Why don't people take emotional abuse seriously?

[Anonymous]

OP, I left an emotional abusove relationship. It fundemenally changed who I am. I hear you. But, as others have said - unless you’ve been through it - people won’t get it.

A support group helps. A lot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I left an emotional abusove relationship. It fundemenally changed who I am. I hear you. But, as others have said - unless you’ve been through it - people won’t get it.

A support group helps. A lot.

Can you (or anyone) share local recommendations?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Serious question. I've recently left a grossly emotionally abusive spouse and nobody seems to understand the gravity of this. Gas lighting, minimizing, insulting, controlling - I couldn't bear this any longer. However, when I posted here about my situation about a year ago, the consensus was overall - NBD. I also have friends and family who seem to think this is not a big deal. But it IS.

What say you?

just keep calling the hotline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have to be honest that I may be guilty of this.

In my very limited and shallow experience, the people whom I know who have complained about emotional abuse usually say and do similar things to their spouses. And when you get down to it(in the cases that I know of) it is difficult to determine who is the victim and who is the abuser. Both spouses seem like victims and abusers to me, and I would usually suggest counselling.

Personally, I would leave an emotional abusive relationship fast, but I am not one to advise others to leave because in the cases that I know of, both spouses were emotionally abusive. So I figure maybe there is a way to teach them how to treat each other through therapy.

Physical abuse seems more dangerous, and usually it is clear that one spouse is doing most or all of the physical abuse and the other is taking the heat..

I'm a survivor of abuse, emotional abuse included.

I would vacillate between always agreeing with my abuser, apologizing, not standing up for myself, doing whatever I could do to "keep the peace." Other times, I would respond in kind - respond viciously, scream, rage etc. So yes, from time to time I also did what the abuser did, but I did not have the underlying pathology that drove me to see myself as "superior" to my partner, nor any desire to control his actions.

I can see what you're saying but I don't think it's common to have a situation in which both people are equally perpetuating abuse.

+1.

There is a cycle to abuse. But victims responding to that cycle don't make them abusers. This requires the detailed involvement of an expert in the field. It is very complicated. It's like punishing a child that is a 7 year old bully, who is being molested at home. Certainly, bullying is not okay. But certainly, punishing is not addressing the true problem here. The problem is the abuse. When that stops, the corresponding and problematic behavior usually follows soon after, with new learned principles and therapy.

There is another aspect of the cycle that far too many people aren't aware of where the victim may subconsciously use provocation as a way of getting the abusive episode over with. In physically abusive relationships, there is often a cycle where there's an episode of violence, then remorse on the part of the abuser where they try to make it up to the victim. After that honeymoon period, there usually come a phase of build-up to the next incident of violence, where the abuser isn't physically hurting their victim but is become kind of restless in their non-violence, they get meaner, short-tempered, threatening, etc., until it peaks with violence. That build-up phase can in some ways be worse for the victim because they know the punch is coming but then don't know when, and it's torturous. The victim in those cases will often do something during that build-up phase to make the violence come faster, such as yelling at their abuser, insulting him, maybe even shoving him (not in a way that will cause injury, just make him mad) so they can get the violence over with and get back to the peaceful, harmonious phase.

This same phenomenon happens in emotionally abusive relationships too but it's even harder to recognize when it happens. The emotional abuse victim who gets into an argument with their abuser and can tell it's not going anywhere constructive but won't end until their abuser has let loose (at which point they can have their make-up sex and he'll tell her how much he loves her) might make the subconscious decision to throw a gratuitous insult at their abuser so their abuser will let loose their verbal tirade and the fight will end. The victim knows there's no other way out of the fight except to let the tirade happen, because even if she were to walk away from the fight before it happens, the tirade will still be waiting for an excuse to come out.

This phenomenon is insidious in all abusive relationships because it gives opening for people to blame the victim for their role in the abuse. In physically abusive relationships, though, it's easier for the victim who has done this to recognize that they are still a victim and their abuser is still an abuser because calling someone an asshole doesn't warrant getting pushed down a flight of stairs. It's much worse for emotional abuse victims because an outsider (and even the victim herself) often can't distinguish between insults hurled for the purpose of harming the other person and the insults hurled only to get the abuse over with.

wow, this totally explains my ex's monthly temper tantrums, taking out his work or life stress on me. you could tell the whole weekend he was angry and ready to explode, and then Sunday night he'd deliberately "forget to put the kids to bed", "disappear", or something else to aggravate me and the kids. bait me and I would just be blindsided into his 3 hour temper tantrum, multi-day stonewalling, and every morning he'd demand an apology or else he's leaving. what a psycho.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have to be honest that I may be guilty of this.

In my very limited and shallow experience, the people whom I know who have complained about emotional abuse usually say and do similar things to their spouses. And when you get down to it(in the cases that I know of) it is difficult to determine who is the victim and who is the abuser. Both spouses seem like victims and abusers to me, and I would usually suggest counselling.

Personally, I would leave an emotional abusive relationship fast, but I am not one to advise others to leave because in the cases that I know of, both spouses were emotionally abusive. So I figure maybe there is a way to teach them how to treat each other through therapy.

Physical abuse seems more dangerous, and usually it is clear that one spouse is doing most or all of the physical abuse and the other is taking the heat..

I'm a survivor of abuse, emotional abuse included.

I would vacillate between always agreeing with my abuser, apologizing, not standing up for myself, doing whatever I could do to "keep the peace." Other times, I would respond in kind - respond viciously, scream, rage etc. So yes, from time to time I also did what the abuser did, but I did not have the underlying pathology that drove me to see myself as "superior" to my partner, nor any desire to control his actions.

I can see what you're saying but I don't think it's common to have a situation in which both people are equally perpetuating abuse.

+1.

There is a cycle to abuse. But victims responding to that cycle don't make them abusers. This requires the detailed involvement of an expert in the field. It is very complicated. It's like punishing a child that is a 7 year old bully, who is being molested at home. Certainly, bullying is not okay. But certainly, punishing is not addressing the true problem here. The problem is the abuse. When that stops, the corresponding and problematic behavior usually follows soon after, with new learned principles and therapy.

There is another aspect of the cycle that far too many people aren't aware of where the victim may subconsciously use provocation as a way of getting the abusive episode over with. In physically abusive relationships, there is often a cycle where there's an episode of violence, then remorse on the part of the abuser where they try to make it up to the victim. After that honeymoon period, there usually come a phase of build-up to the next incident of violence, where the abuser isn't physically hurting their victim but is become kind of restless in their non-violence, they get meaner, short-tempered, threatening, etc., until it peaks with violence. That build-up phase can in some ways be worse for the victim because they know the punch is coming but then don't know when, and it's torturous. The victim in those cases will often do something during that build-up phase to make the violence come faster, such as yelling at their abuser, insulting him, maybe even shoving him (not in a way that will cause injury, just make him mad) so they can get the violence over with and get back to the peaceful, harmonious phase.

This same phenomenon happens in emotionally abusive relationships too but it's even harder to recognize when it happens. The emotional abuse victim who gets into an argument with their abuser and can tell it's not going anywhere constructive but won't end until their abuser has let loose (at which point they can have their make-up sex and he'll tell her how much he loves her) might make the subconscious decision to throw a gratuitous insult at their abuser so their abuser will let loose their verbal tirade and the fight will end. The victim knows there's no other way out of the fight except to let the tirade happen, because even if she were to walk away from the fight before it happens, the tirade will still be waiting for an excuse to come out.

This phenomenon is insidious in all abusive relationships because it gives opening for people to blame the victim for their role in the abuse. In physically abusive relationships, though, it's easier for the victim who has done this to recognize that they are still a victim and their abuser is still an abuser because calling someone an asshole doesn't warrant getting pushed down a flight of stairs. It's much worse for emotional abuse victims because an outsider (and even the victim herself) often can't distinguish between insults hurled for the purpose of harming the other person and the insults hurled only to get the abuse over with.

I agree with most of what you are saying. I just wonder how a victim can get out of abusive relationships if they don't see their role in the abuse.

My former therapist told he I just have to "not take the bait, not take the bait, not take the bait." But that just led to more dysfunction in the household, total lack of communication (which was already majorly lacking/juvenile on his end), and lack of trust. The abuser will just push and push your buttons, make mistakes, even ram a car or forget to take a kid to an appointment, to get you to release his anger via your quick disappointment with him and his mishaps. I ID'd him as passive aggressive early on, but that went "underground" so to speak and emerged with this temper tantrum and emotional abuse pattern two years later.

Sadly, by years 5-7 it was clearly untreated ADHD Inattentive as well. The constant mistakes -- but now the stakes with higher with 3 kids, a house, two busy careers, decisions that needed to be made together -- drive him to explode at me when he or I discovered them. Then he could take comfort in pretending to be a victim. THey were constant, he would not get treated even though his GP said to get tested. He much preferred to attempt to anger me than resolve large or small problems, or his illness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Serious question. I've recently left a grossly emotionally abusive spouse and nobody seems to understand the gravity of this. Gas lighting, minimizing, insulting, controlling - I couldn't bear this any longer. However, when I posted here about my situation about a year ago, the consensus was overall - NBD. I also have friends and family who seem to think this is not a big deal. But it IS.

What say you?

I am SO with you, OP! And you are absolutely right, emotional abuse is disregarded and shoved under the rug. In my situation my ex-H family's attitude was "he makes a lot of money, he can go off rails once in a while". Friends (his and mine) saw it differently, though.
I am glad you left the abuser, happy for you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What upset my husband the most was that as a Domestic Violence Officer in Virginia, he could not do anything about emotional abuse when a victim came in. He retired in August, and until his last day it was one of the most frustrating things about his job. He had to turn them away unless there was physical abuse, and it hurt. He was also not able to help the men, because his grant was only for women. That also bothered him immensely. Laws need to be changed.

I am very surprised to read that!
I know for a fact that immigration laws (American citizen- foreign spouse) were changed around 1998-1999 after the murder of a foreign young woman who was killed by her American husband. He was very emotionally abusive and controlling (it was revealed during the investigation from her diary) but he never hurt her physically. Until the day when her dismembered body was found in a shallow grave in Indian reservation.
And no one knows what happened to his first foreign wife, she simply vanished.
Before this awful case only a physical abuse was taken seriously.
Wrong, how wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My former therapist told he I just have to "not take the bait, not take the bait, not take the bait." But that just led to more dysfunction in the household, total lack of communication (which was already majorly lacking/juvenile on his end), and lack of trust. The abuser will just push and push your buttons, make mistakes, even ram a car or forget to take a kid to an appointment, to get you to release his anger via your quick disappointment with him and his mishaps. I ID'd him as passive aggressive early on, but that went "underground" so to speak and emerged with this temper tantrum and emotional abuse pattern two years later.

Sadly, by years 5-7 it was clearly untreated ADHD Inattentive as well. The constant mistakes -- but now the stakes with higher with 3 kids, a house, two busy careers, decisions that needed to be made together -- drive him to explode at me when he or I discovered them. Then he could take comfort in pretending to be a victim. THey were constant, he would not get treated even though his GP said to get tested. He much preferred to attempt to anger me than resolve large or small problems, or his illness.

Hi PP, I completely relate to what your wrote. I'm just curious if there was ever (even once) a time when not taking the bait actually worked and if so, what that looked like? I know what you mean about continually pushing buttons and the longer you avoid taking the bait the more they are on high alert looking for the "wrong" that sparks the tantrum.

[Anonymous]

OP, here with you.

[Anonymous]

Some therapists get it and some don't. I've written pretty extensively on this board over the years about sessions where therapists - especially marriage therapists - didn't "get it". OP, here is another resource for you the website outofthefog.net.

I got out and I am glad you did, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My former therapist told he I just have to "not take the bait, not take the bait, not take the bait." But that just led to more dysfunction in the household, total lack of communication (which was already majorly lacking/juvenile on his end), and lack of trust. The abuser will just push and push your buttons, make mistakes, even ram a car or forget to take a kid to an appointment, to get you to release his anger via your quick disappointment with him and his mishaps. I ID'd him as passive aggressive early on, but that went "underground" so to speak and emerged with this temper tantrum and emotional abuse pattern two years later.

Sadly, by years 5-7 it was clearly untreated ADHD Inattentive as well. The constant mistakes -- but now the stakes with higher with 3 kids, a house, two busy careers, decisions that needed to be made together -- drive him to explode at me when he or I discovered them. Then he could take comfort in pretending to be a victim. THey were constant, he would not get treated even though his GP said to get tested. He much preferred to attempt to anger me than resolve large or small problems, or his illness.

Hi PP, I completely relate to what your wrote. I'm just curious if there was ever (even once) a time when not taking the bait actually worked and if so, what that looked like? I know what you mean about continually pushing buttons and the longer you avoid taking the bait the more they are on high alert looking for the "wrong" that sparks the tantrum.

DP here, but taking the bait never worked to change his behavior in my case. It just made the worm that he was going to eventually serve up bigger. Not taking the bait did empower me to be more in control of my response, and to build confidence in my observations. That was pretty meaningful after asking myself if I were crazy for so long. The more I studied patterns and motivations of abusers, the more predictability I had in how things would go; this helped reinforce my decisions to eventually leave for everyone's wellbeing.

[Anonymous]

Are you really surprised by the lack of empathy of these savages?

These are the people that will sleep with your spouse without a second thought.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My former therapist told he I just have to "not take the bait, not take the bait, not take the bait." But that just led to more dysfunction in the household, total lack of communication (which was already majorly lacking/juvenile on his end), and lack of trust. The abuser will just push and push your buttons, make mistakes, even ram a car or forget to take a kid to an appointment, to get you to release his anger via your quick disappointment with him and his mishaps. I ID'd him as passive aggressive early on, but that went "underground" so to speak and emerged with this temper tantrum and emotional abuse pattern two years later.

Sadly, by years 5-7 it was clearly untreated ADHD Inattentive as well. The constant mistakes -- but now the stakes with higher with 3 kids, a house, two busy careers, decisions that needed to be made together -- drive him to explode at me when he or I discovered them. Then he could take comfort in pretending to be a victim. THey were constant, he would not get treated even though his GP said to get tested. He much preferred to attempt to anger me than resolve large or small problems, or his illness.

Hi PP, I completely relate to what your wrote. I'm just curious if there was ever (even once) a time when not taking the bait actually worked and if so, what that looked like? I know what you mean about continually pushing buttons and the longer you avoid taking the bait the more they are on high alert looking for the "wrong" that sparks the tantrum.

DP here, but taking the bait never worked to change his behavior in my case. It just made the worm that he was going to eventually serve up bigger. Not taking the bait did empower me to be more in control of my response, and to build confidence in my observations. That was pretty meaningful after asking myself if I were crazy for so long. The more I studied patterns and motivations of abusers, the more predictability I had in how things would go; this helped reinforce my decisions to eventually leave for everyone's wellbeing.

I am the PPP. Agree, it never changed his behavior and certainly did not resolve the underlying issue.

[Anonymous]

I am a prosecutor and while emotional abuse is indeed real, I have seen way too many people (women in particular) crying wolf just to stick it to their exes. It takes more than just a bald, one sided allegation to convince me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a prosecutor and while emotional abuse is indeed real, I have seen way too many people (women in particular) crying wolf just to stick it to their exes. It takes more than just a bald, one sided allegation to convince me.

I’m a survivor PP, and reading about this makes me angry. Those women created horrible circumstances for people like me and the other posters who had to fight through victimization, and the stigmas and disbeliefs that their lies fed. It’s wrong. Any woman (or man) who has knowingly pretended to be a victim of abuse is low, and it is insulting. They should be ashamed. It’s as disgusting as the women who say they were raped when they weren’t. It’s nothing to joke or lie about. This is so disappointing to read.