The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid has a slow processing speed they deserve a lower score. This charade will end soon. Affluent parents gaming the system so their kid can bump their 1400 to a 1500 is going to end. They have to have a non-timed test, call it something else and offer it as an addition to the traditional ACT or SAT. Call it the NTSAT (non-timed SAT) offer to anyone with a 504 or to any kid who doesn't want to take the SAT with time constraints. Let the colleges then decide then. But the colleges should KNOW who is getting more time on these tests and this seems like the only fair way. NO MORE EXTRA TIME ON SAT OR ACT FOR ANYONE

. So a blind person who needs technology/reader that slows things down because of the technology should be penalized?

I'm pretty sure OP doesn't think a blind student should get technology/reader. After all, his kid doesn't. Everyone should just go in and do their best. If the blind kid doesn't do as well because he can't see the words, oh well. After all, it's a standardized test, so no deviations allowed. SNORT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want employees who can do the job in the alotted time. I want to know who cant before I hire them.

Since SAT's aren't used in hiring, that's not really relevant.

Actually some companies have asked for these scores - with grade inflation etc they want to know but now either the abuse and accommodations, it will fall back to who you know.

[Anonymous]

Read the Spenceley and Wheeler study on the use of extended time by college students with disabilities:” our results provide evidence that students with disability may be able to access test content in less time than they are provided. Given the threats to validity of scores on tests taken with accommodations, more research is needed to fully understand how extended time influences performance on classroom tests administered to students with and without disabilities both with and without this accommodations. Until then, we recommend that disability services providers continue to work to balance all students right to access academic content without providing unnecessary accommodations that may produce an unfair advantage”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid has a slow processing speed they deserve a lower score. This charade will end soon. Affluent parents gaming the system so their kid can bump their 1400 to a 1500 is going to end. They have to have a non-timed test, call it something else and offer it as an addition to the traditional ACT or SAT. Call it the NTSAT (non-timed SAT) offer to anyone with a 504 or to any kid who doesn't want to take the SAT with time constraints. Let the colleges then decide then. But the colleges should KNOW who is getting more time on these tests and this seems like the only fair way. NO MORE EXTRA TIME ON SAT OR ACT FOR ANYONE

. So a blind person who needs technology/reader that slows things down because of the technology should be penalized?

Stupid. Those accommodations, if given to the typical test taker, would not help. The issue is giving accommodations to some that clearly would be beneficial to all if given to al.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really want to see this extra time scam go away. I’d like ACT and SAT to have to disclose the exact accommodations. But I know this won’t happen.

Instead I invite everyone to get their kids extra time. Go to an ed psych and explain how you think your dc is slow and not performing to his potential. Have your dc absolutely bomb the processing speed subtests. It’s not hard to explain to your kid how and why. Done.

If more and more people do this hopefully this will change for the better.

My DC had extra time because he had a reader and a scribe. Both take longer to take tests as a result. It has to go through two brains ad the scribe frequently doesnt write very fast. He received 50% extra time as a result.

Is your DC in a private school? Do you pay for the reader and the scribe? I am am curious. If your DC is in a public school and the school system pays for the reader and the scribe, will colleges, whether public or private, also pay for the reader and the scribe? Will employers also pay? I genuinly don't know the answer to this. I am asking to be aware of the opportunities that exist out there. TIA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I want employees who can do the job in the alotted time. I want to know who cant before I hire them.

Same. I'm scared for what the workforce is going to look like in 5-7 years when these young people enter the real working world with deadlines and structure that can't bend to their needs.

My teen son is the ONLY boy on his soccer team without an ADD/ADHD diagnosis. When I was his age, there was maybe 3-5 kids in my whole grade who had been diagnosed with those.

Things I overhear during the games "getting Tucker's diagnosis has been such a blessing. His grades have really improved since the accommodations have gone into place. It can be a pain to work around the extra time he's given for the tests, but it's so worth it in the end." "Same for Josh. We're having Emily retested next month as we didn't like the outcome from our first visit." "You should definitely try Dr. Smith if you don't get a favorable outcome this time. He's very understanding of situations like this."

Literally openly talking about gaming the system. Wishing for their kids to be diagnosed with a disability to get extra test time!? Insanity!

Every kid could do just as well on tests if they were also given 90 mins to 2 hours instead of 45-60 minutes. Not only that, but my son has told me how his friends who get to go to the testing center cheat because the room proctor doesn't walk the room.

The fact that next year my kid will be looking at colleges alongside these extra time having cheaters is infuriating. Colleges absolutely need to know which students received accommodations during their academic careers and which did not.

[Anonymous]

There is a lot of misunderstanding going on in this thread. Accommodations have been a thing for quite some time; the world is not suddenly ending.

Processing speed as a technical term in the world of ed psych does not refer to general thinking speed. Instead, it involves visual and general motor speed (including fine motor skill, hand-eye coordination, etc.), functions of the nervous system. Slow reading can be part of the issue, but it's much more than even that.

[Anonymous]

My friend's son was accommodated in HS and at an SLAC. Great kid, but he was fired over and over and over again once he entered the workforce. It was really sad and now he's a stay at home dad. This was a few years ago and I now understand that some workplaces have special training for students with learning differences to help them succeed. I applaud those organizations, and hope for the best for the LD kids because it can be a harsh and rocky road to adulthood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really want to see this extra time scam go away. I’d like ACT and SAT to have to disclose the exact accommodations. But I know this won’t happen.

Instead I invite everyone to get their kids extra time. Go to an ed psych and explain how you think your dc is slow and not performing to his potential. Have your dc absolutely bomb the processing speed subtests. It’s not hard to explain to your kid how and why. Done.

If more and more people do this hopefully this will change for the better.

My DC had extra time because he had a reader and a scribe. Both take longer to take tests as a result. It has to go through two brains ad the scribe frequently doesnt write very fast. He received 50% extra time as a result.

Is your DC in a private school? Do you pay for the reader and the scribe? I am am curious. If your DC is in a public school and the school system pays for the reader and the scribe, will colleges, whether public or private, also pay for the reader and the scribe? Will employers also pay? I genuinly don't know the answer to this. I am asking to be aware of the opportunities that exist out there. TIA.

Not the PP, but my nephew is engaged to a woman who is deaf and they met at college. The college was required to provide her with an interpreter but after the first semester she and her family decided to hire their own private professional interpreter. She's now out in the workforce and the company where she works is required to provide her with an interpreter as well. Her job doesn't require a ton of face-to-face time with others, so the interpreter is only required on some days when there are meetings or presentations. She and her coworkers get by fine without one there during her normal day-to-day job duties, but if she requested one, the company would have to provide it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If your kid has a slow processing speed they deserve a lower score. This charade will end soon. Affluent parents gaming the system so their kid can bump their 1400 to a 1500 is going to end. They have to have a non-timed test, call it something else and offer it as an addition to the traditional ACT or SAT. Call it the NTSAT (non-timed SAT) offer to anyone with a 504 or to any kid who doesn't want to take the SAT with time constraints. Let the colleges then decide then. But the colleges should KNOW who is getting more time on these tests and this seems like the only fair way. NO MORE EXTRA TIME ON SAT OR ACT FOR ANYONE

OP, I'm so sorry that your "normal" kid didn't get into his/her/your college of choice. Next time, be a better parent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is a lot of misunderstanding going on in this thread. Accommodations have been a thing for quite some time; the world is not suddenly ending.

Processing speed as a technical term in the world of ed psych does not refer to general thinking speed. Instead, it involves visual and general motor speed (including fine motor skill, hand-eye coordination, etc.), functions of the nervous system. Slow reading can be part of the issue, but it's much more than even that.

Are you a fool? College Board stopped indicating on scores which needed extra time and the accomodations exploded. Today, the landscape is completely different - kids are getting accomodations left and right. It is no longer a level playing field - the grades and scores are NOT valid when accomodations are so freely given.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid has a slow processing speed they deserve a lower score. This charade will end soon. Affluent parents gaming the system so their kid can bump their 1400 to a 1500 is going to end. They have to have a non-timed test, call it something else and offer it as an addition to the traditional ACT or SAT. Call it the NTSAT (non-timed SAT) offer to anyone with a 504 or to any kid who doesn't want to take the SAT with time constraints. Let the colleges then decide then. But the colleges should KNOW who is getting more time on these tests and this seems like the only fair way. NO MORE EXTRA TIME ON SAT OR ACT FOR ANYONE

OP, I'm so sorry that your "normal" kid didn't get into his/her/your college of choice. Next time, be a better parent.

You mean be a CHEATING parent with low morals

[Anonymous]

My son was diagnosed with ADHD in 3rd grade. He has never had a 504 or IEP. Not all kids need them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is a lot of misunderstanding going on in this thread. Accommodations have been a thing for quite some time; the world is not suddenly ending.

Processing speed as a technical term in the world of ed psych does not refer to general thinking speed. Instead, it involves visual and general motor speed (including fine motor skill, hand-eye coordination, etc.), functions of the nervous system. Slow reading can be part of the issue, but it's much more than even that.

Accommodations have been around for ages, yes, but the abuse of those accommodations and the sheer number of students needing them is alarming.

When a class has so many students with accommodations that it is easier for the non-accommodation students to join another classroom to take the test instead of having all the others leave for the learning/testing center, that's a red flag, IMO. My 10th grader has this issue in his Chemistry class. His teacher and the neighboring teacher hold their tests on the same day because his class has so many students with accommodations that it's easier for the 8 without to go next door than for the 16 with to leave for the testing center.

It's just like the emotional support animal people ruining it for legit service dogs with their abuse of places not being able to ask any questions other than "is it a service animal and what service does it provide?" When I see a dog in the grocery store, my first reaction now is to watch its behavior to see if it is well behaved (real service dog) or badly behaved (fake). When I hear a friend talking about their kid's accommodations, my first reaction is to try to figure out if her kid really has a disability or if her kid is just stupid and they figured out a way to game the system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LOL, you people are so angry...it is comical. So glad my ADHD kid got his deserved extra time that he needed and scored well on the ACT and got into his first choice top 20 school. As for what is done to curb the abuse, I doubt it will change much. Maybe be more careful about who gets accommodations. If you have a kid who struggled since elementary school, it is doubtful that kid is "gaming the system." I believe it is more suspect when kids suddenly in late middle school or in high school decide to get evaluated. Maybe just have more stringent requirements for evaluation for them.

But you will NEVER see the accommodations go away. Sorry, but you won't win this one...nice try though.

when Chinese take over there will be no accommodations whatsoever.

Ha! The biggest accommodation cheat in my kid’s school is Chinese! My child is very close friends with the student so I actually know the student is a cheat.