out. But I had a feeling they’d fall in love! Sure enough, once she turned 18, they decided to give it a real go. Fairy Takes DO come true!”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:


OP, why are you so reluctant to seek actual legal help for this girl? Stop making assumptions and ask actual legal professionals. Seek out a lawyer and a GAL if you really want to help her.

The potential legal costs might seem overwhelming, OP, in terms of "fighting" this to a conclusion, but If you and other family members can scrape together a few hundred dollars, that would pay for an attorney for the child to listen to the case/facts for an hour and give you some accurate basic advice about options.

I'm concerned that you seem to be conflating 2 different legal tactics in this situation --1) emergency custody order change and 2) temporary restraining order. It may indeed be the case that an emergency custody order change would take some time to get on the court calendar. BUT, generally speaking, temporary restraining orders are heard ex parte and thus are held very quickly. "Ex Parte" means without notice to the defendant (the father in this case). The standard in Florida for a domestic violence restraining order is disjunctive (meaning only 1 of the two following situations must be proved) -- 1) domestic violence has already happened OR 2) there is an imminent danger of domestic violence. Consult with a FL attorney, but it may well be that for the ex parte temporary restraining order to be approved, the court may look for imminent danger. BUT, if the court turns down the temporary restraining order due to lack of imminence, a hearing is still set and must occur within 15 days to hear a permanent restraining order. There is NO requirement for imminence for a permanent restraining order. The father will have notice and the opportunity to argue against a permanent restraining order. A person can fail to get a temporary restraining order but still get a permanent one. This is because since the temporary restraining order hearing is ex parte, the court may require a higher burden of proof so as not to unfairly prejudice the interests of the defendant who doesn't even have notice of the proceeding.

It's very complicated the different standards and rules that apply to situations which involve CPS versus child custody versus restraining orders (both temporary and permanent). I'm not a Florida attorney, and you have not provided all the facts, so it's unclear to me how FL CPS could have "documented injuries" but decided not to take action. This could be because they didn't have proof that the father caused the injuries OR it could be that the remedy available to CPS was taking the child away from the father, which would normally require a very serious behaviors by the father.

This is why you need a lawyer that has an ethical obligation only to the child to walk you/her through the options. It may be that an attorney can also offer some advice on how to stall her way through the next couple of months even if the likelihood of getting a custody change or restraining order was low. That attorney may also offer some more clear guidelines about what the real repercussions to the minor child and mother would be if they avoided visitation, or how best/most effectively to avoid custody.

Finally, I think marriage is a pretty permanent solution to a temporary problem. Are there any other family members in other parts of the country to whom the child could flee. If she can live with another family member and enroll in school, I think there is a very low probability that the father could get through the court system fast enough to get the child returned. Best case scenario would be that the child could return to the home school once she turns 18. Of course an attorney should advise. If she's already "run away" once, then I would prefer an out of state family member to flee to. FWIW, running away to a friend or family should not put them in danger of a kidnapping charge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


OP, why are you so reluctant to seek actual legal help for this girl? Stop making assumptions and ask actual legal professionals. Seek out a lawyer and a GAL if you really want to help her.

Well, it doesn’t make as exciting a story as “Did you know my little cousin had to get married at 17 just to get away from her crazy daddy. That mean old judge was going to send her back, but I fixed her up with my friend from HS and they looked soooo cute at the courthouse. He sent her home to live with her momma because he was in it just to help the poor girl out. But I had a feeling they’d fall in love! Sure enough, once she turned 18, they decided to give it a real go. Fairy Takes DO come true!”

I’m glad you find this so funny. It’s very upsetting for our whole family. She ran away, and no one has been able to locate her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


OP, why are you so reluctant to seek actual legal help for this girl? Stop making assumptions and ask actual legal professionals. Seek out a lawyer and a GAL if you really want to help her.

Well, it doesn’t make as exciting a story as “Did you know my little cousin had to get married at 17 just to get away from her crazy daddy. That mean old judge was going to send her back, but I fixed her up with my friend from HS and they looked soooo cute at the courthouse. He sent her home to live with her momma because he was in it just to help the poor girl out. But I had a feeling they’d fall in love! Sure enough, once she turned 18, they decided to give it a real go. Fairy Takes DO come true!”

I’m glad you find this so funny. It’s very upsetting for our whole family. She ran away, and no one has been able to locate her.

Wait! She ran away and you’ve been posting some crazy teen wedding scheme rather than out looking for her?

[Anonymous]

Running away was a good choice for her to make, since none of the adults in the picture seem prepared to actually help her.